Must Confession be Catholic?

Rick Otto

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As a Reformed believer I've always admired the Catholic practice of confession. I think that it ends up having some theological pitfalls and my Catholic brothers are welcome to correct me if I'm misunderstanding them. But to me, the pitfalls are:
  1. A notion of penance which appears to be a form of re-payment for our sins.
  2. The insistence that an ordained priest must hear confession in order for a person to receive forgiveness (extenuating circumstances aside).
Reformed types, and by extension most Protestants, have rejected these theological pitfalls, but why have we rejected the practice of confession altogether? The idea of fixed hours wherein parishioners may come to the pastor or elders of the church in order to confess their sins seems to me to be a wonderful help against the corruptions of the flesh. Yet this is not advertised, encouraged, or even practiced among reformed believers and protestants alike.

Why not? Wouldn't we benefit from it?
It's an illegitimate authority being exercised.
People confess their sins to each other and or God, routinely, if not ritually... ya get my drift?
I don't disagree that pastors and ministers should be available and ready for that.
 
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FireDragon76

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I was not aware that the Lutherans practiced confession. What does this look like in the Lutheran church?

General confession and absolution begins at the beginning of the service, usually before the entrance hymn or immediately afterwards. Similar to the Roman Mass.

Pastors can always hear individual confessions privately, and provide spiritual counselling and advice as well. It's very similar to the Catholic practice, though our theology differs. It is traditional among some Lutherans to give a first confession around the time of first communion or Confirmation.

In my pastors conservative LCMS church growing up, confession was required once a month to be a member in good standing. That was normal at some Lutheran churches, though practices differed, at one time. Now days, private confession is rarer, but the rite is still retained.
 
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FireDragon76

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BTW, in the Lutheran church, there is no reason one cannot receive communion without confession, though there might be extenuating circumstances where one should confess their sins privately first, such as perhaps rejecting the faith altogether, or other extreme sins. We believe communion itself gives us assurance of the forgiveness of sins, it is a means of grace. It is just the Gospel being applied to us, either one does the same thing when it is faithfully received, it gives us Jesus present through his Word.

Luther considered absolution a sacrament and wished it to be retained, so it was, though some Lutherans quibble over its status as a sacrament, none disparrages it. It is a blessing if it is done right and for the right reasons.
 
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HereIStand

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General confession and absolution begins at the beginning of the service, usually before the entrance hymn or immediately afterwards. Similar to the Roman Mass.

Pastors can always hear individual confessions privately, and provide spiritual counselling and advice as well. It's very similar to the Catholic practice, though our theology differs. It is traditional among some Lutherans to give a first confession around the time of first communion or Confirmation.

In my pastors conservative LCMS church growing up, confession was required once a month to be a member in good standing. That was normal at some Lutheran churches, though practices differed, at one time. Now days, private confession is rarer, but the rite is still retained.
Having been LCMS, I at times felt the absolution part of the service to be a little jarring. There were different wordings for it. The "your sins are forgiven" wording felt more like a proclamation of forgiveness. But the "I forgive you" felt more like a granting of forgiveness. Hence, it felt more uncomfortable.
 
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FireDragon76

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I actually like the "I forgive you" part, because it's an active tense rather than passive tense. The pastor always makes it clear by what authority he is forgiving- it's in the name of Jesus.

Nontheless, usually the rites we use in the ELCA are passive tense and just declare your sins are forgiven. Either way is fine.
 
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Citizen of the Kingdom

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I actually like the "I forgive you" part, because it's an active tense rather than passive tense. The pastor always makes it clear by what authority he is forgiving- it's in the name of Jesus.

Nontheless, usually the rites we use in the ELCA are passive tense and just declare your sins are forgiven. Either way is fine.
Well that is what Jesus got killed for, likening oneself to God. They knew that only God could forgive sins.
Confession of an alliance to Christ is the main thrust of the term in the NT.
 
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Tom 1

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It is an ancient Orthodox practice for every Christian to have a spiritual father to whom one turns for spiritual advice and counsel.

Going off topic a bit here but how does a person go about choosing a spiritual father in the Orthodox Church? I’m asking because that kind of makes sense of something someone Orthodox told me about their having a spiritual mentor within the church.
 
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Goatee

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I'm glad you appreciate confession, though I think for many Catholics its simply a mechanistic thing, much as how they view other sacraments, and they do not see it as a moment for Jesus, through the priest, to declare their sins are forgiven. That's why I prefer the Lutheran understanding that it is more like a form of preaching, one applied to the individual. Not for the purpose of being your judge, but to strengthen your faith.

That's you own personal view. Very much skewed!
 
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Tom 1

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Possibly. It depends on a level of trust with the mature brother or pastor. As I've heard a Nazarene professor/pastor remark, he did not want people to tell him their stories (embarrassing ones, I assume), because he had to look at them next Sunday.

I think it’s important to have a strong personal relationship with the person you confess your sins to
 
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Halbhh

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As a Reformed believer I've always admired the Catholic practice of confession. I think that it ends up having some theological pitfalls and my Catholic brothers are welcome to correct me if I'm misunderstanding them. But to me, the pitfalls are:
  1. A notion of penance which appears to be a form of re-payment for our sins.
  2. The insistence that an ordained priest must hear confession in order for a person to receive forgiveness (extenuating circumstances aside).
Reformed types, and by extension most Protestants, have rejected these theological pitfalls, but why have we rejected the practice of confession altogether? The idea of fixed hours wherein parishioners may come to the pastor or elders of the church in order to confess their sins seems to me to be a wonderful help against the corruptions of the flesh. Yet this is not advertised, encouraged, or even practiced among reformed believers and protestants alike.

Why not? Wouldn't we benefit from it?

Yes, we are told to confess our sins to one another (or to those mature enough not to condemn us) in the epistle of James (chapter 5). John writes in 1 John chapter 1, "8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness."

So, confession is a necessary thing for all Christians to do at least at times. We should not think of it as an extra, but instead as a necessary.

Of course a pastor can be quite helpful for many that need to confess, to help them do it in real contrition.

To confess sincerely.

But if you are able to confess sincerely with true contrition directly to God in your heart (that is, inside), then this real confession/repentance results in forgiveness. So this is of immediate use to those that don't already have a pastor or elder they feel they can confess to now.

The prayer of a truly believing mature Christian brother or sister is helpful to us, and this is one reason why we should consider if we have an opportunity to confess to another believer who is mature.
 
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Mary of Bethany

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Going off topic a bit here but how does a person go about choosing a spiritual father in the Orthodox Church? I’m asking because that kind of makes sense of something someone Orthodox told me about their having a spiritual mentor within the church.

For most of us, our priest is our confessor or spiritual father. It is our priest who has gotten to know us and know the sins we struggle with, and so can best counsel us. Some people have monastics as a spiritual father or mother. Priests have other, usually older priests as confessors. Everyone, layperson, priest, bishop, monastic - has someone to whom they confess and receive counsel.

Mary
 
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FireDragon76

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That's you own personal view. Very much skewed!

I said many, not all, or even most. The Catholics that leave mass halfway immediately after they receive communion don't exactly refute a mechanist view of the sacraments.

Lutherans do have different attitudes about the sacraments, we don't regard them as being completely discrete things, ex opere operato. They are all the Word applied to us. Receiveing communion then skipping town would be as strange to us and putting on your shirt and not your pants. Maybe you do it an emergency, but otherwise it's tasteless.
 
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Goatee

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I said many, not all, or even most. The Catholics that leave mass halfway immediately after they receive communion don't exactly refute a mechanist view of the sacraments.

Lutherans do have different attitudes about the sacraments, we don't regard them as being completely discrete things, ex opere operato. They are all the Word applied to us. Receiveing communion then skipping town would be as strange to us and putting on your shirt and not your pants. Maybe you do it an emergency, but otherwise it's tasteless.

Your own personal view!
 
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FenderTL5

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Going off topic a bit here but how does a person go about choosing a spiritual father in the Orthodox Church? I’m asking because that kind of makes sense of something someone Orthodox told me about their having a spiritual mentor within the church.
When I came into the church (Chrismation 2015), working with the parish priest during catechism, I was introduced the the older gentleman who would be my mentor.
I know there are members of our parish who have a spiritual father in nearby monasteries and they will make their confession there. I'm unsure of how that process works. Our priest has mentioned, on several occasions, that he has a spiritual father that he makes regular confession in the presence of.
I still make my Confession in the presence of our parish Priest (confession is to God, not the priest). Unfortunately for me, my mentor has since passed away and I turn to several elders in the church for advice as well as the priest.
 
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Most evangelicals see confession as either or, when it's both and in Scripture.

(Jas 5:16 [ESV]) "Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working."

Apostates, religious hypocrites, and unbelievers in the Church have made the practice of confession to one another undesirable to say the least. People lie, and use knowledge to damage other people. Most of us would rather avoid the shame, embarrassment, judgmental attitudes, and harassment altogether.

For me, I suppose you could say my Christian mother is my Catholic priestess, she knows more about my past sins than anybody in the world. I know her and trust her, I know she loves me and means me no harm.
 
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Rick Otto

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That's you own personal view. Very much skewed!
Not to disagree with you, but I remember the 'mechanistic view' being predominate in my RC experience. I accepted it as normal, as I accepted the general view that I wasn't normal.
A lot of people hold that 'view' without being conscious of it. In fact, most are in denial of it.

I'm also not offering this observation as comment on relative worth of any sect or denomination.
 
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