JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

[Aseyesee]

This includes the 7th Day Sabbath which Jesus made for us and commands us to keep as a holy day. In Christ Always!

Do you believe the lamb of God took away the sin of the world?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Christ taught more than just the 10 commandments Deuteronomy 6:4-5 and Leviticus 19:18 are the 2 greatest commandments, and they're not from the 10 When the devil was tempting him, he quoted the Deuteronomy, not Exodus Matthew 5:17 shows that the Messiah taught the full and correct meaning of the law and the prophets He didn't just stop at 10 Even Peter taught from the law 1 Peter 1:15-16 But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. "Be ye Holy, for I am Holy" is not in the 10 commandments. It's actually from the book of Leviticus

Everything from the new testament scriptures come from the Old Testament. The two great commandments do indeed come from the Old Testament writings. However these two great commandments were only summing up the 10 commandments. The diagram provided above shows a good illustration what the two great commandments were referring to. The first is your duty towards God (the first table Exodus 20:1-11) and the second is your duty towards your neighbor (2nd table Exodus 20:12-17) and is why Jesus says on these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets (Matthew 22:36-40).

The Jews (Pharisees/Lawyers) knew this however as is referenced in Luke 10:25-28

Luke 10:25-28
25, And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? 26, He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? 27, And he answering said <the Lawyer/Pharisee>, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbor as thyself. 28, And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

Because this was indeed referring to the Old testament scriptures (Deut 6:5; Lev 19:18)
Notice again the same question asked by the rich young ruler in what shall I do to inherit eternal life?

Matthew 19:16-19
16, And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17, And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18, He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

This is the reason Jesus says that the two great commandments (love to God and Love to man) hang all the law and the prophets (Matthew 22:36-40) because you cannot separate Love from action. Love produced the fruit of obedience and is demonstrated by action.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Do you believe the lamb of God took away the sin of the world?

John 1:29,
The next day John sees Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which takes away the sin of the world.

 

[Aseyesee]

John 1:29,
The next day John sees Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which takes away the sin of the world.

But do you believe he did?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

But do you believe he did?

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believe in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I do believe God's Word. He only takes away the sins of those who believe and follow His Word. I love him because he first loved me. This is why I follow Him now

 

[listed]

WHAT DID JESUS AND THE APOSTLES TEACH ABOUT GOD’S LAW
(the scriptures below are no where near exhaustive)

Jesus taught the 10 commandments…..

1. Jesus kept God’s Law (10 commandments) and said the Law and the prophets would not pass away (Matt 5:17-18)

Already responded to this with Luke 24:44 which is rejected as truth. Also have included Hebrews 7:12 showing jots and titles of the law have passed and rejected as truth.

2. Jesus taught others to follow the 10 commandments (Mark 10:17-21)

Very good. At least you got away from Matthew 19 on this incident. What did the man ask? Isn't it "What must I do to inherit eternal life? What does even the OT say about this?

They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

and Isaiah laments: O Lord, why hast thou made us to err from thy ways, and hardened our heart from thy fear? Return for thy servants' sake, the tribes of thine inheritance.

In the NT we find: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Evidently no one kept the law.

God designed the law in such a way no one would keep it. Furthermore the law doesn't speak about eternal life.

MY question then becomes what did Jesus really say? I think He said very plainly a person can't do anything of themselves to secure eternal life agreeing with the OT Scripture I quoted above. I fully believe Jesus' words found in John 3:16 and 5:24. CF posters have been challenged to provide anyone's name who has accomplished this awesome feat and so far have failed.

The pro law contingency have been asked and asked to discuss the context of the same incident found it Matthew 19 and so far have resolutely declined by ignoring the request. Anyone wonder why?

3. Jesus taught that Love is the fulfilling (doing) of God’s Law (10 commandments Matt 22:36-40)

I don't think so. Jesus only answered a question. Jesus did say keep the law. It also should be noted neither come from the ten commandments. It's held by the pro law contingency here those commandments are nailed tot he cross being what is referred to as the law of Moses. What we have here is really double speak.

4. If we break God’s Law by following man-made traditions we are not following God (Matt 15:3-9)

This statement is really 2 things: self condemnation by non compliance of the speaker and that no one not keeping the law is a Christian (following God). The positive statement of this is: One must keep the law to have salvation. This is a direct contradiction to the words of Jesus several places in the Gospel of John.

5. Jesus says if we commit sin we are a servant of sin and he has come to free us from sin (John 8:32-36)

If we are the servants of sin is true for the person we call Christian there is no salvation or eternal life. Paul, James and John all discuss this issue. None of them grant the right to live a lifestyle of sin. All of them admit the Christian sins.

6. Jesus taught if you love God you will keep God’s Law and abide in His Love (John 14:15; 15:10

Jesus did no such thing in either of these verses. Jesus takes possession of something. Jesus doesn't take possession of the law clearly evident by His comparison statement in John 15:10.

7. If anyone is breaking any of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven <least = lost> (Matt 15:19)

The brief definition provided above isn't provable by Scripture. If a person is lost they aren't in the kingdom of God. The verse clearly speaks of being in the kingdom of heaven. It doesn't speak about those outside of the kingdom of heaven.

8. No one can obey God’s Law producing the fruit of obedience of ourselves and unless we abide in Jesus we can do nothing (John 15:4-10)

Here the subject is changed from the "ten commandments" to "the law of God." Jeremiah does this in his prophecy about the replacement of the covenant. The pro law contingency put forth the ten commandments are the only and exclusive law of God. This can't be true considering just the OT. For instance Genesis 26:5 says Abraham kept God law and Moses says Abraham didn't have the ten commandment law in Deuteronomy 5:3.

This post is already way to long. I see no real need to show the implied misinformation of the remainder of the post.

 

[Aseyesee]

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believe in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I do believe God's Word. He only takes away the sins of those who believe and follow His Word

So I assume you believe John was wrong, or he was being hypothetical ?

 

[listed]

If the Christian breaks one of the TC they are guilty of breaking all?

Therefore if a Christian has any impure thoughts, or desires anything that is not theirs to desire, or, even fleetingly has a graven image in their mind, they are guilty of breaking all of the TC. And if a Christian fails, at anytime to love God with all their heart, body soul mind and strength, they are guilty of breaking all of the TC. If a Christian makes one slip in regards to honouring their parents they are guilty of breaking all of the TC.
On this point we agree

impure thoughts only becomes sin when an individual takes possession of them. The enemy of our soul has permission to tempt us.

 

[listed]

So I assume you believe John was wrong, or he was being hypothetical ?

I think he believes John is lying.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

So I assume you believe John was wrong, or he was being hypothetical ?

God's promises have only ever been conditional. If we do not abide by God's Word then the promises are not for us. God's Word is only for God's people and is why Jesus says my sheep hear my voice. I believe all of God's Word

 

[listed]

Hi Stuart, I just woke up. Good morning from my side of the world and hope you are well.

Depending on the context and scripture used the term "under the law" has a few different meanings. One of them is that if we break God's Law and are guilty before God of sin. As it is written;

Knowing what you promote I find it very surprising you would post something like this. But then I also note your inconsistencies. You teach we are "under the law if we sin." A discussion trying to prove something else is of no value.

Romans 2:12-13
All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified."

Romans 3:19
Now we know that what things soever the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Romans 3:9
What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin

If you are being controlled by sin in your life you are under the law and guilty before God.

Romans 3:19
For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

I have never said "observe the law or you are under the law guilty. It is written we are saved by grace through faith and not of yourselves it is a gift of God lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8-9)

But you say repeatedly if we sin we're under the law. That means observance of the law. Your above statement is great evidence of double speak in the same post.

 

[listed]

God's promises have only ever been conditional. If we do not abide by God's Word then the promises are not for us. God's Word is only for God's people and is why Jesus says my sheep hear my voice.

Salvation isn't conditional of obedience to the law. The Gospel of John is great on this issue.

 

[Aseyesee]

God's promises have only ever been conditional. If we do not abide by God's Word then the promises are not for us. God's Word is only for God's people and is why Jesus says my sheep hear my voice.

So you don't believe John was telling the whole truth, which as Jesus was purported to have said, whosoever sins you hold will be beheld, and whosoever sins you remit will be remitted, which seems to put the ball in our court, seeing how God declares the end from the beginning, just as the lamb was slain from the foundation of the world (same word John used (which seems to put God's declaration of an end from the beginning in the hypothetical department?).

You had said to me in your thread the administrators closed that the ceremonial law was done away with, which includes one having to come up to Jerusalem to keep a feast (which I really don't disagree with).

Do you see Zechariah 14 as having already happened? (because it states that the nations that came against Jerusalem would have to come up every year to keep the feast of tabernacles).

 

[listed]

Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law. Romans 3:31

What do you mean by this passage?

 

[Dkh587]

...

 

[listed]

The interpretation of what is being said is not correct "If we sin we are under the law and guilty before God" as found in Romans 2:12-13; Romans 3:19; Romans 3:9; Romans 3:19 Is not the same you saying "If we fail to observe the law we are under the law and guilty before God" because we are not saved by observing the law. I have told you twice now that I have never said "observe the law or you are under the law guilty as you have stated. It is written we are saved by grace through faith and not of yourselves it is a gift of God lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8-9). So I hope this clears up any misunderstanding. Hope this helps

In Christ Always!

Just absolutely incredible given your posting history.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Carry each others burdens( love them) and so FULFILL the law of Christ
Gal6:2

So you could say, the second greatest commandment, which isn't one of the TC fulfills the law of Christ

 

[listed]

Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. Matthew 5:17

This appears often here. I wonder why Luke 24:44 and Hebrews 7:12 are ignored.

And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

 

[stuart lawrence]

If the two greatest comnandments ONLY summed up the TC, why were they given at all?
Love thy neighbour as thyself covers far more than is written in the TC

 

[Aseyesee]

I think he believes John is lying.

It is easy to measure the sacrifce of God without knowing we have ...