Are professed Christians who deliberately practice sin saved?

[Old Trapper]

Yes. Jesus came to DIVIDE.

Have you any clue, what is the ONE FACT, that DIVIDES the people?

God Bless,
SBC

Oh, oh, another master of all. No lord of the gospels, please tell me what that "one fact" (as if there was only one) is that divides the people.

Remember, it was you that said Christ did not come to divide.

 

[listed]

OK. So, the translators got it wrong. Now, how do we then say that the scripture is inerrant, and inspired by God?

By study. Our versions are translations of another language trying to accurately convey meaning. That's why the complete Scripture must be considered on every verse. It's also why context is so important.

 

[listed]

Your right we can't be fighting each other. We have to follow Jesus example.

Your right we can't be fighting each other. I was wrong. we do have a new commandment from Jesus. But in Mathew 5:19
"19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments" he was referring to the Old Testament not the new covenant.

Thanks for pointing that out. We have to be nice to each other.

How can "these" be any more than what is spoken about. The word "these" isn't all inclusive of the law.

 

[listed]

Oh my... the Law has a purpose. If you read all of my posts on this thread... I address it.

Jesus “Fulfilled” the Law. Hint

1 John 2:2

2nd hint

“Canceling all the charges”

3rd hint

1 Timothy 1:9 is great on this issue.

 

[Old Trapper]

No problem - go have your general conversation with God, instead of people, who must guess what you mean, since you cannot express yourself with a clear understanding.

God Bless,
SBC

Somebody got up a little [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]y this morning. Now, I don't see where anyone has a problem understanding what I say save for some who are so ingrained in their own egos to think others might have some knowledge greater then theirs. In another thread I was posting in a poster kept asking me a question over, and over, again. Eventually I had answered the question in three different ways, and then she finally changed the topic insinuating something I had not said.

I have a feeling you are similar in lacking the ability to understand the spoken, or written, word save for an in depth description of what ever the topic might be.

 

[listed]

I was referring to this scripture.

Mathew 5:18
19 Whosoever therefore

I know you were. You also refuse to consider Luke 24:44 a direct reference to your verse.

I'm not going to get into these kind of debated and discutions it just brings negative energy I don't want to be fighting people about scripture. Jesus is the new covenant. if you want to celebrate Passover that's up to you. If you want to ride on a donkey in Israel. That's cool to. Lol..
Here is a good scripture I wanted to share yesterday.
Matthew 6:19-20
19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:

20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:

Don't understand how this relates to the discussion.

 

[listed]

I'm sorry. I thought that when Jesus said the the Law would not pass until ALL things, including the Prophets (prophecies), were fulfilled, or when Paul taught in Romans 7: 5-7

"For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter. What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

Now, I don't read every post mad ein here just the ones related to myself. However, it would appear that you are mocking me (which is something you do not want to do), so tell me "master", just how did Christ fulfilling the Law destroy the law?

Oh yes, as to your "2nd. hint" can you show me where I even suggested that we were not free from the Law, or is it your claim that we no longer have to obey the Law? And if the Law was destroyed then just what is it we are compelled to follow?

It isn't the law that's destroyed (old covenant). The law has been replaced by something much better called grace (new covenant).

 

[Old Trapper]

The Law is our tutor to lead us to Christ. Under the new covenant, we have the Holy Spirit within us to remind us to follow God's commandments:

This is an example of why one must study the scripture "precept upon precept, line upon line, here a little, there a little". Some seem to feel that the Law is of no purpose since Christ fulfilled the Law with His death and resurrection. As the verse you cite says "and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances", the purpose of the Holy Spirit indwelling in a believer is to guide the person to follow those very laws. Christ is then the redemption for us when we fail to do so.

 

[Old Trapper]

It isn't the law that's destroyed (old covenant). The law has been replaced by something much better called grace (new covenant).

Without the Law what is the need for Grace? Is not sin the violation of the Law?

 

[listed]

Somebody got up a little [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]y this morning. Now, I don't see where anyone has a problem understanding what I say save for some who are so ingrained in their own egos to think others might have some knowledge greater then theirs. In another thread I was posting in a poster kept asking me a question over, and over, again. Eventually I had answered the question in three different ways, and then she finally changed the topic insinuating something I had not said.

I have a feeling you are similar in lacking the ability to understand the spoken, or written, word save for an in depth description of what ever the topic might be.

 

[listed]

This is an example of why one must study the scripture "precept upon precept, line upon line, here a little, there a little". Some seem to feel that the Law is of no purpose since Christ fulfilled the Law with His death and resurrection. As the verse you cite says "and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances", the purpose of the Holy Spirit indwelling in a believer is to guide the person to follow those very laws. Christ is then the redemption for us when we fail to do so.

She's promoting the law for salvation. Yes this will probably get a denial.

 

[listed]

Without the Law what is the need for Grace? Is not sin the violation of the Law?

No sin isn't only violation of the law as 1 John 3:4 clearly states. Sin was in the world before the law (Romans 5:13) and is the reason for the law (Gal 3:19). 1 Timothy 1:9 says the law isn't for the righteous (born again Christian). It says very clearly it's for the wicked. The lw has no purpose for the Christian who is or rather should be led by the Spirit (Galatians 5:18).

 

[listed]

The Law is our tutor to lead us to Christ. Under the new covenant, we have the Holy Spirit within us to remind us to follow God's commandments:

But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. (Galatians 3:26 NASB)
​

Great passage. Please note my emphasis with a change in color.

I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances. (Ezekiel 36:26 NASB)

This isn't talking about the covenant law issued at Sinai.​

There is nothing wrong with eating or not eating meat, keeping or not keeping the sabbath, as long as you do so according to faith:

One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. He who observes the day, observes it for the Lord, and he who eats, does so for the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who eats not, for the Lord he does not eat, and gives thanks to God. (Romans 14:5-6 NASB)

I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean. For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died. (Romans 14:14-15 NASB)​

Agreed there's nothing wrong with eating meat or keeping the sabbath. You're really trying to force the sabbath as a requirement on the Christian. There's no such requirement in the new covenant. I'm very familiar with your argument. You're presenting a very classic SDA argument that can't be missed. This was your intent from the OP.

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

True repentance need be only a one time thing because once you are filled with the Spirit you a dead to sin and no longer walk in the flesh. That is the ideal. However, if you do slip, you must repent.

Calvinism: No repentance needed, just faith in Christ. Once saved, always saved. False assurance.

Arminianism: Repent every day. No assurance.

Walk in the Spirit: Nothing to repent of if you don't commit any willful sins. Complete assurance.

All this time has passed and STILL no legalists will step forward and discuss those pesky old SINS OF OMISSION...too busy working at the food lines and taking strangers into their homes I suppose

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

.
Do you mean repenting of sin after your a Christian?

Then the answer is NO, because

1) A Christian cannot sin

1 Jn. 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin;

2) If a Christian does sin there isn't any Repentance for him a second time.

Heb. 10:26
For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Heb. 6:4-6
4) For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5) And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6) If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

) A Christian cannot sin.........Really? Tell that to the guy in Paul’s Church in Corinth....Sleeping with your Mother is not a sin?

 

[SBC]

Going to church or subscribing to Christian principals in general doesn't make one a Christian.

Say person sits in Chruch for 2 years and hears and believes the Word of God....
And then goes to an alter call....
IS NOT A Believer?
IS NOT A Christian?
And when he goes to an Alter call....
He is NOW a Christian?
He is NOW a Believer?

Why do we have:

1 John 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Why not? Do you think there might be A person out of billions of people that claim they have no sin?
And the teaching is they are deceived to believe they have no sin?

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Why not? Do you think there might A person out of billions of people that claim they have sin?
And the teaching is they can confess their sins, and the Lord is faithful to forgive their sins and cleanse them from all unrighteousness?

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

Why not? Do you think there might be A person out of billions of people that claim they have not committed sin?
The teaching is they would make Christ a liar, and they would not have the Spirit of Truth in them?

John is talking to Christians.

Disagree. John is speaking to people IN the world and OF the world.

I believe 1 John 1 - 8, 9, 10 are quite clear, whom John is addressing.

I have not heard ONE PERSON claim....
1 John 1:8.....is their claim.
1 John 1:10...is their claim.

But I have heard....SEVERAL PERSONS claim....1 John 3:9 applies TO THEM....with THEIR CAVEAT, ADDED, That CHANGES the Scripture.

1 John 3: 9
Whosoever is born of God doth "not commit sin":for his seed remaineth in him, He "cannot sin". because he is born of God.

And their CAVEAT IS...they "CAN" SIN.

And IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THEM...
They call YOU a heretic ~
Say YOU are wrong ~
Call YOU a liar ~
Proclaim FOR YOU, you claim to HAVE no sin.
Proclaim FOR YOU, you claim to HVE NOT committed sin.

So what is your standing?

1 ) A man is not entitled to call himself a Christian .... UNTIL he goes to an alter call?

2 ) A man is not entitled to call himself a
Believer .... UNTIL he goes to an alter call?

3 ) ONLY saved and born again men ARE
World wide called Christians?

4 ) ONLY saved and born again men ARE
World wide called Believers?

5 ) You can BE Born of God, and STILL SIN?

6 ) Your TRUTH is what you claim for yourself?

7 ) Your TRUTH is what ANOTHER claims FOR you?

8 ) If you have claimed you were born in Sin,
1 John 1:8, would apply to you?

9 ) If you have claimed you committed Sin,
1 John 1:10, would apply to you?

10) If you have claimed to have become Born of God, you SIN NO MORE?

Thanks, These are pretty much yes or no answers that do not require an explanation.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

Keeping the law - repentance - same thing.

Repentance is something we can do.....seeing yourself as a sinner who can’t keep the Law and needs a Saviour

Keeping the Law was something only Jesus could do

 

[jmldn2]

I think a main point is that we should refrain from concluding that perfection isn't to be sought after at all. We shouldn't tire of seeking it in fact. Some, Christians and non-believers alike, give up on the cause if they ever took it up to begin with at some point in time, with the Christians in this case having determined that it's pointless -and opposed to the gospel.

Of course, we should continue to seek to be a perfect as Christ's example even though we know we can't obtain it while in this fleshly garment. One should always strive for perfection in their spiritual life.

 

[jmldn2]

.
How are you using the term "Body of Flesh" what does the term mean to you?

Body of flesh equals our fallen nature which is the part of us that wars with our spiritual nature.

 

[SBC]

Post # 338 (SBC)

Did Jesus say, He came to DIVIDE ?

Post # 368 (Old Trapper)

In fact He did.

Post # 380 (SBC)

Yes. Jesus came to DIVIDE.

Remember, it was you that said Christ did not come to divide.

Sadly, Your MEMORY is but an ILLUSION.
And, sadly Your false claim is based on your ILLUSION.

God Bless,
SBC