Can a Christian lose his/her salvation?

Albion

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You agree then if one leaves the faith God has no obligation to save him anyway therefore OSAS cannot be true?
Not at all. I was saying that God has no obligation to save anyone. It isn't about OSAS or the opposite view. The idea of God being obliged to either save someone or not save them is just a punk argument.
 
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Handmaid for Jesus

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If Lord Jesus started my salvation, He will finish it.

Hebrews 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
 
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Quasar92

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You are simply confusing faithfulness as the definition of being Christian. Becoming a Christian is the
result of hearing the gospel, believing and obedience:
1) repentance from dead works;
2) water baptism by full immersion;
3) Holy Spirit baptism - God dwelling within a convert.

But this is only the beginning. Read the epistles.
But Jesus himself spoke of our failings and the weaknesses of the flesh - Jesus speaks of those not enduring read the parable of the sower ...
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that hears the word, and anon with
joy receives it;
Mat 13:21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but endures for a while: for when tribulation or persecution
arises because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that hears the word; and the care of this world,
and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful.
Matthew 13:

18 And these are they which are sown among thorns; such as hear the word,
19 And the cares of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, and the lusts of other things entering in, choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful.
Mark 4:18-19
this verse definitely refers to the loss suffered by a believer after a period of time - taking their eyes
off the Lord and the Word of God.

8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor
unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 But he that lacks these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was
purged from his old sins.
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye
do these things, ye shall never fall:

2 Peter 1:8-10


One night I dreamed a dream.
As I was walking along the beach with my Lord.
Across the dark sky flashed scenes from my life.
For each scene, I noticed two sets of footprints in the sand,
One belonging to me and one to my Lord.

After the last scene of my life flashed before me,
I looked back at the footprints in the sand.
I noticed that at many times along the path of my life,
especially at the very lowest and saddest times,
there was only one set of footprints.

This really troubled me, so I asked the Lord about it.
"Lord, you said once I decided to follow you,
You'd walk with me all the way.
But I noticed that during the saddest and most troublesome times of my life,
there was only one set of footprints.
I don't understand why, when I needed You the most, You would leave me."

He whispered, "My precious child, I love you and will never leave you
Never, ever, during your trials and testings.
When you saw only one set of footprints,
It was then that I carried you."


Author unknown


Quasar92
 
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aiki

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I believe that Luke 8:12-13 show that a Christian can lose his salvation.

V.12 says that the devil took the seed away so that they may not believe and be saved. From this we see that Jesus means that one must believe to be saved. I'm sure we all agree on that.

V.13 then says that some received the word and believed for a while. Considering that anyone who believes is saved then this verse can only mean that believing for a while means saved for a while.

Many try to refute this conclusion by saying that believe in v.12 does not mean the same as it means in v.13 which, of course, is not a reasonable statement.

The apostle James makes the point that not all belief is saving belief:

James 2:19
19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe--and tremble!

If the demons believe - and tremble - are we to expect they are saved? Obviously not. Not every sort of belief is a saving belief. My grandfather used to preach a sermon he called "Missing Heaven by Eighteen Inches." In it he would explain that an intellectual belief - the sort adopted by those in Christ's parable of the Sower and the Seed - is insufficient to obtain salvation. Simply agreeing in your mind that the Gospel is true and admiring it as a symbol of divine grace and mercy does not save you. The Gospel must travel the eighteen inches from your head to your heart and stir belief there. And when the heart believes, that is, believes with the anticipation of a changed life, then one has a saving belief, or faith.
 
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NothingIsImpossible

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Truth is OSAS is false doctrine. Because lets say someone becomes saved (legitly in their heart and Gods sees that), then some years later they snap for some reason. So they go around killings hundreds of people, raping people (including kids), cutting up animals and all kinds of extreme stuff. And finally they get caught and a shoot out occurs and they die.

Does he go to heaven? The answer is no. Now, what if he prayed for forgiveness right before he died. That I do not know, maybe he goes to heaven, maybe he doesn't. One could argue he wasn't saved to begin with. But thats just an argument to logic our way into saying "OSAS" doesn't apply to him.

And what about those who commit suicide as christians? I don't believe they go heaven. Why? Because why would any christian want to alive then? All christians can become saved and just kill themselves so they can get to heaven right away. I mean who cares about the sadness we leave behind when this is all temporal anyways right?

This is why I believe OSAS is not true at all. Its just one of those prosperity preaching type things to make people feel better about themselves so they don't have to wonder about if they are really on the right path or not as a christian since they believe they are going to heaven no matter what.

Which is why I wonder if part of those who God turns away are some OSAS believers. Because it says they will not understand why they didn't get to go to heaven.
 
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RoseforChrist

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That situation with the Galations ocurred BEFORE the New Covenant came into effect, through the shed blood of Jesus on a cross. See the following for another statement by Jesus:

Jn.10:27 "My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than allc]">[c]; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”


Quasar92
any one who listens and follows shall not be snatched
 
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That situation with the Galations ocurred BEFORE the New Covenant came into effect, through the shed blood of Jesus on a cross. See the following for another statement by Jesus:

Jn.10:27 "My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than allc]">[c]; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”


Quasar92
Dear Quasar,

Your quote from John 10:27-30 was also before the New Covenant came into effect. As a matter of fact, practically everything Jesus said was before the New Covenant. You need to either dismiss it all or accept it all, not accept the bits that please you.

Also, John 10:27-30 is of no help to support OSAS. In v.27, Jesus said that His sheep listen to and follow Him. Both 'listen' and 'follow' are Present Tense meaning that His sheep must continue to listen and continue to follow. If they don't then they may be plucked out of His hand.

God bless,
Mick
 
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The apostle James makes the point that not all belief is saving belief:

James 2:19
19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe--and tremble!

If the demons believe - and tremble - are we to expect they are saved? Obviously not. Not every sort of belief is a saving belief.

So you are telling me that in the parable, "believe" means to be saved in v.12 and in v.13 it does not mean to be saved. Do you really believe this?
 
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aiki

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So you are telling me that in the parable, "believe" means to be saved in v.12 and in v.13 it does not mean to be saved. Do you really believe this?

Is your incredulity supposed to serve as an argument?
 
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Handmaid for Jesus

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The more I look at it, the more I'm convinced that lose-able salvation is a lie from Satan -- meant to embitter people with legalism and worry.
Yep! It is a control mechanism. This is how cults are formed.
 
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aiki

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"Repent" in English implies continuous action. The dictionary defines it as "feel or express sincere regret or remorse about one's wrongdoing or sin", now a flip floppy disposition is not repentance!

I don't look in this instance to a dictionary to define what the Bible means by repentance. The word is used most frequently in Scripture to refer to God choosing a course different from the one He was pursuing. Here's an example from the KJV:

Exodus 32:14
14 And the LORD repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.


And from the NKJV:

Exodus 32:14
14 So the Lord relented from the harm which He said He would do to His people.


And from the NASB:

Exodus 32:14
14 So the Lord changed His mind about the harm which He said He would do to His people.


I think the NASB best renders the word appearing as "repented" in the KJV in Exodus 32:14: God changed His mind. He was purposing to do x and decided instead to do y. This happens over and over again in the OT (Jdg. 2:18; 1 Sam. 15:35; 2 Sam. 24:16; 1 Chr. 21:15; Ps. 106:45; Am. 7:3, etc.) Is God feeling regret or remorse over sin when He repents? Of course not! As the NASB correctly describes it, when God "repented" He simply changed His mind. This is the heart of repentance. It is not merely feeling regret or remorse about one's sin.

I agree with you that "flip-flopiness" is not repentance. One has not truly had a change of mind about something if they are still going back and forth inwardly about their thinking on it.
 
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aiki

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aiki

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Sorry to hear you do not follow, you are in my prayers.

Okay. I get it. You don't want to actually argue for your point of view, just make unjustified assertions about it. At some point, though, if you want to be a strong, stable, mature disciple of Christ, you're going to have to go deeper in your knowledge of your own faith.

I shall pray for you, too.
 
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RoseforChrist

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Okay. I get it. You don't want to actually argue for your point of view, just make unjustified assertions about it. At some point, though, if you want to be a strong, stable, mature disciple of Christ, you're going to have to go deeper in your knowledge of your own faith.

I shall pray for you, too.
There is no point in argument. Answer me this according to your opinion on your blog post why would i need to grow deeper in faith if God has already done the work and i could never lose my salvation? Thank you for your prayers
 
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klutedavid

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Before this question is answered, the term “Christian” must be defined. A “Christian” is not a person who has said a prayer, or walked down an aisle, or been raised in a Christian family. While each of these things can be a part of the Christian experience, they are not what “makes” a Christian. A Christian is a person who has, by faith, received and fully trusted in Jesus Christ as the only Savior (John 3:16; Acts 16:31; Ephesians 2:8-9).

So, with this definition in mind, can a Christian lose salvation? Perhaps the best way to answer this crucially important question is to examine what the Bible says occurs at salvation, and to study what losing salvation would therefore entail. Here are a few examples:

A Christian is a new creation. “Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!” (2 Corinthians 5:17). This verse speaks of a person becoming an entirely new creature as a result of being “in Christ.” For a Christian to lose salvation, the new creation would have to be canceled and reversed.

A Christian is redeemed. “For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your forefathers, but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect” (1 Peter 1:18-19). The word “redeemed” refers to a purchase being made, a price being paid. For a Christian to lose salvation, God Himself would have to revoke His purchase that He paid for with the precious blood of Christ.

A Christian is justified. “Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ” (Romans 5:1). To “justify” means to “declare righteous.” All those who receive Jesus as Savior are “declared righteous” by God. For a Christian to lose salvation, God would have to go back on His Word and “un-declare” what He had previously declared.

A Christian is promised eternal life. “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life” (John 3:16). Eternal life is a promise of eternity (forever) in heaven with God. God promises, “Believe and you will have eternal life.” For a Christian to lose salvation, eternal life would have to be taken away. If a Christian is promised to live forever, how then can God break this promise by taking away eternal life?

A Christian is guaranteed glorification. “And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified” (Romans 8:30). As we learned in Romans 5:1, justification is declared at the moment of faith. According to Romans 8:30, glorification is guaranteed for all those whom God justifies. Glorification refers to a Christian receiving a perfect resurrection body in heaven. If a Christian can lose salvation, then Romans 8:30 is in error, because God could not guarantee glorification for all those whom He predestines, calls, and justifies.

Many more illustrations of what occurs at salvation could be shared. Even these few make it abundantly clear that a Christian cannot lose salvation. Most, if not all, of what the Bible says happens to us when we receive Jesus Christ as Savior would be invalidated if salvation could be lost. Salvation cannot be reversed. A Christian cannot be un-newly created. Redemption cannot be undone. Eternal life cannot be lost and still be considered eternal. If a Christian can lose salvation, God would have to go back on His Word and change His mind—two things that Scripture tells us God never does.

The most frequent objections to the belief that a Christian cannot lose salvation are 1) What about those who are Christians and continually live an immoral lifestyle? 2) What about those who are Christians but later reject the faith and deny Christ? The problem with these two objections is the phrase “who are Christians.” The Bible declares that a true Christian will not live a continually immoral lifestyle (1 John 3:6). The Bible declares that anyone who departs the faith is demonstrating that he never truly was a Christian (1 John 2:19). Therefore, neither objection is valid. Christians do not continually live immoral lifestyles, nor do they reject the faith and deny Christ. Such actions are proof that they were never redeemed.

No, a Christian cannot lose salvation. Nothing can separate a Christian from God’s love (Romans 8:38-39). Nothing can remove a Christian from God’s hand (John 10:28-29). God is both willing and able to guarantee and maintain the salvation He has given us. Jude 24-25, “To Him who is able to keep you from falling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy—to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.”


Source:Can a Christian lose salvation? in Ask a Question Get an Answer Forum


Quasa92
Hello Quasar92.

Can a Christian surrender their salvation?

God will never release His grip on anyone who believes in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. So anyone who calls on the name of Jesus will be saved. Nothing can separate us from the love of God. From the perspective of God this gift of salvation is unconditional, a free gift.

Though from the perspective of man, we need to endure in this believing in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. So if we choose to no longer trust in Jesus Christ for our salvation, then we will be released from the contract.

There are two sides to this covenant.
 
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