Nudists and Christianity.

AMOG

Regular Member
Jul 29, 2007
473
51
✟17,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Others
my thoughts so far...

yeah, you always have to have a towel if you plan to sit on ANYTHING. and usually it covers all contact with the chair or lounge. not just your bum. So in reality, less flesh to chair contact than a swim suit and no towel.

b. I have to agree. nothing in the first chapters of gen require clothing. also, if you read the law, it says if you take a man's cloak in pledge for a lone you must return it to him by nightfall. now if you were poor enough to need a loan secured by your cloak, then that cloak was your ONLY garment. (undies were not a thing back then) and there was no concern about keeping the cloak all day, (leaving you nude) but you had to return it by nightfall for protection against the chill. similarly there are a lot of references to clothing the nude, but that seems to be more in relation to poverty, not a command that you must wear cloths. So no, I don't see it. and I've looked.
 
Upvote 0

JackRT

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Oct 17, 2015
15,722
16,445
80
small town Ontario, Canada
✟767,295.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Unorthodox
Marital Status
Married
my thoughts so far...

yeah, you always have to have a towel if you plan to sit on ANYTHING. and usually it covers all contact with the chair or lounge. not just your bum. So in reality, less flesh to chair contact than a swim suit and no towel.

b. I have to agree. nothing in the first chapters of gen require clothing. also, if you read the law, it says if you take a man's cloak in pledge for a lone you must return it to him by nightfall. now if you were poor enough to need a loan secured by your cloak, then that cloak was your ONLY garment. (undies were not a thing back then) and there was no concern about keeping the cloak all day, (leaving you nude) but you had to return it by nightfall for protection against the chill. similarly there are a lot of references to clothing the nude, but that seems to be more in relation to poverty, not a command that you must wear cloths. So no, I don't see it. and I've looked.

Matthew 5:40 ---“If someone sues you for your coat, give up your shirt as well.” --- In Jewish law if you fail to repay a debt you may be taken to court and if you are still unable to repay, the lender is entitled to take your coat. The lender holds the coat during the day but he is obliged to return it at night because the coat or cloak doubled as a blanket at night. In a two-garment society this would be highly embarrassing to the debtor. However it would be even more embarrassing to the court and the lender if the debtor were to turn over both garments and stand there naked. Remember this was a society with a strong taboo against public nakedness. Using this somewhat risque humour Jesus is once again counseling covert defiance and taking the part of the poor against the rich. I'll bet his audience laughed out loud. Humour is a great aid to the memory.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Darkhorse
Upvote 0

HermanNeutics13

Regular Member
May 8, 2013
434
174
✟32,380.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
AMOG .. thanks for your well thought out post.
I'm with you on this one.

It is interesting that men post in these threads. Yet when one goes to a nudist resort its almost even with the number of females to males.
It is true there tend to be more women than you might expect, most of them are part of a couple while it is more common for single men to go than single women.
 
Upvote 0

Darkhorse

just horsing around
Aug 10, 2005
10,078
3,977
mid-Atlantic
Visit site
✟288,141.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Like a lot of other things which society disapproves of, many women enjoy social nudity, but they don't talk about it much.

I'm surprised this thread hasn't been deluged by the Christian nay-sayers in the earlier threads. Maybe they consider it a moot point.
 
Upvote 0

pat34lee

Messianic
Sep 13, 2011
11,293
2,637
59
Florida, USA
✟89,330.00
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
Since the question is "Is it sinful" then I expect some sort of Biblical support for an argument that there is something wrong with it. For my part, I find no Biblical command to wear cloths and I find the liberty to not wear cloths (When in an appropriate venue) from Paul's general principle that if someone finds something to be sinful (separating them from God) then they should not do it, but if another person sees nothing wrong with it, then it does not separate them from God and they have the liberty to do that thing.

The bible rarely gets into practical absurdities. Don't bang your
head against the wall. People generally know better. You know
that most people, Christian or not, are offended by nudists. That
puts the practice squarely against Paul's teachings. And Jesus'.

Romans 14:21
1 Corinthians 8:13
Luke 17:1-2

There was only one man in all the bible commanded to walk
around naked and barefoot, and he did so for three years:
Isaiah. He did that as a sign to Egypt and Cush that they were
going to be taken captive by Assyria. It's hard to ignore a man
with no clothes in a world that is clothed.
 
Upvote 0

dayhiker

Mature veteran
Sep 13, 2006
15,557
5,287
MA
✟220,067.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
The bible rarely gets into practical absurdities. Don't bang your
head against the wall. People generally know better. You know
that most people, Christian or not, are offended by nudists. That
puts the practice squarely against Paul's teachings. And Jesus'.

Romans 14:21
1 Corinthians 8:13
Luke 17:1-2

Which is why nudists don't go shopping naked.
Rom.14:22 - Berean Study Bible
Keep your belief about such matters between yourself and God. Blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves.
I like being blessed ....
 
  • Like
Reactions: Darkhorse
Upvote 0

AMOG

Regular Member
Jul 29, 2007
473
51
✟17,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Others
Matthew 5:40 ---“If someone sues you for your coat, give up your shirt as well.” --- In Jewish law if you fail to repay a debt you may be taken to court and if you are still unable to repay, the lender is entitled to take your coat. The lender holds the coat during the day but he is obliged to return it at night because the coat or cloak doubled as a blanket at night. In a two-garment society this would be highly embarrassing to the debtor. However it would be even more embarrassing to the court and the lender if the debtor were to turn over both garments and stand there naked. Remember this was a society with a strong taboo against public nakedness. Using this somewhat risque humour Jesus is once again counseling covert defiance and taking the part of the poor against the rich. I'll bet his audience laughed out loud. Humour is a great aid to the memory.
THis is interesting and different from what I have read about the historical period. was this from a commentary? If so which one. Thanks.
 
Upvote 0

AMOG

Regular Member
Jul 29, 2007
473
51
✟17,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Others
Interesting thing about the 'stumbling' based arguments. Contextually they always speak of causing a weaker brother or a child to stumble. However, they seem to mostly be asserted by people who consider themselves strong in the faith. I have never had a week person or a non Christian "stumble" over someone being a nudist (assuming they are doing so in a proper place, not on the city streets). It seems to be the "strong warriors of the faith" who stumble over this one. The only people questioning the salvation of nudists seem to be those who should know it is not their place to question such things.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

AMOG

Regular Member
Jul 29, 2007
473
51
✟17,349.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Others
The bible rarely gets into practical absurdities. Don't bang your
head against the wall. People generally know better. You know
that most people, Christian or not, are offended by nudists. That
puts the practice squarely against Paul's teachings. And Jesus'.

Romans 14:21
1 Corinthians 8:13
Luke 17:1-2

There was only one man in all the bible commanded to walk
around naked and barefoot, and he did so for three years:
Isaiah. He did that as a sign to Egypt and Cush that they were
going to be taken captive by Assyria. It's hard to ignore a man
with no clothes in a world that is clothed.
Actually, you are factually incorrect. Vast numbers of people in the WORLD are not offended by nudity as it is a part of their culture. Please take a moment and realize that the population of the USA is not MOST of the world. There are vast numbers of people in Africa, Europe, central and south america, Asia, and even australia where public nudity is an every day event and they take no real notice of it. You are arguing from an isolated cultural moras, not from an ethical position or a Biblical perspective. Actually the Bible is very good at speaking up and naming sin as sin. It is when we try to add things to the Bible that we fall into the trap of having to justify why the Bible is silent on the issue. However, in the case of public nudity, I would go further and note that God created us to be nude. That was the original state of man, and it was said to be good. So God did actually take a position on it.
 
Upvote 0

Dave-W

Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2014
30,521
16,866
Maryland - just north of D.C.
Visit site
✟771,800.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Vast numbers of people in the WORLD are not offended by nudity as it is a part of their culture. Please take a moment and realize that the population of the USA is not MOST of the world.
I can hear the nay-sayers now:

"But America is the Godly west. Those other places will cover up as soon as they repent and believe the gospel."

[/sarcasm]
 
Upvote 0

Sheep dog

Active Member
Dec 18, 2017
301
253
67
Okahoma
✟13,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
I have read past threads in this forum on the subject of ''recreational nudity" or "naturists" and though there was some interesting information and opinions there, I would like to focus the discussion a little more in order to lower the noise floor.

I have been a casual, and very occasional nudist for the past 25 years (I am just over 50). However, during the last two years, I have become a much more frequent practitioner. I am now building a cabin at a nudist resort and plan to live there full time. In part it is because the cost of living, month to month, is less than a quarter of the cost of a similar place outside the nudist resort, but it is also because I enjoy being nude in nature and in the micro society of the resort. I also see opportunities for Christian ministry and exhorting the Christians that already live there. (well over half the members self identify as Christian).

I am in the cultural environment of the South Central US. I am a life long evangelical Christian.

I am interested in hearing from people who feel social nudity is sinful or anti Christian. As affirming as the "Yeah, I see no problem with it" comments are, I clearly already believe that way. I am looking for an authentic, well considered, counter opinion. I am also interested in hearing from those people pro and con, who live in other cultures that have widely differing views of nudity.

Since the question is "Is it sinful" then I expect some sort of Biblical support for an argument that there is something wrong with it. For my part, I find no Biblical command to wear cloths and I find the liberty to not wear cloths (When in an appropriate venue) from Paul's general principle that if someone finds something to be sinful (separating them from God) then they should not do it, but if another person sees nothing wrong with it, then it does not separate them from God and they have the liberty to do that thing.

Here are some things I have found to be true during my journey, and some random thoughts of what I have already read here.

1. Social nudity is definaly less sexualy arousing then most forms of dress, even modest dress. If someone is behaving in a sexual way, then yeah, nudity is sexy, but prohibitions against such behaviour are stronger in a nudist group than anywhere else in society. Life in a nudist colony is no more sexually charged then a trip to the Grocery store in the textile world, and much LESS sexualy charged then a trip to the average american beach.

2. "Nudism is about 'being' not 'seeing'. if you go to a nudist resort expecting to see something you will always be disappointed. Every single time. Nudism is a personal experience, not a peep show.

3. Nudist groups should not be confused with 'lifestyle' groups, some of which look a lot like nudist resorts. AANR nudist resorts do not promote any kind of public sex. However, there is a rising interest in nude clubs that do cater to public sex, swingers, alternate lifestyles, etc. these may seem similar to the casual observer but they are worlds apart in reality. I am NOT referring to or interested in discussing lifestyle clubs that may include nudity as I see them as a different issue entirely.

4. I was raised to equate nudity with sexual activity as I would venture to say most kids growing up in the southern US in the 70s were, especially if they were raised in church. Dissociating the two takes time. I think learning to disassociate the two is beneficial.

5. I believe our bodies were designed by God and are 'beautiful' even when we may not feel they are physically attractive. I sometimes wonder if our obsession with covering up what God gave us is not an exercise in vanity. Do we believe that we make ourselves more beautiful then God made us by hiding behind cloths? I'm not trying to be judgemental of others here as the need to wear clothing is a societal imperative. You can't live 100% in a nudist colony. But I do think it is an interesting question to discuss.

6. One poster on a past thread said "I suppose it's okay, but I can't really see Jesus going to a nudist colony." Really? Jesus did a lot of things that the religious folk of his day 'couldn't see him doing'. He associated with Samaritans. He ate with Romans. And their tax collectors. He ignored a host of rabbinic laws. I'm not sure I would cast such a bold statement of what Jesus would or wouldn't do.

7. For many years I have practiced several spiritual disciplines nude. Praying, Studying the Bible, Solitude, etc. As others have noted, it seems different somehow though I cant exactly say how.

8. On a similar note, I have noticed social interactions within the nudist community seem to be more open and with less pretence then in the textile world. Something about shedding you clothes also helps you bring down other facades that stand in the way of authentic fellowship. not always, but it's a general tendency.

9. in the short time I have been working on my cabin in the nudist community, three close friends (who don't know what I'm doing) have all commented that I look happy. I generally consider myself a happy person and I find it strange that something has changed in my demeanor to the point that they notice it. no one ever commented on me looking happy before. I wonder if it is just coincidence, or if something has relaxed in me due to the more 'natural' environment that I am in.

Anyway, that's more than enough general musing. I am interested in hearing what you think.
Interesting post.

I live in the country on a small acreage. It's somewhat private. I do enjoy catching some vitamin D when the temps are above 70. Privacy is a little more difficult. Got new neighbors. Will be planting some green giants ever green trees this spring.

Interacting with other is a problem for me if this issue (nudity) comes up even though God said it's good. People are generally closed and refuse to examine anything they aren't familiar with meaning - it's so because its always been that way, so its right.

It took years for the derogatory gossip to surface about a supposed relationship with a neighbors I did some work for. I no longer do work for any locals. Knew about country life problems by prior experience. They just don't accept new people in their communities very easily. Most new people here tend to bring their city attitude with them - not associating with neighbors. What ever happened to the country atmosphere? We really must attend events to impress people we only discuss trivia and gossip with. Really? Hey but if you'll work for free you're busy all the time.
 
Upvote 0

Sheep dog

Active Member
Dec 18, 2017
301
253
67
Okahoma
✟13,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
The bible rarely gets into practical absurdities. Don't bang your
head against the wall. People generally know better. You know
that most people, Christian or not, are offended by nudists. That
puts the practice squarely against Paul's teachings. And Jesus'.

Romans 14:21
1 Corinthians 8:13
Luke 17:1-2

There was only one man in all the bible commanded to walk
around naked and barefoot, and he did so for three years:
Isaiah. He did that as a sign to Egypt and Cush that they were
going to be taken captive by Assyria. It's hard to ignore a man
with no clothes in a world that is clothed.
Did God command him to sin?
 
Upvote 0

Sheep dog

Active Member
Dec 18, 2017
301
253
67
Okahoma
✟13,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
I can hear the nay-sayers now:

"But America is the Godly west. Those other places will cover up as soon as they repent and believe the gospel."

[/sarcasm]
And yet most of the known world has problems with inappropriate contentography. If we were healthy I don't think that problem would exist at least to the extent it does.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Dave-W

Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2014
30,521
16,866
Maryland - just north of D.C.
Visit site
✟771,800.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
And yet most of the known world has problems with inappropriate contentography. If we were healthy I don't think that problem would exist at least to the extent it does.
"If we were healthy."

I am not sure all of what we deem "inappropriate contentography" is that for much of the rest of the world. We can show people in any sort of activity together or individually. Hunting. Camping. Rock climbing. Deep sea diving. Driving. marching. dancing. playing an instrument or singing. Invasive surgery.

Everything except something sexual. Much of the rest of the world does not make that hard of a division.
 
Upvote 0

Dave-W

Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2014
30,521
16,866
Maryland - just north of D.C.
Visit site
✟771,800.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Upvote 0

Sheep dog

Active Member
Dec 18, 2017
301
253
67
Okahoma
✟13,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
Many would say yes. Just as God told Abraham to sin by killing Isaac.

I would say no.
Most people use the Bible as a quote source only to support their idea. in other words they bring their belief looking for something that seems to support it.
 
Upvote 0

Dave-W

Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2014
30,521
16,866
Maryland - just north of D.C.
Visit site
✟771,800.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Most people use the Bible as a quote source only to support their idea. in other words they bring their belief looking for something that seems to support it.
Indeed. It is called eisegesis.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bugkiller
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Dave-W

Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner!
Site Supporter
Jun 18, 2014
30,521
16,866
Maryland - just north of D.C.
Visit site
✟771,800.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Did God command him to sin?
And would the people who saw him with all his man bits hanging out there sin in doing so? If so, that would have been leading the people into sin. Does God do that?

Did Michelangelo sin when he sculpted a nude King David?
Is that "inappropriate content?"
Would it have been inappropriate content if he was depicted with a large erection?
 
Upvote 0