The Beast

[Tree of Life]

He appears in Revelation 13, among other places:

5 And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. 6 It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. 7 Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation, 8 and all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain. 9 If anyone has an ear, let him hear:

10 If anyone is to be taken captive,
to captivity he goes;
if anyone is to be slain with the sword,
with the sword must he be slain.

Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.​

The Beast gets his authority from the dragon (Satan).

The Beast is a symbol of human government which rejects God and sets itself against God. There's an interesting Biblical tension with human government. On the one hand, it was instituted by God (Genesis 9) and can be a great force of good. On the other hand, when it sets itself against God it can be a great force for evil (Genesis 11). When a human government acknowledges the Creator then it can be ok because that government is self-limiting. It doesn't see its laws as the highest law. But when it refuses to acknowledge God then things get scary. At that point, the only basis for morality is human law which is democratically (or otherwise) established. It's the will of God versus the will of the people. And when the will of the people overthrows God on a governmental level then it's the will of sinful people which becomes the basis of morality and becomes enforceable on its citizens - leading to the oppression of the godly.

So the Beast is human government set in opposition to God. It will be allowed to conquer the church and, in some sense, destroy the church before the end. But Jesus will come back and whup the Beast and vindicate his church by raising her from the dead.

As an aside, The USA resembles the Beast more and more every day. But this could be true of any nation at any time.

 

[David Kent]

You make too much of the USA. The beast is Rome.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

You make too much of the USA. The beast is Rome.

I agree

however there is a second beast
Revelation 13:11
And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.

This is the USA in prophecy.

 

[seventysevens]

Will have to wait to see how things go the next few years, USA has been looking like a spiritual Babylon with all the crazy stuff that has happened over the last decade or two especially the last decade , the current Pres has done more than any pres in the last 2 decades to bring God back to our government , while the last pres tried very hard to remove God from our country . A pres does not have to be A Christian to bring our country back to God . Our current pres maybe the equivalent of a modern day Cyrus as there are a lot of similarities , only time will tell , thing is with all those who love to believe the media and many of the country's people turning away from God it be hard to say where we are headed , so far so good , will have to wait it out

 

[Tree of Life]

You make too much of the USA. The beast is Rome.

Rome could've been beastly. The Beast should not be identified with one historical referent.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

Rome could've been beastly. The Beast should not be identified with one historical referent.

How about 13 identifing charachteristics in Prophecy?
Daniel's dream describes a little horn that arises from among the ten horns of the fourth terrible beast. The little horn power represents the Antichrist and is described in Daniel's dream with great detail so that we can clearly identify who this end-time enemy will be. Since we don't want to make any mistake, it is essential that we correctly identify this power.

Daniel 7 gives us very precise identifying features of the horn, and every single one must apply in order to make an accurate identification possible. The 13 features are as follows:

1. It arose out of the fourth beast.
2. It came up among the ten horns.
3. It came up after the ten horns had been established.
4. It was to uproot three horns.
5. It was to be greater than the others.
6. It was to be different than the others.
7. It was to have eyes like the eyes of a man and speak great words against God.
8. It was to make war on God's saints.
9. It would think to change times and laws.
10.The saints were to be handed over to it for a time and times and half a time.
11. It shall devour the whole earth.
12. It shall reign until the Ancient of Days comes.
13. Its dominion will be taken away.

The Antichrist power has to fulfill all of the characteristics given in the Bible. It cannot meet only some of them. Thirteen times in the above articles, we see how the papal system qualifies for all the identifying points of the little horn power of Daniel 7, as sad and shocking as it may seem. It is essential that we realize that the Bible is not dealing with individuals, but with a religious and political system that for more than 1500 years has claimed the power to control the planet’s conscience. Moreover, for a set time, it had power to enforce its decrees and to persecute all who chose to obey God and His Word.

Identifying the Antichrist | Prophecy of Daniel | Religious and Political System

Reformers who identified the Beast/anti-christ
Calvin and Luther were not the only church leaders to identify the Antichrist. A host of reformers identified the Antichrist as the Papacy, such as Thomas Cranmer ("Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons"vii), John Knox ("Hitherto the pope has been antichrist"viii), John Wesley ("He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers"ix), John Wycliffe, John Huss, Jerome, and John Melanchthon.

Others who identify the Antichrist

 

[Tree of Life]

Since the term "Antichrist" does not occur in Revelation or in Daniel I think this significantly weakens your argument.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

Since the term "Antichrist" does not occur in Revelation or in Daniel I think this significantly weakens your argument.

Tell that to the reformers who went to thier death because they would not recant.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

Since the term "Antichrist" does not occur in Revelation or in Daniel I think this significantly weakens your argument.

If the beast is against or in place of Christ then he is ant-christ.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

Since the term "Antichrist" does not occur in Revelation or in Daniel I think this significantly weakens your argument.

the founders of your church
"Being Presbyterian refers to a theological heritage started by Martin Luther and refined by John Calvin. The roots of the Presbyterian Church go all the way back to Protestant Reformation, led by Martin Luther."

taught that the anti-christ was the papal system.

I take it your church no longer followes the teaching of the founders based on your comments.

 

[Tree of Life]

If the beast is against or in place of Christ then he is ant-christ.

Anyone who denies Christ is an antiChrist.

 

[Tree of Life]

the founders of your church
"Being Presbyterian refers to a theological heritage started by Martin Luther and refined by John Calvin. The roots of the Presbyterian Church go all the way back to Protestant Reformation, led by Martin Luther."

taught that the anti-christ was the papal system.

I take it your church no longer followes the teaching of the founders based on your comments.

We do not. Luther is the father of Lutheranism, by the way. Very different from Presbyterianism. But, no, very few of us believe that the Pope is an antiChrist.

 

[FireDragon76]

We do not. Luther is the father of Lutheranism, by the way. Very different from Presbyterianism. But, no, very few of us believe that the Pope is an antiChrist.

Yeah, very different. The Reformed movement was actually started by an opponent of Luther, Huldrich Zwingli. We only agree on some things... not all, because we share a common late renaissance humanist religious heritage, which was common to many educated theologians of the day.

Few Reformers went to their deaths as martyrs, and from its origins the movement was enmeshed it wordly politics as much as religion. It is wrong to identify the Roman church as being the beast. People can follow Jesus in many different churches.

I agree that the imagery in Revelation refers to no particular time period. It is about the eternal struggle of good vs. evil.

 

[Revealing Times]

He appears in Revelation 13, among other places:

5 And the beast was given a mouth uttering haughty and blasphemous words, and it was allowed to exercise authority for forty-two months. 6 It opened its mouth to utter blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name and his dwelling, that is, those who dwell in heaven. 7 Also it was allowed to make war on the saints and to conquer them. And authority was given it over every tribe and people and language and nation, 8 and all who dwell on earth will worship it, everyone whose name has not been written before the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who was slain. 9 If anyone has an ear, let him hear:

10 If anyone is to be taken captive,
to captivity he goes;
if anyone is to be slain with the sword,
with the sword must he be slain.

Here is a call for the endurance and faith of the saints.​

The Beast gets his authority from the dragon (Satan).

The Beast is a symbol of human government which rejects God and sets itself against God. There's an interesting Biblical tension with human government. On the one hand, it was instituted by God (Genesis 9) and can be a great force of good. On the other hand, when it sets itself against God it can be a great force for evil (Genesis 11). When a human government acknowledges the Creator then it can be ok because that government is self-limiting. It doesn't see its laws as the highest law. But when it refuses to acknowledge God then things get scary. At that point, the only basis for morality is human law which is democratically (or otherwise) established. It's the will of God versus the will of the people. And when the will of the people overthrows God on a governmental level then it's the will of sinful people which becomes the basis of morality and becomes enforceable on its citizens - leading to the oppression of the godly.

So the Beast is human government set in opposition to God. It will be allowed to conquer the church and, in some sense, destroy the church before the end. But Jesus will come back and whup the Beast and vindicate his church by raising her from the dead.

As an aside, The USA resembles the Beast more and more every day. But this could be true of any nation at any time.

The LAST BEAST is a Man, the other Six Heads of the Rev. 13 Beast are indeed Governments, but so is the last Beast, what you do not get is the 10 Horns (Kings) freely give their POWERS unto this ONE MAN.......Rev. 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

So these 10 Kings are END TIME KINGS, they are not the RCC as Happy Camper is trying to say, they receive power ONE HOUR (Short time) with the Beast, not nearly 2000 years.

The Five Kings (Beasts) who have fallen per Rev. 17 are Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece, the One King (Beast) that WAS is/was of course Rome. The One that is YET TO COME is of course the coming Anti-Christ/Little Horn/BEAST.

Why are/was Governments Beasts? Because the bible is about Israel and these were the 6 Powers that Ruled, Enslaved or Conquered Israel throughout Israel's LIFE-SPAN. The Statue is basically the same but its only from Daniel's life forward, as were his Beasts, but the Rev. Beast adds in all of the actual Beasts because its a look back in time. The Statue stops at the Rome legs and goes forward 2000 years to the End Time Toes because it is a SNAPSHOT of Israel's LIFE-SPAN !! Israel is no more for a 2000 year period from 70-130 AD to 1948, God saw them as Dead Men's Bones, he gave Ezekiel a prophecy about them being such. Then God told him, son of man, can these bones live again and Ezekiel said, Thou knowest oh Lord (Good Answer LOL) And thus God showed him those bones rising from the Dead, skin forming on them, and God breathing life back into Israel again, thus Israel was REBORN in 1948.

Rome Ceased being a Beast when Israel was dispersed 2000 years ago and became as Dead men's bones. Thus the MORTAL WOUND of Rev. 13. Only when Israel was reborn could there ever be another Beast come forth OVER ISRAEL !! Thus when this BEAST/Man/Anti-Christ/Little Horn Conquers Jerusalem/Israel he then and ONLY THEN Becomes the BEAST for 42 Months. He is a Man, Daniel tells us that if we listen.........Dan. 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame. (HELL......Matches Rev. 19)

Rev. 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

So when this MAN/BEAST Conquers Jerusalem, the MORTAL WOUND IS HEALED !! Its a figurative wound of course. The Beast has nothing to do with the RCC or with Islam, that is two head-fakes by Satan or outright lies.

The Church is GONE/Raptured, the Saints are the Israeli people at this point who are overcome by the Beast, the ones that heed Jesus' words and flee (1/3) to the Wilderness will be protected/saved, the others 2/3, will not be saved. The REMNANT in Rev. 12 are the small part of the Church that's on earth, they were Saved after the Rapture. They become the BEHEADED under the Alter in the 5th Seal and those who reign with Christ for 1000 years (Rev. 20:4).

Babylon is WORLD Governance under Satan, so you are close in your thinking. Babylon gets hits by all of Gods Seals, Trumpets and Vial Plagues. Babylon is the WORLD or World Governance. THINK the Statue of Dan. ch. 2. In the End Jesus is going to smash the Statue to smithereens and give the Kingdom unto the Saints.

P.S. he does arise out of Old Rome (Europe) via Greece. He is born in Greece which is in the European Union.

 

[David Kent]

How about 13 identifing charachteristics in Prophecy?
Daniel's dream describes a little horn that arises from among the ten horns of the fourth terrible beast. The little horn power represents the Antichrist and is described in Daniel's dream with great detail so that we can clearly identify who this end-time enemy will be. Since we don't want to make any mistake, it is essential that we correctly identify this power.

Daniel 7 gives us very precise identifying features of the horn, and every single one must apply in order to make an accurate identification possible. The 13 features are as follows:

1. It arose out of the fourth beast.
2. It came up among the ten horns.
3. It came up after the ten horns had been established.
4. It was to uproot three horns.
5. It was to be greater than the others.
6. It was to be different than the others.
7. It was to have eyes like the eyes of a man and speak great words against God.
8. It was to make war on God's saints.
9. It would think to change times and laws.
10.The saints were to be handed over to it for a time and times and half a time.
11. It shall devour the whole earth.
12. It shall reign until the Ancient of Days comes.
13. Its dominion will be taken away.

The Antichrist power has to fulfill all of the characteristics given in the Bible. It cannot meet only some of them. Thirteen times in the above articles, we see how the papal system qualifies for all the identifying points of the little horn power of Daniel 7, as sad and shocking as it may seem. It is essential that we realize that the Bible is not dealing with individuals, but with a religious and political system that for more than 1500 years has claimed the power to control the planet’s conscience. Moreover, for a set time, it had power to enforce its decrees and to persecute all who chose to obey God and His Word.

Identifying the Antichrist | Prophecy of Daniel | Religious and Political System

Reformers who identified the Beast/anti-christ
Calvin and Luther were not the only church leaders to identify the Antichrist. A host of reformers identified the Antichrist as the Papacy, such as Thomas Cranmer ("Whereof it followeth Rome to be the seat of antichrist, and the pope to be very antichrist himself. I could prove the same by many other scriptures, old writers, and strong reasons"vii), John Knox ("Hitherto the pope has been antichrist"viii), John Wesley ("He is in an emphatical sense, the Man of Sin, as he increases all manner of sin above measure. And he is, too, properly styled the Son of Perdition, as he has caused the death of numberless multitudes, both of his opposers and followers"ix), John Wycliffe, John Huss, Jerome, and John Melanchthon.

Others who identify the Antichrist

Not only the reformers but before the reformation, the Waldenses who wrote a Treatise On Antichrist in about AD 1200. The Lollards, the Hussites. Jan Hus wrote many letters to leading Lollards about the papal antichrist. He was martyred 100 years before the reformation.

 

[David Kent]

he LAST BEAST is a Man, the other Six Heads of the Rev. 13 Beast are indeed Governments, but so is the last Beast, what you do not get is the 10 Horns (Kings) freely give their POWERS unto this ONE MAN.......Rev. 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

So these 10 Kings are END TIME KINGS, they are not the RCC as Happy Camper is trying to say, they receive power ONE HOUR (Short time) with the Beast, not nearly 2000 years.

The Five Kings (Beasts) who have fallen per Rev. 17 are Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece, the One King (Beast) that WAS is/was of course Rome. The One that is YET TO COME is of course the coming Anti-Christ/Little Horn/BEAST.

OK where do we start?
The The beast is indeed a government, and as the former Roman rulers were, a dynasty. The beasts that had fallen were also Roman govts. Beginning with Kings, republics (2) triumvirate, dictatorship,the one that is Emperors, the one to come, Christian Emperors. the Roman empire was overthrown by 10 Gothic kings, kings of the Heruli, Suevi, Burgundisans, Huns, Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Lombards, Franks, and Saxons. These ruled for a relatively short time, less than 150 years, before they gave their Power to the Papacy. The popes used various forged documents such as the Donation of Constantine, which supposedly left the Empire to the Bishops of Rome, and the false Decretals of Peter, which supposedly named the Bishops of Rome as rulers over the church. These were believed by the pagan kings and they gave power to the popes. This came into full force in AD 610 when the decree of Phocas came into effect making the pope the supreme bishop.

The little horn, the papacy, overthrew three of these kings, The Hueruli under Odacer in 493, The Vandals in 534 and the Ostrogoths in 553. The Papacy then became sole ruler of most of Italy, known as the papal states. This power lasted till 1870 when the horns turned on the little horn and his power over those states was removed and the Italian king, Victor Emmanuel took the Italian kingdom. The Papacy then had no possessions except the Vatican palace. He sulked and refused to come out. This lasted till 1926 when Mussolini made a treaty with the pope and gave him the Vatican city.

The One that is YET TO COME is of course the coming Anti-Christ/Little Horn/BEAST.

The One that is YET TO COME, was YET TO COME at the time John wrote, but is not still YET TO COME. He has come.

Something I have noticed about futurists that I have never read in their posts is that there are two different time periods of the ten horns/seven heads.

 

[Revealing Times]

OK where do we start?
The The beast is indeed a government, and as the former Roman rulers were, a dynasty. The beasts that had fallen were also Roman govts. Beginning with Kings, republics (2) triumvirate, dictatorship,the one that is Emperors, the one to come, Christian Emperors. the Roman empire was overthrown by 10 Gothic kings, kings of the Heruli, Suevi, Burgundisans, Huns, Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Lombards, Franks, and Saxons. These ruled for a relatively short time, less than 150 years, before they gave their Power to the Papacy. The popes used various forged documents such as the Donation of Constantine, which supposedly left the Empire to the Bishops of Rome, and the false Decretals of Peter, which supposedly named the Bishops of Rome as rulers over the church. These were believed by the pagan kings and they gave power to the popes. This came into full force in AD 610 when the decree of Phocas came into effect making the pope the supreme bishop.

The Beast is a Government, but ONE MAN can be the Lord over all the Government, its called a dictator, and as scripture proves in Dan. 7:11 and Rev. 19:20 the Beast is a MAN ho is cast into hell, he has a Mouth and Eyes. As per the Saxons, Franks etc. etc. it astounds me that anyone still falls for that bunk to be honest. The Scriptures are very clear, thy receive power ONE HOUR with the Beast, they are not around for 1500 years.......Rev. 17 12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

So they rule for a SHORT TIME (One Hour) with the BEAST which himself only rules for 42 Months. The Papacy as nothing to do with the Beast, I explained everything above in the other post, I have heard that bogus stuff 30 years ago, its from the Armstrong camp amongst many others. They do not rule for 1500 years with the BEAST (Papacy) that is just not scriptural.

The Little Horn is a MAN !! Why do you guys who fall for this stuff and not use the scriptures?

Dan. 7:11 tells you the Beast is a MAN, I posted it and it seems you just ignore the facts, the scriptures do not matter, all that matters is a preconceived notion.

Dan. 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame. (HELL......Matches Rev. 19)

Rev. 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

The One that is YET TO COME, was YET TO COME at the time John wrote, but is not still YET TO COME. He has come.

Something I have noticed about futurists that I have never read in their posts is that there are two different time periods of the ten horns/seven heads.

The ONE THAT IS YET TO COME is the Anti-Christ/Little Horn.

There is ONE TIME PERIOD of the Ten Horns. Rome ceases being a Beast when Israel is dispersed. The Ten Horns arise 2000 some odd years later out of Europe/Fourth Beasts Head. It has nothing to do with the Fourth Beast per se, it only arises in the same territory, its a whole nother Beast.

That is why verse 7:24 says its different from the FIRST (Verse 23)..........And not the REST. Two Beasts arise out of Europe/Rome 2000 years apart.

 

[SummaScriptura]

In a vision, John the Apostle sees two beasts arise from the earth in order to bring a time of trial upon the world. Shortly after the first beast is revealed to mankind, the world’s last and greatest tribulation period suddenly springs upon this the final generation of humanity.

The first beast seen by John the Apostle, rises from the Mediterranean Sea and represents a leviathan of political and military oppression. This beast is epitomized in a man who is destined to be the Antichrist who the Bible has predicted for millennia.

The second beast is seen rising from the land of Israel on the shore of the Mediterranean Sea. He represents a behemoth of religious deception and oppression. This beast is epitomized in the False Prophet who forces worship of the Antichrist upon the people of the world.

Both beasts work together to wage war on the people of God who remain on earth.

Earth’s days are now characterized by war, disasters in the natural realm, social upheaval, and increasing wickedness in the actions of men. Conditions on earth descend into an ever-worsening downward spiral, twice as bad as the times before the flood of Noah’s day.

But as the days grow dark, the light begins to shine brighter for the increasing numbers of those who are coming to a saving knowledge of Christ.

 

[David Kent]

Dan. 7:11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame. (HELL......Matches Rev. 19)

Symbolic prophecy. The beast is Rome. The fourth and last beast in Daniel 7. Represents the Iron kingdom in Daniel 2. The whole structure will be destroyed by Christ's kingdom.

 

[Revealing Times]

Symbolic prophecy. The beast is Rome. The fourth and last beast in Daniel 7. Represents the Iron kingdom in Daniel 2. The whole structure will be destroyed by Christ's kingdom.

Th Last Beast is the Little Horn/Anti-Christ who becomes a Beast when he Conquers Jerusalem. Rome received the Mortal Wound. Israel was no more then there was no Beast. Ezekiel stated God saw them as Dead Men's Bones.