The "Jesus" we accept, MUST be "PREACHED".

Dartman

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I started a previous thread, at the request of another member, to discuss the 'trinity'. In that thread I challenged anyone, to produce even ONE example of ANY teacher in the Bible explaining the trinity to an audience.

No surprise.

Not one text.

In stead, MOST of the replies were of this nature;
John 17:11
I am no longer in the world; and yet they themselves are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep them in Your name, the name which You have given me, that they may be one even as we are.

The Father and the Son have the same name.

Jesus surrendered His royal name to take on the human form, then He received it back again
Without debating the obvious weaknesses of this statement, I offer this as an example of the dubious, peripheral tangents resorted to, in the attempt to show SOME Scripture that MIGHT offer "support" for trinitarian theory.
I will admit, there are MUCH better texts that 'trinitarian' supporters can produce, but NOT ONE meets Paul's criteria in 2 Cor 11:3-4 ... the "Jesus" we accept MUST be the "Jesus" actually PREACHED by the apostles.
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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I started a previous thread, at the request of another member, to discuss the 'trinity'. In that thread I challenged anyone, to produce even ONE example of ANY teacher in the Bible explaining the trinity to an audience.

No surprise.

Not one text.

In stead, MOST of the replies were of this nature;

Without debating the obvious weaknesses of this statement, I offer this as an example of the dubious, peripheral tangents resorted to, in the attempt to show SOME Scripture that MIGHT offer "support" for trinitarian theory.
I will admit, there are MUCH better texts that 'trinitarian' supporters can produce, but NOT ONE meets Paul's criteria in 2 Cor 11:3-4 ... the "Jesus" we accept MUST be the "Jesus" actually PREACHED by the apostles.

In fact ironically the new catholic encyclopedia concedes that the doctrine of Trinity is not taught in the OT... and that's a major red flag there cause if no ones explaining it in the Nt either then owch.


Not to mention the New encyclopedia Britannica reports that the word trinity neither the explicit doctrine appears int eh NT.

The new international dictionary of the NT theology says the same thing.


But as you point out even just reading the word of God you can't find anyone specifically teach it that's why caused me to no longer embrace it like I used. It wasn't the encyclopedias and history of the view of God (that I sort of looked into later) but it was just by looking through the bible and not finding a teacher specifically break it down.

Additionally, many sources including hte new catholic encyclopedia say that the Trinity wasn't assimilated into life until the 4th century which is rather interesting.
 
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Tolworth John

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Sowho is the God who said,' This is my Son in whom I am pleased.'?
Why did Jesus say that he was going to send the Spirit and that this Spirit would know the mind of God?

Yes the trinity is not taight in the bible, but the elements that make up the trinity are there so please explain how we reconcile them all?
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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Sowho is the God who said,' This is my Son in whom I am pleased.'?
Why did Jesus say that he was going to send the Spirit and that this Spirit would know the mind of God?

Yes the trinity is not taight in the bible, but the elements that make up the trinity are there so please explain how we reconcile them all?
I sort of broke it down in this thread I had the other person may have his own take but this is mine.


Why you should pray to JESUS
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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Sowho is the God who said,' This is my Son in whom I am pleased.'?
Why did Jesus say that he was going to send the Spirit and that this Spirit would know the mind of God?

Yes the trinity is not taight in the bible, but the elements that make up the trinity are there so please explain how we reconcile them all?
I also find it rather strange how one God is taught especially in the OT but trinity not treated with the same care.

With the trinity there are just "elements" or "hints" or "indicators" and 99% of them found in the NT
 
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Tolworth John

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I also find it rather strange how one God is taught especially in the OT but trinity not treated with the same care.
I agree it is strange.
Possible because the NT were more concerned about teaching about Jesus and the gospel then in writing detailed theological books.

Fortunetly whether one is a trinitarian or not is not a salvation critical issue.
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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I agree it is strange.
Possible because the NT were more concerned about teaching about Jesus and the gospel then in writing detailed theological books.

Fortunetly whether one is a trinitarian or not is not a salvation critical issue.

Well lets say that was the case....why wasn't the trinity emphasized in the OT when under this logic knowing who God was was actually important.


I would say it matters when it comes to baptism though, whether you baptize in JESUS name, or Father, son, Holy Ghost, but outside of that doesn't effect repentance, Holy Spirit reception and other things.
 
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Tolworth John

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why wasn't the trinity emphasized in the OT
Given theJews tendancy to latch on to the nearest false God, teaching them that God was a trinity would have sent them crazy.
Most of the OT is God hammering home the fact that there is only One God.
The problem is they were a single track thought by th time Jesus was there and teaching that he was also God.
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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Given theJews tendancy to latch on to the nearest false God, teaching them that God was a trinity would have sent them crazy.
Most of the OT is God hammering home the fact that there is only One God.
The problem is they were a single track thought by th time Jesus was there and teaching that he was also God.


interesting explanation

Also what do you mean by your last sentence?
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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Jesus claimed to be God in the NT.
True but even under the trinity Jesus is God is he not? If they are co-equal then they all have to be God because God essentially means supreme. IN the trinity all 3 "Beings/persons" are God but not each other essentially that's at least how it seems
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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And the Jew did not accept that. It is partly why they excuted Jesus.
I agree at least in the sense that they didn't accept who he was as God so they killed him.. but of course I differ when it comes to the belief of 3 beings or persons that's the only thing I differ on compared to trinitarians. I believe all 3 are God but I just don't believe they are different persons or beings but rather manifestations of One God. Kind of like how he manifested himself in the OT as a cloud or fire or bush or figure.
 
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JESUS=G.O.A.T

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Weird, Jesus is God as the Son of God, the 2nd person of the trinity.
That's where manifestation makes more sense because son=The human body essentially and under oneness or a manifestation perspective son would be a title simply representing the human body God operated under.
 
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Dartman

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So who is the God who said,' This is my Son in whom I am pleased.'?
Jehovah/YHVH God, the ONLY true God. The ONLY creator of the universe. The God of Israel. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Jesus' God.

Tolworth said:
Why did Jesus say that he was going to send the Spirit and that this Spirit would know the mind of God?
Jesus said he was going to "pray the Father" to send the Father's spirit/mind/power.
Where do you find any Scripture that states the "spirit would know the mind of God"?

Tolworth said:
Yes the trinity is not taight in the bible, but the elements that make up the trinity are there so please explain how we reconcile them all?
Of course Jehovah, Jehovah's spirit and Jesus are discussed in Scripture, that isn't the issue.
The "how" they are to be reconciled is very simple.

The Scriptures explicitly clarify Jehovah/YHVH God is "the ONLY true God".

Jehovah/YHVH God has MADE, EXALTED, ANOINTED, APPOINTED, SENT, RAISED UP a direct descendant of Adam, Abraham, Judah and David through their direct descendant Mary.

Jehovah God gave His spirit/power to Jesus of Nazareth, and EXALTED Jesus to be; Lord, Christ, Prince, High Priest, Chief Shepherd, His holy servant, His son.
 
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Dartman

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I agree it is strange.
Possible because the NT were more concerned about teaching about Jesus and the gospel then in writing detailed theological books.

Fortunetly whether one is a trinitarian or not is not a salvation critical issue.
Of course it's a salvation issue! Worshiping the "only TRUE God" is crucial both OT and NT!
If you don't think so, read 1 Kings 18, and see how critical believing in the RIGHT "Elohiym" is!
 
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