Matthew 25 Jesus Returns In Final Judgment, Eternal Kingdom

[SeventyOne]

I don't know the exact day, but it did take place as Jesus said: his audience's generation.

You ever do a word study where you are using the word translated 'this' in Matthew 24:34. It's used to mean 'this one' or 'the same'. Jesus even uses it a few sentences before, in verse 13, 'But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.' This is not the same usage as you are assigning to it in verse 34.

When He's talking in verse 34, it is being qualified by verse 33, 'So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This (or 'the same') generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.'

 

[seventysevens]

this teaching will help seat the future?

AKA the Antichrist

explain

 

[seventysevens]

I don't know the exact day, but it did take place as Jesus said: his audience's generation.

Here is my answer to your question: if Jesus said that the son of man would come during the lifetime of his audience, then I believe Him.

The second advent is the same as Jesus 2nd coming or the return of Jesus
If you think that happened don't you think there would be a lot of evidence that he was here a second time ? Bible tells us that when he returns there will be no more wars at all , where is the evidence that the war in Meggido has happened , how do you support such a claim , saying you don't know the exact day ...why not ? don't you think that would be the slam dunk if you could prove any of this claim of yours ?

What do you call the Last Days , and how do you define when it is ?

 

[Truth7t7]

seventysevens: explain

You teach Jesus Will return physically to Jerusalem?

The Antichrist will proclaim to be God the Messiah in Jerusalem?

The 42 month time frame between the two events you teach, will be blurred and erased, as the world and apostate church receives the man of sin with open arms, plain and simple!

Jesus won't return to this earth, and hang out with mortal humans as you teach, Jesus warned the believer against this teaching Matthew 24:23-27

"Believe It Not"!

Jesus Christ Is The Lord

Truth7t7

 

[seventysevens]

You teach Jesus Will return physically to Jerusalem?

The Antichrist will proclaim to be God the Messiah in Jerusalem?

The 42 month time frame between the two events you teach, will be blurred and erased, as the world and apostate church receives the man of sin with open arms, plain and simple!

Jesus won't return to this earth, and hang out with mortal humans as you teach, Jesus warned the believer against this teaching Matthew 24:23-27

"Believe It Not"!

Jesus Christ Is The Lord

Truth7t7

The 42 months is the period of time the Great trib lasts and at the end of those 42 months Jesus returns and casts the antichrist alive into the lake of fire
What part of that don't you understand?
The ONLY reason Jesus came to earth is to be with humans and die on the cross for them

Jesus hung out with humans the first time he was here , even being born through the womb of a human , why would you think he would not come to earth to visit humans again? He came because the humans were here
How do you substantiate this claim?

The deeper meaning is that this is a spiritual battle between God and the fallen angel lucifer/satan
Those who live for Christ live in eternal bliss
Those who reject Christ go to the same place satan goes when he is judged -Lake of Fire

 

[BABerean2]

Jesus hung out with humans the first time he was here , even being born through the womb of a human , why would you think he would not come to earth to visit humans again? He came because the humans were here

1Co 15:50　 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.　

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[seventysevens]

1Co 15:50　 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.　

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1Co 15:51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.
54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.


Since lucifer said that he would replace God his creator this is a spiritual battle and lucifer wants to destroy as much of Gods beloved humans as he can by tricking them into believing God is not real

 

[jgr]

We will disagree, you believe Matthew 24:21 is a literal tribulation, literal temple, armies, people fleeing, and you deny a literal second coming is seen in Matthew 24:29 "They shall see the Son of man coming"

You deny the second advent as literal, because it disproves your 70AD fulfillment of the "Great Trib"

The entire chapter of Matthew 24 is dedicated to the second advent.

Twist and Bend the very plain and simple scripture, to make the preterist system work

The dispy's pre-trib rapture is more believable than your preterist eschatology in 70AD fulfillment.

We will disagree

You haven't addressed the use of symbolic language in the cited passages.

Nor have you addressed the abundance of historical evidence which confirms Christ's predictions.

I don't deny the second advent as literal. I believe it begins in verse 36, where Christ begins to address the disciples' second question "what is the sign of the end of the world?" Up to that point, He has been answering the other question "what is the sign of Thy coming?".

But yes, we are all free to disagree.

There is much about which we do agree.

 

[claninja]

You ever do a word study where you are using the word translated 'this' in Matthew 24:34. It's used to mean 'this one' or 'the same'. Jesus even uses it a few sentences before, in verse 13, 'But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.' This is not the same usage as you are assigning to it in verse 34.

When He's talking in verse 34, it is being qualified by verse 33, 'So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This (or 'the same') generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.'

Matthew 24:13 But the one who endures to the end will be saved.
Correct me if I am wrong, but it sounds like you are saying this: the one who endures is "the same" as the one who is saved. Is that correct?

So by that logic in Matthew 23:33-34 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 34Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

The ones who see all these things, are “the same" as the generation that will not pass away. So Who is the one that "sees all these things"? It is pretty clear that the "you" Jesus is talking to is the disciples, which would be "the same" as this generation.

We can also clarify this with other biblical texts

Matthew 16:27-28
For the Son of Man is going to come with his angels in the glory of his Father, and then he will repay each person according to what he has done. 28Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”

The some standing here are the disciples Who would not taste death until they see the son of man coming in his kingdom.

Matthew 23:35-36
so that on you (pharisees, scribes, unfaithful Israel) may come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah the son of Barachiah,f whom you murdered between the sanctuary and the altar. 36Truly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

The subjects of this topic are again who Jesus is talking to (the pharisees and scribes). Jesus says all the righteous blood shed is on unfaithful Israel, and it will specifically fall on "the same" generation jesus is talking to.

Matthew 26:64
Jesus said to him, “You have said so. But I tell you, from now on you will see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of Power and coming on the clouds of heaven.

When did the pharisees see Jesus coming on the clouds of heaven? From now on.

 

[claninja]

You ever do a word study where you are using the word translated 'this' in Matthew 24:34. It's used to mean 'this one' or 'the same'. Jesus even uses it a few sentences before, in verse 13, 'But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.' This is not the same usage as you are assigning to it in verse 34.

When He's talking in verse 34, it is being qualified by verse 33, 'So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This (or 'the same') generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.'

Was Jesus rejected by a future generation? Will he suffer under a future generation?

Then He said to the disciples, “The time is coming when you will long to see one of the days of the Son of Man, but you will not see it. 23People will tell you, ‘Look, there He is,’ or ‘Here He is.’ Do not go out or chase after them. 24For as the lightning flashes and lights up the sky from one end to the other, so will be the Son of Man in His day. 25But first He must suffer many things and be rejected by this generation.

 

[claninja]

The second advent is the same as Jesus 2nd coming or the return of Jesus

Correct

If you think that happened don't you think there would be a lot of evidence that he was here a second time ?

Luke 17:20-21
Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, “The kingdom of God is not coming in ways that can be observed, 21nor will they say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or ‘There!’ for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.”h

Bible tells us that when he returns there will be no more wars at all

I assume you are talking about Isaiah 2:4?
And He will judge between the nations, And will render decisions for many peoples; And they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, And never again will they learn war.


Do true Christians advance the kingdom with physical violence on the Earth? Or did we exchange the old covenant ways (conquering the land of canaan through violence) with the spreading of the gospel of peace; Ephesians 6:15 and, as shoes for your feet, having put on the readiness given by the gospel of peace.

John 18:36
“My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm.”

where is the evidence that the war in Meggido has happened , how do you support such a claim ,

Revelation doesn't say a war will take place in Meggido, only that kings were gathered there

The Romans had an army camp there and used it as a way to travel to Jerusalem.

saying you don't know the exact day ...why not ?

It was some time in 70 AD, but only the father knows they day and hour. Most likely around the time of the temple destruction.

don't you think that would be the slam dunk if you could prove any of this claim of yours ?

Nope, as people will believe what they want to. People didn't believe Jesus, even when miracles were shown to them.

What do you call the Last Days , and how do you define when it is ?

I define "the last days" as the apostles do. The times they were living in aka, the last days of the Old covenant

Acts 2:16
but this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel: 17‘AND IT SHALL BE IN THE LAST DAYS,’ God says,

Hebrews 1:2
2in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

1 corinthians 10:11
Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.

 

[Truth7t7]

Correct


Luke 17:20-21
Being askexplanati. s when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, “The kingdom of God is not coming in ways that can be observed, 21nor will they say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or ‘There!’ for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you.”h



I assume you are talking about Isaiah 2:4?
And He will judge between the nations, And will render decisions for many peoples; And they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, And never again will they learn war.


Do true Christians advance the kingdom with physical violence on the Earth? Or did we exchange the old covenant ways (conquering the land of canaan through violence) with the spreading of the gospel of peace; Ephesians 6:15 and, as shoes for your feet, having put on the readiness given by the gospel of peace.

John 18:36
“My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm.”





Revelation doesn't say a war will take place in Meggido, only that kings were gathered there

The Romans had an army camp there and used it as a way to travel to Jerusalem.



It was some time in 70 AD, but only the father knows they day and hour. Most likely around the time of the temple destruction.



Nope, as people will believe what they want to. People didn't believe Jesus, even when miracles were shown to them.



I define "the last days" as the apostles do. The times they were living in aka, the last days of the Old covenant

Acts 2:16
but this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel: 17‘AND IT SHALL BE IN THE LAST DAYS,’ God says,

Hebrews 1:2
2in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.

1 corinthians 10:11
Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.

Do you believe in a future second coming/advent of Jesus Christ?

Simple yes/no?

Do you believe in a future bodily resurrection of the believer?

Simple yes/no?

 

[seventysevens]

I don't know the exact day, but it did take place as Jesus said: his audience's generation.

Here is my answer to your question: if Jesus said that the son of man would come during the lifetime of his audience, then I believe Him.

The second advent is the same as Jesus 2nd coming or the return of Jesus
If you think that happened don't you think there would be a lot of evidence that he was here a second time ?
You simply doing an evasive dance to avoid admitting how wrong you are
EVERYONE who follows Jesus is waiting on him to arrive ,
Scripture clearly states that Jesus return will be the single biggest most Glorious event to happen in all of earths existence , It will be IMPOSSIBLE for the entire earth NOT to know exactly when Jesus return , You say that he has returned but you have zero data to show that he has , you pretend that you know scripture but you have no clue about what it means or why it was written. You don't know why Jesus will return , you have no idea if he was here , no explanation why he is not here now , no explanation why the things that Jesus said would happen have not happened...simply because he has not yet returned and you cannot admit that you are so very very wrong

 

[claninja]

Do you believe in a future second coming/advent of Jesus Christ?

Simple yes/no?

Do you believe in a future bodily resurrection of the believer?

Simple yes/no?

1. No, not future, already happened. As I have already told a couple times now.
2. Yes.

 

[Truth7t7]

1. No, not future, already happened. As I have already told a couple times now.
2. Yes.

Do you believe in a future final judgment?

 

[claninja]

The second advent is the same as Jesus 2nd coming or the return of Jesus
If you think that happened don't you think there would be a lot of evidence that he was here a second time ?

already answered, see previous post.

You simply doing an evasive dance to avoid admitting how wrong you are

Instead of telling me Im dancing and very wrong. Refute the scriptures I posted and how you would interpret them. that's how debates work. So far you have not been able to do that.

EVERYONE who follows Jesus is waiting on him to arrive ,

Not preterists.

Scripture clearly states that Jesus return will be the single biggest most Glorious event to happen in all of earths existence ,

I disagree, scripture talks more about his first coming. and that was glorious.

You say that he has returned but you have zero data to show that he has ,

I have showed you multiple times where Jesus says it will be during his audience generation.
I trust the words of Christ. If he said some standing here will not pass away until they see the son of man coming in his kingdom, then I faith that he did.

You don't know why Jesus will return , you have no idea if he was here , no explanation why he is not here now , no explanation why the things that Jesus said would happen have not happened...simply because he has not yet returned and you cannot admit that you are so very very wrong

Straw man argument. Rebuttal the verses i have posted instead of making up new arguments.

 

[claninja]

Do you believe in a future final judgment?

yes. when we die, we will certainly stand before the lord

 

[Truth7t7]

yes. when we die, we will certainly stand before the lord

How does the resurrection of the believer take place?

At his personal time of death?

How does the final judgment of the believer take place?

At his personal time of death?

 

[seventysevens]

I disagree, scripture talks more about his first coming. and that was glorious.
Revelation doesn't say a war will take place in Meggido, only that kings were gathered there

The designation of a Valley of Jehoshaphat is applied as a specific toponym for the first time by the pilgrim of Bordeaux, in 333. Since then it has become a general designation for the Kidron Valley, between Jerusalem and the Mount of Olives, which is repeatedly mentioned in the Old Testament and the New, under its own name.
Valley of Meggido , Valley of Jezzreal are in the same place all in the very same area as the war moves along the valley

Book of Ezekiel has about 4 full chapters on this very same war

Rev17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, “Come, gather together for the great supper of God, 18 so that you may eat the flesh of kings, generals, and the mighty, of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all people, free and slave, great and small.”

19 Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to wage war against the rider on the horse and his army. 20 But the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who had performed the signs on its behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur. 21 The rest were killed with the sword coming out of the mouth of the rider on the horse, and all the birds gorged themselves on their flesh.

Matthew 24 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather

Jol 3
“In those days and at that time, when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,
2 I will gather all nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat.
There I will put them on trial for what they did to my inheritance, my people Israel,
because they scattered my people among the nations and divided up my land.
3 They cast lots for my people and traded boys for prostitutes; they sold girls for wine to drink.
9 Proclaim this among the nations: Prepare for war! Rouse the warriors!
Let all the fighting men draw near and attack.
10 Beat your plowshares into swords
and your pruning hooks into spears.
Let the weakling say,
“I am strong!”
11 Come quickly, all you nations from every side, and assemble there.
Bring down your warriors, Lord!
12 “Let the nations be roused;let them advance into the Valley of Jehoshaphat,
for there I will sit to judge all the nations on every side.

14 Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision!
For the day of the Lord is near in the valley of decision.
The sun and moon will be darkened, and the stars no longer shine.
16 The Lord will roar from Zion
and thunder from Jerusalem;
the earth and the heavens will tremble.
But the Lord will be a refuge for his people,
a stronghold for the people of Israel.

YES there will be war , the bloodiest most horrific war the world has or will ever see during this GREAT TRIBULATION !

Even the scientists tell us that Israel has the worlds largest population of every type of carnivorous flesh eating birds

Scripture proving you wrong !

 

[BABerean2]

I have showed you multiple times where Jesus says it will be during his audience generation.
I trust the words of Christ. If he said some standing here will not pass away until they see the son of man coming in his kingdom, then I faith that he did.

Some aspect of the kingdom came into being during His earthly ministry found below.

Mat_12:28　 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.

The 500 or more who saw Him alive after being crucifed, saw some aspect of the kingdom.

Neither of these mean that He will not come back for us in the future.

Based on Luke 21:24-28, a period of time known as "the times of the Gentiles" will occur before His future Second Coming.
We see in Luke 21:24 that part of it occurs after 70 AD.

.