Christian Zionism - a modern-day heresy?

Christian Zionism = A modern heresy?

  • Yes

  • No


Results are only viewable after voting.

random person

1 COR. 10:11; HEB. 1:2; HEB. 9:26,28; 1 PET. 1:20
Dec 10, 2013
3,646
262
Riverside California
✟14,087.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Democrat
I repeat again, the Land promises were but a type and a shadow for the Kingdom of Heaven. The True And Eternal Inheritance In Heaven.

By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: for he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
Hebrews 11:8-10


Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable. These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.
Hebrews 11:12-16

And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us [NEW COVENANT SAINTS, THE TRUE CIRCUMCISION, THE TRUE CHILDREN OF ABRAHAM - mine emphasis], that they without us should not be made perfect.
Hebrews 11:39-40
 
Upvote 0

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,492
28,588
73
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,270.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
Oh, the Palestinian and Jew problem is so messy and complex.

But I will add, the Palestinians had nothing to do with the European Holocaust and they have as much right if not more to that land than the Jews. They weren't responsible for the European Holocaust, they weren't even on the same continent.


America and England did not want to open their borders to the Jewish refugees during WWII, and even than the Zionists were adamant about Palestine as their homeland.

To sum it all up, there has been a lot more innocent Palestinian blood spilt than innocent Jewish blood spilt. The Palestinians have lost a lot of land, agriculture, ancestral homes, and have endured the longest military occupation in the world now entering its 48th year.

Furthermore, Palestinians are the largest and longest suffering group of refugees in the world. One in three refugees world wide is Palestinian. There are about 7.2 million Palestinian refugees worldwide.

Palestinian extremists commits acts of terrorism against innocent Jews.

The State Of Israel deals out corporate punishment (or state terrorism) in return, usually wounding and killing more innocent Palestinians than baddies.

My 0.02, the Palestinians are getting the worst of it. Don't listen to the nutjob garden variety Christian Zionist televangelists, they are deep in Israeli and AIPAC pockets.
The Palistinians having nothing to do with the Holocaust is a good point........

http://uprootedpalestinians.blogspot.com/2011/03/khalid-bin-al-khalifa-and-his-chabad.html

jewish%2Bracism24.jpg
.............................
jewish%2Bracism7.jpg
 
Upvote 0

Alive_Again

Resident Alien
Sep 16, 2010
4,167
231
✟12,991.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Israel after the flesh is spoken of in scripture. They have not been cast off. They were, as in former times, led (permitted) into bondage because of their deeds. God never forgot about them. At the appropriate time, they were called back. They are referred to in the New Testament as "Israel", and Paul would have traded in his own salvation for the nation of "Israel".

Who's gonna build the third temple? Who's going to have their blindness (for your sake) removed? Israel! We're not to boast about ourselves being over them. They still have to receive the Lord to be saved, but the promises to the seed of Abraham still apply. His heart is after them and a great blessing is for those who pray for the city of Jerusalem. It was a great sign for the His chosen people (not because of their greatness) to return from bondage and from where they were scattered from. It was a GREAT SIGN this time after nearly 2,000 years to bring them back from where those descendants were scattered. How can you not see this? It's a powerful delusion all right to miss this.

Replacement theology is not accurate. It is not because of the godliness of the people, but because of His promises. The land promises are not temporary. What does it say? They are not finished getting the land! Greater signs are coming as well!

Look at how God delivered Israel in the two wars. The very day after their coming back into being, everyone declared war on them and by miracles attested by even the Jews, they prevailed. It's not a "false sign" to behold the works of God. All of the nations on the earth have born witness (though some are blind) to God standing up for His chosen people. Watch what happens not too far down the road. Israel says they "Know what to do" if those missiles were brought in to Syria. Russia brought them in anyway, sneaking fighter planes underneath the transports. Listen to Bibi's statement to the UN yesterday. They're not going to wait around and let their enemies gather. The same goes for Iran. Do you know Iran suffered an earthquake that set back their nuclear ambitions previously. Guess where that came from?

Although danger is on every side and they surely need prayer, it's all good for them (from the bigger picture) and like many believers, I wait to see the salvation of God for the Nation of Israel.
 
  • Like
Reactions: zippy2
Upvote 0

random person

1 COR. 10:11; HEB. 1:2; HEB. 9:26,28; 1 PET. 1:20
Dec 10, 2013
3,646
262
Riverside California
✟14,087.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Democrat
Israel after the flesh is spoken of in scripture. They have not been cast off. They were, as in former times, led (permitted) into bondage because of their deeds. God never forgot about them. At the appropriate time, they were called back. They are referred to in the New Testament as "Israel", and Paul would have traded in his own salvation for the nation of "Israel".

Who's gonna build the third temple? Who's going to have their blindness (for your sake) removed? Israel! We're not to boast about ourselves being over them. They still have to receive the Lord to be saved, but the promises to the seed of Abraham still apply. His heart is after them and a great blessing is for those who pray for the city of Jerusalem. It was a great sign for the His chosen people (not because of their greatness) to return from bondage and from where they were scattered from. It was a GREAT SIGN this time after nearly 2,000 years to bring them back from where those descendants were scattered. How can you not see this? It's a powerful delusion all right to miss this.

Replacement theology is not accurate. It is not because of the godliness of the people, but because of His promises. The land promises are not temporary. What does it say? They are not finished getting the land! Greater signs are coming as well!

Look at how God delivered Israel in the two wars. The very day after their coming back into being, everyone declared war on them and by miracles attested by even the Jews, they prevailed. It's not a "false sign" to behold the works of God. All of the nations on the earth have born witness (though some are blind) to God standing up for His chosen people. Watch what happens not too far down the road. Israel says they "Know what to do" if those missiles were brought in to Syria. Russia brought them in anyway, sneaking fighter planes underneath the transports. Listen to Bibi's statement to the UN yesterday. They're not going to wait around and let their enemies gather. The same goes for Iran. Do you know Iran suffered an earthquake that set back their nuclear ambitions previously. Guess where that came from?

Although danger is on every side and they surely need prayer, it's all good for them (from the bigger picture) and like many believers, I wait to see the salvation of God for the Nation of Israel.

Why is there a third Temple? The Temple served the requirements of the Mosaic Covenant afterall.

Why are the Jews still God's exclusive chosen people?

What are land promises without circumcision and the Law?

Where in the scriptures does it say God will regather the Jews in disbelief?
 
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
9,486
3,322
✟858,457.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Christian Zionism is a movement to "usher in the end times".

I voted yes due to the simple fact that man has absolutely NO say in determining the will of GOD. :)

If we want to "usher in the end times" then we should be going to the ends of the earth until every nation and tribe has heard His name.
 
Upvote 0

Berean777

Servant of Christ Jesus. Stellar Son.
Feb 12, 2014
3,283
586
✟22,009.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
The way I look at the sons of Jacob is figuratively according to the parable of the prodigal son who took his inheritance and went off to a far country and plundered it all. The youngest son is also figurative for a son who is not very matured in faith and so is little in faith and so he no longer relies on the faith of his Father (God), who sowed the seed of promise Jesus Christ and therefore went about doing his own thing in the diaspora of the world, thinking that he can make it on his own without the Father (God) of his fathers (Jacobs sons of the old covenant).

The youngest son then finds a drought where he can not sustain his identity and his worth and if he continues to stay the way he is, with the unclean things of the world, which symbolises the pig pen of the world. Then when he realises that he needs to go back to his Father (God), he has to come back completely broken and demoralised to no longer boast, but ask that he only be considered as a servant and not a son. The eldest son at this point is the one who is the one matured in faith, because he was always with the father, meaning he continued in the faith in Christ once delivered onto the saints (Jews). So this eldest brother in faith becomes someone jealous of his youngest rebellious brother, because the Father (God) is taking him back and is throwing a party for him by the slaughter of the fatted calf, which symbolises of the red heffer, which points to the sons of Jacob coming back to faith in droves after they realise that messiah has already come and that he is Jesus.

So Jesus also points to another parable of the workmen, from the 1st, 3rd, 6th, 9th and 11th. The 11th hour workmen come along towards the end of the new covenant age where they have only one hour to labour before the bride groom comes at 12:00 o'clock. So the 3rd, 6th and the 9th hour workmen become jealous when they get the same amount of treatment as the the last hour workmen. Couple this with the eldest in faith jealous brother in the prodigal son parable and what you have is the scenario that the youngest brother was deemed to have left the faith of the fathers (old covenant) from when the eldest son who is symbolised by the 3rd, 6th and 9th hour workmen stayed with the faith and laboured in the heat of the day by spreading the gospel, all the way to the final hour before 12 o'clock, where the bride groom was soon to come.

So this eldest brother who took the faith from the beginning when messiah came is the symbol of the gentile nations who ultimately carried it whilst the youngest son was disbanded until the fullness of these Gentiles comes where all the gentile world has been invited to come and what is left is the youngest son (Jacobs seed) to also come to the wedding supper of the lamb.

The youngest son's disbanding of the Abrahmic faith from the 1st century's ejection of messiah is also indicated in scripture as follows

Matthew 22
The Parable of the Wedding Banquet

1Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying: 2“The kingdom of heaven is like a king who prepared a wedding banquet for his son. 3He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come.

4“Then he sent some more servants and said, ‘Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner: My oxen and fattened cattle have been butchered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding banquet.’

5But they paid no attention and went off—one to his field, another to his business. 6The rest seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them. 7The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.

8“Then he said to his servants, ‘The wedding banquet is ready, but those I invited did not deserve to come. 9So go to the street corners and invite to the banquet anyone you find.’ 10So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, the bad as well as the good, and the wedding hall was filled with guests.

11“But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12He asked, ‘How did you get in here without wedding clothes, friend?’ The man was speechless.

13“Then the king told the attendants, ‘Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

14“For many are invited, but few are chosen.”

Notice on the versus above the fattened cow is mentioned where the Father slaughters in celebrating his youngest son return and it is linked in context to the invitation to the wedding supper of the lamb which is an evangelistic calling as the 11th hour workmen, only if those who accept it can be clothed in time and to be made ready (oil in their lamps) for the bridegroom return, when he comes at 12 o'clock.

Notice also the context of the above verse Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner is pointing squarely at the Jews (sons of Jacob). Yet they ignored the evangelistic calling and went about in the far country to waste their inheritance in the pig pen of the world. Then you see the Pharisees rebel against God to persecute the 1st century Jewish apostolic church and the result was the burning down of their city (Jerusalem) by the Romans in 70AD.

Jesus hints at the youngest son returning to the Abrahamic fathers faith when he states that the first (Jacobs seed) to hear about the gospel in the 1st century will become the last to embrace it and preach it for the last and final rally to preach it before 12 o'clock. What needs to happen is for Jacobs seed to say blessed is the Christ who came in the name of the Lord. This rally call will be paralleled to the rally that Gideon made with the Israelites when he said I want you to make a decision today. Will you accept the God of Israel, it so, then give me an answer today by saying yes.

The instrument that Jesus also hinted at is symbolised as God's handy work, the Assyrians (Men of Nineveh) will also be used by God to re-establish the highway and to post the invitation and to also rally behind Jacobs seed like the Gideon's of the world. Jesus would hint at this by saying the Men of Nineveh will come to chasten this generation because they believed in Jonah and yet there is one greater than Jonah standing and they believed not. So the Assyrians again will be like the symbol of the Jonah's of the world.

In conclusion the sons of Jacob will come and it is only a matter of time. The instrument of God's handy work, the Assyrians will be used to bring about this last hour rally. Then the gentile world (symbol of the eldest brother), seeing this will all come also in unity as one body and under one shepherd Jesus Christ, before the devil steps in to spoil the party and commit world wide Calvary in an unprecedented scale that pales the 1st century persecution of the Jewish apostolic church.

The ministry of the Power and Spirit of Elijah (God) will be from the church for the East where East is the symbol of the Sun/Son of righteousness who will speak through the mouth of one to bring back this youngest son back to his loving arms.
 
Upvote 0

thecolorsblend

If God is your Father, who is your Mother?
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2013
9,199
8,425
Gotham City, New Jersey
✟308,231.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Christian Zionism = A modern heresy?

Yes it is, a manifestly destructive one. Others have posted what rabbis and other jews think about goy... I mean, gentiles. So there's no need for me to do so. Christian Zionism ought to be a contradiction in terms... and would be such in a fair and sane world. Luckily it looks like the younger generation is waking up to reality so the future looks bright.

Boycott, divest, sanction.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rakovsky
Upvote 0

RhaegarTargaryen

Active Member
May 27, 2015
367
52
40
✟784.00
Faith
Lutheran
Christian Zionism = A modern heresy?

Yes it is, a manifestly destructive one. Others have posted what rabbis and other jews think about goy... I mean, gentiles. So there's no need for me to do so. Christian Zionism ought to be a contradiction in terms... and would be such in a fair and sane world. Luckily it looks like the younger generation is waking up to reality so the future looks bright.

Boycott, divest, sanction.

Ahh...the BDS-crowd.
The rules here doesn't allow proper categorization of those people, but all decent people know exactly who and what they are.
As proved by their spreading of anti-semitic lies.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nige55
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

thecolorsblend

If God is your Father, who is your Mother?
Site Supporter
Jul 1, 2013
9,199
8,425
Gotham City, New Jersey
✟308,231.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Ahh...the BDS-crowd.
The rules here doesn't allow proper categorization of those people, but all decent people know exactly who and what they are.
As proved by their spreading of anti-semitic lies.
Call it whatever you want but I refuse to support a terrorist state. There's no political reason to do so. Certainly there's no religious reason to do so since the Church is Israel now.
 
Upvote 0

SeventyTimes7

Active Member
Oct 24, 2015
288
38
✟8,147.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
New heaven and new earth and the New Jerusalem coming down on the new earth. Yes sure, men can do it LOL

But if we talk about the first part of the eternal kingdom (the millennium), that will be made by Jesus the Messiah, by no one else, after Jesus will destroy the antichrist and his power.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

rakovsky

Newbie
Apr 8, 2004
2,552
557
Pennsylvania
✟67,675.00
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
Israel after the flesh is spoken of in scripture. They have not been cast off.
If you follow Paul, then in some sense the nonChristians were cast off, because Paul describes them as branches broken off from the real tree. (Rom 9-11)

They were, as in former times, led (permitted) into bondage because of their deeds. God never forgot about them. At the appropriate time, they were called back.
What should be the basis for the return? In the Bible, the plan is that the people turn to God and then God rewards them by restoring them to their land. Did the nonChristians turn to God in 1946-48 in a way that they had not before that made God restore them to the land?

If not, it sounds very strange to imagine 1946-48 to be fulfillment of some kind of a Torah contract.

Scribe_400x400.jpg

He doesn't get it either.
 
Upvote 0

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,492
28,588
73
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,270.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
If you follow Paul, then in some sense the nonChristians were cast off, because Paul describes them as branches broken off from the real tree. (Rom 9-11)

What should be the basis for the return? In the Bible, the plan is that the people turn to God and then God rewards them by restoring them to their land.
Did the nonChristians turn to God in 1946-48 in a way that they had not before that made God restore them to the land?

If not, it sounds very strange to imagine 1946-48 to be fulfillment of some kind of a Torah contract...................
I agree.

From what I know, it is mainly dispensationalists zionists that believe 1948 was a fulfillment of any Bible prophecy. Preterism [either partial or full] and Amils [RCC and possibly the EOC] reject that futureistic nonsense, as well they should.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/the-destructive-preterist-view.7840781/

FINGERPRINTS, folks. FINGERPRINTS.............................

AD70.
The preterist view says that horrible event was a fulfillment of Zechariah. Now I know there are many variations of preterism but this is one of those variations.
I would ask a “preterist” to show me a 100% match to the event of AD 70 and Zechariah/Olivet discourse. Please post no links, if possible.
BEWARE!!
Example of confusion. Most people believe that 1948 was a fufillment of Bible prophecies. Prophecy mongers and “experts” fail to see that there were ZERO matches in the fingerprints of prophecy and “fulfillment”. It is like comparing fingerprints with FOOTPRINTS!.

ISRAEL-BECOMES-A-NATION-146117641376.png

.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LLoJ
Upvote 0

rakovsky

Newbie
Apr 8, 2004
2,552
557
Pennsylvania
✟67,675.00
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
I agree.

From what I know, it is mainly dispensationalists zionists that believe 1948 was a fulfillment of any Bible prophecy. Preterism [either partial or full] and Amils [RCC and possibly the EOC] reject that futureistic nonsense, as well they should.

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/the-destructive-preterist-view.7840781/




.
Lamb,

I see these options in my profile:

  • Historic
  • Preterist
  • Futurist
  • Amillennialism
  • Premillennialism
  • Postmillennialism
  • Pretribulation
  • Midtribulation
  • Posttribulation
Choose options that best describes your beliefs regarding endtimes.

And I just want to pick "Normal".
 
Upvote 0

dennis777

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2006
613
29
✟8,413.00
Faith
Christian
Christian Zionism is a movement to "usher in the end times".

I voted yes due to the simple fact that man has absolutely NO say in determining the will of GOD. :)


google JOHN MCTERNAN'S book........."AS AMERICA HAS DONE TO ISRAEL".........

Each time the USA hurt Israel nation, a great catastrophe occured in the usa........when we hurt Israel, Jesus strikes us........we reap what we sow.........Christ is working on converting Israel (Jews) to Christ in the endtimes and the Trib........it will take the Trib to turn their hearts to Jesus...........when Israel calls on Jesus by Name, then Christ will Return, at the end of the 7 year trib (Daniel's 70th week)........the 1948 re-birth of Israel nation is part of the process........the OT says that the Jews will return to the LAND in un-belief, and will be converted in the Trib.

Christ has a special love for the Jews "for the sake of the Fathers (Abe, Issac, Jacob).
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

LittleLambofJesus

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!
Site Supporter
May 19, 2015
125,492
28,588
73
GOD's country of Texas
Visit site
✟1,237,270.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
LiturgyInDMinor said:
The political state of Israel is no more important than Brooklyn in the grand scheme of things.
Of course, after all, Brooklyn was mentioned several hundered times throughout the Bible.
Nah, the Bronx is much more important and holier than Israel [or at least not much better..IMHO

upload_2016-2-8_15-48-24.jpeg


 
Upvote 0