How come good Friday is only two days from Easter Sunday?

Der Alte

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<<Neither the Passover nor the Feast of Unleavened Bread [ULB] are ever designated a Sabbath in the OT.>>
passover Abib 14, is not so designated, yes;
passover Abib 15, is designated a 'sabbath', Leviticus 23:11,15,16

passover Abib 15, is designated a 'sabbath' in the NT, John 19:31,39.
Leviticus 23:11 is about the the feast of first fruits, not the feast of unleavened bread. Vss. 15 and 16 are about the feast of Pentecost not ULB.
I have never said that all holy convocations are not called Sabbaths in the OT, only the 1st and 7th days of ULB.
It is a false assumption that John 19:31, 39 calls the ULB a Sabbath, which as I have said numerous times, is not supported anywhere in the OT. If ULB was a Sabbath surely it would have been mentioned somewhere in the OT.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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Mark 14:12-18 — "And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover? And he sendeth forth two of his disciples, and saith unto them, Go ye into the city, and there shall meet you a man bearing a pitcher of water: follow him. And wheresoever he shall go in, say ye to the goodman of the house, The Master saith, Where is the guestchamber, where I shall eat the passover with my disciples? And he will show you a large upper room furnished and prepared: there make ready for us. And his disciples went forth, and came into the city, and found as he had said unto them: and they made ready the passover. And in the evening he cometh with the twelve. And as they sat and did eat ..."

Personally, I'm tired of listening to you and watching you ignore scripture as though there's some room here for an alternate interpretation. It was the 14th of the month. Two disciples were sent to make ready the Passover, and to secure the room where Jesus intended to eat the Passover. They made ready the Passover. And when the evening came, Jesus and the other disciples came, and they ate the Passover.

This is scripture. It is in no way ambiguous. My previous comments stand. And until you can demonstrate how this says or means anything other than what it clearly says and means, you are wrong. I am right.

Re: AFrazier, <<It was the 14th of the month. Two disciples were sent to make ready the Passover, and to secure the room where Jesus intended to eat the Passover. They made ready the Passover. And when the evening came, Jesus and the other disciples came, and they ate the Passover.>>

…which means…

afternoon the 14th of the month, two disciples were sent to make ready the passover and to secure the room where Jesus intended to eat the passover, and that they finished to make ready the passover before the evening came and that after evening had come, <<Jesus and the other disciples ate the Passover.>>

What AFrazier says, correct?

Correct!


Re: Mark 14:12, “And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?

…which says and means what the Gospel of Mark says and means…

…it was the fourteenth of the month, 14:17“evening having HAD come … 12ON the first day of leaven remove when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover?


Is it what AFrazier says? No! This is scripture. It is in no way ambiguous. So, obviously is it not what AFrazier alleges!



AFrazier post #243, <<So when it says that Peter and John went and made ready the Passover, are you suggesting that they did not? Or that they broke the law and somehow sacrificed a Passover lamb in the temple (which is where it has to be slain), without the aid of the priests (who were required to kill it with the people), out of its proper season (thereby nullifying its purpose by sacrificing it a day early), and before all leaven had been burned?>>


No; that is for you to explain, which you cannot because Mark 14:12 Matthew 26:17 Luke 22:7 refer to beginning of the 14th the “evening” of the Lord’s Supper of bread and wine and not to the passover meal of the passover lamb that WOULD have been eaten WOULD it be killed the NEXT day before the evening, but was not eaten the evening after Mark 15:42 Matthew 27:57 John 19:31 Luke 23:50 it was suppose to be eaten, because it was never killed the next day because Jesus became the Lamb of God who replaced the Jews’ lamb once for all ON THAT DAY that He ate the Lord’s Supper the evening of its beginning the night before.


There is no Indicative word-of-act of Jesus that He did eat in the Gospels. It is every time a Subjunctive or (‘conjunctive’) Infinitive. Never, ‘He ate’ and never ‘I eat’ or “he eats”; never even ‘I will eat’ unconditionally, but unconditionally, Indicatively, “I will NOT eat”.


Jesus did not eat “the passover” but The Passover, even The Passover-OF-YAHWEH and therefore ate He spiritually, metaphorically, Divinely Real! Thus spoke Jesus plainly the truth when He said, “I will not eat this passover with YOU”, meaning (I believe), “I will not eat this passover-Suffering with YOU”, but with My Father.


Or He may have meant, “I will not this passover, eat with you”, but as I promised you, I will eat the passover in the Kingdom of my Father again with you.


The disciples “came / went and PREPARED that He might eat” -- that Christ might enter the Kingdom of his Father and engage in the Final Battle—his Last Passover of Yahweh SUFFERING— wherein the Lord the Man of War, triumphed gloriously.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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I don't quite understand all this. A lot of calculating but no scripture which says exactly what you have said. Ex 16:5 is not about the the Passover or the feast of unleavened bread [ULB] it is about the preparation day which precedes the Sabbath. The Israelites gathered double on the 6th day so they would not work by gathering food, on the Sabbath.
.....I will say again there was only one Sabbath in Passion week and only one parasceue/preparation, the day we call Friday. Neither the 1st day nor the 7th day of ULB are ever called a Sabbath in the OT. They are called holy convocations which differ from the Sabbath in that the preparation and cooking of food is specifically permitted. If either day was considered to be Sabbaths, it surely would have been mentioned somewhere in the OT. I don't see how 2 Chronicles 35 supports your argument.

Re: <<Ex 16:5 is not about the Passover or the feast of unleavened bread [ULB] it is about the preparation day which precedes the Sabbath. The Israelites gathered double on the 6th day so they would not work by gathering food, on the Sabbath.>>
I have no problem with that. I only used Exodus 16:5 to show how hard Israel had to work on the passover- 'sabbath', double as hard, so to speak.


Re: <<I will say again there was only one Sabbath in Passion week and only one parasceue/preparation, the day we call Friday.>>
Repetition doesn't prove a thing.

But you're right, <<there was only one Sabbath in Passion week and only one parasceue/preparation, the day we call Friday>>, the day AFTER the day Jesus was crucified on and had died on.


But you're wrong there wasn't also only one "Preparation OF THE PASSOVER" in Passion week, the day THAT Jesus was crucified and had died on, the only one several times and in various ways called, "The Preparation OF THE PASSOVER", e.g., 2Chronicles 35 -- called so in John 19:14 and implied as such in John 28:18 as well as in Mark 14:12 Matthew 26:17 Luke 22:7 John 13:1.
Abundance of evidence if ever there was for you! It <<surely would have been mentioned somewhere in the OT>> and indeed had been mentioned from Exodus and through all the Law and Prophets BECAUSE IT WAS THE DAY OF THE LAST SUFFERING OF GOD'S PASSOVER LAMB in preparation for its elevation through honourable Burial as "FIRST SHEAF LAID", "in store for you", and, "on the day after the sabbath", "FIRST SHEAF WAVED BEFORE THE LORD".


The passover had three days for three events, one event per day,

Day One, 14th day of the First Month, "the first day they always had to KILL the passover the first day leaven is removed"--CRUCIFIXION day. Mark 14:12,17 Matthew 26:17,20 Luke 22:7,14 John 13:1,30 1Corinthians 11:23.

Day Two, 15th day of the First Month, "the first day of seven days no leaven shall be eaten", "that which remained must be burned"--BURIAL day. Leviticus 23:15 John 19:39 "At the First Night" Exodus 12:18,42 "the day (of) the sabbath...the sheaf must rest--stored--laid down" Leviticus 23:11a.

Day Three, 16th day of the First Month, "the first day counted" Leviticus 23:16 "the day after the sabbath...(the sheaf must rest--stored--laid down" Leviticus 23:11a) First Sheaf Waved--RESURRECTION day!




 
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Jan001

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Which is supported by the Jewish Encyclopedia.
Jewish Encyclopedia – DAY
By : Emil G. Hirsch Michael Friedlander
In the Bible, the season of light (Gen. i. 5), lasting "from dawn [lit. "the rising of the morning"] to the coming forth of the stars" (Neh. iv. 15, 17). The term "day" is used also to denote a period of twenty-four hours (Ex. xxi. 21). In Jewish communal life part of a day is at times reckoned as one day; e.g., the day of the funeral, even when the latter takes place late in the afternoon, is counted as the first of the seven days of mourning; a short time in the morning of the seventh day is counted as the seventh day; circumcision takes place on the eighth day, even though of the first day only a few minutes remained after the birth of the child, these being counted as one day. Again, a man who hears of a vow made by his wife or his daughter, and desires to cancel the vow, must do so on the same day on which he hears of it, as otherwise the protest has no effect; even if the hearing takes place a little time before night, the annulment must be done within that little time. The day is reckoned from evening to evening—i.e., night and day—except in reference to sacrifices, where daytime and the night following constitute one day (Lev. vii. 15; see Calendar). "The day" denotes: (a) Day of the Lord; (b) the Day of Atonement; (c) the treatise of the Mishnah that contains the laws concerning the Day of Atonement (See Yoma and Sabbath).E. G. H. M. F.

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=167&letter=D

Thank you for this information. Much appreciated. :)
 
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Jan001

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I'm not talking about salvation; just understanding God's natural order, which pre-dates the Law and the fall

The Israelites/Jews had their own specific calendar and they still use it today. After Jews become Christians, the Jewish calendar is irrelevant.

Jews must come to faith just like the Gentiles under the New Covenant of Jesus Christ instead of the Gentiles becoming like the Jews under the Jews' Old Covenant Law of Moses.

Romans 9:30-33; 10:1-4
What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, righteousness through faith; 31 but that Israel who pursued the righteousness which is based on law (of Moses) did not succeed in fulfilling that law. 32 Why? Because they did not pursue it through faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone, 33 as it is written,
“Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone that will make men stumble,
a rock that will make them fall;
and he who believes in him will not be put to shame.”
10 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for them (Jews) is that they may be saved. 2 I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but it is not enlightened. 3 For, being ignorant of the righteousness that comes from God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. 4 For Christ is the end of the law (of Moses), that every one who has faith (law of Christ) may be justified. rsv

Acts 15:10-11
Now therefore why do you (Jews) make trial of God by putting a yoke (Law of Moses) upon the neck of the disciples (Gentiles) which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? 11 But we (Jews who are believers in Jesus Christ) believe that we shall be saved through the (new covenant) grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they (Gentiles) will.” rsv
The Law of Moses (yoke) was given to the Israelites because they made the golden calf. If the Jews had not made the golden calf, they would have based their laws on the Ten Commandments just like the Christians do base most of their laws today on their own Ten Commandments. (Rest day for Christians is Sunday the first day of the week as commanded by Jesus Christ to His apostles after His resurrection.)

Romans 5:18-21
Then as one man’s (Adam's) trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one man’s (Jesus Christ's) act of righteousness leads to acquittal and life for all men. 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by one man’s obedience many will be made righteous. 20 Law (of Moses) came in, to increase the trespass; but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, 21 so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. rsv
God brought good out of the evil (worship of golden calf) that these Israelites did. God used their rejection of Him as their God in order to save the Gentiles who would believe in Jesus Christ! Jesus Christ sent His apostles to save the Gentiles. He sent them to gather all the nations to Himself under His New Covenant. Romans 11:1-12, Matthew 28:18-20

The name of the month of Nissan is not mentioned in OT Scriptures that I know of and most likely this month meant nothing to nations other than Israel and Judah. I don't see that the month of of Nissan has relevancy for NT Christians.
 
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Jan001

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Probably because early Catholic tradition had Jesus' arrest taking place in the early hours of night on Wednesday, and so Wednesday was a fast day.
(As I mentioned in a previous post, Jesus actually could have legally ate the Passover at the beginning of Wed after sundown, which for the purposes of Passover reckoning would have been counted as part of Tuesday - as there were about 3 evenings at that time in history when people could celebrate the Passover due to which dating system (Pharisee or Saducee) they used. He then would have died around the time the Passover lambs were being slaughtered for the next evening Passover meal.)

Why they placed the arrest Wed. and crucifixion Fri. is not immediately clear, but might have been influenced by some fringe Jewish sects (like the Essenes) who tried to make every important day fall on a Wednesday, Fri, or Sunday and always situated Passover on the night after Tuesday which started Wednesday.

Later on (I'm not sure how many centuries later, I haven't researched the Catholic change of the days over time thoroughly yet) the meaning of the fast for many Catholics got changed from Judas betraying Jesus and Jesus' arrest to Judas 'conspiring' to betray Jesus - hence it often is called 'spy Wednesday' now.

The third century Didascalia Apostalorum describes this a bit:

The Didascalia Apostolorum in English

This person's treatise is not approved by the Catholic Church.

I do think it is possible that different sects of Judaism celebrated the Passover on different days. It would be very difficult to prepare the many lambs for all Jews in Jerusalem for the Passover on just one designated day.
 
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AFrazier

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This person's treatise is not approved by the Catholic Church.

I do think it is possible that different sects of Judaism celebrated the Passover on different days. It would be very difficult to prepare the many lambs for all Jews in Jerusalem for the Passover on just one designated day.
Just to say so, the Didascalia was absolutely Catholic, and can be traced back to the Didache, and forward to Victorinus, Epiphanius of Salamis, and a number of psuedopigraphical works like the Acts of Pilate (Epiph. Pan. 26.1-27.3; ibid De Fide 22.1; Connolly, Didascalia, 5.14, 184; Vict. De Fab. Mund. 3-4; J. K. Elliot, ed., Narrative of Joseph of Arimathaea, 2-3, in Apocryphal New Testament, 218-220). I disagree with a lot of what's written in the Didascalia (there are presumptuous additions to scripture found in the text), but it was most definitely a work advocated by the Roman church fathers of that day and age. Furthermore, it embraced the newer version of the paschal tradition with Friday and Sunday celebrations (which would date it later than Victor), and fasting on Wednesday and Friday, because on Wednesday "he was arrested" and Friday he was crucified (according to their patristic analysis of the Wednesday fast centuries later, though the Didache expresses different reasons).

From the Didascalia (Connolly, Didascalia, 5.13-14, 180-184) (the relevant sections): — "Now this was done on the fourth day of the week. For when we had eaten the passover on the third day of the week at even, we went forth to the Mount of Olives; and in the night they seized our Lord Jesus. And the next day, which was the fourth of the week, He remained in ward in the house of Caiaphas the high priest. And on the same day the chiefs of the people were assembled and took counsel against Him. And on the next day again, which was the fifth of the week, they brought Him to Pilate the governor. And He remained again in ward with Pilate the night after the fifth day of the week. But when it drew on (towards day) on the Friday, they accused him much [Mk 15.3] before Pilate; and they could show nothing that was true, but gave false witness against Him. And they asked Him of Pilate to be put to death; and they crucified Him on the same Friday. [...] But (fast) not after the custom of the former People, but according to the new testament which I have appointed you: that you may be fasting for them on the fourth day of the week, because on the fourth of the week they began to destroy their souls, and apprehended Me. — For the night after the third of the week belongs to the fourth of the week, as it is written: There was evening and there was morning, one day (Gen 1.5). The evening therefore belongs to the following day: for on the third of the week at even I ate My Pascha with you, and in the night they apprehended Me. — But fast for them also on the Friday, because thereon they crucified Me, in the midst of their festival of unleavened bread."

And from Victorinus (Vict. De Fab. Mund. 3) (again, the relevant section): — "But we fast till the ninth hour on the fourth day and the eve of the Sabbath, because the Lord was arrested at the beginning of the fourth day and crucified on the eve of the Sabbath.”

And from Epiphanius (Epiph. De Fide 22.1): — “Now is manifested the reason of the truth why the fourth day is called the Tetras, why we fast even to the ninth hour, or even to the evening […]. The man Christ Jesus […] was taken prisoner by wicked hands […]. Therefore on account of His captivity, […] we make the fourth day a station or a supernumerary fast."

As Brant Pitre notes, “In light of such evidence, […] it is reasonable to conclude that the patristic tradition of a Tuesday Last Supper is […] a mistaken patristic etiology for the custom of the Christian Wednesday fast.” (Pitre, Jesus and the Last Supper, 276.)

And according to Josephus, they did, in fact, sacrifice all those lambs in a single day. Sounds like an enormous task, but whereas on normal occasions there would be one course on duty, during the major festivals like Passover, all twenty-four courses were on duty together, which amounts to thousands of priests. You can see support for this in the Dead Sea Scrolls.
 
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Jan001

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I'm curious to know. What was considered the Law of Moses in the old testament? Are you implying that the Feasts of the Lord were created only for the Jews?

Yes. The Law of Moses' feasts for the Israelites/Jews were created for them alone. These feasts and laws in the OT Law of Moses are not valid for NT Christians. Jesus ended/finished/completed/fulfilled the Law of Moses by His death on the cross. Colossians 2:11-17, 2 Corinthians 3:6, Hebrews 8:13, Hebrews 9:15

The Ten Commandments preceded the Law of Moses. The Ten Commandments are based on the natural law which acknowledges God as Creator of all things.

However, the OT Law of Moses and its feasts were created for the Israelite nation alone as a means of training them to obey God and thereby be good examples of conduct to peoples of the other nations. But most of them were disobedient and therefore they were bad examples of conduct to peoples of the other nations.


The OT Pentecost feast which is still celebrated today by the Jews who do not believe in Jesus Christ is not the same feast as the NT Pentecost feast which is celebrated by NT Christians today.

The OT Israelites'/Jews' feasts are irrelevant to NT Christians. Jesus is our Passover Lamb and the apostles received the Holy Spirit fifty days (Pentecost) after Jesus became our Passover Lamb and offered His own Body and Blood under the appearances of bread and wine at His Last Supper before He died.

Pentecost is the name given by the Greek-speaking Jews to the festival which occurred fifty days (ἡ πεντηκόστη, sc. ἡΜέρα = "Ḥag Ḥamishshim Yom"; comp. Lev. xxiii. 16) after the offering of the barley sheaf during the Passover feast. PENTECOST - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Before the coming of the Holy Spirit, the OT Pentecost feast was celebrated by only the Jews and the converts to Judaism.
Acts 2:1-3
When the day of Pentecost (of the Israelites/Jews) had come, they (apostles) were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly a sound came from heaven like the rush of a mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared to them tongues as of fire, distributed and resting on each one of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. rsv

After the coming of the Holy Spirit, Pentecost was celebrated by all NT Christians as the feast day commemorating the first coming of the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles.
Acts 20:16
For Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus, so that he might not have to spend time in Asia; for he was hastening to be at Jerusalem, if possible, on the day of Pentecost. rsv

1 Corinthians 16:7-10
For I do not want to see you now just in passing; I hope to spend some time with you, if the Lord permits. 8 But I will stay in Ephesus until Pentecost, 9 for a wide door for effective work has opened to me, and there are many adversaries. 10 When Timothy comes, see that you put him at ease among you, for he is doing the work of the Lord, as I am. rsv
Jesus changes the meaning of Pentecost for the Christians. This is the day that He first baptized them with His own Holy Spirit.

Acts 1:1-8
In the first book, O The-oph′ilus, I have dealt with all that Jesus began to do and teach, 2 until the day when he was taken up, after he had given commandment through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom he had chosen. 3 To them he presented himself alive after his passion by many proofs, appearing to them during forty days, and speaking of the kingdom of God. 4 And while staying with them he charged them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the promise of the Father, which, he said, “you heard from me, 5 for John baptized with water, but before many days you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” 6 So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8 But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samar′ia and to the end of the earth.” rsv
 
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ImAHebrew

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  1. I was debunking the 'part of a day for a whole day' tradition as applied to the fri-Sun timeline. Explaining alternate timeline theories would take a great deal more space!

    However, in brief, scripture does not say that the weekly Sabbath followed the crucifixion. It says that the day Jesus died was a preparation day for a High Sabbath. (Jn 19:31, Mk 15:42, Jn 19:42) We know that the Passover was followed by the First day of the Feast of Unleavened bread, which was a special Sabbath where no work was done (Ex 12:15-16). Passover was also the preparation day for the seven day Feast of Unleavened bread, where every last bit of leaven would be removed from the house, if it had not been already, before noon. Passover was a bit of an unusual holiday, as it was was considered to be the same day, but was conducted over the 14th (such as the slaughtering of the Passover lamb) as well as the evening of the 15th. Thus, Passover and the seven day Feast of Unleavened bread were not just back to back, but slightly overlapping as well.

    To further complicate matters, in the time of Christ, both the 14th of Nissan and the 15th were celebrated as the first day of Passover (so the 14th/+night 15th or 15th/+night 16th) due to differences in the calculation of the timing by the Saducees and Pharisees. (This common Jewish practice is called 'doubling')

    To complicate things even further, the Passover meal could be had during the twilight right after the sunset that began the 14th (Leviticus 23:5-6) or the twilight just after sunset which began the 15th. Both were allowed by the law.

    This is a more likely timeline than Fri-Sun:
    - Ate the last Supper with his disciples in the twilight just after the 14th began
    - Prayed in Gethsemane and was betrayed during the night of the 14th
    - Was crucified about the time that the Passover lambs were being slaughtered on the 14th, on the preparation day for the High Sabbath of the first day of the Feast of unleavened bread
    - Was buried around sundown (around the time most people were beginning to eat the Passover lamb)
    - In the tomb the night/day of 15th (High Sabbath), night/day of 16th (second day of Feast of Unleavened bread), and the night/day of the 17th - the weekly Sabbath.
    [This also explains how Mary and the women could rest on a Sabbath, buy and prepare spices, then rest on another Sabbath before going to the tomb in Mk 16:1, Lk 23:36-Luke 24:1.]
    - Rose about sundown on the weekly Sabbath (which as mentioned in the previous post was a fuzzy period, so also classified as Sunday)
    - The empty tomb was discovered during the night of the 18th, on Sunday while it was still dark, before morning. (Jn 20:1)

    He would have then been in the tomb three days and nights, just as He gave as a sign in Matt 12:40. (Our Wed. sundown to Sat. sundown)
Shalom Jennifer, you are explaining things very well. Yeshua was for sure placed in the tomb right at sunset on Wednesday, and rose right at sunset on Saturday - 3 days and 3 nights. And for sure, Yeshua died EXACTLY when the Passover was to be killed (afternoon of the 14th).

I would like to give you something that will help to silence critics of a Wednesday crucifixion/burial. Luke 24:21 is mistranslated. It is not saying "today, IS (G71) the 3rd day since these things were done." The translators were BIASED in how they translated that word "IS." The Greek word G71 should not have been translated "is," it should have been translated "leads." Thus the rendering should be, "today, LEADS the 3rd day away from when these things were done." That Sunday, was the 4th day, as it was LEADING the 3rd day away. The 3rd day had come and gone, and this is WHY those 2 Disciples were sad - Luke 24:17. If it was STILL the 3rd day, WHY be so sad. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
 
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Jan001

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Do you think there is any benefit to resting one day a week? This 7 year rest principle is based on the same concept. Jesus said that man was not made for the sabbath, but the sabbath was made [as a beneficial element] for man. Not everything that does not have absolute value, then is marked as no value. If you don't find any value in discovery insights about our nature, the nature of this creation and/or God's nature from these things, I don't have a problem with that. But I enjoy pondering these things; and the Lord has taken advantage of my interest to commune with me at various times; not because these things are absolute, but because that is part of the package of how I am, so in his graciousness, he meets me. It is good to be gracious to the subtle revelations of God in another persons life, even when outside your experience (not everyone's donkey talks, or rug doesn't get dew)

I agree that we can commune with God on any and every day of the week....and we should! :)

Romans 14:5-7
One man esteems one day as better than another, while another man esteems all days alike. Let every one be fully convinced in his own mind. 6 He who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. He also who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God; while he who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 None of us lives to himself, and none of us dies to himself. rsv​

The formal day of worship for Christians is Sunday the first day of the week and this is the formal rest day for Christians. The early Christians recorded in some letters that the day that Jesus set aside for them to rest and for formal worship is Sunday the first day of the week and this actual practice of Sunday worship is recorded in the Scriptures. It is required of Christians that we worship and rest on one day a week. Acts 20:7, 1 Corinthians 16:2, Hebrews 10:19-27

However, due to the secular society that we live in today, some people must work on Sunday in order to provide for themselves and their families. Also, life-saving services must be provided 24 hours every day so if a person must work on Sunday and cannot attend formal worship on that day, he should then set aside another day of the week if possible to worship and to rest.
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Yes. The Law of Moses' feasts for the Israelites/Jews were created for them alone. These feasts and laws in the OT Law of Moses are not valid for NT Christians. Jesus ended/finished/completed/fulfilled the Law of Moses by His death on the cross. Colossians 2:11-17, 2 Corinthians 3:6, Hebrews 8:13, Hebrews 9:15

The Ten Commandments preceded the Law of Moses. The Ten Commandments are based on the natural law which acknowledges God as Creator of all things.

However, the OT Law of Moses and its feasts were created for the Israelite nation alone as a means of training them to obey God and thereby be good examples of conduct to peoples of the other nations. But most of them were disobedient and therefore they were bad examples of conduct to peoples of the other nations.


The OT Pentecost feast which is still celebrated today by the Jews who do not believe in Jesus Christ is not the same feast as the NT Pentecost feast which is celebrated by NT Christians today.

The OT Israelites'/Jews' feasts are irrelevant to NT Christians. Jesus is our Passover Lamb and the apostles received the Holy Spirit fifty days (Pentecost) after Jesus became our Passover Lamb and offered His own Body and Blood under the appearances of bread and wine at His Last Supper before He died.

Pentecost is the name given by the Greek-speaking Jews to the festival which occurred fifty days (ἡ πεντηκόστη, sc. ἡΜέρα = "Ḥag Ḥamishshim Yom"; comp. Lev. xxiii. 16) after the offering of the barley sheaf during the Passover feast. PENTECOST - JewishEncyclopedia.com

Before the coming of the Holy Spirit, the OT Pentecost feast was celebrated by only the Jews and the converts to Judaism.
Acts 2:1-3
When the day of Pentecost (of the Israelites/Jews) had come, they (apostles) were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly a sound came from heaven like the rush of a mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared to them tongues as of fire, distributed and resting on each one of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. rsv

After the coming of the Holy Spirit, Pentecost was celebrated by all NT Christians as the feast day commemorating the first coming of the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles.
Acts 20:16
For Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus, so that he might not have to spend time in Asia; for he was hastening to be at Jerusalem, if possible, on the day of Pentecost. rsv

1 Corinthians 16:7-10
For I do not want to see you now just in passing; I hope to spend some time with you, if the Lord permits. 8 But I will stay in Ephesus until Pentecost, 9 for a wide door for effective work has opened to me, and there are many adversaries. 10 When Timothy comes, see that you put him at ease among you, for he is doing the work of the Lord, as I am. rsv
Jesus changes the meaning of Pentecost for the Christians. This is the day that He first baptized them with His own Holy Spirit.

Acts 1:1-8
In the first book, O The-oph′ilus, I have dealt with all that Jesus began to do and teach, 2 until the day when he was taken up, after he had given commandment through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom he had chosen. 3 To them he presented himself alive after his passion by many proofs, appearing to them during forty days, and speaking of the kingdom of God. 4 And while staying with them he charged them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the promise of the Father, which, he said, “you heard from me, 5 for John baptized with water, but before many days you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” 6 So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8 But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samar′ia and to the end of the earth.” rsv

The Sabbath is one of the 10, yes? Also, do you know where the word Pentecosta came from? All the Jewish Moedim (Feasts) were to be fulfilled by Yeshua.
 
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AFrazier

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Shalom Jennifer, you are explaining things very well. Yeshua was for sure placed in the tomb right at sunset on Wednesday, and rose right at sunset on Saturday - 3 days and 3 nights. And for sure, Yeshua died EXACTLY when the Passover was to be killed (afternoon of the 14th).

I would like to give you something that will help to silence critics of a Wednesday crucifixion/burial. Luke 24:21 is mistranslated. It is not saying "today, IS (G71) the 3rd day since these things were done." The translators were BIASED in how they translated that word "IS." The Greek word G71 should not have been translated "is," it should have been translated "leads." Thus the rendering should be, "today, LEADS the 3rd day away from when these things were done." That Sunday, was the 4th day, as it was LEADING the 3rd day away. The 3rd day had come and gone, and this is WHY those 2 Disciples were sad - Luke 24:17. If it was STILL the 3rd day, WHY be so sad. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
Yeah ... I checked the Greek on that. You are so not right it isn't even funny. It's to lead or to bring. It's in the 3rd person, sing., pres., act., ind. "Today brings this third day since these things occurred," which in a layman's paraphrase is, "Today is the third day since these things occurred." The bias is yours.

Furthermore, Jesus didn't die when the Passover lambs were being slain. He died the next day. He and the disciples ate the Passover at the Last Supper.

Wednesday is not possible.
 
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Jan001

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Just to say so, the Didascalia was absolutely Catholic, and can be traced back to the Didache, and forward to Victorinus, Epiphanius of Salamis, and a number of psuedopigraphical works like the Acts of Pilate (Epiph. Pan. 26.1-27.3; ibid De Fide 22.1; Connolly, Didascalia, 5.14, 184; Vict. De Fab. Mund. 3-4; J. K. Elliot, ed., Narrative of Joseph of Arimathaea, 2-3, in Apocryphal New Testament, 218-220). I disagree with a lot of what's written in the Didascalia (there are presumptuous additions to scripture found in the text), but it was most definitely a work advocated by the Roman church fathers of that day and age. Furthermore, it embraced the newer version of the paschal tradition with Friday and Sunday celebrations (which would date it later than Victor), and fasting on Wednesday and Friday, because on Wednesday "he was arrested" and Friday he was crucified (according to their patristic analysis of the Wednesday fast centuries later, though the Didache expresses different reasons).

It seems to me that the Son of man was delivered up to the Jews on Thursday and then condemned to be crucified/slain on the next day, Friday.

I think that the day Jesus said the following (Matthew 26:1-2) was on the Tuesday before He died.


Matthew 26:1-25--27:
When Jesus had finished all these sayings (on Tuesday), he said to his disciples, 2 “You know that after two days (today which is Tuesday and tomorrow which is Wednesday) the Passover is coming (on Thursday), and the Son of man will be delivered up (on Thursday night) to be crucified (Friday).”
3 Then (sometime on Wednesday) the chief priests and the elders of the people gathered in the palace of the high priest, who was called Ca′iaphas, 4 and took counsel together in order to arrest Jesus by stealth and kill him. 5 But they said, “Not during the feast, lest there be a tumult among the people.”
6 Now when Jesus was at Bethany in the house of Simon the leper (also sometime on Wednesday), 7 a woman came up to him with an alabaster flask of very expensive ointment, and she poured it on his head, as he sat at table. 8 But when the disciples saw it, they were indignant, saying, “Why this waste? 9 For this ointment might have been sold for a large sum, and given to the poor.” 10 But Jesus, aware of this, said to them, “Why do you trouble the woman? For she has done a beautiful thing to me. 11 For you always have the poor with you, but you will not always have me. 12 In pouring this ointment on my body she has done it to prepare me for burial. 13 Truly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her.”
14 Then one of the twelve, who was called Judas Iscariot, went to the chief priests (on this same Wednesday) 15 and said, “What will you give me if I deliver him to you?” And they paid him thirty pieces of silver. 16 And from that moment he sought an opportunity to betray him.
17 Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread (Thursday morning, the next day) the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Where will you have us prepare for you to eat the passover?” 18 He said, “Go into the city to a certain one, and say to him, ‘The Teacher says, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at your house with my disciples.’” 19 And the disciples did as Jesus had directed them, and they prepared the passover (on this same Thursday).

20 When it was evening
(on this same Thursday), he sat at table with the twelve disciples; 21 and as they were eating, he said, “Truly, I say to you, one of you will betray me.” 22 And they were very sorrowful, and began to say to him one after another, “Is it I, Lord?” 23 He answered, “He who has dipped his hand in the dish with me, will betray me. 24 The Son of man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.” 25 Judas, who betrayed him, said, “Is it I, Master?” He said to him, “You have said so.”
26 Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, “Take, eat; this is my body.” 27 And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, “Drink of it, all of you; 28 for this is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. 29 I tell you I shall not drink again of this fruit of the vine until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.” 30 And when they had sung a hymn, they went out to the Mount of Olives. 31 Then Jesus said to them, “You will all fall away because of me this night; for it is written, ‘I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.’ 32 But after I am raised up, I will go before you to Galilee.” 33 Peter declared to him, “Though they all fall away because of you, I will never fall away.” 34 Jesus said to him, “Truly, I say to you, this very night, before the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crows, you will deny me three times.” 35 Peter said to him, “Even if I must die with you, I will not deny you.” And so said all the disciples.
36 Then Jesus went with them to a place called Gethsem′ane, and he said to his disciples, “Sit here, while I go yonder and pray.” 37 And taking with him Peter and the two sons of Zeb′edee, he began to be sorrowful and troubled. 38 Then he said to them, “My soul is very sorrowful, even to death; remain here, and watch with me.” 39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, “My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as thou wilt.” 40 And he came to the disciples and found them sleeping; and he said to Peter, “So, could you not watch with me one hour? 41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.” 42 Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, “My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, thy will be done.” 43 And again he came and found them sleeping, for their eyes were heavy. 44 So, leaving them again, he went away and prayed for the third time, saying the same words. 45 Then he came to the disciples and said to them, “Are you still sleeping and taking your rest? Behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. 46 Rise, let us be going; see, my betrayer is at hand.”
47 While he was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and with him a great crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests and the elders of the people. 48 Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying, “The one I shall kiss is the man; seize him.” 49 And he came up to Jesus at once and said, “Hail, Master!” And he kissed him. 50 Jesus said to him, “Friend, why are you here?” Then they came up and laid hands on Jesus and seized him. 51 And behold, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword, and struck the slave of the high priest, and cut off his ear. 52 Then Jesus said to him, “Put your sword back into its place; for all who take the sword will perish by the sword. 53 Do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father, and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels? 54 But how then should the scriptures be fulfilled, that it must be so?” 55 At that hour Jesus said to the crowds, “Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me? Day after day I sat in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. 56 But all this has taken place, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled.” Then all the disciples forsook him and fled.
57 Then those who had seized Jesus (late on this Thursday night) led him to Ca′iaphas the high priest, where the scribes and the elders had gathered. 58 But Peter followed him at a distance, as far as the courtyard of the high priest, and going inside he sat with the guards to see the end. 59 Now the chief priests and the whole council sought false testimony against Jesus that they might put him to death, 60 but they found none, though many false witnesses came forward. At last two came forward 61 and said, “This fellow said, ‘I am able to destroy the temple of God, and to build it in three days.’” 62 And the high priest stood up and said, “Have you no answer to make? What is it that these men testify against you?” 63 But Jesus was silent. And the high priest said to him, “I adjure you by the living God, tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God.” 64 Jesus said to him, “You have said so. But I tell you, hereafter you will see the Son of man seated at the right hand of Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven.” 65 Then the high priest tore his robes, and said, “He has uttered blasphemy. Why do we still need witnesses? You have now heard his blasphemy. 66 What is your judgment?” They answered, “He deserves death.” 67 Then they spat in his face, and struck him; and some slapped him, 68 saying, “Prophesy to us, you Christ! Who is it that struck you?”
69 Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard. And a maid came up to him, and said, “You also were with Jesus the Galilean.” 70 But he denied it before them all, saying, “I do not know what you mean.” 71 And when he went out to the porch, another maid saw him, and she said to the bystanders, “This man was with Jesus of Nazareth.” 72 And again he denied it with an oath, “I do not know the man.” 73 After a little while the bystanders came up and said to Peter, “Certainly you are also one of them, for your accent betrays you.” 74 Then he began to invoke a curse on himself and to swear, “I do not know the man.” And immediately the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crowed (very. very early on Friday morning). 75 And Peter remembered the saying of Jesus, “Before the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crows, you will deny me three times.” And he went out and wept bitterly.
27 When (Friday) morning came, all the chief priests and the elders of the people took counsel against Jesus to put him to death; 2 and they bound him and led him away and delivered him to Pilate the governor.
3 When Judas, his betrayer, saw that he was condemned, he repented and brought back the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and the elders, 4 saying, “I have sinned in betraying innocent blood.” They said, “What is that to us? See to it yourself.” 5 And throwing down the pieces of silver in the temple, he departed; and he went and hanged himself. 6 But the chief priests, taking the pieces of silver, said, “It is not lawful to put them into the treasury, since they are blood money.” 7 So they took counsel, and bought with them the potter’s field, to bury strangers in. 8 Therefore that field has been called the Field of Blood to this day. 9 Then was fulfilled what had been spoken by the prophet Jeremiah, saying, “And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him on whom a price had been set by some of the sons of Israel, 10 and they gave them for the potter’s field, as the Lord directed me.”
11 Now Jesus stood before the governor; and the governor asked him, “Are you the King of the Jews?” Jesus said, “You have said so.” 12 But when he was accused by the chief priests and elders, he made no answer. 13 Then Pilate said to him, “Do you not hear how many things they testify against you?” 14 But he gave him no answer, not even to a single charge; so that the governor wondered greatly.
15 Now at the feast the governor was accustomed to release for the crowd any one prisoner whom they wanted. 16 And they had then a notorious prisoner, called Barab′bas. 17 So when they had gathered, Pilate said to them, “Whom do you want me to release for you, Barab′bas or Jesus who is called Christ?” 18 For he knew that it was out of envy that they had delivered him up. 19 Besides, while he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent word to him, “Have nothing to do with that righteous man, for I have suffered much over him today in a dream.” 20 Now the chief priests and the elders persuaded the people to ask for Barab′bas and destroy Jesus. 21 The governor again said to them, “Which of the two do you want me to release for you?” And they said, “Barab′bas.” 22 Pilate said to them, “Then what shall I do with Jesus who is called Christ?” They all said, “Let him be crucified.” 23 And he said, “Why, what evil has he done?” But they shouted all the more, “Let him be crucified.”
24 So when Pilate saw that he was gaining nothing, but rather that a riot was beginning, he took water and washed his hands before the crowd, saying, “I am innocent of this man’s blood; see to it yourselves.” 25 And all the people answered, “His blood be on us and on our children!” 26 Then he released for them Barab′bas, and having scourged Jesus, delivered him to be crucified.
27 Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the praetorium, and they gathered the whole battalion before him. 28 And they stripped him and put a scarlet robe upon him, 29 and plaiting a crown of thorns they put it on his head, and put a reed in his right hand. And kneeling before him they mocked him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!” 30 And they spat upon him, and took the reed and struck him on the head. 31 And when they had mocked him, they stripped him of the robe, and put his own clothes on him, and led him away to crucify him.
32 As they went out, they came upon a man of Cyre′ne, Simon by name; this man they compelled to carry his cross. 33 And when they came to a place called Gol′gotha (which means the place of a skull), 34 they offered him wine to drink, mingled with gall; but when he tasted it, he would not drink it. 35 And when they had crucified him, they divided his garments among them by casting lots; 36 then they sat down and kept watch over him there. 37 And over his head they put the charge against him, which read, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” 38 Then two robbers were crucified with him, one on the right and one on the left. rsv

It seems to me that Jesus Christ was delivered up to the Jews on Thursday, late evening, and then on Friday morning He was condemned to be crucified that same day.
From the Didascalia (Connolly, Didascalia, 5.13-14, 180-184) (the relevant sections): — "Now this was done on the fourth day of the week. For when we had eaten the passover on the third day of the week at even, we went forth to the Mount of Olives; and in the night they seized our Lord Jesus. And the next day, which was the fourth of the week, He remained in ward in the house of Caiaphas the high priest. And on the same day the chiefs of the people were assembled and took counsel against Him. And on the next day again, which was the fifth of the week, they brought Him to Pilate the governor. And He remained again in ward with Pilate the night after the fifth day of the week. But when it drew on (towards day) on the Friday, they accused him much [Mk 15.3] before Pilate; and they could show nothing that was true, but gave false witness against Him. And they asked Him of Pilate to be put to death; and they crucified Him on the same Friday. [...] But (fast) not after the custom of the former People, but according to the new testament which I have appointed you: that you may be fasting for them on the fourth day of the week, because on the fourth of the week they began to destroy their souls, and apprehended Me. — For the night after the third of the week belongs to the fourth of the week, as it is written: There was evening and there was morning, one day (Gen 1.5). The evening therefore belongs to the following day: for on the third of the week at even I ate My Pascha with you, and in the night they apprehended Me. — But fast for them also on the Friday, because thereon they crucified Me, in the midst of their festival of unleavened bread."

And from Victorinus (Vict. De Fab. Mund. 3) (again, the relevant section): — "But we fast till the ninth hour on the fourth day and the eve of the Sabbath, because the Lord was arrested at the beginning of the fourth day and crucified on the eve of the Sabbath.”

And from Epiphanius (Epiph. De Fide 22.1): — “Now is manifested the reason of the truth why the fourth day is called the Tetras, why we fast even to the ninth hour, or even to the evening […]. The man Christ Jesus […] was taken prisoner by wicked hands […]. Therefore on account of His captivity, […] we make the fourth day a station or a supernumerary fast."

As Brant Pitre notes, “In light of such evidence, […] it is reasonable to conclude that the patristic tradition of a Tuesday Last Supper is […] a mistaken patristic etiology for the custom of the Christian Wednesday fast.” (Pitre, Jesus and the Last Supper, 276.)

And according to Josephus, they did, in fact, sacrifice all those lambs in a single day. Sounds like an enormous task, but whereas on normal occasions there would be one course on duty, during the major festivals like Passover, all twenty-four courses were on duty together, which amounts to thousands of priests. You can see support for this in the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Was Josephus speaking about only the Passover practices of his own sect of Judaism or was he referring to the Passover practices of all the different sects of Judaism which were active at that time?

Not everything that is written in the early church fathers' writings is correct and it is not doctrine unless it has been proclaimed to be doctrine by the Magisterium of the Church.
 
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AFrazier

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It seems to me that the Son of man was delivered up to the Jews on Thursday and then condemned to be crucified/slain on the next day, Friday.

I think that the day Jesus said the following (Matthew 26:1-2) was on the Tuesday before He died.


Matthew 26:1-25--27:
When Jesus had finished all these sayings (on Tuesday), he said to his disciples, 2 “You know that after two days (today which is Tuesday and tomorrow which is Wednesday) the Passover is coming (on Thursday), and the Son of man will be delivered up (on Thursday night) to be crucified (Friday).”
3 Then (sometime on Wednesday) the chief priests and the elders of the people gathered in the palace of the high priest, who was called Ca′iaphas, 4 and took counsel together in order to arrest Jesus by stealth and kill him. 5 But they said, “Not during the feast, lest there be a tumult among the people.”
6 Now when Jesus was at Bethany in the house of Simon the leper (also sometime on Wednesday), 7 a woman came up to him with an alabaster flask of very expensive ointment, and she poured it on his head, as he sat at table. 8 But when the disciples saw it, they were indignant, saying, “Why this waste? 9 For this ointment might have been sold for a large sum, and given to the poor.” 10 But Jesus, aware of this, said to them, “Why do you trouble the woman? For she has done a beautiful thing to me. 11 For you always have the poor with you, but you will not always have me. 12 In pouring this ointment on my body she has done it to prepare me for burial. 13 Truly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her.”
14 Then one of the twelve, who was called Judas Iscariot, went to the chief priests (on this same Wednesday) 15 and said, “What will you give me if I deliver him to you?” And they paid him thirty pieces of silver. 16 And from that moment he sought an opportunity to betray him.
17 Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread (Thursday morning, the next day) the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Where will you have us prepare for you to eat the passover?” 18 He said, “Go into the city to a certain one, and say to him, ‘The Teacher says, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at your house with my disciples.’” 19 And the disciples did as Jesus had directed them, and they prepared the passover (on this same Thursday).

20 When it was evening
(on this same Thursday), he sat at table with the twelve disciples; 21 and as they were eating, he said, “Truly, I say to you, one of you will betray me.” 22 And they were very sorrowful, and began to say to him one after another, “Is it I, Lord?” 23 He answered, “He who has dipped his hand in the dish with me, will betray me. 24 The Son of man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.” 25 Judas, who betrayed him, said, “Is it I, Master?” He said to him, “You have said so.”
26 Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, “Take, eat; this is my body.” 27 And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, “Drink of it, all of you; 28 for this is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. 29 I tell you I shall not drink again of this fruit of the vine until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.” 30 And when they had sung a hymn, they went out to the Mount of Olives. 31 Then Jesus said to them, “You will all fall away because of me this night; for it is written, ‘I will strike the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock will be scattered.’ 32 But after I am raised up, I will go before you to Galilee.” 33 Peter declared to him, “Though they all fall away because of you, I will never fall away.” 34 Jesus said to him, “Truly, I say to you, this very night, before the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crows, you will deny me three times.” 35 Peter said to him, “Even if I must die with you, I will not deny you.” And so said all the disciples.
36 Then Jesus went with them to a place called Gethsem′ane, and he said to his disciples, “Sit here, while I go yonder and pray.” 37 And taking with him Peter and the two sons of Zeb′edee, he began to be sorrowful and troubled. 38 Then he said to them, “My soul is very sorrowful, even to death; remain here, and watch with me.” 39 And going a little farther he fell on his face and prayed, “My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as thou wilt.” 40 And he came to the disciples and found them sleeping; and he said to Peter, “So, could you not watch with me one hour? 41 Watch and pray that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.” 42 Again, for the second time, he went away and prayed, “My Father, if this cannot pass unless I drink it, thy will be done.” 43 And again he came and found them sleeping, for their eyes were heavy. 44 So, leaving them again, he went away and prayed for the third time, saying the same words. 45 Then he came to the disciples and said to them, “Are you still sleeping and taking your rest? Behold, the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. 46 Rise, let us be going; see, my betrayer is at hand.”
47 While he was still speaking, Judas came, one of the twelve, and with him a great crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests and the elders of the people. 48 Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying, “The one I shall kiss is the man; seize him.” 49 And he came up to Jesus at once and said, “Hail, Master!” And he kissed him. 50 Jesus said to him, “Friend, why are you here?” Then they came up and laid hands on Jesus and seized him. 51 And behold, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand and drew his sword, and struck the slave of the high priest, and cut off his ear. 52 Then Jesus said to him, “Put your sword back into its place; for all who take the sword will perish by the sword. 53 Do you think that I cannot appeal to my Father, and he will at once send me more than twelve legions of angels? 54 But how then should the scriptures be fulfilled, that it must be so?” 55 At that hour Jesus said to the crowds, “Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me? Day after day I sat in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. 56 But all this has taken place, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled.” Then all the disciples forsook him and fled.
57 Then those who had seized Jesus (late on this Thursday night) led him to Ca′iaphas the high priest, where the scribes and the elders had gathered. 58 But Peter followed him at a distance, as far as the courtyard of the high priest, and going inside he sat with the guards to see the end. 59 Now the chief priests and the whole council sought false testimony against Jesus that they might put him to death, 60 but they found none, though many false witnesses came forward. At last two came forward 61 and said, “This fellow said, ‘I am able to destroy the temple of God, and to build it in three days.’” 62 And the high priest stood up and said, “Have you no answer to make? What is it that these men testify against you?” 63 But Jesus was silent. And the high priest said to him, “I adjure you by the living God, tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God.” 64 Jesus said to him, “You have said so. But I tell you, hereafter you will see the Son of man seated at the right hand of Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven.” 65 Then the high priest tore his robes, and said, “He has uttered blasphemy. Why do we still need witnesses? You have now heard his blasphemy. 66 What is your judgment?” They answered, “He deserves death.” 67 Then they spat in his face, and struck him; and some slapped him, 68 saying, “Prophesy to us, you Christ! Who is it that struck you?”
69 Now Peter was sitting outside in the courtyard. And a maid came up to him, and said, “You also were with Jesus the Galilean.” 70 But he denied it before them all, saying, “I do not know what you mean.” 71 And when he went out to the porch, another maid saw him, and she said to the bystanders, “This man was with Jesus of Nazareth.” 72 And again he denied it with an oath, “I do not know the man.” 73 After a little while the bystanders came up and said to Peter, “Certainly you are also one of them, for your accent betrays you.” 74 Then he began to invoke a curse on himself and to swear, “I do not know the man.” And immediately the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crowed (very. very early on Friday morning). 75 And Peter remembered the saying of Jesus, “Before the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] crows, you will deny me three times.” And he went out and wept bitterly.
27 When (Friday) morning came, all the chief priests and the elders of the people took counsel against Jesus to put him to death; 2 and they bound him and led him away and delivered him to Pilate the governor.
3 When Judas, his betrayer, saw that he was condemned, he repented and brought back the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and the elders, 4 saying, “I have sinned in betraying innocent blood.” They said, “What is that to us? See to it yourself.” 5 And throwing down the pieces of silver in the temple, he departed; and he went and hanged himself. 6 But the chief priests, taking the pieces of silver, said, “It is not lawful to put them into the treasury, since they are blood money.” 7 So they took counsel, and bought with them the potter’s field, to bury strangers in. 8 Therefore that field has been called the Field of Blood to this day. 9 Then was fulfilled what had been spoken by the prophet Jeremiah, saying, “And they took the thirty pieces of silver, the price of him on whom a price had been set by some of the sons of Israel, 10 and they gave them for the potter’s field, as the Lord directed me.”
11 Now Jesus stood before the governor; and the governor asked him, “Are you the King of the Jews?” Jesus said, “You have said so.” 12 But when he was accused by the chief priests and elders, he made no answer. 13 Then Pilate said to him, “Do you not hear how many things they testify against you?” 14 But he gave him no answer, not even to a single charge; so that the governor wondered greatly.
15 Now at the feast the governor was accustomed to release for the crowd any one prisoner whom they wanted. 16 And they had then a notorious prisoner, called Barab′bas. 17 So when they had gathered, Pilate said to them, “Whom do you want me to release for you, Barab′bas or Jesus who is called Christ?” 18 For he knew that it was out of envy that they had delivered him up. 19 Besides, while he was sitting on the judgment seat, his wife sent word to him, “Have nothing to do with that righteous man, for I have suffered much over him today in a dream.” 20 Now the chief priests and the elders persuaded the people to ask for Barab′bas and destroy Jesus. 21 The governor again said to them, “Which of the two do you want me to release for you?” And they said, “Barab′bas.” 22 Pilate said to them, “Then what shall I do with Jesus who is called Christ?” They all said, “Let him be crucified.” 23 And he said, “Why, what evil has he done?” But they shouted all the more, “Let him be crucified.”
24 So when Pilate saw that he was gaining nothing, but rather that a riot was beginning, he took water and washed his hands before the crowd, saying, “I am innocent of this man’s blood; see to it yourselves.” 25 And all the people answered, “His blood be on us and on our children!” 26 Then he released for them Barab′bas, and having scourged Jesus, delivered him to be crucified.
27 Then the soldiers of the governor took Jesus into the praetorium, and they gathered the whole battalion before him. 28 And they stripped him and put a scarlet robe upon him, 29 and plaiting a crown of thorns they put it on his head, and put a reed in his right hand. And kneeling before him they mocked him, saying, “Hail, King of the Jews!” 30 And they spat upon him, and took the reed and struck him on the head. 31 And when they had mocked him, they stripped him of the robe, and put his own clothes on him, and led him away to crucify him.
32 As they went out, they came upon a man of Cyre′ne, Simon by name; this man they compelled to carry his cross. 33 And when they came to a place called Gol′gotha (which means the place of a skull), 34 they offered him wine to drink, mingled with gall; but when he tasted it, he would not drink it. 35 And when they had crucified him, they divided his garments among them by casting lots; 36 then they sat down and kept watch over him there. 37 And over his head they put the charge against him, which read, “This is Jesus the King of the Jews.” 38 Then two robbers were crucified with him, one on the right and one on the left. rsv

It seems to me that Jesus Christ was delivered up to the Jews on Thursday, late evening, and then on Friday morning He was condemned to be crucified that same day.


Was Josephus speaking about only the Passover practices of his own sect of Judaism or was he referring to the Passover practices of all the different sects of Judaism which were active at that time?

Not everything that is written in the early church fathers' writings is correct and it is not doctrine unless it has been proclaimed to be doctrine by the Magisterium of the Church.
You have to get out of fight mode. I wasn't disagreeing with you in terms of ultimate outcome. I agree that he was arrested Thursday night, crucified on Friday, and risen Sunday. I also agree that just because the church held to a particular tradition and explanation for that tradition, that doesn't make it the way it was historically.

All I was saying is that your denial of Roman Catholic support on the doctrines presented in the Didascalia are not necessarily correct. Those doctrines were supported and preached during the era in which they were expressed. Right or wrong, it was church doctrine.

If you had read what I wrote, you might have been able to save yourself a lot of time typing, copying and pasting. You and I are not in disagreement so far as I'm aware, unless you believe he was crucified on the 14th rather than the 15th, which seems to be a common belief even amongst those who hold to a Friday crucifixion and Sunday resurrection.
 
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AFrazier

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Was Josephus speaking about only the Passover practices of his own sect of Judaism or was he referring to the Passover practices of all the different sects of Judaism which were active at that time?
It is a very common misconception that the Passover, or any of the holidays, were celebrated differently by different sects in Jerusalem. The sects may have disagreed on how the particulars should be, like the counting of the omer, but these were hashed out and a conclusion reached. The Beth Din declared the particular days of the holidays.

So no, Josephus was speaking concerning the practice of the Passover in general, which was the same for everyone, even if there were disagreements outside of established rabbinical law that needed to be resolved.
 
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Jan001

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The Sabbath is one of the 10, yes? Also, do you know where the word Pentecosta came from? All the Jewish Moedim (Feasts) were to be fulfilled by Yeshua.

The Saturday Sabbath day of rest for the OT Israelites was for the Israelites only
and therefore Saturday is not the Sabbath day of rest for the early NT Christians which were comprised of both Jews and non-Jews. The Rest/Sabbath day for all NT Christians is Sunday, the first day of the week.

The Jewish Feast days were all fulfilled by Jesus Christ.

",,,,,,,,You believe the last three Festivals are yet to be fulfilled by Jesus. You believe Rosh HaShanah, Yom Kippur, and Sukkot are yet in the future. The implications of this belief would suggest:​
  1. There are no saints "in Christ" yet in heaven. Abraham, the patriarchs, the apostles, and all the dead "in Christ" are awaiting their entrance into the heavenly kingdom. The captives have not been set free.

  2. There has been no atonement. The atoning blood of Jesus Christ has yet to do its work. Redemption is not complete. The letter to the Hebrews is wrong, and the veil has not yet been rent.

  3. The Spirit of the living God does not yet dwell in men. Jeremiah 31 has not yet happened. Paul was wrong when he said that saved men are the tabernacle of the Holy Ghost, and Peter was wrong when he said we are being built up a Spiritual house. John was wrong when he said, "Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God." God does not yet tabernacle with man.
I believe the captives have been set free, the dead "in Christ" are in heaven, and those of us believeth on to Jesus have already passed from death to life, and we have been raised up and seated with Christ in God’s heaven. God’s promise in Jeremiah has come to pass and God tabernacles with men." https://www.preteristarchive.com/Modern/0000_silvestri_festivals-fulfilled.html
 
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Jan001

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You have to get out of fight mode. I wasn't disagreeing with you in terms of ultimate outcome. I agree that he was arrested Thursday night, crucified on Friday, and risen Sunday. I also agree that just because the church held to a particular tradition and explanation for that tradition, that doesn't make it the way it was historically.

All I was saying is that your denial of Roman Catholic support on the doctrines presented in the Didascalia are not necessarily correct. Those doctrines were supported and preached during the era in which they were expressed. Right or wrong, it was church doctrine.

If you had read what I wrote, you might have been able to save yourself a lot of time typing, copying and pasting. You and I are not in disagreement so far as I'm aware, unless you believe he was crucified on the 14th rather than the 15th, which seems to be a common belief even amongst those who hold to a Friday crucifixion and Sunday resurrection.

I did read all that you wrote. :) I write for whoever is reading my posts.

I personally do not think it matters whether it was Nissan 14th or 15th. There could have been some error in the determination of dates because different calendars were used by different peoples. Did the disobedient Israelites in their exiles correctly use the original Israelites' calendar of feasts or did they abandon their calendar during these time periods of exile and then later try to piece it together again?

I am emphatically stating that some of the things that were written in the early church fathers' writings are not factually true and that is why they never became Church doctrine. :)
 
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It is a very common misconception that the Passover, or any of the holidays, were celebrated differently by different sects in Jerusalem. The sects may have disagreed on how the particulars should be, like the counting of the omer, but these were hashed out and a conclusion reached. The Beth Din declared the particular days of the holidays.

So no, Josephus was speaking concerning the practice of the Passover in general, which was the same for everyone, even if there were disagreements outside of established rabbinical law that needed to be resolved.

Now that it is almost 2000 years after the destruction of the temple in 70 A.D. and the ending of the Old/First Covenant, it seems that this is impossible to prove.

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant he treats the first as obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. rsv (The Old/First Covenant with its temple and its animal sacrifices vanished away in 70 A.D.)

Josephus was a Jewish historian, but I am sure that he did not record everything that was pertinent to all the Jews of every sect. He most likely did not have all the knowledge about how the different sects practiced. Even the Jews today do not agree about everything concerning the practices of worship of the Jews who lived nearly 2000 years ago.
 
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AFrazier

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Now that it is almost 2000 years after the destruction of the temple in 70 A.D. and the ending of the Old/First Covenant, it seems that this is impossible to prove.

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant he treats the first as obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. rsv (The Old/First Covenant with its temple and its animal sacrifices vanished away in 70 A.D.)

Josephus was a Jewish historian, but I am sure that he did not record everything that was pertinent to all the Jews of every sect. He most likely did not have all the knowledge about how the different sects practiced. Even the Jews today do not agree about everything concerning the practices of worship of the Jews who lived nearly 2000 years ago.
First of all, Josephus was one of those Jews who lived nearly 2000 years ago. His testimony as to how things were done is a matter of first-hand knowledge for him. He lived it in the pre-70 CE period. And I did say that the Beth Din declared the start of the months and the ordering of the festivals. The Talmud records this.

So when Josephus and the Talmud both tell us how Passover was conducted, they are a far better source than either of our opinions or interpretations.

The abolition of the Old Covenant is irrelevant to the discussion of historical fact. That's really a matter of theology. The Old Covenant still stands for those outside of Christ.
 
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ImAHebrew

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Yeah ... I checked the Greek on that. You are so not right it isn't even funny. It's to lead or to bring. It's in the 3rd person, sing., pres., act., ind. "Today brings this third day since these things occurred," which in a layman's paraphrase is, "Today is the third day since these things occurred." The bias is yours.

Furthermore, Jesus didn't die when the Passover lambs were being slain. He died the next day. He and the disciples ate the Passover at the Last Supper.

Wednesday is not possible.
Shalom AFrazier, thank you for the response. You may need to re-examine this. This Greek word was used 72 times in the KJV and ONLY once was it translated "is," and that was in Luke 24:21. That should be a big tip off to you that something is wrong. Luke uses this Greek word (G71) in the previous chapter several times, and it shows you how HE was thinking of this word (Luke 23:1 & Luke 23:32). The third day was being LED AWAY from when those things occurred, not that it IS the third day. Also, you did not address the "sadness" of the two Disciples, why were they sad IF it was STILL the third day?

There is one more Greek word that you have to consider (G575) in your thinking. Here is the verse in question - Luke 24:21:

Luke 24:21 But we trusted that it had been He which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, today is LEADS the third day since AWAY FROM those things happening.

That First day of the week was leading the third day AWAY FROM (G575) those things happening. They were not saying that "today" IS the third day, but that "today" leads the third day AWAY FROM those things happening. And that is what made them sad, the third day had been led away.

Now, your objection to Yeshua dying AT the appointed time that the Passover was to be killed, you may need to consider several Scriptures. Numbers 9:13 shows us that keeping the Passover at it's appointed time, whether in the 1st month or the 2nd, is required...the 14th day of the month, not the 15th day of the month.

And then we have the words of John speaking about the Jews not wanting to enter the judgment hall. They did not want to enter because they might have become defiled. And that defilement would have made it to where they would be unable to eat the Passover (Numbers 9:6). Was this not all happening in the DAY that Yeshua died (John 18:28), on the PREPARATION of the PASSOVER (John 19:14)? It is obvious that some were STILL preparing for the EATING of the Passover that evening AFTER sunset, so you may want to try and figure out just exactly what was going on the evening prior when a totally NEW Covenant was established, in the eating of the Passover. What they did on the night He was betrayed, was not the LAWFUL appointed time for the Passover, but when they wrote about this, it was viewed as The Passover because of Yeshua BEING the Passover (1 Corinthians 5:7), and He was entering INTO a New Covenant with them and MAKING them PART of Himself, The Passover.

Hopefully this helps you to see that Yeshua died on Wednesday and rose three days and three night later on Saturday evening. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.

P.S. Have you considered the women, and the TIME involved with building a fire, boiling oils, adding in the spices, letting it cool, and then skimming off the residues in the preparation of making burial perfumes/ointments?
 
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