JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

[stuart lawrence]

I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear
But when he, the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth
John16:12&13

The true dividing line among those who attend church, the Holy Spirit, NOT denominations

 

[LoveGodsWord]

We who are Jews by birth and not Gentile sinners know that a man is not justified by observing the law but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we too have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified. If while we seek to be justified in Christ it becomes EVIDENT that we ourselves are SINNERS, does this mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! If I rebuild what I destroyed I prove I am a lawbreaker Gal2:14-17 Paul is speaking in the above of a justification by faith in Christ, NOT observing the law that takes time to achieve, it is NOT instantaneous TBC

Hello Friend, nice scripture and your point is?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Point3
You show a total lack of understanding g the message.
Once again, gal2:16&17 clearly shows it takes time to cross over from being a slave of sin to a slave of righteousness leading to holiness

It is because it is not clearly written and hence the questions for clarification.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Point2)
Once again you quote scripture that speaks of wilfull,.not Unrepentant sin. You have already previously been shown your error in this regard, but though you refused to respond to posts showing you your error, you continue to err in this regard.
I am not in contrading anyrhing at all. A new convert hates the sin that still binds them, and trusts in Christ for deliverance from it. And gal2:16&17 is speaking of a converts seekingto be justified by faith in Christ, NOT observing the law.
Rom.3: 20 states: Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law/ not committing sin, rather through the law we become conscious of sin. So once again Paul shows your error

If you are in willful unrepentant sin you are not in a saved state. Paul supports this statement (Romans 8:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 6:6; Romans 8:6; Romans 6:16; Hebrews 10:62-27; Hebrews 6:4-8; Romans 2:13-16; Romans 2:12-13 etc etc) No one has ever said we are saved by observing the law so not sure of the point your trying to make here. There is no error in God's Word it is truth.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Point1) For because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy made us alive with Christ, EVEN WHEN we were dead in transgression/ sin, it is by grace you have been saved
Eph2:5 You are made alive with Christ EVEN WHEN you are dead in sin.
Does all sin immediatley vanish the moment you get saved? In the following paul is speaking of a new convert seeking justification of their christianity by faith in Christ:

If while we seek to be justified in Christ it becomes EVIDENT that we ourselves are SINNERS, does this mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not, if i rebuild what I destroyed I prove I am a lawbreaker
Gal2:16&17 So Paul has answered your question, and shown your error

I asked you 5-6 question in my post for clarity on what you were saying in your earlier post. So what question are you referring to as there is not error in my post? Thanks for the update.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Continued from post 177
What justification is Paul speaking of in gal2:14-17 that is not instantaneous?

None. Righteousness is by faith as soon as you believe God's Word. It is so if you believe God's Word. If you do not believe God's Word you are still in your sins.
Gal 2:14-17 is talking about someone trying to earn salvation through the works of the Law and not Faith in God's Word not whether justification is instant or not.

Much sin you can immediately cease upon conversion, for it does not have much hold over you. But other sin, you may have been a slave to over decades, and this sin takes time to see victory over, it is often not instant deliverance. Now what would someone who did not understand the true message think? A new convert with glaring sin in their life joins their church, and heartily joins in the service, worshipping and praising God. Someone who didn't understand Pauls message concerning justification would immediatley think: If this man is a Christian Christ must promote sin. For here he is praising and worshipping God while having glaring sin in his life.

God is constantly leading people to him because he is not willing that any should perish but that all through faith in Him should be saved by His free gift of grace through the power of His Word in us who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit. God is true make every man a liar that thou might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged because the just shall live by faith. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. This man is still in his sins and not born again. Do you know the scriptures quoted?

 

[stuart lawrence]

If you are in willful unrepentant sin you are not in a saved state. Paul supports this statement (Romans 8:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 6:6; Romans 8:6; Romans 6:16; Hebrews 10:62-27; Hebrews 6:4-8; Romans 2:13-16; Romans 2:12-13 etc etc) No one has ever said we are saved by observing the law so not sure of the point your trying to make here. There is no error in God's Word it is truth.

I ignore now your citing of scripture to support what you write. For as I have, on numerous occasions shown you, you cite verses incorrectly in this regard. They either do not support what you write, or are not relevant to what you write.
And it would take far too long to over them all

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yep, if we break one of Gods applicable commands we are guilty of breaking them all. Therefore it is sinless perfection or you are guilty of breaking all of Gods commands. Are you sinless in your flesh?
I am going to ignore all your comments about unrepentant sin as you refuse to address your error when shown it.
King David committed wilfull sin but repented of it. So your view of wilfull sin being Unrepentant sin is shown to be false

Stuart a few points

There is only sin in the flesh and if we live after the flesh we will die. If we do kill the deeds of the flesh through the Spirit we shall live (Romans 8:13 )

You should not ignore God's Word on unrepentant sin because if we have sin that is known and there is no repentance. You do not know God and are in danger of the judgment and being lost. You know what Paul says (Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrews 6:4-8; Romans 8:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 6:6; Romans 8:6; Romans 6:16; Romans 2:13-16; Romans 2:12-13 etc etc).

David is not a comparison of unrepentant sin because he repented of his sin (2 Sam 12:13; Psalms 32; 51; 86; 122) so you there is no comparison as this is not an example of someone that is unrepentant.

Hope this is helpful

 

[LoveGodsWord]

You don't understand the doctrine at the heart of the NC

Romans 8
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6For to be carnally minded isdeath; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7Because the carnal mind isenmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

1 John 3:3-10
3, And every man that hath this hope in him purifies himself, even as he is pure. 4, Whosoever commits sin transgresses also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. 5, And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6, Whosoever abides in him sins not: whosoever sins has not seen him, neither known him. 7, Little children, let no man deceive you: he that does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. 8, He that commits sin is of the devil; for the devil sins from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9, Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10, In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever does not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loves not his brother.

1 John 2:2-4
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4, He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

The law God desires you to follow is written in your mind and placed on your heart by God himself. What is in your mind you in your mind must know, law in your heart must bring heartfelt conviction of sin if you wilfully transgress it. Your conviction of sin comes from within. So it is from inner conviction we know what law God has placed in our hearts.

It is the Holy Spirit that convicts of sin and of righteousness and the Judgement to come by the hearing or reading of God's Word (John 16:7-8; Romans 10:17; Romans 7:7-8; Matthew 4:4)

That is born again christianity. People who have to read law written in ink in the OT to be conscious of sin/ know the law God desires them to follow, do NOT have truly born again christianity. For they obviously have no conviction from within of sin. They rely on what is written in ink

No they Born again Christian relies on God's Word and they are saved by the faith they have in it. Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23) So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Romans 10:17) This produces the fruit of obedience through love. (1 John 3:3-10; James 2:8-12; Romans 13:9-10; Romans 8:1-8)

Hope this helps.

In Christ Always![/QUOTE]

 

[stuart lawrence]

Stuart a few points

There is only sin in the flesh and if we live after the flesh we will die. If we do kill the deeds of the flesh through the Spirit we shall live (Romans 8:13 )

You should not ignore God's Word on unrepentant sin because if we have sin that is known and there is no repentance. You do not know God and are in danger of the judgment and being lost. You know what Paul says (Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrews 6:4-8; Romans 8:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 6:6; Romans 8:6; Romans 6:16; Romans 2:13-16; Romans 2:12-13 etc etc).

David is not a comparison of unrepentant sin because he repented of his sin (2 Sam 12:13; Psalms 32; 51; 86; 122) so you there is no comparison as this is not an example of someone that is unrepentant.

Hope this is helpful

Once again, I take no notice of your scriptural quotes in support of what you write for the reasons previously given

 

[stuart lawrence]

Stuart a few points

There is only sin in the flesh and if we live after the flesh we will die. If we do kill the deeds of the flesh through the Spirit we shall live (Romans 8:13 )

You should not ignore God's Word on unrepentant sin because if we have sin that is known and there is no repentance. You do not know God and are in danger of the judgment and being lost. You know what Paul says (Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrews 6:4-8; Romans 8:13; Romans 6:23; Romans 6:6; Romans 8:6; Romans 6:16; Romans 2:13-16; Romans 2:12-13 etc etc).

David is not a comparison of unrepentant sin because he repented of his sin (2 Sam 12:13; Psalms 32; 51; 86; 122) so you there is no comparison as this is not an example of someone that is unrepentant.

Hope this is helpful

And David committed wilfull sin then repented of it. So wilfull sin is not Unrepentant sin

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Once again, I take no notice of your scriptural quotes in support of what you write for the reasons previously given

It is ok Stuart, I know you never have. I provide the scripture though in hope that it may be a help to you. If any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. He that rejects me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. Let's agree to disagree and work out our own salvation with fear and trembling. May God help you and me.

Ok have a nice day I have to go now.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

And David committed wilfull sin then repented of it. So wilfull sin is not Unrepentant sin

Not in the context you apply it to but in the context of Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrews 6:4-8 and the many other scripture references I have provided you it certainly is. Goodnight friend.

 

[stuart lawrence]

It is ok Stuart, I know you never have. I provide the scripture though in hope that it may be a help to you. If any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. He that rejects me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

Ok have a nice day I have to go now.

Yesterday you cited Matt5:19 as an endorsement of those who break Gods laws and encourage others to do so cannot attain to heaven.

This is what Matt5:19 states:

Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do so will be least IN( IN) the kingdom of heaven. But whoever practices and teaches these commands will be great IN( IN) the kingdom of heaven

 

[stuart lawrence]

Not in the context you apply it to but in the context of Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrews 6:4-8 and the many other scripture references I have provided you it certainly is. Goodnight friend.

It is a plain fact King David committed wilfull sin that he repented of. Proving your claim wilfull sin is Unrepentant sin us totally false

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yesterday you cited Matt5:19 as an endorsement of those who break Gods laws and encourage others to do do cannot attain to heaven.

This is what Matt5:19 states:

Anyone e who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do so will be least IN( IN) the UK ngdom if heaven. But whoever practices and teaches these commands will be great IN( IN) the kingdom of heaven

You really need to check your scriptures.

Are you saying now that if you sin you are going to Heaven?

“Least in the Kingdom of Heaven” is not referring to those that will be in the Kingdom but those not in the Kingdom and those that are in the Kingdom referring to them as the least. Let's quickly look at the scriptures....

Matthew 5:19
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven

Who is the scripture referring to?
Those that break God's Law and teach others to do the same.

What will happen to those that are found in unrepentant sin when Jesus returns?

Hebrews 10:26-27
26, For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9, Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revellers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21
19, Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21, Envying’s, murders, drunkenness, revelling’s, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Now it is clear in Matthew 15:19 that we are talking about someone that is breaking one of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so. They are called least in the Kingdom of Heaven by those that are in the Kingdom of Heaven because they are not going there. The supporting scriptures provided above (there are others also elsewhere) tell us what happens to those that break God’s commandments that they shall not inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. This is compared to Matthew 5:19 which is talking about those breaking God’s commandments and are being referred to as also being the least in God’s Kingdom because they are teaching others to depart from the Kingdom of Heaven.

This also includes the 7th Day Sabbath.

Hope this helps. I have to go out for now have a nice day.

 

[stuart lawrence]

You really need to check your scriptures.

Are you saying now that if you sin you are going to Heaven?

“Least in the Kingdom of Heaven” is not referring to those that will be in the Kingdom but those not in the Kingdom and those that are in the Kingdom referring to them as the least. Let's quickly look at the scriptures....

Matthew 5:19
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven

Who is the scripture referring to?
Those that break God's Law and teach others to do the same.

What will happen to those that are found in unrepentant sin when Jesus returns?

Hebrews 10:26-27
26, For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9, Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revellers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Galatians 5:19-21
19, Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21, Envying’s, murders, drunkenness, revelling’s, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Now it is clear in Matthew 15:19 that we are talking about someone that is breaking one of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so. They are called least in the Kingdom of Heaven by those that are in the Kingdom of Heaven because they are not going there. The supporting scriptures provided above (there are others also elsewhere) tell us what happens to those that break God’s commandments that they shall not inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. This is compared to Matthew 5:19 which is talking about those breaking God’s commandments and are being referred to as also being the least in God’s Kingdom because they are teaching others to depart from the Kingdom of Heaven.

This also includes the 7th Day Sabbath.

Hope this helps. I have to go out for now have a nice day.

You cannot rewrite the English language to suit your beliefs. In does not mean out and out does not mean in.
It is just another in a long line of scriptures you cite to support your beliefs that do not support them.

Try and quote scripture that may at least appear to support your beliefs, not scripture that plainly does not

 

[LoveGodsWord]

And David committed wilfull sin then repented of it. So wilfull sin is not Unrepentant sin

It is ok friend, you are free to believe what you like. I do not judge you. Ok last one from me to you. We will have to agree to disagree. I have sent you the scriptures. It is between you and God now. Have a nice day bb

 

[stuart lawrence]

It is ok friend, you are free to believe what you like. I do not judge you. Ok last one from me to you. We will have to agree to disagree.I have sent you the scriptures. It is between you and God now. Have a nice day bb

And I repeat, you consistently post scripture that does not support your beliefs. I have on many occasions now given examples of this

 

[stuart lawrence]

Romans 8
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 5For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6For to be carnally minded isdeath; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7Because the carnal mind isenmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

1 John 3:3-10
3, And every man that hath this hope in him purifies himself, even as he is pure. 4, Whosoever commits sin transgresses also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. 5, And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6, Whosoever abides in him sins not: whosoever sins has not seen him, neither known him. 7, Little children, let no man deceive you: he that does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. 8, He that commits sin is of the devil; for the devil sins from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 9, Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. 10, In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever does not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loves not his brother.

1 John 2:2-4
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. 4, He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

It is the Holy Spirit that convicts of sin and of righteousness and the Judgement to come by the hearing or reading of God's Word (John 16:7-8; Romans 10:17; Romans 7:7-8; Matthew 4:4)

No they Born again Christian relies on God's Word and they are saved by the faith they have in it. Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever. (1 Peter 1:23) So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Romans 10:17) This produces the fruit of obedience through love. (1 John 3:3-10; James 2:8-12; Romans 13:9-10; Romans 8:1-8)

Hope this helps.

In Christ Always!

The born again Christian has the law God desires them to follow written in their minds and placed on their hearts by God himself. That is one of the two main clauses of the NC
What is in your mind you in your mind must know. What is in your heart must bring heartfelt conviction of sin when you wilfully transgress it, for:
Through the law we become conscious of sin. Rom3:20
The truly born again spirit filled Christian does NOT( NOT) rely on reading law written in ink in the OT to know what sin is/ the law God desires them to follow. For their conviction regarding this comes from within, for that is where the law has been placed