The New Revised Bibles, Fines, Prison and Closed Megachurches...?

[A_Thinker]

How can one repent and be forgiven unless one knows that by fornicating we have hurt ourselves and others?

I have no doubt that homosexuals are aware that most of the rest of the world is not approving of their behavior.

Christians should be able to do better than simply reaffirming that.

 

[A_Thinker]

Because Christianity has become a Munchausen syndrome movement.

Help me to think that through, please ...

 

[Targaryen]

Help me to think that through, please ...

From the wikipedia:

Munchausen syndrome is a factitious disorder wherein those affected feign disease, illness, or psychological trauma to draw attention, sympathy, or reassurance to themselves. Munchausen syndrome fits within the subclass of factitious disorder with predominantly physical signs and symptoms, but patients also have a history of recurrent hospitalization, travelling, and dramatic, extremely improbable tales of their past experiences. The condition derives its name from Baron Munchausen.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

And what do you think others are doing as well? Only, with less inherant fear and more out of a need, to actually make society better. Which, is what our mission should be. Rather then ranting and railing against hypotheticals, that will not happen.

There is a missionary from Germany who boasts 55 million received Christ in his altar calls, excluding some who did not fill their cards out correctly. Mostly in Africa. It took work for Christianity to survive Germany!
Christ for all Nations

 

[Targaryen]

There is a missionary from Germany who boasts 55 million received Christ in his altar calls, excluding some who did not fill their cards out correctly. Mostly in Africa. It took work for Christianity to survive Germany!

As of 2016, Christianity with 47.9 million (58.3%) members is the largest religion in Germany, with the Protestant Evangelical Church in Germany (EKD) comprising 26.5% of the population and Roman Catholicism comprising 28.5%. Consequently, a majority of the German people belong to a Christian community, although many of them take no active part in church life. About 1.9-2.7%% of the population is Orthodox Christian.

Independent and congregational churches exist in all larger towns and many smaller ones, but most such churches are small. One of these is the confessional Lutheran Church called Independent Evangelical-Lutheran Church in Germany.

Numbers tend to tell a different story there.

 

[AlexDTX]

I suggest the hypothesis of a Canada in which any Pastor, priest or professor suggesting Jesus would condemn fornicators, lovers, homosexuals and lesbians... was fined or imprisoned or fired leading to the closure of megachurches, churches, Bible colleges and missions.

I am having trouble believing that those who denounce biblical sins have mega churches. Mega churches tend to be filled with preachers scratching itchy ears.

It seems you are posing a rhetorical question to see who stands for the secular influence on the Church and who stands for the biblical truth.

There are many who will be persecuted for speaking biblical truth not because of the truth they speak but the obnoxious manner they speak the truth.

Truth never hurts. What hurts are lies exposed by the truth. True persecution comes because truth spoken in love still exposes the lies. So to answer your question, I take the path of the martyr by speaking the truth in love.

 

[Ken Rank]

Help me to think that through, please ...

Munchausen is a condition in which a person, without using excuses to avoid their responsibilities, acts as if they have an illness by deliberately producing, feigning, or exaggerating symptoms, purely to attain a patient's role (read - seeks undeserved sympathy).

I think >>SOME<< Christians cry persecution and or at least envision it as being aimed at them when that isn't the case at all. So, in a SENSE, I think my statement is accurate.

 

[Adstar]

Probably not. Jesus didn't tell us to worship Him. He told us to worship God The Father.

Men worshiped Jesus on multiple occasions during his ministry.. Jesus never reprimanded them for worshiping Him.. Why? Because when they where worshiping Him they where Worshiping God.. Because God and Jesus are One..

 

[A_Thinker]

Munchausen is a condition in which a person, without using excuses to avoid their responsibilities, acts as if they have an illness by deliberately producing, feigning, or exaggerating symptoms, purely to attain a patient's role (read - seeks undeserved sympathy).

I think >>SOME<< Christians cry persecution and or at least envision it as being aimed at them when that isn't the case at all. So, in a SENSE, I think my statement is accurate.

Thank-you ... I tend to agree with you on this ...

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Munchausen is a condition in which a person, without using excuses to avoid their responsibilities, acts as if they have an illness by deliberately producing, feigning, or exaggerating symptoms, purely to attain a patient's role (read - seeks undeserved sympathy).

I think >>SOME<< Christians cry persecution and or at least envision it as being aimed at them when that isn't the case at all. So, in a SENSE, I think my statement is accurate.

Judging others?

 

[Instrument150]

I suggest the hypothesis of a Canada in which any Pastor, priest or professor suggesting Jesus would condemn fornicators, lovers, homosexuals and lesbians... was fined or imprisoned or fired leading to the closure of megachurches, churches, Bible colleges and missions. Further that the Bible without censure or omissions was banned. Christian activity in public would be limited and only in secret would true preaching take place. Christians especially pastors would lose their property in fines.

Christian businesses would close or compromise. Children would sometimes turn their parents into the authorities for true teaching, and be considered brave.

The result could be a great fall of preachers from pulpits to streets to prisons or to go abroad and some on missions considered illegal. Some listeners to preachings would be touched by the Holy Spirit and be unable but to confess their sins as witnesses to the reality of an unchanging Christ and immediately be fined.

If this happened and we were there, would you compromise, or be firm? Would another Jesus definition be good or okay? Could it still be church? Would it be worth going on a new Jesus for Africa mission? Would you worship new Jesus? Would you go to prison for the original revelation? What would one do if one still needed to overcome sins and be set free? Could you endure a homeless winter?

As with all things, there is some truth in it.

In the sense that Jesus doesn't condemn the homosexual anymore than He condemns the man who speaks a single idle word without a repentant heart. Anyone who speaks otherwise, is an abomination.

But .... The Bible also says that you should agree with your enemy quickly when you are in the way with him, unless he deliver you up to the court.

So that being said ... you don't have to SAY that being gay is good. If asked the question, you can answer, "I believe that my Lord Jesus is able and willing to forgive ALL sin." and leave it at that.

And keep in mind, preachers, that "The Gospel Truth" is not that gay people are going to hell. "The Gospel Truth" is that God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that the world might be saved through Him.

Preach and show the love of Jesus, and no prison will find you, at least for now.

 

[Targaryen]

Judging others?

that and thinking the church is under attack or that society is lost....on and on. Basically, your hypothesis being an example of Christian Munchausen's

 

[Lucian Hodoboc]

Men worshiped Jesus on multiple occasions during his ministry.. Jesus never reprimanded them for worshiping Him.. Why? Because when they where worshiping Him they where Worshiping God.. Because God and Jesus are One..

Weren't people more, like, very grateful to Him? I'm not sure if gratitude is the same as worship.

 

[Targaryen]

Weren't people more, like, very grateful to Him? I'm not sure if gratitude is the same as worship.

Source: Does the Bible describe Jesus being worshiped?

Question: "Does the Bible describe Jesus being worshiped?"

Answer: Worship means “reverence paid to a divine being.” If Jesus was offered and accepted worship, then by doing so He was confirming His divinity. This is important because there are those who deny the deity of Christ, relegating Him instead to a lesser position than God. Yes, Jesus accepted worship. As the second Person of the Trinity, He was and still is worshiped.

From the beginning of Jesus’ life, we see examples of Him being worshiped. As soon as the Magi laid eyes on the infant Christ, “they bowed down and worshiped Him” (Matthew 2:11). The Bible records the initial response Jesus received when He made His triumphal entry into Jerusalem: “So they took branches of palm trees and went out to meet him, crying out, ‘Hosanna! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, even the King of Israel!’” (Matthew 21:9; John 12:13) The word hosanna is a plea for salvation and an expression of adoration. This word used by the crowd is definitely a form of worship.

Just after Jesus amazed the disciples by walking on water, “those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God’” (Matthew 14:33). Two more memorable examples of Jesus accepting worship occurred just after His resurrection. Some of the women (Matthew 21:1; Mark 16:1; Luke 24:10) were on their way to tell the disciples of the resurrection when Jesus met them on their way. When they realized it was He, they “came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him” (Matthew 28:9).

Then there is the case of Thomas, who didn't believe Jesus had risen from the dead despite the other disciples’ testifying to that fact. It had been about a week since the resurrection, and Thomas still doubted it. Jesus, knowing Thomas doubted, appeared to him and showed him the nail marks in His hands and feet and the wound in His side. How did Thomas respond? “Thomas said to him, ‘My Lord and my God!’” (John 20:28). In none of these instances do we see Jesus telling those worshiping Him to stop, as did mere men and even angels who were being worshiped wrongly by others (Acts 10:25–26; Revelation 19:9–10).

We continue to offer worship to Jesus today by offering ourselves to Him as a living sacrifice—offering ourselves to God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to do with as He sees fit (Romans 12:1–2). Jesus said, “God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24). We worship God in spirit and truth by obedience to His commands. Worship is not solely about bowing to Jesus, throwing palm branches at His feet, or singing and shouting about our love for Him. Worship is about knowing Him, communing with Him, serving Him, and trusting in Him.

 

[Ken Rank]

Judging others?

First of all, it was a joke.. to a point anyway. Second, I can give you scores of verses that directly tell you to judge. In fact, you judged my reply and then responded based on your judgement. That isn't wrong... being able to judge and see the need for correction or rebuke is our duty. What we are not to do is judge unto condemnation... we do not have the right nor the ability (or authority) to determine where one's eternal destination rests.

 

[frienden thalord]

Except that He still thinks of it. Sy Rogers as a homosexual was touched by the Holy Spirit and discovered grace, by surprise. He has his own ministry now.

People don't know Jesus as is, and are surprised by grace. What happens if people only worship a human defined Jesus, who is permissive, and are not touched by grace?

Sadly many already do. IF the church even makes you seem in error for asking these questions.
Then already we see what Christ said would come to pass nigh the end.
We will be betrayed by many. AND MANY who do so will think they do this
all inlusive no correction gods will when they do so.
Sadly for years not only has the world been prepared to come against the true lambs
that wont compromise the true gospel, So too are the churches .
I see this very clearly. The times you speak of , the mindset is alrady in many churches.
it will take nothing for men to persuade them to come against what they deem as haters.
Big warning . Jesus warned us, beware of false prophets , beware of many who come in his name
yet shall deceive many. When a person cannot even come and speak the truth
to those in the church without being made to seem as they are in some kind of error.
Then know delusion is filling many now. And it is all about world peace , world unity
world inclusion . and anyone who dares to remind us about sin and error,
about being Holy as HE is holy, about The dire need to preach repentance and Faith in
ONLY Christ , are seen more and more as haters and errounous and that to many in churches.
When a false JESUS is preached and not the true one and most just love it
then understand a delusion is being poured down and most are going under it.
We will be betrayed . And just LIKE JESUS
was betrayed by one who in pretense followed Him. Don't be suprised
when many who in pretense follow him, betray the true church.
We running out of time. So fear not man. Preach the true gospel
be grave , be serious , be compassionate , but never conform to what
many in churches are even conforming too.
The gospel preached today, leaves many in sin, FEELING saved , but they are not.
Keep on warning , never stop, for if we love all, then we desire life for all
SO wepreach the TRUE JESUS no matter what it costs us . See it as gain only
no matter what we have to suffer for Christ .

 

[frienden thalord]

And this helps with Christian mission how exactly? Prevent the spreading of God's love in the face of fear of things that are not out of control by and large, yes, we all face challenges. But to face the world with this fear in your heart is not what we are told by Christ, and it does nothing to help teach the world about his love and forgiveness.

I see no fear in the one who sent this. Usually when ones say I fear when I warn
it is because what I said made them have fear of what is coming.
Ps. Many are not spreading love , nor teaching True love.
True love desires none to perish. How can leaving one in sin be love , when the end of sin is death.
IF we have not LOVE then we have NOT CHRIST and it matters not what we did.
SO we better KNOW the love that comes from GOD and not what the world says is love.
Charity does not rejoice in inquity , nor behave itself unseemingly
so any who does so , is not saved and if we don't warn them. WHERE is our LOVE.
certainly not from GOD , we just love as does the WORLD.
Remember charity does not BEHAVE itself UNSEEMINGLY.
ever heard that word UNSEEMINGLY .
here lets read romans chapter ONE. For this cause God gavethem over to vile
affections , even the woman left the natural even the men too, burned
in lust one towards another man with man Working that which is Unseemingly.

 

[Catherineanne]

I suggest the hypothesis of a Canada in which any Pastor, priest or professor suggesting Jesus would condemn fornicators, lovers, homosexuals and lesbians... was fined or imprisoned or fired leading to the closure of megachurches, churches, Bible colleges and missions. Further that the Bible without censure or omissions was banned. Christian activity in public would be limited and only in secret would true preaching take place. Christians especially pastors would lose their property in fines.

Christian businesses would close or compromise. Children would sometimes turn their parents into the authorities for true teaching, and be considered brave.

The result could be a great fall of preachers from pulpits to streets to prisons or to go abroad and some on missions considered illegal. Some listeners to preachings would be touched by the Holy Spirit and be unable but to confess their sins as witnesses to the reality of an unchanging Christ and immediately be fined.

If this happened and we were there, would you compromise, or be firm? Would another Jesus definition be good or okay? Could it still be church? Would it be worth going on a new Jesus for Africa mission? Would you worship new Jesus? Would you go to prison for the original revelation? What would one do if one still needed to overcome sins and be set free? Could you endure a homeless winter?

What makes you think any of that is possible, let alone likely?

 

[Catherineanne]

Except that He still thinks of it. Sy Rogers as a homosexual was touched by the Holy Spirit and discovered grace, by surprise. He has his own ministry now.

People don't know Jesus as is, and are surprised by grace. What happens if people only worship a human defined Jesus, who is permissive, and are not touched by grace?

What happens if people only worship a human defined Jesus, who echoes their own bigotry, and are not touched by grace?

 

[Catherineanne]

In the hypothetical, I make up the bleak future. Forgiving isn't permitting. How can one repent and be forgiven unless one knows that by fornicating we have hurt ourselves and others?

Where does the Gospel tell us to make up a bleak future and then wallow in it?