LDS Joseph Smith Despised God's Will Being More Powerful Than Man's

[Rescued One]

According to Mormonism:
Free Agency Is Evidence of God's Justice
Righteousness and obedience to divine law are and must be a requirement based upon the principle of eternal justice. The fact that man has been given his free agency is an evidence of the justice and mercy of our Eternal Father. He will teach, persuade, and encourage his children to walk in the ways of righteousness, but even his divine love cannot transcend the decree of justice and the edict that none but the clean can dwell in his kingdom. We are taught that the heavens wept over the rebellion of Lucifer and those who followed him. Moreover, it was justice of a kind Heavenly Father that grants to every soul the great gift of free agency which makes individuals morally responsible for their own deeds.

Naturally, the expression that our Eternal Father loves Satan needs some qualification.There is no doubt that there was a deep sorrow and weeping when Lucifer rebelled. From all that we have received pertaining to the pre-existence, we learn that there was a time when Lucifer held great authority and was known as the light bearer. No doubt at that time he rebelled against giving to every soul the great gift of free agency. He advocated a doctrine of compulsion.
Selections from Answers to Gospel Questions, A Course of Study for the Melchizedek Quorums 1972-1973, Selections from the Writings of Joseph Fielding Smith, Tenth President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Published by the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, p. 19

 

[Jane_Doe]

The title doesn't follow the text of the OP.

But if you want to say "LDS believe that man has free will, which is a gift from God", that is true.

 

[Rescued One]

The title doesn't follow the text of the OP.

But if you want to say "LDS believe that man has free will, which is a gift from God", that is true.

You and I don't know what every single LDS believes.

So you're welcome to your opinion.

Here's a contradiction:

Abraham 4
27 So the Gods went down to organize man in their own image, in the image of the Gods to form they him, male and female to form they them.

28 And the Gods said: We will bless them. And the Gods said: We will cause them to be fruitful and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it, and to have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

 

[God bless Joshua]

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

Romans 8:29-30

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

Romans 8:29-30

 

[Ironhold]

The actual theology of the church is this:

Everyone who is, was, and will be are literal children of God and were up in Heaven with him before the world was.

When the world was to be created, Jesus volunteered to come down as the world's savior by paying the necessary price for sin; he understood that as people made choices and lived their lives, it would be inevitable that wrongs would occur and the tab would have to be settled up. Lucifer, however, volunteered to "save" the world by forcing everyone to do everything the "right" way, and in exchange he wanted the glory.

When Jesus was chosen, Lucifer had a snit fit and tried to take the glory right then and there. This got him kicked to the curb along with those who supported him, and he's been mad ever since.

 

[Jane_Doe]

Romans 8:29-30

LDS firmly believe these verses and Matthew 25:41, though not through a Calvinist lens.

 

[Rescued One]

LDS firmly believe these verses and Matthew 25:41, though not through a Calvinist lens.

Mormons believe everything through a Mormon lens.

29 And after these plain and precious things were taken away it [the Bible] goeth forth unto all the nations of the Gentiles; and after it goeth forth unto all the nations of the Gentiles, yea, even across the many waters which thou hast seen with the Gentiles which have gone forth out of captivity, thou seest—because of the many plain and precious things which have been taken out of the book, which were plain unto the understanding of the children of men, according to the plainness which is in the Lamb of God—because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel of the Lamb, an exceedingly great many do stumble, yea, insomuch that Satan hath great power over them.
Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 13

 

[Jane_Doe]

Mormons believe everything through a Mormon lens.

And Calvinists see through a Calvinist lens
And Catholics see through a Catholics lens
And Orthodox see through a Orthodox lens
And Hindus see through a Hindus lens
And Americans see through a Americans lens
And women see through a woman's lens

This seems a little obvious...

 

[ChristIsSovereign]

And Calvinists see through a Calvinist lens
And Catholics see through a Catholics lens
And Orthodox see through a Orthodox lens
And Hindus see through a Hindus lens
And Americans see through a Americans lens
And women see through a woman's lens

This seems a little obvious...

Bias is a natural part of human psychology.

 

[Rescued One]

And Calvinists see through a Calvinist lens
And Catholics see through a Catholics lens
And Orthodox see through a Orthodox lens
And Hindus see through a Hindus lens
And Americans see through a Americans lens
And women see through a woman's lens

This seems a little obvious...

And some people rely on the Holy Spirit.

 

[He is the way]

Joseph Smith Despised God's Will Being More Powerful Than Man's

You made that up didn't you?

 

[drstevej]

Romans 8:29-30

LDS firmly believe these verses ...

Then why does the JST change justified to sanctified?


Greek Text: οὓς δὲ προώρισεν τούτους καὶ ἐκάλεσεν καὶ οὓς ἐκάλεσεν τούτους καὶ ἐδικαίωσεν οὓς δὲ ἐδικαίωσεν τούτους καὶ ἐδόξασεν

KJV: Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

JST: Moreover, him whom he did predestinate, him he also called; and him whom he called, him he also sanctified; and him whom he sanctified, him he also glorified.

Name ONE greek manuscript that supports the JST. This is changing Scripture to fit Mormonism.

 

[Rescued One]

You made that up didn't you?

I didn't have to. Joseph did.

2 Nephi 25
23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.

“Wherefore, because that Satan rebelled against me, and sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him, and also, that I should give unto him mine own power; by the power of mine Only Begotten, I caused that he should be cast down;
“And he became Satan, yea, even the devil, the father of all lies, to deceive and to blind men, and to lead them captive at his will, even as many as would not hearken unto my voice” (Moses 4:1–4).

 

[He is the way]

I didn't have to. Joseph did.

2 Nephi 25
23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.

“Wherefore, because that Satan rebelled against me, and sought to destroy the agency of man, which I, the Lord God, had given him, and also, that I should give unto him mine own power; by the power of mine Only Begotten, I caused that he should be cast down;
“And he became Satan, yea, even the devil, the father of all lies, to deceive and to blind men, and to lead them captive at his will, even as many as would not hearken unto my voice” (Moses 4:1–4).

I have no idea how you got that idea from those scriptures. For one thing I do believe in faith based works because the Bible states that dead faith and dead works will not save anyone:

(New Testament | James 2:14 - 18)

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
Satan was cast out:
(New Testament | Revelation 12:7 - 9)

7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Why do you believe the statement you made has anything to do with the scriptures you quoted?

 

[He is the way]

It seems to me that the whole premise of this thread is based on an erroneous presumption. Please check the Goading & Flaming Rules.

 

[Rescued One]

It seems to me that the whole premise of this thread is based on an erroneous presumption. Please check the Goading & Flaming Rules.

No, it is not a presumption. It is a fact. And I gave the evidence.

 

[Rescued One]

I have no idea how you got that idea from those scriptures. For one thing I do believe in faith based works because the Bible states that dead faith and dead works will not save anyone:

I believe that Christ wants us to go and bear fruit, to walk in the light, and to love others. The difference between Mormonism and Christianity is that Mormons teach that works are necessary for salvation. That's not true! we are justified by faith. It is not of works.

There is no such thing as dead faith. Faith is living. If it's dead, it's not there.

Titus 1
15Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work rebrobate.

There are unbelievers (who have no faith) and believers (who have faith that God gave).

Praying for you.

 

[He is the way]

I believe that Christ wants to go and bear fruit, to walk in the light, and to love others. The diffence between Mormonism and Christianity is that Mormons teach that works are necessary for salvation. That's not true! we are justified by faith. It is not of works.

There is no such thing as dead faith. Faith is living. If it's dead, it's not there.

Titus 1
15Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work rebrobate.

There are unbelievers (who have no faith) and believers (who have faith that God gave).

Praying for you.

The Bible says there is dead faith:
(New Testament | James 2:14 - 20)

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

If you believe the Bible (all of it) then you will know there is dead faith. You can't be saved by dead faith.