Is There Such a Thing as a Biblical Feminist?

[AlexDTX]

In the #MeToo thread it became apparent that several of our believing sisters regard themselves as feminists. I am curious to other sisters, and brothers in the lord, what you all think that means. Secular feminists, in my understanding, is contrary to Biblical femininity. Yet, I can see, however, that there can be some overlap. So I would like to tease out those parts of the feminist movement that are contrary to biblical femininity, and discover those parts that line up. So all comments are welcomed. My only desire is that I do not want anyone to dismiss out of hand what a contrary point of view might be. Thank you for your help.

 

[HereIStand]

The feminism aligned with the pro-choice movement is anti-Christian. To the extent feminism could be aligned with anti-human trafficking and other human rights causes, it could be Christian. Human rights in general are rooted in Christianity.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Feminism is a secular political movement and has nothing to do with biblical philosophy. Christian belief from what I can tell is that all people are equally worthy and no one should be concerned with the secular status of another believer nor give any special regard to one person over another. Just as Humanism proposes that the secular concerns of humans are of the foremost importance, Feminism proposes that the secular concerns of women take precedence over other concerns.

 

[derpytia]

In the #MeToo thread it became apparent that several of our believing sisters regard themselves as feminists. I am curious to other sisters, and brothers in the lord, what you all think that means. Secular feminists, in my understanding, is contrary to Biblical femininity. Yet, I can see, however, that there can be some overlap. So I would like to tease out those parts of the feminist movement that are contrary to biblical femininity, and discover those parts that line up. So all comments are welcomed. My only desire is that I do not want anyone to dismiss out of hand what a contrary point of view might be. Thank you for your help.

I would say I'm a feminist but not in the way that society defines a feminist.
Society would have us believe there are no differences between men and women. I believe men and women ARE different but complementary to each other as God made us to be.

As for things like marriage, modern feminism would say that marriage is a sham and that men are dictators over their wives. I believe the husband to be the head of the family and the wife to be his helper, meaning that the husband has the final say so at the end of the day but his decisions should always be for the best interest of his family and his wife, not just himself. Marriage is not a dictatorship, it's a partnership. Abuse of the headship position makes a man unfit to be a husband.

I always keep in mind that in a day and age where unmarried (and even married) women were not normally allowed to converse with men who were not their husbands or family, Jesus kept company with many such women and they followed him. He treated women with kindness, with compassion, and with the highest respect.

I believe that women are, in some areas of modern society, treated unfairly. There is such thing as culture telling men that they cannot cry or that they have a right to women's bodies that makes them cruel and violent and commit atrocities like rape. I also believe that women should be encouraged to pursue careers in medicine and engineering and sports if they feel inclined to do so. A woman's worth is not defined by her ability to have children. I also believe that God does not view women as inferior to men.

 

[archer75]

I'd ask the OP to define feminism for the purposes of the thread, that would be easier to answer.

 

[PloverWing]

My feminism is based largely on 1) the principle that in Christ there is neither male nor female (Galatians 3:28); 2) the command to love one's neighbor as one's self (Matthew 22:39 and elsewhere) and to treat others as you want to be treated (Matthew 7:12); 3) the principle that both men and women are made in the image of God (Genesis 1:26-31); and 4) the principle that God hears the cries of those who are oppressed by the powerful, a theme found in many places in the Old Testament prophets, in the Magnificat, and in several of Jesus' stories and sermons.

 

[A_Thinker]

As for things like marriage, modern feminism would say that marriage is a sham and that men are dictators over their wives.

I think that you are speaking of an extreme form of feminism. Most feminists I know are married ... and almost slavishly devoted to their husbands. I think as long as there is a wage gap, some degree of feminism is appropriate.

Feminism has developed in its purpose from the time of its beginning. It used to be about getting the right to vote and to run for office, and to make the same wage as men who do the same job. Obviously now it is also about shielding women from predatory men and women.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

The sort of blue-haired lesbian feminism we see today I find hard to square with any particular passage that the bible has concerning relations between the sexes. Genesis lays out the punishments of both sexes in the beginning, men are to work all their lives and women are to have pain in childbirth and that is reinforced in the New Testament where Paul tells us that the woman will be saved through childbearing and that if a man does not work he shall not eat.

Yet Christianity was never into the idea of women having absolutely no say in things or no power. Women have authority over sexual rights to their husband (something I do not believe existed in the ancient world) and they also had the choice to forgo marriage in favour of a celibate life dedicated to God. That there exists within the Christian tradition women like Anna Komnene, Queen Elizabeth, Teresa of Avila and Catherine of Sienna, should call into question women were merely regarded as objects to be impregnated and forced to have babies. All of those women (and many more) are celebrated in their particular sphere's of influence political or theological.

 

[Micah888]

Secular feminists, in my understanding, is contrary to Biblical femininity.

Correct. Therefore there can be no such thing as Biblical Feminism. I'm sure you meant Feminism, not Femininity. Then again, perhaps not.

Feminist theology seeks to overthrow Divine revelation and replace it with humanistic thinking:

Feminist theology is a movement that reconsiders the traditions, practices, scriptures, and theologies of religions from a feminist perspective. Some of the goals of feminist theology include increasing the role of women among the clergy and religious authorities, reinterpreting male-dominated imagery and language about God, determining women's place in relation to career and motherhood, and studying images of women in the religion's sacred texts.

Christian feminism is a branch of feminist theology which seeks to interpret and understand Christianity in light of the equality of women and men. Because this equality has been historically ignored, Christian feminists believe their contributions are necessary for a complete understanding of Christianity. While there is no standard set of beliefs among Christian feminists, most agree that God does not discriminate on the basis of biologically-determined characteristics such as sex. Their major issues are the ordination of women, male dominance in Christian marriage, and claims of moral deficiency and inferiority of abilities of women compared to men. They also are concerned with the balance of parenting between mothers and fathers and the overall treatment of women in the church.

History and theory of feminism

According to Scripture there is no distinction between male and female within the Body of Christ. All are children of God by faith.

However, also according to Scripture, men and women have different and distinct roles within the home and within the local church. And so-called "Christian Feminism" is essentially a rebellion against these roles.

 

[Paidiske]

I'm a feminist, and I take Scripture very seriously.

To me it means that I believe God created men and women equal, that patriarchy in the family, in society and in the church is a result of the fall, and something which in Christ we should strive to overcome.

It means that women have the gifts of the Spirit, and should be encouraged to discern what God calls them to do in this life, and encouraged, equipped and enabled to do it, just as much as men.

It means working side by side for the kingdom. It is not, therefore, a secular thing at all, for me.

 

[Micah888]

To me it means that I believe God created men and women equal, that patriarchy in the family, in society and in the church is a result of the fall, and something which in Christ we should strive to overcome.

Yes, patriarchy is a result of the Fall, but it is GOD ORDAINED.

Unto the woman he [God] said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. (Gen 3:16)

So how would Christians "overcome" what God has ordained without rebelling against His Word? The New Testament has much to say about the roles of men and women in the home and in the local church, and Peter and Paul were writing by divine inspiration.

 

[akaDaScribe]

I think activists in all of the movements today tend to take things to the extreme and claim to represent the people, but for the most part, they don't.

 

[Paidiske]

Yes, patriarchy is a result of the Fall, but it is GOD ORDAINED.

I disagree. God was telling Adam and Eve what the result of their sin would be, but not because that's ever what God willed. It was a description, not a command.

The New Testament has much to say about the roles of men and women in the home and in the local church, and Peter and Paul were writing by divine inspiration.

It does, but much of that was about particular cultural issues at the time. In a different culture - one where the law doesn't give our husbands the legal right as pater familias to kill us, for example - roles are necessarily different.

 

[dreadnought]

In the #MeToo thread it became apparent that several of our believing sisters regard themselves as feminists. I am curious to other sisters, and brothers in the lord, what you all think that means. Secular feminists, in my understanding, is contrary to Biblical femininity. Yet, I can see, however, that there can be some overlap. So I would like to tease out those parts of the feminist movement that are contrary to biblical femininity, and discover those parts that line up. So all comments are welcomed. My only desire is that I do not want anyone to dismiss out of hand what a contrary point of view might be. Thank you for your help.

Perhaps Deborah, judge of Israel, could be considered a feminist.

 

[Micah888]

It does, but much of that was about particular cultural issues at the time. In a different culture - one where the law doesn't give our husbands the legal right as pater familias to kill us, for example - roles are necessarily different.

Once Christians accept the idea that some teachings in Scripture are limited by culture or time, there is no end to how people may dismiss Scriptures which they don't wish to accept.

On the other hand this is what we are told (also given by divine inspiration): All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. (2 Tim 3:16,17).

Paul said to the Corinthian Christians -- by divine inspiration -- that women are to keep (maintain) silence in the churches. His authority was in fact Genesis 3:16 (according to almost all conservative commentators).

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. (1 Cor 14:34)

Therefore that injunction would be applicable today regardless of changes in culture or society. And for large numbers of Christians, that is a directive from God, given through His apostle for all times and for all churches.

The same would be true for all instructions regarding the roles of men and women in the home and in the church. Disregarding them would simply lead to chaos and spiritual confusion.

 

[Paidiske]

Once Christians accept the idea that some teachings in Scripture are limited by culture or time, there is no end to how people may dismiss Scriptures which they don't wish to accept.

Can you tell me, then, what sense you make of Acts 15:1-31?

The same would be true for all instructions regarding the roles of men and women in the home and in the church. disregarding them would simply lead to chaos and spiritual confusion.

On the contrary, rejecting instructions which diminish and oppress women leads to the greater flourishing of home, church and society. No spiritual confusion here, but great joy in being able to use my gifts in obedience to God's call.

 

[Micah888]

Can you tell me, then, what sense you make of Acts 15:1-31?

This was not related to culture or time, but spiritual truth -- that the New Covenant was in force since the crucifixion of Christ, and the Old Covenant was no longer applicable. This is a major Bible truth based upon the one great sacrifice of Christ as the Lamb of God.

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.(Acts 15:5)

What these Judaizers were falsely teaching is that in order to be justified Christians must observe the rites and rituals of the Old Covenant, along with believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. Paul addressed this in detail in Galatians.

On the contrary, rejecting instructions which diminish and oppress women leads to the greater flourishing of home, church and society. No spiritual confusion here, but great joy in being able to use my gifts in obedience to God's call.

I would not presume to address anything personal here, just Bible principles.

 

[Paidiske]

I'd say that the very fact that there is an old covenant and a new covenant shows that some teachings in Scripture are limited by culture and time.

 

[Andrew77]

In the #MeToo thread it became apparent that several of our believing sisters regard themselves as feminists. I am curious to other sisters, and brothers in the lord, what you all think that means. Secular feminists, in my understanding, is contrary to Biblical femininity. Yet, I can see, however, that there can be some overlap. So I would like to tease out those parts of the feminist movement that are contrary to biblical femininity, and discover those parts that line up. So all comments are welcomed. My only desire is that I do not want anyone to dismiss out of hand what a contrary point of view might be. Thank you for your help.

Feminism, in pop culture, has a rather ambiguous meaning. People read into the name, whatever they want Feminism to be.

If you take Feminism to be that Women has as much moral, and divine value, as men, that they are not property, and not slaves, and have dignity and respect as a man does.... then yes a Feminist can be a Christian.

But if you define Feminism as being what we see in the Feminist groups, and Feminist manifesto, then it is not possible for a Feminist to be a Christian.

I'm not going to list every single Feminist web site, but I'll post just one, as a basic reference.
Mina Loy, "Feminist Manifesto"

A real Feminist believes that sexual freedom is key to their own identity.

A Christian believes in purity before G-d.

A Feminist believes that Virtue itself is a fictional value.

A Christian believes in devotion to her family, which includes her husband.

A Feminist believes such devotion are outdated, and holding her back.

A Feminist believes it isn't good enough to have organizations exclusively for women, but rather that they need to eliminate organizations exclusively for men.

For example, it's not good enough to have a women only organization dedicated to raising girls to become wonderful women, called the girl scouts.

No, they have to eliminate a men only organization dedicated to raising good men, by making the boy scouts into the "Scouts".

Boy Scouts Changing Name To 'Scouts BSA,' As Girls Welcomed Into Program

The truth is most women that claim to be Christian Feminists, either don't really know what Feminism stands for, or they don't know what being a Christian is really about. Because the two are completely compatible.

 

[Andrew77]

I'd say that the very fact that there is an old covenant and a new covenant shows that some teachings in Scripture are limited by culture and time.

Yes, but I would suggest those things that are limited to culture and time, are few.

For example, Women should keep their heads covered. That was because in that time in Jewish culture, having your hair uncovered was a sign you were available, and having your head covered was a sign of devotion to your husband.

There isn't anyone anywhere in Western culture that you could ask "what does covering your hair mean, for a women" and have them give you that answer.

This why we don't follow that in today's culture, because it simply doesn't have that meaning.

But beyond the extremely few instance of that, I think it is largely directly applicable to today's world.