What Holidays May I celebrate this upcoming Season?

[CherubRam]

Easter, a Pagan Christian festival, embodies many pre Christian traditions. The 8th-century English scholar St. Bede, Claimed it came from Eastre, ( Also known as Ishtar) the Anglo Saxon name for a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. traditions associated with the festival survive in the Easter rabbit, a symbol of fertility, and in the colored easter eggs, originally painted with bright colors to represent the sunlight of spring, also given as gifts. Such festivals and the stories help explain their origin. The early Christians, of whom were of Jewish origin, were brought up in the Hebrew tradition. According to the New Testament, Christ was crucified on Friday the 13th , just before the eve of Passover began, and three days afterward rose from the dead. In time, a serious difference over the date of the Easter festival arose among Christians. The Christians of Jewish origin celebrated the resurrection immediately following the Passover festival on Monday, the first day of the week after the two Sabbaths. Christians of Pagan origin, however, wished to commemorate the resurrection on the first day of the week, Sunday.
The Council of Nicaea Ruling on the Date of Easter
The Roman emperor, Constantine the Great, convoked the Council of Nicaea in 325. The council unanimously ruled that the Easter festival should be celebrated throughout the Christian world on the first Sunday after the full moon following the vernal equinox; and that if the full moon should occur on a Sunday and thereby coincide with the Passover festival, Easter should be commemorated on the Sunday following. In that way the feasts of Easter and Passover coinciding was avoided.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I have no idea, but if you celebrated on "Easter Sunday" it was probably Easter. Passover fell on Monday, April 10 this year.


I am not the one that concluded that. Post #5 addresses the issue.

I would invite you to do some historical research on the liturgical origins of Easter/Pascha. The division you are making between them is quite strange to me. You are aware that most of the non English speaking Christian world calls Easter Pascha or some variant of resurrection day right? Why is that? Is it possible Pascha (Easter) represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover? Is it possible that the connection between Easter is not to a pagan holiday, but the Jewish one? Consider the following below.

Post five is full of unwarranted conclusions which cannot be demonstrated. Consider that the earliest mentions we have of the Christian Pascha come from the second century (Melito of Sardis and Ireneaus) and it is nowhere called Easter but instead Pascha and it would continue to be called in most of the Christian world with the exception of England and Germany. So the etymological connection falls flat on it's face as an explanation for the word Easter since no one can explain how an ancient Babylonian word skipped an entire continent and all the Greek and Romance languages in between to be called Easter only in England.

Also, can it be demonstrate that the ancient Pagans celebrated a specific holiday in relation to the Sunday following the vernal equinox? Are there any primary sources?

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Easter, a Pagan Christian festival, embodies many pre Christian traditions. The 8th-century English scholar St. Bede, Claimed it came from Eastre, ( Also known as Ishtar) the Anglo Saxon name for a Teutonic goddess of spring and fertility. traditions associated with the festival survive in the Easter rabbit, a symbol of fertility, and in the colored easter eggs, originally painted with bright colors to represent the sunlight of spring, also given as gifts. Such festivals and the stories help explain their origin. The early Christians, of whom were of Jewish origin, were brought up in the Hebrew tradition. According to the New Testament, Christ was crucified on Friday the 13th , just before the eve of Passover began, and three days afterward rose from the dead. In time, a serious difference over the date of the Easter festival arose among Christians. The Christians of Jewish origin celebrated the resurrection immediately following the Passover festival on Monday, the first day of the week after the two Sabbaths. Christians of Pagan origin, however, wished to commemorate the resurrection on the first day of the week, Sunday.
The Council of Nicaea Ruling on the Date of Easter
The Roman emperor, Constantine the Great, convoked the Council of Nicaea in 325. The council unanimously ruled that the Easter festival should be celebrated throughout the Christian world on the first Sunday after the full moon following the vernal equinox; and that if the full moon should occur on a Sunday and thereby coincide with the Passover festival, Easter should be commemorated on the Sunday following. In that way the feasts of Easter and Passover coinciding was avoided.

Hang on, how did the council of Nicaea address Easter when it wasn't called Easter by that council but Pascha? Was the Church reliant on English pagans in 325 to establish it's feast or was that later? If Eostre is the explanation for Pascha's origins what do we make of the sources before Bede which call the feast Pascha? Also those sources don't dispute the feast being different depending on the days, but the days being different for the same feast. Hence why Polycarp celebrated Pascha one way (the 14th of Nisan, or quatrodecimism) and why others like Anicetus practiced it another way (the way Christians celebrate it today).

Also I would ask for some primary sources which demonstrate pagans coloured eggs for fertility purposes. As far as Im aware this is uniquely Christian but if you can demonstrate otherwise, please do.

 

[gadar perets]

I would invite you to do some historical research on the liturgical origins of Easter/Pascha. The division you are making between them is quite strange to me. You are aware that most of the non English speaking Christian world calls Easter Pascha or some variant of resurrection day right? Why is that?

They call it Pascha because they are ignorant of the truth.

Is it possible Pascha (Easter) represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover?

This statement would be true if the word "Easter" was removed.

Is it possible that the connection between Easter is not to a pagan holiday, but the Jewish one?

No. Neither the Jews, nor the OT connects Pascha to Easter.

Post five is full of unwarranted conclusions which cannot be demonstrated. Consider that the earliest mentions we have of the Christian Pascha come from the second century (Melito of Sardis and Ireneaus) and it is nowhere called Easter but instead Pascha and it would continue to be called in most of the Christian world with the exception of England and Germany. So the etymological connection falls flat on it's face as an explanation for the word Easter since no one can explain how an ancient Babylonian word skipped an entire continent and all the Greek and Romance languages in between to be called Easter only in England.

The church became corrupted after Paul died. That is why he prophesied about wolves not sparing the flock after his departing (Acts 20:29). They adopted all sorts of false teachings which culminated in Nicea.

If your church is similar to Roman Catholicism concerning Easter, then "Good Friday" is Pascha and "Easter Sunday" is resurrection day.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

They call it Pascha because they are ignorant of the truth.


This statement would be true if the word "Easter" was removed.


No. Neither the Jews, nor the OT connects Pascha to Easter.


The church became corrupted after Paul died. That is why he prophesied about wolves not sparing the flock after his departing (Acts 20:29). They adopted all sorts of false teachings which culminated in Nicea.

If your church is similar to Roman Catholicism concerning Easter, then "Good Friday" is Pascha and "Easter Sunday" is resurrection day.

I notice you're not actually addressing my central concern. How does any of this demonstrate a pagan connection? You say it's called Pascha in the Christian world because of ignorance, yet is that the case? Though the idea of a universal apostasy is not relevant to this specific discussion (though I don't believe Jesus and his disciples to be so incompetent as to have the body they left corrupt so easily).

Also, what do you mean by the word easter being removed? The word Easter is almost entirely irrelevent to the liturgical history of the feast itself given that it wasn't called Easter till the 500s/600s and only then by certain peoples on the British Isles and in Germany.

 

[gadar perets]

I notice you're not actually addressing my central concern. How does any of this demonstrate a pagan connection?

I am not addressing a pagan connection. Others did that. I am addressing the Scriptural connection that Easter cannot possibly be Pascha. The two words obviously came to refer to the same thing, but only through the ignorance after the church became corrupted. It doesn't matter to me whether Easter is pagan or not. We are never commanded to celebrate Easter; it is not Pascha (Passover); and Pascha is certainly not to be celebrated on a specific Sunday each year. The true Pascha falls at various times depending on when the first day of the year (Abib 1) falls. If you want to celebrate based on man's calendar, so be it. I will celebrate the resurrection based on YHWH's calendar and when wave sheaf day occurs.

Also, what do you mean by the word easter being removed? The word Easter is almost entirely irrelevent to the liturgical history of the feast itself given that it wasn't called Easter till the 500s/600s and only then by certain peoples on the British Isles and in Germany.

I meant the following statement is false;

Is it possible Pascha (Easter) represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover?
​

But removing the word "Easter" makes it true;

Is it possible Pascha represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover?​

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

So if Pascha is not Easter, what did I celebrate this year in my Greek Orthodox Church? Also please tell me how you conclude Easter has pagan origins. Evidence please.

Pascha is calculated on a different calendar than Easter. We celebrate Pascha.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

and Pascha is certainly not to be celebrated on a specific Sunday each year. The true Pascha falls at various times depending on when the first day of the year (Abib 1) falls. If you want to celebrate based on man's calendar, so be it. I will celebrate the resurrection based on YHWH's calendar and when wave sheaf day occurs.

Actually it does. Pascha is on the Sunday after Passover, on Yom HaBikkurim. Rabbinic Jews calculate it as occurring on the day after Passover. Karaite Jews calculate it the same as we do. Shavuot is also always on a Sunday.

You shall also count for yourselves from the day after the sabbath, from the day when you brought in the sheaf of the wave offering; there shall be seven complete sabbaths. You shall count fifty days to the day after the seventh sabbath; then you shall present a new grain offering to the LORD.…

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The early Christians, of whom were of Jewish origin, were brought up in the Hebrew tradition. According to the New Testament, Christ was crucified on Friday the 13th , just before the eve of Passover began, and three days afterward rose from the dead. In time, a serious difference over the date of the Easter festival arose among Christians. The Christians of Jewish origin celebrated the resurrection immediately following the Passover festival on Monday, the first day of the week after the two Sabbaths. Christians of Pagan origin, however, wished to commemorate the resurrection on the first day of the week, Sunday.

That is totally incorrect. Yeshua was crucified on the 14th, NOT the 13th. Early Christians in the east kept Passover. The resurrection was NEVER celebrated on a Monday (which is NOT the first day of the week). Whoever wrote that has no idea what they are talking about...

 

[gadar perets]

Actually it does. Pascha is on the Sunday after Passover, on Yom HaBikkurim. Rabbinic Jews calculate it as occurring on the day after Passover. Karaite Jews calculate it the same as we do. Shavuot is also always on a Sunday.

You shall also count for yourselves from the day after the sabbath, from the day when you brought in the sheaf of the wave offering; there shall be seven complete sabbaths. You shall count fifty days to the day after the seventh sabbath; then you shall present a new grain offering to the LORD.…

"Pascha" is the Greek word for Passover which never falls on Easter Sunday. So to call that Sunday Pascha is not Scriptural. Also, putting the controversial count to Shavuot aside, a Sunday HaBikkurim does not always fall on Easter Sunday which is fixed as the first Sunday after the first full moon occurring on or after the vernal equinox. However, if there is no barley available for the offering, Pascha is postponed a month, but Easter is not.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

If your church is similar to Roman Catholicism concerning Easter, then "Good Friday" is Pascha and "Easter Sunday" is resurrection day.

Holy Friday is the day Yeshua was crucified. Pascha is held Saturday after sundown. We have no "sunrise services". Psalms are read beginning at sundown on Friday, through the Sabbath until sundown. no, we are NOT Roman catholic.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

"Pascha" is the Greek word for Passover which never falls on Easter Sunday. So to call that Sunday Pascha is not Scriptural. Also, putting the controversial count to Shavuot aside, a Sunday HaBikkurim does not always fall on Easter Sunday which is fixed as the first Sunday after the first full moon occurring on or after the vernal equinox. However, if there is no barley available for the offering, Pascha is postponed a month, but Easter is not.

Pascha is the whole week culminating in the resurrection. Yeshua is our Pascha. Pascha (the resurrection) always occurs after Passover. Pascha is calculated using a different calendar than Western Easter.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

The Eastern Orthodox (Julian) as well as the Jewish calendars are based on the Metonic cycle. The Western Christians follow Rome's Gregorian calendar.

Metonic cycle - Wikipedia

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Pascha is calculated on a different calendar than Easter. We celebrate Pascha.

The difference in calendars does not necessitate a difference in the substance of the feast. Yes we celebrate it according to the Julians

I am not addressing a pagan connection. Others did that. I am addressing the Scriptural connection that Easter cannot possibly be Pascha. The two words obviously came to refer to the same thing, but only through the ignorance after the church became corrupted. It doesn't matter to me whether Easter is pagan or not. We are never commanded to celebrate Easter; it is not Pascha (Passover); and Pascha is certainly not to be celebrated on a specific Sunday each year. The true Pascha falls at various times depending on when the first day of the year (Abib 1) falls. If you want to celebrate based on man's calendar, so be it. I will celebrate the resurrection based on YHWH's calendar and when wave sheaf day occurs.


I meant the following statement is false;

Is it possible Pascha (Easter) represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover?
​

But removing the word "Easter" makes it true;

Is it possible Pascha represents a belief by the Church of Christ's fulfilment of the old Passover?​

I can grant that the exact practice of the Christian pascha is not as described in the Torah. We don't celebrate the old Exodus, we celebrate the new Exodus, the new sacrificial lamb Jesus Christ because he his the one to whom we orientate
ourselves.

Now it does matter whether or not Easter is Pagan. That's the prime justification for those who reject ancient Christianity to not celebrate it in the first place and so I've been addressing that. As for it being man's calender, what do you mean by that? Because it is not mandated we celebrate the resurrection of the Lord and signify it as the most important event in the liturgical year? Tell me, is the Jewish passover devoid of Christ more important than the Christian passover which is full of Christ?

 

[CherubRam]

That is totally incorrect. Yeshua was crucified on the 14th, NOT the 13th. Early Christians in the east kept Passover. The resurrection was NEVER celebrated on a Monday (which is NOT the first day of the week). Whoever wrote that has no idea what they are talking about...

You are mistaken. Friday was the 13th and that same evening was the 14th. He was placed in the tomb just as the Sabbath was about to begin. From Friday evening to Monday evening is three full days.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

You are mistaken. Friday was the 13th and that same evening was the 14th. He was placed in the tomb just as the Sabbath was about to begin. From Friday evening to Monday evening is three full days.

No, I am not mistaken. We KNOW through Scripture that the 14th was a Friday and Yeshua resurrected on Sunday. We even have 2 witnesses on the road to Emmaus.

 

[CherubRam]

No, I am not mistaken. We KNOW through Scripture that the 14th was a Friday and Yeshua resurrected on Sunday. We even have 2 witnesses on the road to Emmaus.

Yahshua said he would be in the tomb for three full days and nights. Do the math.

 

[Dave-W]

We KNOW through Scripture that the 14th was a Friday

We do? Where?

 

[Steve Petersen]

Yeah, John disagrees with the Synoptics on the day of the Last Supper.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

Yahshua said he would be in the tomb for three full days and nights. Do the math.

Here we go again SMH...the problem is that YOU cant do the math!