If the Bible has errors or discrepancies how am I supposed to believe in Jesus?

[rjs330]

John did write the Gospel according to John, the scholars are wrong.

I agree. Part of the issue here is that men often either want to appear intellectual so they challenge scripture or they are deliberately trying to undermine scripture. Many scholars are not believers. We have to be very careful about who these scholars really are. For when they cast doubt upon the word of God they are tools in the hand of the deceiver whether they realize it or not.

 

[-V-]

Thanks for sharing. I like these:

 

[rjs330]

You're not addressing the issue at all. Just more misrepresentations and straw men. I never said you can have Christian living without the Bible. I never said you can do your own thing. I never said you can follow Christ without it being according to God's Word. I never said to follow another Christ.


Yeah, that's pretty much what I suspected your answer would boil down to - "it's correct because the KJV says so."

You are handling yourself very well here. Do no let others misrepresent or twist what you are saying. Some here are VERY prone to do just that. I have experienced that myself. Your arguments are spot on.

 

[-V-]

You are handling yourself very well here. Do no let others misrepresent or twist what you are saying. Some here are VERY prone to do just that. I have experienced that myself. Your arguments are spot on.

Thank you, sir.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Thanks for sharing. I like these:
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Those songs sound a little too much like the world for my tastes.

I prefer praise and worship songs like the following videos:

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[RogerRoger]

If I can't see the mountain directly -- why is that brought up? -- then I must accept the most accurate description of it. I must depend on somebody who wants to convey to me what the mountain is really like.

Are you saying that the gospels aren't "well-painted", even though they have been accepted as part of the canon of scripture for roughly 2,000 years? You demand some ill-defined concept of "truth"? Why don't you tell God that the portraits of his son aren't accurate?

Go ahead and test everything by your own standard, never mind that that's the opposite of faith. "Faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1

I think you're answering a slightly different question than the one they're asking. It's not about the quality of the portrait, I think the concern, which is something many Christian's go through at some point in their journey, is whether the mountain exists at all.

I think their concern is that much of our source of the history of Christianity and God's people is the bible. If there are consistency issues, or authorship issues, with that source, then how do we believe? What's our foundation?

The question is more about starting to believe than confirming an existing belief. Your mention of scripture being accepted canon is only important to someone if they accept that history as valid. And in all likelihood part of how they evaluate that history is the source material. Using that history to validate the source material can seem like coming at it backwards.

I don't think this is a silly concern at all, it's something that many people have struggled with.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Just citing the examples of the Gospel of Mark and the Gospel of John, when the supper and day and hour of cruxificion is different,

It sounds like you may be referring to John 19:14.
For a long time it was a mystery to me, but I never let it shake my faith.

Anyways, if you are referring to John 19:14:
Well, this is resolved by looking at the words of Jesus in Matthew 26 when He says,

"Behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners."
(Matthew 26:45).​

In other words, when John 19:14 says it was "about the sixth hour" when Pilate says to the Jews (with Jesus present), "Behold your King!", it is the counting of time (six hours from) the beginning point of time called "the hour is at hand" as said by Jesus. This hour that is at hand was when He would be betrayed into the hands of sinners. It was six hours from this point or hour that Jesus was talking about in Matthew 26:45. In other words, I can say, in about four hours from now I will be sound asleep. So from the hour mentioned by Jesus in Matthew 26:45, six hours had passed and Jesus was standing before the people with Pilate declaring to the Jews, "Behold your King!"

or, John in the gospel saying he was an eyewitness of the events, when scholars don't believe it was he who wrote ithe gospel, how am I supposed to believe in Jesus? I'm wavering on my belief.

Scholars are just men and they are infallible; Trust in God and His Word and He will never let you down. Walk by faith and not by sight. Sometimes we do not have all the answers (even in God's Word). But if this is the case, ask the Lord and be patient; Sometimes it takes years to get an answer to a complicated passage. This happened to me two times. So be patient and wait upon the Lord.


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[Bible Highlighter]

It sounds like you may be referring to John 19:14.
For a long time it was a mystery to me, but I never let it shake my faith.

Anyways, if you are referring to John 19:14:
Well, this is resolved by looking at the words of Jesus in Matthew 26 when He says,

"Behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners."
(Matthew 26:45).​

In other words, when the text says it was "about the sixth hour" when Pilate says to the Jews (with Jesus present), "Behold your King!", it is in reference from the time beginning point of time called "the hour is at hand" as said by Jesus that was in reference to the beginning time of when He would be betrayed into the hands of sinners. It was six hours from this point or hour that Jesus was talking about in Matthew 26:45. In other words, I can say, in about four hours from now I will be sound asleep. So from the hour of Matthew 26:45, six hours passed and Jesus was standing before the people with Pilate declaring "Behold your King!"



Scholars are just men and they are infallible; Trust in God and His Word and He will never let you down. Walk by faith and not by sight. Sometimes we do not have all the answers (even in God's Word). But if this is the case, ask the Lord and be patient; Sometimes it takes years to get an answer to a complicated passage. This happened to me two times. So be patient and wait upon the Lord.


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After more study on John 19:14, I have yet revised my position on it.
Please check out my re-edit explanation for John 19:14 within post #227 (above).

Thank you.

May God bless you.


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[Bible Highlighter]

As for Matthew 26:17:

At evening (when the sun went down), it would be the 14th (on what we could consider a Tuesday evening). But the sun going down on a Tuesday evening would be the beginning calendar day of Wednesday the 14th.

So how can Jesus celebrate the passover or how can it be the 1st day of unleavened bread at the Lord's supper a day before He was crucified on the Passover Day when the 1st day of unleaven bread begins on the 15th?

Luke 22:1 tells us the feast of unleavened bread is known as the Passover. It is the 14th. it is the time they would get rid of all leaven out of their homes. They are referring to preparation day leading up to the meal.
John 19:14 suggests the same day He was crucified is also called the "Day of Preparation." It was the Day of Preparation for the Passover meal at evening (i.e. the end of the 14th and the beginning of the 15th).

Also, from many Jews perspectives, this would be the first day leading up to the feast. The conclusion of the 14th ends with them not having any leaven in their homes and with them eating the Passover. So for them, it was the first day of preparation leading to the meal.


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[Steve Petersen]

You can go around and around trying to reconcile conflicting passages about the Last Supper. It can't be done.

The necessity of trying to resolve this problem comes from the cognitive dissonance caused by the belief in an inerrant Bible and the recognition that it is not inerrant. People can be very creative in their attempts to resolve the problem.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You can go around and around trying to reconcile conflicting passages about the Last Supper. It can't be done.

The necessity of trying to resolve this problem comes from the cognitive dissonance caused by the belief in an inerrant Bible and the recognition that it is not inerrant. People can be very creative in their attempts to resolve the problem.

Not at all. A person can clearly see there is no contradictions in Scripture with the proper understanding by God.

A person chooses to have either a half glass full type mentality or a glass half empty mentality.

Scripture says without faith, it is impossible to please Him; And faith comes by hearing the Word of God.

For I should not correct Scripture, but Scripture should correct me.


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[OrthodoxyUSA]

Just citing the examples of the Gospel of Mark and the Gospel of John, when the supper and day and hour of cruxificion is different, or, John in the gospel saying he was an eyewitness of the events, when scholars don't believe it was he who wrote ithe gospel, how am I supposed to believe in Jesus? I'm wavering on my belief.

If every book agreed on all things while being written by different people at different times. I would be far more suspicious.

The overall problem here is a lack of a guide. The Church has been provided to us by Christ for these very reasons.

Forgive me...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If every book agreed on all things while being written by different people at different times. I would be far more suspicious.

The overall problem here is a lack of a guide. The Church has been provided to us by Christ for these very reasons.

Forgive me...

While fellow believers can be helpful,
I believe our ultimate guide or teacher of the Scriptures is the Holy Spirit.

"Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come." (John 16:13).

"But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things." (1 John 2:20).

What must a person do?

"Call unto me, and I will answer thee, and shew thee great and mighty things, which thou knowest not." (Jeremiah 33:3).

"But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint." (Isaiah 40:31).

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." (2 Timothy 2:15).

"These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." (Acts of the Apostles 17:11).

There is nothing in God's Word about joining a specific church so as to have a guide; In fact, I believe going to just any church will cause more problems for a person then it will resolve the answers that they are looking for. Instead of seeking out the answers in person and getting caught up in false doctrine by a wrong church, the best way is to study the Scriptures in prayer with God and to read what other believers have said on the topic online. If no answer is forth coming, then wait upon the Lord. Sometimes it may be years before an answer presents itself or sometimes it may be weeks.

I also believe the church is the body of Christ and that fellowship should be done like in the New Testament. Believers should gather in small groups within their homes and have intimate fellowship.


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[OrthodoxyUSA]

While fellow believers can be helpful, I believe our ultimate guide or teacher of the Scriptures is the Holy Spirit.

"Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come." (John 16:13).

"But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things." (1 John 2:20).

What must a person do?

"Call unto me, and I will answer thee, and shew thee great and mighty things, which thou knowest not." (Jeremiah 33:3).

"But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint." (Isaiah 40:31).

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." (2 Timothy 2:15).

"These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so." (Acts of the Apostles 17:11).


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There are services (Burial, Baptism etc.) the Church provides... would you agree?
Does scripture alone tell us HOW to do these things?

Forgive me...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There are services (Burial, Baptism etc.) the Church provides... would you agree?
Does scripture alone tell us HOW to do these things?

Forgive me...

I believe the church is not a building but it is the body of Christ (i.e. God's people). Today, the word "church" has become some kind of faceless institution or business where people point out a building and say ... "church." When they should be pointing to the people and then say... "church." Do a search on the word "church" at BlueLetterBIble and you will find that it has nothing to do with a building.

I believe true fellowship should be like in the New Testament where they gathered in each others homes in small fellowship whereby people can get to know each other and to help each other in intimate settings. They can worship God in a more deeper and more intimate way. No unbelievers are invited to have fellowship. For what fellowship does Christ have with Belial? What fellowship does light have with darkness? Evangelization was generally done by believers going out "two by two."

As for being buried: A person can be buried without using a specific church service. The body is just a shell. Nothing is said in the New Testament of the importance of treating the body when it dies for the fellow brethren.

As for baptism: A person can be baptized by just one other believer. We see this happen with Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch.


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[OrthodoxyUSA]

Nothing is said in the New Testament of the importance of treating the body when it dies for the fellow brethren.
...

Incorrect.

Forgive me...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Incorrect.

Show me Scripture in the New Testament on any burial procedures that we need to follow as prescibed by some church institution or business.

Forgive me...

No offense, but why do you keep saying this, my friend?


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[OrthodoxyUSA]

Show me Scripture in the New Testament on any burial procedures that we need to follow as prescibed by some church institution or business.



No offense, but why do you keep saying this, my friend?


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No offense taken...

I'm the one saying there are no instructions in the Bible on HOW to do it....

you said...

Nothing is said in the New Testament of the importance of treating the body when it dies for the fellow brethren.

Different things.

Forgive me...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

No offense taken...

I'm the one saying there are no instructions in the Bible on HOW to do it....

you said...

Different things.

My authority is God's Word and not a church institution or business (See 2 Timothy 3:16-17).
Remember, Jesus was upset at the pharisees for having traditions that violated the Word of God.

Forgive me...

Why do you keep saying that?


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[OrthodoxyUSA]

So... The Church had nothing to do with what's in our bible?
Is that what you are saying?

Forgive me...