Can a Christian lose his/her salvation?

[Solomons Porch]

Mika was 33 years old. Born and raised atheist by his parents. At the age of 19 he met a young lady that caught his eye, she was christian, and due to this she asked him to attend church and being that he liked her so, he attended and within a year was saved, accepted Jesus as His Lord and Savior, life seemed a little brighter and the relationship flourished. They stayed together for the next 5 years with promises of marriage and commitment to each other, eventually one day Mika noticed Lily was distant, he come too soon learn she was pregnant with another man's child, a man within their church and close Christian friend.

At the age of 25, Mika became enraged and angry, not only at his Lily but also at the Christian friend and anything that had the title of "Christian" attached to it. This pregnancy and the betrayal of a close Christian friend devastated him. His anger turned to hate. He renounced Christ. He began searching for anything that could bring him peace, one day a friend at the workplace offered him another religion. He began his journey of looking for peace in the Buddhist community and before long Buddha became his god. He had finally found what he was looking for. The pain seemed to be gone from him.

One night during a night out with the guys to relax and unwind at a local gathering place, he noticed someone familiar, it was Lily. Suddenly all the pain returned upon seeing his love with another man, laughing in an environment that they claimed was not of Christ to be in such a place. Lily did not notice Mika, neither did Samuel Lily's new husband. Filled with rage and alcohol, memories flooded Mika and before long he could not control the urge to confront his love Lily and used to be friend Samuel. He decided to walk over and give them a piece of his mind. He staggered to their table yelling and asking why you betrayed me you scum, you betrayed me Lily and I loved you with all my heart, and as for your God, He is nothing and you serve a powerless God.

Before long all attention was towards the confrontation and as Mika's friends began to realize they should step in and calm him down, they still struggled with him outside begging him to let's just leave, it's over man you need to calm down. That statement from his friend Paul was the last statement Paul would ever make, because when Mika heard those words "you need to calm down", Mika pushed Paul into the street yelling obscenities. Paul was hit and killed by a car instantly.

Everyone claimed it was an accident, so Mika was freed of charges. One night 2 months later Mika could no longer take the pain of killing his friend, he grabbed the gun and took his life alone in his tiny bedroom apartment. On the nightstand was a Bible and there was a note on the Bible with a knife jabbed thru the front cover, it read, your God is a liar, see what your God did to me. I'm sorry Margaret (Pauls mom) I'm so sorry.


Does Mika lose his salvation???

At the age of 19 he met a young lady that caught his eye, she was Christian, and due to this she asked him to attend church and being that he liked her so, he attended and within a year was saved, accepted Jesus as His Lord and Savior

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

for it is HE working IN YOU that which is WELL pleasing in his sight.

Exactly! He is doing the work of righteousness in us. All of our works righteousness is as filthy rags.

What of sin?
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Mika was 33 years old. Born and raised atheist by his parents. At the age of 19 he met a young lady that caught his eye, she was christian, and due to this she asked him to attend church and being that he liked her so, he attended and within a year was saved, accepted Jesus as His Lord and Savior, life seemed a little brighter and the relationship flourished. They stayed together for the next 5 years with promises of marriage and commitment to each other, eventually one day Mika noticed Lily was distant, he come too soon learn she was pregnant with another man's child, a man within their church and close Christian friend.

At the age of 25, Mika became enraged and angry, not only at his Lily but also at the Christian friend and anything that had the title of "Christian" attached to it. This pregnancy and the betrayal of a close Christian friend devastated him. His anger turned to hate. He renounced Christ. He began searching for anything that could bring him peace, one day a friend at the workplace offered him another religion. He began his journey of looking for peace in the Buddhist community and before long Buddha became his god. He had finally found what he was looking for. The pain seemed to be gone from him.

One night during a night out with the guys to relax and unwind at a local gathering place, he noticed someone familiar, it was Lily. Suddenly all the pain returned upon seeing his love with another man, laughing in an environment that they claimed was not of Christ to be in such a place. Lily did not notice Mika, neither did Samuel Lily's new husband. Filled with rage and alcohol, memories flooded Mika and before long he could not control the urge to confront his love Lily and used to be friend Samuel. He decided to walk over and give them a piece of his mind. He staggered to their table yelling and asking why you betrayed me you scum, you betrayed me Lily and I loved you with all my heart, and as for your God, He is nothing and you serve a powerless God.

Before long all attention was towards the confrontation and as Mika's friends began to realize they should step in and calm him down, they still struggled with him outside begging him to let's just leave, it's over man you need to calm down. That statement from his friend Paul was the last statement Paul would ever make, because when Mika heard those words "you need to calm down", Mika pushed Paul into the street yelling obscenities. Paul was hit and killed by a car instantly.

Everyone claimed it was an accident, so Mika was freed of charges. One night 2 months later Mika could no longer take the pain of killing his friend, he grabbed the gun and took his life alone in his tiny bedroom apartment. On the nightstand was a Bible and there was a note on the Bible with a knife jabbed thru the front cover, it read, your God is a liar, see what your God did to me. I'm sorry Margaret (Pauls mom) I'm so sorry.


Does Mika lose his salvation???

At the age of 19 he met a young lady that caught his eye, she was Christian, and due to this she asked him to attend church and being that he liked her so, he attended and within a year was saved, accepted Jesus as His Lord and Savior

If he was truly born again no he did not lose his salvation. But, from the story, his faith was in his girl. It did not seem to me that he trusted Lord Jesus.

 

[aiki]

Keep twisting doctrine to suit what men teach.

Simply saying I'm "twisting doctrine" does not prove that I am. If you're going to make an assertion that you want people to accept, you're going to have to show that it is valid and true.

 

[TheSeabass]

Hey sea bass........if you had seen me before grace
you would have cringed I as that wicked. A slave to sin I was.....
but WHOME THE SON SETS FREE IS FREE
now die daily , for who we follow IS our master
and it cant be both the flesh and spirit
it cant be boht Christ and belial
it cant be darkness and light.
that IS THE DELUSION so many are now under. that it can be both. BUT IT CANT>

Hi,

Yes, and because one chooses to follow the light today does not mean it is impossible for him to return back to darkness tomorrow.

 

[TheSeabass]

Ah, so NOW you are okay with taking something from the Bible out of context. That's a pretty fast turnaround, isn't it?

My point was John 10:28 is taken out of context then used to wrongly declare OSAS.

Yes, I understood you. But God has no obligation to save anyone anyway, so there's no point to saying he doesn't have an obligation to save any particular bunch of people.

You agree then if one leaves the faith God has no obligation to save him anyway therefore OSAS cannot be true?

 

[TheSeabass]

"Jesus died on the cross once for our salvation. Saying you lose your salvation and have to regain it again and again means that our father continues to die on the cross over and over again which cannot be true."

That is not the case with Simon in Acts 8. Simon, as the Samaritans, believed and was baptized (Acts 8:12-13) and saved per Jesus' words of Mark 16:16. He later sinned by trying to buy the power of the Holy Ghost and was then in a lost state, perishing with his money, v20. He was commanded to repent, v22 to be forgiven. Christ therefore does not have to be crucified over and over.

Water baptism is for the remission of sins (Acts 2:38), therefore is water baptized is the point when one's sins begin to cleansed away by the blood of Christ and as long as the Christian walks in the light Christ's blood CONTINUES to wash away all sin 1 John 1:7, again, no reason for Christ to be crucified over and over for His blood continues to wash away sins as long as the Christian continues to walk in the light. If the Christian quits altogether walking in the light then Christ's blood no longer washes away all sins. Yet the Christian can repent and return to walking in the light and Christ blood will cleanse away all sins as it did before.

 

[WilliamBo]

I am starting to pray daily ''God please make it impossible for me NOT to repent... please change my DNA, my brain chemistry, my spiritual pre-disposition, my heart, or whatever else you can change AGAINST my own will so that I will NOT reject you because God I do NOT trust my own free will or my own heart... please make me to surrender to you until the day that I die... God, please don't let me turn against you 20 years from now after you have blessed my life, and I might feel like I don't need you any more... please don't let that happen to me''

 

[TheSeabass]

Understand, it is the spirit that is born again and is saved. The flesh accounts for nothing. It is going to die anyway for it is mortal. Apostle Paul explains it this way when instructing the Church at Corinth.
1 Corinthians 5:5
To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

This individual at Corinth became lost for having his father's wife > fornication 1 Cor 5:1 cf Galatians 5:19-21 fornication is a sin that keeps anyone that commits it from entering the kingdom. The church at Corinth was directed by Paul to use church discipline against this fornicator which they did and the fornicator repented 2 Cor 2:6-7.

Some people are wheat, some are tares. That is why Apostle Peter says
2 Peter 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: (KJV emphasis mine)

This verse proves the Christian can fall.

 

[TheSeabass]

If that is true then I would say no man has met the conditions. But, the loss of salvation theology is s wrong, there really is no need to worry about meeting any conditions.

All one has to do to be in Christ is be water baptized:

Gal 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

The Greek for "put on" is endyō meaning to sink into (clothing), put on, clothe one's self.

IF I put on a coat then am in the coat likewise when one puts on Christ in baptism he is in Christ and must faithfully remain there to be saved for there is no salvation to be found outside of Christ.

 

[TheSeabass]

Romans 8.38-39 has a wonderful promise to the believer.

ROm 8:38-39 lists thing external to the Christian for the Christian can separate himself from the love of God. Jude commanded "Keep yourselves in the love of God" Jude 1:21 with the imperative implying the Christian can be separated from the love of God.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Can a Christian lose his/her salvation?

Of course.

Would any of the proponents of "Can't lose your salvation" like to take a stab at explaining the meaning of the Prodigal son parable to me?

If you would like to refresh yourselves on it, here it is along with just a few verses prior to the actual parable to keep it in context.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 15 - King James Version

 

[TheSeabass]

Exactly! He is doing the work of righteousness in us. All of our works righteousness is as filthy rags.

What of sin?
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Again, there is the CONDITION of being "IN CHRIST"...no condemnation to them that are in Christ and faithfully remain in Christ. If one becomes unfaithful and falls away from Christ then there will be condemnation to all outside of Christ.

 

[WilliamBo]

Does Mika lose his salvation???

At the age of 19 he met a young lady that caught his eye, she was Christian, and due to this she asked him to attend church and being that he liked her so, he attended and within a year was saved, accepted Jesus as His Lord and Savior

That is a really sad story... makes me think how close I was to death so many times... but I don't understand what you mean at the end. Did he lose his salvation in your opinion or not? You underlined where it says he ''was saved''

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

ROm 8:38-39 lists thing external to the Christian for the Christian can separate himself from the love of God. Jude commanded "Keep yourselves in the love of God" Jude 1:21 with the imperative implying the Christian can be separated from the love of God.

Read three more verses. For Jude also said
Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

It is just amazing to me that people who say that Lord Jesus is the Savior and that we can't save ourselves believe that we can ,by the law, keep ourselves saved.

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Again, there is the CONDITION of being "IN CHRIST"...no condemnation to them that are in Christ and faithfully remain in Christ. If one becomes unfaithful and falls away from Christ then there will be condemnation to all outside of Christ.

You added to what that verse said.

 

[Halbhh]

Exactly! He is doing the work of righteousness in us. All of our works righteousness is as filthy rags.

What of sin?
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Very much reminds me of John chapter 15.

But Christ said it deeper and more complete.

 

[faroukfarouk]

Read three more verses. For Jude also said
Jude 1:24 Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

It is just amazing to me that people who say that Lord Jesus is the Savior and that we can't save ourselves believe that we can ,by the law, keep ourselves saved.

Well, exactly. Ephesians 2.8-10

 

[Quasar92]

With real faith, we are being saved.

Saved by grace through faith, Ephesians 2, and thereby we are "created in Christ to do good works" as Paul wrote.

Do these very works Paul writes of after he writes we are saved by grace through faith matter for salvation?...

Christ said this --

24 “Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25 The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock.
26 But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. 27The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash.”

What is falling down in verse 27? Belief. Faith.

The means of being justified.[/QUOTE


Indeed, works we are to do, AFTER we have become born again Christians. They have nothing whatever to do for us, in obtaining our salvation.


Quasar92

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

Indeed, works we are to do, AFTER we have become born again Christians. They have nothing whatever to do for us, in obtaining our salvation.


Quasar92

Neither in obtaining or in keeping our salvation. Great point.