Bulgarian Orthodox Church withdraws from Pan-Orthodox Council in Crete

[Anhelyna]

The governing body of the Bulgarian Orthodox Church, the Holy Synod, signalled on June 1 its withdrawal from the Pan-Orthodox Council to be held in Crete from June 16 to 26.

Strictly speaking, the Holy Synod demanded the postponement of the council unless its various demands were met, but given that this is unlikely to happen, the Synod’s decision effectively amounts to withdrawal.........

http://sofiaglobe.com/2016/06/01/bu...withdraws-from-pan-orthodox-council-in-crete/

 

[ICXC-NIKA]

Such a shame!

 

[~Anastasia~]

 

[Cappadocious]

Wonder why. Doesn't really say.

 

[ArmyMatt]

well, there ya go

 

[Orthodoxjay1]

Bummer, I thought I heard a while back Antioch was not going too, and the OCA couldn't attend. Oh well hopefully, even without Bulgaria, Antioch, and the OCA everything goes well, yet with the tensions between the M.P. and E.P, who knows? Pray for a successful council people. Personally I expect the status Quo, ohh well Orthodoxy moves at Ancient speed since 33 A.D .

 

[buzuxi02]

Cant wait for the Greeks to lay the proverbial smack down on the Ecumenical Patriarchate. That would be the icing on the cake. I can assure you the Church of Greece is more at odds with the EP than Moscow. That one bulgarian objection seems to be the same objections that the Greeks, Serbians and Russians have, about the wording of Orthodox relations to the christian world and other references to the human person:

The Holy Synod said that Autocephalous Orthodox Churches had already officially declared disagreements on some of the texts already approved for the council meeting.

:Below is a video from Fr. Theodoros Zisis professor of Patristics under the Church of Greece which sums up the topics of this council. He speaks Greek in the video but has english subtitles. If anyone speaks greek and know the mannerisms he can be humorous at times such as in 7:35 & 23.34 of the video when speaking of the inability of these bishops to even figure out the ordering of diptychs.

That the pre-conciliar councils dealt with issues that span so many decades that many themes have been revised so many times because the original themes have become obselete over the course of the past 55 years. Just what he says between 27:09 to 27:54 of the video is golden.
Notice how as a spokesman of the church of Greece, he rejects most topics that the EP is promoting:
On the Great and Holy Council - Fr Theodoros Zisis - YouTube

 

[GregConstantine]

And we wonder why no one knows of us, don't take us seriously, and why we are not making an impact on our society and culture, why so many leave the Church? This is pitiful. They are far more concerned about their petty, internecine ethnic disagreements and power plays with each other than the poor, the widows, the lame, the hungry, the homeless, those who have not been evangelized.

Every time they engage in these shenanigans, they lose relevancy.

Now I think there are plenty of priest and lay people who do have their priorities straight and are making an impact locally, but our bishops? Perhaps a few, but not the majority of them.

 

[E.C.]

One of those times when having an Orthodox monarch strong and influential enough to successfully summon a council could really pay off.

Buzuxi, I find it difficult to believe that relations between the EP and Athens would be worse than between Russia and the Phanar. Has that normally been the case?

 

[prodromos]

One of those times when having an Orthodox monarch strong and influential enough to successfully summon a council could really pay off.

Buzuxi, I find it difficult to believe that relations between the EP and Athens would be worse than between Russia and the Phanar. Has that normally been the case?

I remember a lot of tension during the selection of our new archbishop in Thessaloniki after HH Panteleimon passed away. Remember that the Archbishop of Greece only looks after Southern Greece. Northern Greece and the Eastern islands are all under the EP.

 

[jckstraw72]

Greek bishops have certainly been speaking out against the Council documents far more than any Russian hierarch, ROCOR excepting.

doesn't seem so crazy that they've pointed out that this Council doesn't stand to accomplish too much of any real value, but will be very costly. doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to see this whole thing as mainly a publicity stunt -- how many times have we heard "the whole world will be watching!" as if everyone who isn't Orthodox is for some reason falling off their chairs waiting to hear what we have to say.

 

[GregConstantine]

I agree that people are definitely making way too much out of this council. Even if they all are able to meet up, do we honestly think they will accomplish much anyways? The only thing they'll probably agree on is that they need to meet again on some undetermined date in another 4 or 500 years from now, lol!

 

[gzt]

It sort of turned into a catch 22, didn't it? They couldn't address anything substantial because people got afraid of what would be said. But banal pablum is also not good.

 

[Anhelyna]

And today's contribution - and yes a Catholic is posting this [ my GodPapa finds such interesting topics to further my education ]

The relations between the Greek Orthodox and Roman Catholic Churches are expected to take a turn for the worse, after the Holy Synod decided that Roman Catholic Church is not a “church” but rather a community!........

Given that the Greek Orthodox Church has been in talks with the Roman Catholic Church for decades, without ever raising such issues before, the development is expected to cause tensions.

http://www.tovima.gr/en/article/?aid=802657

 

[~Anastasia~]

And we wonder why no one knows of us, don't take us seriously, and why we are not making an impact on our society and culture, why so many leave the Church? This is pitiful. They are far more concerned about their petty, internecine ethnic disagreements and power plays with each other than the poor, the widows, the lame, the hungry, the homeless, those who have not been evangelized.

Every time they engage in these shenanigans, they lose relevancy.

Now I think there are plenty of priest and lay people who do have their priorities straight and are making an impact locally, but our bishops? Perhaps a few, but not the majority of them.

Sigh.

I know nothing of the politics of the Church. What I have learned, I have not been pleased about. It is almost so foreign to and separate from what I experience on a parish or interpersonal level, or my practice of the faith. Thank God that was not my introduction to Orthodoxy.

But when I read the first article, I had pretty much these same thoughts.

And if documents cannot be edited in council - then basically it's everyone meeting and either being swayed over to agree 100% on an issue, or rejecting it outright? I suspect that means nothing will be accepted, if there can be no dialogue or even tweaking of the outcome.

"The bishops" do seem to be utterly separate and distant, in the case of those higher-ups that one never sees. By contrast I have met two on FB (yes, I know people are not always who they say they are) but both head their own local communities (one a parish, one a small monastery) in less-developed places in the world, and speak with amazing wisdom and love. One in particular absolutely amazes me with his manner, kindness, humor even, and ability to work through sticky questions and give good reasons "why" he answers this way or that. Their concern is for their own little flock, and the wider Church as they are able. These men seem worlds apart from the "politics" of what goes on. I waited to see what they would say too about this Council, and only one addressed it and in a simple, good-natured way just said to pray for the Church. I doubt either of them or however many others who exist who are like them (I hope it is many!) will be asked to the Council. Which if I am right about that is sad - I think these men could get things done, and with love and concern for all.

 

[gzt]

The succulents can apparently be amended but only unanimously.

 

[buzuxi02]

I remember a lot of tension during the selection of our new archbishop in Thessaloniki after HH Panteleimon passed away. Remember that the Archbishop of Greece only looks after Southern Greece. Northern Greece and the Eastern islands are all under the EP.

Yes I remember that It was under the late archbishop Christodoulos.There is some kind of agreement on how bishops are to be appointed in what they called the new lands. Archbishop Christodoulos appointed someone without approval (or whatever the agreement called for) the EP then suspended communion with Greece, it was lifted a few months later.

Anyhow to the original point, there are over 80 bishops in the synod of Greece, many of them are highly critical of the EP and have written about it. It was bishops of the Church of Greece that influenced the Serbs to push for the recognition of the Photian council as the 8th ecumenical council at this pan orthodox synod. If successful would have meant that ecumenical dialogues with the Latins would require they abandon the fillioque phrase hefore any unity of any kind were even remotely possible.

 

[~Anastasia~]

The succulents can apparently be amended but only unanimously.

Well that is something ... It makes me wonder if there is even enough time for dialogue, amendment proposal, more dialogue, to reach eventual agreement. But at least it isn't totally cementing out any possibility of reaching agreement.

(If I understand you - lol my auto correct does things like that!)

 

[gzt]

The Bulgarians objected to the aloe vera but there's just no changing it.

 

[buzuxi02]

I actually mentioned a while back that in today's age they may as well set up video conferencing. When the Ecumenical councils took place the state picked up the tab and the bishops could stay as long as they wanted. They were even free to leave at anytime, arrive later on. Replace ones that had to leave.
Regardless of what the media has reported, I am positive this council had no way of taking place in Constantinople. There is no way Turkey could or would support the immense security precautions that would have been required with over 200 Orthodox bishops descending in aformer byzantine church.