GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday

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I thought the Father and Son were One? You are suggesting otherwise?
Yes we know you don't believe the doctrine of the Trinity and post here against what you agreed to. Essentially you also disregard the rules here and you expect us to regard the law you also disregard with your amendments.
 
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It's because they do not have real basis to their position that they ask such childish [Hebrews 5:12 KJB] things after their other positions fail them, which is exactly what the pharisees, sadducees, herodians, etc tried to do to Jesus and the disciples.
This is simply amazing that you'd speak like this about yourself.
 
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You are saying that God had a type/shadow [given because of sin [1 John 3:4 KJB]] to point forward before man sinned?
Wasn't it your group that recently said all things were finished before the world was created citing Hebrews 4:3?
 
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There is only a dispute between Light and Darkness ... and Darkness cannot see:
We know. The Scripture also says in 2 Corinthians 3:15: But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
Where is the Ark of the Covenant now located and on display for all mankind?
The Bible [KJB] doctrine is still called the Investigative Judgment by true Seventh-day Adventists:

The saints do not get to escape judgment, though they have an Advocate, Jesus Christ the Righteous:

Psalms 7:11 KJB - God judgeth the righteous, and God is angry [with the wicked] every day.

Psalms 37:33 KJB - The LORD will not leave him in his hand, nor condemn him when he is judged.

Ecclesiastes 3:17 KJB - I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for there is a time there for every purpose and for every work.

Ecclesiastes 12:14 KJB - For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether [it be] good, or whether [it be] evil.
This also links to the record books in Heaven - COL 2:14-17 The REAL truth from God's Word

The investigative judgment is found in type and in prophecy throughout the whole of scripture [KJB]:

In Genesis 2 & 3, we see Eve being deceived into sin, though Adam was warned, and He having warned her, and Adam following in sin, and then "they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day", and God ['Jesus'] investigates, inquiring and asking questions [Genesis 3:9-19; not that God doesn't know, but it is for the benefit of the angels and Adam/Eve and us], having already warned man of the sentence for sin [Genesis 2:17], and then God carries out sentence, but also gives hope [Genesis 3:15].

In Genesis 4, we see Cain and Abel, which both claimed to worship God, yet one was a son of that wicked one, satan. When Abel was killed by Cain, God came down and asked/inquired/investigated of Cain, before sentence was carried out.

In Genesis 6-9, we see that the world was becoming wicked, and while many claimed to follow God, they were already inter-marrying with the children of Cain. God looks upon the world in investigation, before execution of Judgment by the Flood.

In Genesis 10-11, we see that the people again rebelled, and God came down to see and look and investigate, before the execution of Judgment in the separation of the languages.

In Genesis 17-19, we see that God had delivered the people of Lot and Sodom, and yet Sodom did not truly repent, and went further in rebellion, and God came down to see/investigate/judge before execution of Judgment. ...etc...

In Leviticus 16 & 23, we see that Israel, and all that claimed to follow God, was to enter into the time of the typical Day of Atonement, wherein the Priest bore into the Sanctuary, upon the Breast plate of Judgment the people, represented by the stones. Anyone found not to be in harmony with God, in true repentance, was to be cut off at the end of it.

In 1 Kings 3, we see Solomon [type of Christ] having an investigation between two persons [women] over a dead Child [Christ], and a living Child [Christ] to see who really loved the Child. Solomon investigates in a judgment setting upon His throne, and gives a test, and a sentence testing the loyalty of the True mother [true Church, worshippers] and the corruption of heart of the false mother [false church, worshippers].

In Ezra 2, we see an investigative judgment in type:

Ezra 2:61 KJB - And of the children of the priests: the children of Habaiah, the children of Koz, the children of Barzillai; which took a wife of the daughters of Barzillai the Gileadite, and was called after their name:

Ezra 2:62 KJB - These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy, but they were not found: therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.

Ezra 2:63 KJB - And the Tirshatha said unto them, that they should not eat of the most holy things, till there stood up a priest with Urim and with Thummim.​

All of those priests coming back from the captivity of Babylon, had to be able to shew themselves by lineage, and had to pass through an investigation, to continue in their role as priests of God. Christians are kings and priests, a royal priesthood, and we have come out of the captivity. This is seen throughout the whole of scripture [KJB]:

The Scriptures from Genesis to Revelation reveal in type and in Prophecy this great end-time Investigative Judgment, and in Exodus 28:15,29,30 KJB we see the breastplate upon the Highpriest, is called “the breastplate of judgment”.​

In Daniel 7, we see God the Father sitting in judgment, with the books of records being opened, and the angels ministering and searching the records, with Jesus present.

In Daniel 12, we see Michael/Jesus standing up, after the searching of the record books of Heaven, and the book of Lifeof the Lamb have been searched and read

In Zechariah 3, we see an investigative judgment, taking place in the Most Holy Place on the day of atonement, with Joshua the High priest.

In Malachi 3, we see God sitting as a refiner, in judgment over his children.

In the Gospels, Jesus himself came to see/investigate/judge Israel, before the execution of Judgment.

In the Gospels, the disciples themselves were sifted, and we can even see this futher with Peter in the courtyard of the Highpriest, with Jesus in the upper room, and so on.

In Matthew 18, we see God taking account of his servants, who had at one point received forgiveness, but later had it revoked.

In Romans 2:13-16, we read of the future judgment of all men, including their secrets by Jesus

In 2 Corinthians 5:10, we read of all having to appear before the judgment seat of Christ

In Hebrews 9, we see this judgment was to begin with the dead, in the time of judgment.

In 1 Peter 4, we see that God, at the time of Peter, was “ready” to judge, and would begin at the time specified in Daniel and in Leviticus 16 & 23.

In Jude 1:15, we read of Jesus second advent to render and to “execute judgment” that was determined beforehand in the investigation.

In Revelation 3:10, 17:12, we see a specific testing of the living professing, that comes after the dead professed [Hebrews 9:27]

In Revelation 11, we see that the very Church, the Temple of God, was to be measured, sometime after the 1,260 years of Daniel.

In Revelation 14, we see the very first Angel's message declare that the time of judgment had begun, and was going forward while the Everlasting Gospel was still being preached.

… and so on.

Notice, that when the Ancient of Days [the person of the Father] sat, multiple thrones were also placed, wherein the angels [which 10,000 etc surrounded Him] also sat, and books were opened. This judgment is for the angels to look into, because they cannot read the human heart as God can, and thus they need to see for themselves that God's judgments were right on who is to be let into a place without sin [Heaven]. The timing of the sequence in Daniel 7 [as shown in context and in chiastic structure, etc] reveals that this phase of judgment takes place after the rise of Rome and its divisions, and before the second advent, and the kingdom come. It is unbreakable in its order. The judgment therein is even taking place while the little horn is still blaspheming on earth, before it is destroyed, before the number of the kingdom of Heaven is made up.

In Daniel 7 is in 4 main parts.

Daniel 7:1-14 KJB the vision of Daniel
Daniel 7:15-18 KJB the super summary of the whole vision by Gabriel [even vss 17,18]
Daniel 7:19-22 KJB Daniel asking about it again, and a specific
Daniel 7:23-28 KJB Gabriel, once more going over the whole in more detail​

Thus Daniel, Gabriel, Daniel, Gabriel. Each portion intimately tied to the other, so that the timing thereof cannot be broken between each section.

Daniel 7:22 KJB - Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.​

Until [refers to the previous time portion in earlier verse, the leading up to 1844, thus the 1,260 years, 538-1798]

Ancient of Days came, and did sit [refers to 1844 until the close of probation]

judgment was given to the saints of the most High [refers to 1,000 years, see Rev 20:4, "given unto", see also Paul, know ye not that the saints will judge angels [fallen], the world [lost].]

and the time came [end of the 1,000 years, see Rev. 20, Isaiah 24, etc] that the saints posesses the kingdom [being New Heaven and New Earth]​

In Ezekiel 1-9, shows the same, wherein a investigative judgment goes forward, and then execution of that judgment takes place after, beginning with the elders of the temple/sanctuary on down to the least.

A very important text to consider:

Proverbs 28:5 KJB - Evil men understand not judgment: but they that seek the LORD understand all things.​
Sorry but the IJ simply doesn't line up with John 5:24. That verse says the Christian has already passed the judgment and has eternal life.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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LoveGodsWord said:
If you are breaking ANY of God's Commandments you are practicing sin (James 2:8-12)

No Christian is breaking the ten commandment by not keeping the sabbath because it isn't part of the requirements of our covenant. We're not under the law.

You certainly are under the LAW guilty of breaking it if you break any of God's Commandments. It is in the very scripture you are quoting from above that disagrees with your teaching.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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This has been done several times. The only thing you're doing here is promoting argument and discord. Oh yeah and spamming the site with your repeated c&p stuff.

Really what has been done several times? All I am doing here is sharing God's WORD. It is God's WORD not mine. Your argument is not with me.
 
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No your explanation isn't in the verse. I'm asking you a direct question who are the thousands? Are they the whole world?

I did not need to explain anything the answer to your question was in the very scripture you quoted. You choose to ignore it. This is sad for you.
 
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The7thColporteur

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...Sorry but the IJ simply doesn't line up with John 5:24. That verse says the Christian has already passed the judgment and has eternal life.
No it doesn't, as one saying of scripture does not negate all the others [John 10:35 KJB]. The text is also conditional based upon faith, notice ["heareth" & "believeth on" [continual ongoing action]].

The passage speaks of "condemnation", which so long as one is in Christ, they are not under, but ...:

John 5:24 KJB Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.​

Hearing and Believing [at first and then continually] as required, places one's name in the "book of Life" [of the Lamb]. It doesn't remove the possibility of having that name removed, by disbelief and disobedience and thus by revocation of forgiveness in Matthew 18, etc:

A person can indeed lose their salvation, as it is written in Leviticus 23; Deuteronomy 30; 1 Samuel 10 & 1 Chronicles 10; Jeremiah 17; Ezekiel 3 & 33, Matthew 12 & 18; Acts 4-5; 1 Corinthians 15; Hebrews 6 & 10; James 1; 2 Peter; Revelation 3 KJB etc, and so on. - [link]

Just as a name can go from the book of Death, to the book of Life [Revelation 20:12 KJB], it can also go from the one back to the other, since a name can be removed from the book of Life:

Exodus 32:33 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

Revelation 3:5 KJB - He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

Revelation 22:19 KJB - And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
Moses was indeed veiled [2 Corinthians 3:7 KJB], and Daniel given in symbols, but in Christ Jesus, we have it unveiled [2 Corinthians 4:3-6 KJB], and revealed in the Revelation [1:1 KJB, etc]. Therefore, we are they who follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth, and enter in by faith, and we hear the bells of our Great High Priest moving in His ministry.

Those who obey the Everlasting Gospel, will take hold of Christ Jesus, and His strength [Philippians 4:13 KJB], and overcome all sin [Matthew 1:21, Revelation 2:7,11,17,26, 3:5,12,21, 21:7 KJB], and they will “keep the commandments of God”, and have the “faith of Jesus” [Revelation 14:12] to do so, and will be not like those who “draw back” [Hebrews 10:38-39] unto “perdition”.

Life eternal, is always based upon condition – obedience to the will of God [Hebrews 5:9 KJB], through living faith. John 5:24 KJB, the “believeth”, is continuing present action, a 'living faith', Bible faith [the just shall live by faith”, not merely “Lord, Lord ...” and disregard the Ten Commandments [John 14:15; Exodus 20:6].

Those who reject the Gospel, are indeed judged already, as they fall under the condemnation of those which have ultimately rejected Light [John 3:18 KJB], but this has nothing to say about those professing Christ, only those rejecting Christ. For among that professing class, there are two groups [sheep and goats, wheat and tares, wise and foolish, etc]. These must be tested, tried and winnowed, beforehand. Thus in Matthew 22:11, we read of this investigation:

Matthew 22:11 KJB And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:​

In Daniel, we see the books opened, and being searched by the thousands and thousands of angels, before Christ Jesus comes back in the second Advent:

Daniel 7:9 KJB - I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire.

Daniel 7:10 KJB - A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

Daniel 12:1 KJB - And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.​
 
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The7thColporteur

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...Where is the Ark of the Covenant now located and on display for all mankind?...
Heaven:

The ARK of the Covenant HAS BEEN FOUND since AD 1844! The Sabbath Commandment [Ex. 20:8-11] is seen!

as already cited, for every man taking hold of God's word by faith -- for faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God -- can look up [rather than down here on earth, like the carnal mind does] by faith and see the Ten Commandments in The True Ark in the True Temple:

Psalms 19:1 KJB - To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

Psalms 50:6 KJB - And the heavens shall declare his righteousness: for God is judge himself. Selah.

Psalms 97:6 KJB - The heavens declare his righteousness, and all the people see his glory.

Psalms 119:172 KJB - My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.
I do notice, that you specifically and others are not posting in the specially created thread and are avoiding it, which was made just for y'all. Care to explain why?
 
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The7thColporteur

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Who is "we"? Be specific please. I would like to know what legion I am dealing with. There are legions of light and legions of darkness [lie-ght].

The Scripture also says in 2 Corinthians 3:15: But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. ...
Are you saying that I am not a believer in Christ, that I am not a Christian? Be specific please. No vagueries. Christians speak words "plain", as it is written, Mark 7:35 KJB.

2 Corinthians 3:14 KJB - But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.​

The verse you cited, ties right into the Heavenly Sanctuary and the True Ark with the Eternal Commandments therein - The ARK of the Covenant HAS BEEN FOUND since AD 1844! The Sabbath Commandment [Ex. 20:8-11] is seen!

You asked me earlier about a "location", but seemed to hint at an 'earthly' location, 'on display for all mankind'.

...Where is the Ark of the Covenant now located and on display for all mankind?...

I told you of the Heavenly location.

Which of us is looking up?

2 Corinthians 3:13 KJB - And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

Daniel 9:27 KJB - And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
Moreso, the Bible itself is on earth, and the same words are found in Exodus 20:1-17 KJB, so that all are without excuse ... including you and I.
 
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The7thColporteur

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Has nothing to do with free will.
Has everything to do with it.

Did Adam know that the 'sabbath', as 1stcenturylady [and others] teach[es], was a "shadow" pointing to a Saviour from sin? Yes/No Please. Let's continue to be straight forward here.

...God knows everything even before it happens.
Not in dispute at all, and I even said so. I say so again, since it was 'missed'.
 
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The7thColporteur

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...What you're doing is mocking. ...
1 Kings 18:27 KJB - And it came to pass at noon, that Elijah mocked them, and said, Cry aloud: for he is a god; either he is talking, or he is pursuing, or he is in a journey, or peradventure he sleepeth, and must be awaked.

Proverbs 1:26 KJB - I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;
 
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1stcenturylady

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No Christian is breaking the ten commandment by not keeping the sabbath because it isn't part of the requirements of our covenant. We're not under the law.

listed, you really need to not end so abruptly. "We're not under the law" - then what? We are filled and guided by the Holy Spirit. If we don't have the Spirit and are not under the law, we are lawless. That is not the gospel, nor scriptural. Just complete the message.
 
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The7thColporteur

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You need to ask such a question. What did Jesus offer to sabbath keeping Jews? why?
He offered them the real "rest" from sin [1 John 3:4 KJB]:

John 8:31 KJB - Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

Deuteronomy 4:2 KJB - Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

John 17:17 KJB - Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
John 8:32 KJB - And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

Psalms 119:142 KJB - Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth.

Psalms 119:143 KJB - Trouble and anguish have taken hold on me: yet thy commandments are my delights.

Psalms 119:144 KJB - The righteousness of thy testimonies is everlasting: give me understanding, and I shall live.

Psalms 119:145 KJB - KOPH. I cried with my whole heart; hear me, O LORD: I will keep thy statutes.

Psalms 119:146 KJB - I cried unto thee; save me, and I shall keep thy testimonies.

Psalms 119:147 KJB - I prevented the dawning of the morning, and cried: I hoped in thy word.

Psalms 119:148 KJB - Mine eyes prevent the night watches, that I might meditate in thy word.

Psalms 119:149 KJB - Hear my voice according unto thy lovingkindness: O LORD, quicken me according to thy judgment.

Psalms 119:150 KJB - They draw nigh that follow after mischief: they are far from thy law.

Psalms 119:151 KJB - Thou art near, O LORD; and all thy commandments are truth.
John 8:33 KJB - They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free?

John 8:34 KJB - Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

1 John 3:4 KJB - Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
John 8:35 KJB - And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever.

John 8:36 KJB - If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Romans 6:18 KJB - Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Psalms 119:172 KJB - My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.
Romans 6:20 KJB - For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

Romans 6:22 KJB - But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.

Galatians 4:26 KJB - But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

What is above?

The ARK of the Covenant HAS BEEN FOUND since AD 1844! The Sabbath Commandment [Ex. 20:8-11] is seen!
John 8:37 KJB - I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.

John 8:38 KJB - I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.
This included the restoration of understanding to the real commandment [Exodus 20:8-11 KJB], which is why Jesus throughout the Gospel continually unloosed all the man-made restrictions from His "rest", the 7th Day the Sabbath; since the pharisees, etc. had continually burdened it with man-made nonsense.

You know like such nonsense as:

Is the person who operates the electric generator on the sabbath do your will? Remember they're to observe the sabbath and do no work. Does the law grant permission for you to take advantage of another's sin in working on the sabbath for personal gain?
Which was rightly answered here:

GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday

GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday
 
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