Oncedeceived
Senior Veteran
No, you misunderstood. You gave examples where you felt God was immoral. We are talking about morality...e.g. morality and immorality. So whether or not you have been very "careful" not to use the word immorality you are claiming it anyway.I gave multiple examples in the other thread. Go look for yourself.
No, again you are claiming that God is immoral in the cases you have presented and when I and others give you reasons for why God in the Christian doctrine is not immoral you claim we are wrong. I stated very clearly that it would be immoral for a human to torture and kill an infant and that it is absolutely and objectively a sin for any human, anywhere, at anytime. I have also given you the Christian viewpoint on the actions of God in taking a human life.I don't know why you're bringing the Bible into this now, lol. I was addressing your misuse of the words "absolute" and "objective."
God says: but let him who boasts boast of this, that he understands and knows Me, that I am the LORD who exercises lovingkindness, justice and righteousness on earth; for I delight in these things," declares the LORD.
So as Christians we know that His motivation for His actions are based in lovingkindness, justice and righteousness on earth because he delights in these things.
But you aren't paying attention.See, again you aren't paying attention.
God makes the rules of morality for human beings.I told you in the other thread that I went to great efforts to avoid using the word "immoral." Now you think I'm trying to show God is immoral. I don't think you have a clue what this conversation is about. Again, for the one billionth time, I just want a straight answer: is morality, on your view, objective and absolute, or does God make the rules? "God is morality" is nonsensical, and is obviously the result of when you had tried and failed to grapple with the horns of the Euthyphro dilemma.
The Christian Bible says: They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them
and:
“This is the covenant that I will make with them
after those days, declares the Lord:
I will put my laws on their hearts,
and write them on their minds,”
So this supports our view that morality comes from God and is inherent in the human being.
So both of those verses supports Christian dogma in this case.
No, it is absolutely and objectively immoral for a human, no matter who, when or where it occurs. Just as God is the maker of time, He sits outside of time, just as God is the Creator of gravity, He is not held to gravitational forces and just as God is the Creator of Life, He has authority over life and death. He is the only Judge of right and wrong, immoral or moral actions of His created and His created can not judge Him.I didn't begin this conversation. But if you're so eager to continue, I'll need you to explain what you mean when you say "absolute" and "objective." You'll need to explain why 2+2=4 is "absolute and objective" and always true no matter who is doing the figuring, while at the same time morality is "absolute and objective" and yet certain things are or aren't OK *depending upon* who is doing what.
Psalm 50:6 And the heavens declare His righteousness, For God Himself is judge. Selah
Isaiah 33:22 For the LORD is our judge, The LORD is our lawgiver, The LORD is our king; He will save us-
Morality is God's nature, His nature is absolute, unchanging, perfect and independent. Since God’s nature is the greatest of all possible good, an act is moral when it reflects God’s nature, God puts that nature within us with the ability to act upon it or act against it.The best sense I can make of your position is that you are saying this:
Morality is absolute and objective, and the fact of morality is that if you are the creator of a universe then you can do whatever you want with it and you can set the rules for the inhabitants however you like.
Well you think wrong. I understand it and you must as well to consider it self-contradictory at all. You are claiming that God can do what ever He wants to do but that is wrong. He does what is perfect, moral, absolute and unchanging and His moral nature is righteous and good. His actions come forth from His very nature.However, I find that to be self-contradictory and also poorly applied to Christian theology. So I don't understand your position at all, and I don't think you do either.
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