What would you do for unity?

[Monk Brendan]

They are just paintings, not windows into heaven.

Can you prove that? If you try to understand the message of the icon, you will not receive a revelation? But first, you have to look, which you don't do, because "they are just paintings."

 

[Monk Brendan]

OOOps!

 

[Monk Brendan]

For some reasons this posted three times.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Christ is not standing in front of you. That is actually another human being that you are taking for diety and acsribing grace as coming from something other than God. How can Christ ever come to know you if you ignor that He is alive and accessable? How could you not agree with the final verdict of "I knew you not" when you never make the effort to go to Him? I don't get why you would substitute a fake Christ ... I wish I didn't have to ask that.

Are you questioning MY walk with Christ? That's against the rules, you know.

However, I am not taking another person for a DEITY (please learn how to spell). I said the the priest is standing In Persona Christi. In persona Christi is a Latin phrase meaning “in the person of Christ”, an important concept in Catholicism and, in Orthodoxy and other Pre-Reformation Churches. A priest is In persona Christi, because he acts as is if Jesus was standing right there. I am not telling my sins to a priest, I am telling those sins to Jesus, and it is Jesus who forgives. The reason that a priest is there is if I might need counseling, or just someone to BE there, or just to listen.

 

[Monk Brendan]

That is actually another human being

Do you think I am stupid? Don't you think that I had that one figured out by the time I was 6? I KNOW he is just a man--in the old days, anonymous, behind a screen, but I still was able to figure out that the man coaxing me to continue, asking me to explain--if not to him, at least to myself--and pulling me up short if he thought I was justifying myself. You must think I haven't come out from under the cabbage leaf yet.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

Do you think I am stupid?

Are you questioning MY walk with Christ? That's against the rules, you know..

No to both... obviously.

 

[W2L]

Can you prove that? If you try to understand the message of the icon, you will not receive a revelation? But first, you have to look, which you don't do, because "they are just paintings."

The Lord is within. Why would i need a painting when He is within? What mystical experience can be greater than seeing the Lord lead you from within?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Okay! So let's get on with it. Most Protestants claim that we bow down and worship statues. WE DO NOT!

Then please explain to us what the point of them is... and why people pray to them?

Most Protestants have a problem with Mary, the Mother of Jesus. We keep her to the forefront, because she was the FIRST one to accept God's grace, no matter what; we refer to her as Theotokos (Mother of God) because we believe that since Jesus is God, and was God at His birth, she should be allowed a little bit more mention than the Protestants give her. You only trot her out on Christmas Eve, and then she goes back into her box until the next December 24.

But you do consider her a co-redeemer with Christ, right? I heard about a common "joke" among Catholics that goes something like this..."If Jesus refuses to let you into Heaven through the front gate, Mary will let you in by the back." I confirmed this with Catholics I know...

We confess to a priest because when he is hearing my confession, he is acting in Persona Christi--as if Christ was also standing in front of me. And He is, and forgiveness flows from Christ through the priest to me.

Mark 2:7
Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?

The belief, "in persona Christi" and "alter Christus" is heresy.. the first meaning "in the very person of Christ" and the second "another Christ", both referring to the roles the Catholic priest invokes. What is the verse that deals with other (false) Christ's?

Matthew 24:23-25
Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

2

 

[The Times]

I look at unity from the vantage point of the Holy Spirit, to whom we are all under His Grace. When we unite in the last hour, it will not be like the unification of the beast that was, is not and will be yet again. We unite under one Lordship, who is Jesus Christ, so the only way I see this unity coming about, across all denominations, is if the once shepherds of the flock, be removed, so that all sheep of the different flocks are allowed to run to their one Master/Patriach/Pope/High Priest, King of kings Jesus Christ.

Until then, the worldly unification of denominations will give rise to the beast that once was, until the disillusion manifests within the masses, who have succumbed to the grand deception.

I believe the falling away will also bring about this disillusion, whereby Lucifer the author of confusion will remove the hope that once was amongst the masses who knew not Jesus Christ. From this point onwards true Christianity will manifest like never before, with flying colours, then the killing games will begin to silence true Christianity forever, then Jesus through the Spirit of truth will fight with his enemies and will send his Holy Angels to inflict much pain upon those not having the seal of the living God. The fall must come first and the fallen must ratify their allegiance to the king of this world, when he comes in pomp and ceremony.

all who were kings of the nations.
All of them will answer and say to you:
‘You too have become as weak as we!
You have become like us!’
Your pomp is brought down to Hell. (Isaiah 14:9-11)

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

How then do we walk in unity when we are divided?

"We"? maybe not all.

For those IN JESUS:
Oldest , best answer: follow Jesus.

Oh, this is only for those who are willing, not for those who are not.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

All im suggesting is that we seek the unity that the apostles teach us

hmmmm.......

Remember the Father reveals everything concerning true Salvation to infants who trust Him actively and rely on HIm. (in this life and in the next life).....

The Apostles all knew this experientially, as also the disciples learned. (repeated throughout the New Testament) .....

Those who follow someone else, it is necessary to tell them "bye", if anything .....

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

The Lord is within. Why would i need a painting when He is within? What mystical experience can be greater than seeing the Lord lead you from within?

As you already know, good -
God's Own Word:
"little children, keep yourselves from idols" (as God calls them, not as man does)

 

[W2L]

hmmmm.......

Remember the Father reveals everything concerning true Salvation to infants who trust Him actively and rely on HIm. (in this life and in the next life).....

The Apostles all knew this experientially, as also the disciples learned. (repeated throughout the New Testament) .....

Those who follow someone else, it is necessary to tell them "bye", if anything .....

Preach the Word.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Preach the Word.

Jesus came
telling people: Turn to Yahweh, (God's Name not permitted in the world church),
because His Kingdom is at hand, now, today. Don't wait, but seek Him while there is still time. I know you don't know how, so come to Me, and I will show you how (with My Life, and My Word, and My deeds) . Do not worry any longer like the gentiles do, about the things necessary for life - the heavenly Father already knows all that you need, and He cares for you. Let Him handle and direct your life, and free you from all the guilt and the shame of sin; let Him give you a new heart , with TORAH written on it, and let Him refresh/renew your mind, and let Him 'birth' you anew with a new and living spirit. Everyone who comes to Me, I will in no wise cast out. I will never leave you nor forsake you, even to the ends of the earth.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Can you prove that? If you try to understand the message of the icon, you will not receive a revelation? But first, you have to look, which you don't do, because "they are just paintings."

I've got an iconic magic 8 ball that you can look at to receive a revelation.. is that the same thing?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

... I wish I didn't have to ask that.

Different people learn different things , and usually believe what they are told when they are children, especially by their parents....
God's hand is not so short that there is anyplace in the world He cannot reach, right ? So whether a child or an adult (or a teen), everyone who seeks God finds Him, right ? That is God's Own Promise, not man's...

 

[Monk Brendan]

But you do consider her a co-redeemer with Christ, right? I heard about a common "joke" among Catholics that goes something like this..."If Jesus refuses to let you into Heaven through the front gate, Mary will let you in by the back." I confirmed this with Catholics I know...

There is NO teaching of the Catholic Churches that define Mary as Co-Redempterist!
And you will not be able to find it!--using Official Catholic books of Doctrine, that is. Father So and So's Little Book of Treasures from the Church is NOT Catholic Doctrine.

Christ is not standing in front of you. That is actually another human being that you are taking for diety and acsribing grace as coming from something other than God. How can Christ ever come to know you if you ignor that He is alive and accessable? How could you not agree with the final verdict of "I knew you not" when you never make the effort to go to Him? I don't get why you would substitute a fake Christ ... I wish I didn't have to ask that.

It does sound as if you are judging me, telling me that I can never be a Christian.

However, I am not taking another person for a DEITY (please learn how to spell). I said the the priest is standing In Persona Christi. In persona Christi is a Latin phrase meaning “in the person of Christ”, an important concept in Catholicism and, in Orthodoxy and other Pre-Reformation Churches. A priest is In persona Christi, because he acts as is if Jesus was standing right there. I am not telling my sins to a priest, I am telling those sins to Jesus, and it is Jesus who forgives. The reason that a priest is there is if I might need counseling, or just someone to BE there, or just to listen.

How is that bowing down to an alternate deity? In actuality, I know that Jesus IS there! I said that I am confessing to Jesus.

Then please explain to us what the point of them is... and why people pray to them?

Again, these are representations of the saints in heaven, or of Jesus. Remember, we are not under LAW, but under GRACE. That is, an unmerited mercy of God. Same thing as Icons.

 

[Monk Brendan]

I've got an iconic magic 8 ball that you can look at to receive a revelation.. is that the same thing?

That is impious, and slandering the Holy Spirit, and it is NOT funny.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

It does sound as if you are judging me, telling me that I can never be a Christian.

Not so. I said that having a substitution for Christ is not the same as the real thing when the real thing is available. But your answer got me thinking that it's a heart thing.