Genesis 6 Giants in scripture

[CryOfALion]

Believers and unbelievers don't produce giants

And, if they do produce a baby with giantism, s/he will likely die very early, and live a painful life in terms of the fragility of the body under such weight.

They certainly won't be 9ft warriors champions who win battles and wield weapons (with armor,) or 11ft kings. And, unbelievers and believers wont produce four different masses of four different races of these giants.

 

[Postvieww]

And, if they do produce a baby with giantism, s/he will likely die very early, and live a painful life in terms of the fragility of the body under such weight.

They certainly won't be 9ft warriors champions who win battles and wield weapons (with armor,) or 11ft kings. And, unbelievers and believers wont produce four different masses of four different races of these giants.

You misunderstand, we are not talking about unbeliever humans, fallen angels are the ones referred to here. This is not giantism as in an unusual human happening, this is a supernatural event. I understand many can not grasp this, it sounds too far out, but I'm convinced the scripture describes exactly that, an unholy union between fallen angels and human women producing giants that are not human. Read and study some of the posts here carefully before jumping to a conclusion that may be incorrect. God Bless

Sorry Cry, I missed the n2thelight Quote

 

[Postvieww]

I really try to avoid the discussion. It's a curious verse...and as a babe in Christ in the late 80's I believed it was angels inbreeding with women.

After really studying it much later I tend to agree it's simply belivers intermarrying with unbelievers.

Anyway the problem comes in understanding the Hebrew "ben elohiym".

That line of thinking leaves many questions unanswered. But we can agree to disagree. God Bless

 

[ebedmelech]

That line of thinking leaves many questions unanswered. But we can agree to disagree. God Bless

Actually it doesn't. The fact that I try to avoid it doesn't mean I didn't study it.

It leads to nonsensical ideas like women and angels intermarrying and reproducing and creating superhumans.

 

[n2thelight]

Actually it doesn't. The fact that I try to avoid it doesn't mean I didn't study it.

It leads to nonsensical ideas like women and angels intermarrying and reproducing and creating superhumans.

Yet,that's exactly what happened......

 

[Douggg]

Yet,that's exactly what happened......

And to them who seemingly know everything to say that angels cannot procreate with humans, to produce an offspring which is not purely a human, we can look at the power that Pharaoh's two occultists had when they threw down their sticks and they became serpents.

 

[KrAZeD]

And to them who seemingly know everything to say that angels cannot procreate with humans, to produce an offspring which is not purely a human, we can look at the power that Pharaoh's two occultists had when they threw down their sticks and they became serpents.

I agree with Ebed on this, I don't believe theirs enough scripture to clarify exactly what and/or created those "giants" wether Angels interbreeding or a term for a "group" of people. It's one of the passages that can lead to many ideas, good and far fetched. Desire and curiosity make me want to understand it properly, though the lack of clarity it seems better to not read into it and trust moses and david killed the last of them Josh 13:12; 2 Sam 21:22.

Though the only issue thats kept me from going with the ideal that they are fallen angels was why did they take wives, their already "against" God, why honor the commandment of not committing adultery (in other words why get married, just fornicate). Lest not forget also it is God who opens and closes wombs- sarah, Rachel,Leah, Elizabeth, Mary: so if it was "fallen angel" genetic inheritance then God himself allowed it and coded it. As well as its God who creates life and allows one to live- deuteronomy 8:3 matt 4:4.

So why would God allow the angels He's thrown out to marry and procreate knowing their going to G just as evil and insubordinate. One would think then lucifer himself had billions of offspring just to enlarge his "army" and help his rebellion against our God and Lord. To me it seems more fitting of a term used for a sect of people purposely and vigorously serving evil- I.e the myans. Then again I am comfortable knowing that this portion of scripture will remain an enigma to me until I'm face to face with our Lord and He reveals all to us.

As for pharaohs occultists- power can just G given, it does not need to come from genetics. Moses was given the same ability to create a serpent, part the Red Sea, have and remove leprosy. Rev 13:2 the dragon gives the beast his power, throne and great authority- no mentioning of needing a genetic inheritance. I think the "transfer" is similar to what satan tempted our Lord with as well (wether or not he was being honest) matt 4:8, no need for genetics just a sworn oath or acceptance to serve the wrong master.

 

[n2thelight]

I agree with Ebed on this, I don't believe theirs enough scripture to clarify exactly what and/or created those "giants" wether Angels interbreeding or a term for a "group" of people. It's one of the passages that can lead to many ideas, good and far fetched. Desire and curiosity make me want to understand it properly, though the lack of clarity it seems better to not read into it and trust moses and david killed the last of them Josh 13:12; 2 Sam 21:22.

Plenty of scripture to know what's being said........

23. "THE SONS OF GOD" IN GEN. 6:2, 4.


It is only by the Divine specific act of creation that any created being can be called "a son of God". For that which is "born of the flesh is flesh". God is spirit, and that which is "born of the Spirit is spirit" (John 3:6). Hence Adam is called a "son of God" in Luke 3:38. Those "in Christ" having "the new nature" which is by the direct creation of God (2Cor. 5:17. Eph. 2:10) can be, and are called "sons of God" (John 1:13. Rom. 8:14, 15. 1John 3:1). (*1)
This is why angels are called "sons of God" in every other place where the expression is used in the Old Testament. Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7. Ps. 29:1; 89:6. Dan. 3:25 (no art.). (*2) We have no authority or right to take the expression in Gen. 6:2, 4 in any other sense. Moreover, in Gen. 6:2 the Sept. renders it "angels". Angels are called "spirits" (Ps. 104:4. Heb. 1:7, 14), for spirits are created by God.

That there was a fall of the angels is certain from Jude 6.

• The nature of their fall is clearly stated in the same verse. They left their own oiketerion. This word occurs only in 2Cor. 5:2 and Jude 6, where it is used of the spiritual (or resurrection) body.
• The nature of their sin is stated to be "in like manner" to that of the subsequent sins of Sodom and Gomorrha, Jude 7.
• The time of their fall is given as having taken place "in the days of Noah" (1Pet. 3:20. 2Pet. 2:7), though there may have been a prior fall which caused the end of "the world that then was" (Gen. 1:1, 2. 2Pet. 3:6).
• For this sin they are "reserved unto judgment", 2Pet. 2:4, and are "in prison", 1Pet. 3:19.
• Their progeny, called Nephilim (translated "giants"), were monsters of iniquity; and, being superhuman in size and character, had to be destroyed (see Ap. 25). This was the one and only object of the Flood.
• Only Noah and his family had preserved their pedigree pure from Adam (Gen. 6:9, see note). All the rest had become "corrupt" (shachath) destroyed [as Adamites]. the only remedy was to destroy it (de facto), as it had become destroyed (de jure). (It is the same word in v. 17 as in vv. 11, 12.) See further under Ap. 25 on the Nephilim.

This irruption of fallen angels was Satan's first attempt to prevent the coming of the Seed of the woman foretold in gen. 3:15. If this could be accomplished, God's Word would have failed, and his own doom would be averted.
As soon as it was made known that the Seed of the woman was to come through ABRAHAM, there must have been another irruption, as recorded in Gen. 6:4, "and also after that" (i.e. after the days of Noah, more than 500 years after the first irruption). The aim of the enemy was to occupy Canaan in advance of Abraham, and so to contest its occupation by his seed. For, when Abraham entered Canaan, we read (Gen. 12:6) "the Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land."
In the same chapter (Gen. 12:10-20) we see Satan's next attempt to interfere with Abraham's seed, and frustrate the purpose of God that it should be in "Isaac". This attempt was repeated in 20:1-18.
This great conflict may be seen throughout the Bible, and it forms a great and important subject of Biblical study. In each case the human instrument had his own personal interest to serve, while Satan had his own great object in view. Hence God had, in each case, to interfere and avert the evil and the danger, of which his servants and people were wholly ignorant. The following assaults of the great Enemy stand out prominently :--

• The destruction of the chosen family by famine, Gen. 50:20.
• The destruction of the male line in Israel, Ex. 1:10, 15, &c. Cp. Ex. 2:5. Heb. 11:23.
• The destruction of the whole nation in Pharaoh's pursuit, Ex. 14.
• After David's line was singled out (2Sam. 7), that was the next selected for assault. Satan's first assault was in the union of Jehoram and Athaliah by Jehoshaphat, notwithstanding 2Chron. 17:1. Jehoram killed off all his brothers (2Chron. 21:4).
• The Arabians slew all his children, except Ahaziah (2Chron. 21:17; 22:1).
• When Ahaziah died, Athaliah killed "all the seed royal" (2Chron. 22:10). the babe Joash alone was rescued; and, for six years, the faithfulness of Jehovah's word was at stake (2Chron. 23:3).
• Hezekiah was childless, when a double assault was made by the King of Assyria and the King of Terrors (Isa. 36:1; 38:1). God's faithfulness was appealed to and relied on (Ps. 136).
• In Captivity, Haman was used to attempt the destruction of the whole nation (Est. 3:6, 12, 13. Cp. 6:1).
• Joseph's fear was worked on (Matt. 1:18-20). Notwithstanding the fact that he was "a just man", and kept the Law, he did not wish to have Mary stoned to death (Deut. 24:1); hence Joseph determined to divorce her. But God intervened : "Fear not".
• Herod sought the young Child's life (Matt. 2).
• At the Temptation, "Cast Thyself down" was Satan's temptation.
• At Nazareth, again (Luke 4), there was another attempt to cast Him down and destroy Him.
• The two storms on the Lake were other attempts.
• At length the cross was reached, and the sepulcher closed; the watch set; and the stone sealed. But "God raised Him from the dead." And now, like another Joash, He is seated and expecting (Heb. 10:12, 13), hidden in the house of God on high; and the members of "the one body" are hidden there "in Him" (Col. 3:1-3), like another Jehoshaba; and going forth to witness of His coming, like another Jehoiada (2Chron. 23:3).

The irruption of "the fallen angels" ("sons of God") was the first attempt; and was directed against the whole human race.

• When Abraham was called, then he and his seed were attacked.
• When David was enthroned, then the royal line were attacked.
• And when "the Seed of the woman" Himself came, then the storm burst upon Him.

(*1) The word "offspring" in Acts 17:28 is quite different. It is genos, which means merely kin or kind, our genus as being originated by God.
(*2) In Hos. 1:10, it is not beni-ha-Elohim, as here, but beni-el-chai.

 

[n2thelight]

25. THE NEPHILIM, OR "GIANTS"
Of GEN. 6, &c.


The progeny of the fallen angels with the daughters of Adam (see notes on Gen. 6, and Ap. 23) are called in Gen. 6, Ne-phil-im, which means fallen ones (from naphal, to fall). What these beings were can be gathered only from Scripture. They were evidently great in size, as well as great in wickedness. They were superhuman, abnormal beings; and their destruction was necessary for the preservation of the human race, and for the faithfulness of Jehovah's Word (Gen. 3:15).


This was why the Flood was brought "upon the world of the ungodly" (2Pet. 2:5) as prophesied by Enoch (Jude 14).
But we read of the Nephilim again in Num. 13:33 : "there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, which come of the Nephilim". How, it may be asked, could this be, if they were all destroyed in the Flood? The answer is contained in Gen. 6:4, where we read : "There were Nephilim in the earth in those days (i.e. in the days of Noah); and also AFTER THAT, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became [the] mighty men (Heb. gibbor, the heroes) which were of old, men of renown" (lit. men of the name, i.e. who got a name and were renowned for their ungodliness).

So that "after that", i.e. after the Flood, there was a second irruption of these fallen angels, evidently smaller in number and more limited in area, for they were for the most part confined to Canaan, and were in fact known as "the nations of Canaan". It was for the destruction of these, that the sword of Israel was necessary, as the Flood had been before.
As to the date of this second irruption, it was evidently soon after it became known that the seed was to come through Abraham; for, when he came out from Haran (Gen. 12:6) and entered Canaan, the significant fact is stated : "The Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land." And in Gen. 14:5 they were already known as "Raphain" and Emim", and had established themselves at Asteroth Karnaim and Shaven Kiriathaim.
In ch. 15:18-21 they are enumerated and named among Canaanite Peoples : "Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims, and the Amorites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites" (Gen. 15:19-21; cp. Ex. 3:8, 17; 23:23. Deut. 7; 20:17. Josh. 12:8).

These were to be cut off, and driven out, and utterly destroyed (Deut. 20:17. Josh. 3:10). But Israel failed in this (Josh. 13:13; 15:63; 16:10; 17:18. Judg. 1:19, 20, 28, 29, 30-36; 2:1-5; 3:1-7); and we known not how many got away to other countries to escape the general destruction. If this were recognized it would go far to solve many problems connected with Anthropology.

As to their other names, they were called Anakim, from on Anak which came of the Nephilim (Num. 13:23), and Rephaim, from Rapha, another notable one among them. From Deut. 2:10, they were known by some as Emim, and Horim, and Zamzummim (v. 20, 21) and Avim, &c.
As Rephaim they were well known, and are often mentioned : but, unfortunately, instead of this, their proper name, being preserved, it is variously translated as "dead", "deceased", or "giants". These Rephaim are to have no resurrection. This fact is stated in Isa. 26:14 (where the proper name is rendered "deceased," and v. 19, where it is rendered "the dead"). It is rendered "dead" seven times (Job 26:5. Ps. 88:10. Prov. 2:18; 9:18; 21:16. Isa. 14:8; 26:19). It is rendered "deceased" in Isa. 26:14.

It is retained as a proper name "Rephaim" ten times (two being in the margin). Gen. 14:5; 15:20. Josh. 12:15 (marg.). 2Sam. 5:18, 22; 23:13.& b31 nbsp; 1Chron. 11:15; 14:9; 20:4 (marg.). Isa. 17:5. In all other places it is rendered "giants", Gen. 6:4; Num. 23:33, where it is Nephilim; and Job 16:14, where it is gibbor (Ap. 14. iv). By reading all these passages the Bible student may know all that can be known about these beings.

It is certain that the second irruption took place before Gen. 14, for there the Rephaim were mixed up with the five nations or peoples, which included Sodom and Gomorrha, and were defeated by the four kings under Chedorlaomer. Their principal locality was evidently "Ashtaroth Karnaim"; while the Emim were in the plain of Kiriathaim (Gen. 14:5).

Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans. Anak's father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron (Gen. 35:27. Josh. 15:13; 21:11); and this Palestine branch of the Anakim was not called Arbahim after him, but Anakim after Anak. They were great, mighty, and tall (Deut. 2:10, 11, 21, 22, 23; 9:2), evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear (Num. 13:33). Og king of Bashan is described in Deut. 3:11.

Their strength is seen in "the giant cities of Bashan" to-day; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem. Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by the Egyptian Pharoahs of the nineteenth dynasty. See note on Num. 13:22.
If these Nephilim, and their branch of Rephaim, were associated with Egypt, we have an explanation of the problem which has for ages perplexed all engineers, as to how those huge stones and monuments were brought together. Why not in Egypt as well as in "the giant cities of Bashan" which exist, as such, to this day?

Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the "men of renown," the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology. That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories, and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the "heroes" of Gen. 6:4. The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks.
Thus the Babylonian "Creation Tablets", the Egyptian "Book of the dead", the Greek mythology, and heathen Cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away.

 

[CryOfALion]

Plenty of scripture to know what's being said........

23. "THE SONS OF GOD" IN GEN. 6:2, 4.


It is only by the Divine specific act of creation that any created being can be called "a son of God". For that which is "born of the flesh is flesh". God is spirit, and that which is "born of the Spirit is spirit" (John 3:6). Hence Adam is called a "son of God" in Luke 3:38. Those "in Christ" having "the new nature" which is by the direct creation of God (2Cor. 5:17. Eph. 2:10) can be, and are called "sons of God" (John 1:13. Rom. 8:14, 15. 1John 3:1). (*1)
This is why angels are called "sons of God" in every other place where the expression is used in the Old Testament. Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7. Ps. 29:1; 89:6. Dan. 3:25 (no art.). (*2) We have no authority or right to take the expression in Gen. 6:2, 4 in any other sense. Moreover, in Gen. 6:2 the Sept. renders it "angels". Angels are called "spirits" (Ps. 104:4. Heb. 1:7, 14), for spirits are created by God.

That there was a fall of the angels is certain from Jude 6.

• The nature of their fall is clearly stated in the same verse. They left their own oiketerion. This word occurs only in 2Cor. 5:2 and Jude 6, where it is used of the spiritual (or resurrection) body.
• The nature of their sin is stated to be "in like manner" to that of the subsequent sins of Sodom and Gomorrha, Jude 7.
• The time of their fall is given as having taken place "in the days of Noah" (1Pet. 3:20. 2Pet. 2:7), though there may have been a prior fall which caused the end of "the world that then was" (Gen. 1:1, 2. 2Pet. 3:6).
• For this sin they are "reserved unto judgment", 2Pet. 2:4, and are "in prison", 1Pet. 3:19.
• Their progeny, called Nephilim (translated "giants"), were monsters of iniquity; and, being superhuman in size and character, had to be destroyed (see Ap. 25). This was the one and only object of the Flood.
• Only Noah and his family had preserved their pedigree pure from Adam (Gen. 6:9, see note). All the rest had become "corrupt" (shachath) destroyed [as Adamites]. the only remedy was to destroy it (de facto), as it had become destroyed (de jure). (It is the same word in v. 17 as in vv. 11, 12.) See further under Ap. 25 on the Nephilim.

This irruption of fallen angels was Satan's first attempt to prevent the coming of the Seed of the woman foretold in gen. 3:15. If this could be accomplished, God's Word would have failed, and his own doom would be averted.
As soon as it was made known that the Seed of the woman was to come through ABRAHAM, there must have been another irruption, as recorded in Gen. 6:4, "and also after that" (i.e. after the days of Noah, more than 500 years after the first irruption). The aim of the enemy was to occupy Canaan in advance of Abraham, and so to contest its occupation by his seed. For, when Abraham entered Canaan, we read (Gen. 12:6) "the Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land."
In the same chapter (Gen. 12:10-20) we see Satan's next attempt to interfere with Abraham's seed, and frustrate the purpose of God that it should be in "Isaac". This attempt was repeated in 20:1-18.
This great conflict may be seen throughout the Bible, and it forms a great and important subject of Biblical study. In each case the human instrument had his own personal interest to serve, while Satan had his own great object in view. Hence God had, in each case, to interfere and avert the evil and the danger, of which his servants and people were wholly ignorant. The following assaults of the great Enemy stand out prominently :--

• The destruction of the chosen family by famine, Gen. 50:20.
• The destruction of the male line in Israel, Ex. 1:10, 15, &c. Cp. Ex. 2:5. Heb. 11:23.
• The destruction of the whole nation in Pharaoh's pursuit, Ex. 14.
• After David's line was singled out (2Sam. 7), that was the next selected for assault. Satan's first assault was in the union of Jehoram and Athaliah by Jehoshaphat, notwithstanding 2Chron. 17:1. Jehoram killed off all his brothers (2Chron. 21:4).
• The Arabians slew all his children, except Ahaziah (2Chron. 21:17; 22:1).
• When Ahaziah died, Athaliah killed "all the seed royal" (2Chron. 22:10). the babe Joash alone was rescued; and, for six years, the faithfulness of Jehovah's word was at stake (2Chron. 23:3).
• Hezekiah was childless, when a double assault was made by the King of Assyria and the King of Terrors (Isa. 36:1; 38:1). God's faithfulness was appealed to and relied on (Ps. 136).
• In Captivity, Haman was used to attempt the destruction of the whole nation (Est. 3:6, 12, 13. Cp. 6:1).
• Joseph's fear was worked on (Matt. 1:18-20). Notwithstanding the fact that he was "a just man", and kept the Law, he did not wish to have Mary stoned to death (Deut. 24:1); hence Joseph determined to divorce her. But God intervened : "Fear not".
• Herod sought the young Child's life (Matt. 2).
• At the Temptation, "Cast Thyself down" was Satan's temptation.
• At Nazareth, again (Luke 4), there was another attempt to cast Him down and destroy Him.
• The two storms on the Lake were other attempts.
• At length the cross was reached, and the sepulcher closed; the watch set; and the stone sealed. But "God raised Him from the dead." And now, like another Joash, He is seated and expecting (Heb. 10:12, 13), hidden in the house of God on high; and the members of "the one body" are hidden there "in Him" (Col. 3:1-3), like another Jehoshaba; and going forth to witness of His coming, like another Jehoiada (2Chron. 23:3).

The irruption of "the fallen angels" ("sons of God") was the first attempt; and was directed against the whole human race.

• When Abraham was called, then he and his seed were attacked.
• When David was enthroned, then the royal line were attacked.
• And when "the Seed of the woman" Himself came, then the storm burst upon Him.

(*1) The word "offspring" in Acts 17:28 is quite different. It is genos, which means merely kin or kind, our genus as being originated by God.
(*2) In Hos. 1:10, it is not beni-ha-Elohim, as here, but beni-el-chai.

25. THE NEPHILIM, OR "GIANTS"
Of GEN. 6, &c.


The progeny of the fallen angels with the daughters of Adam (see notes on Gen. 6, and Ap. 23) are called in Gen. 6, Ne-phil-im, which means fallen ones (from naphal, to fall). What these beings were can be gathered only from Scripture. They were evidently great in size, as well as great in wickedness. They were superhuman, abnormal beings; and their destruction was necessary for the preservation of the human race, and for the faithfulness of Jehovah's Word (Gen. 3:15).


This was why the Flood was brought "upon the world of the ungodly" (2Pet. 2:5) as prophesied by Enoch (Jude 14).
But we read of the Nephilim again in Num. 13:33 : "there we saw the Nephilim, the sons of Anak, which come of the Nephilim". How, it may be asked, could this be, if they were all destroyed in the Flood? The answer is contained in Gen. 6:4, where we read : "There were Nephilim in the earth in those days (i.e. in the days of Noah); and also AFTER THAT, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became [the] mighty men (Heb. gibbor, the heroes) which were of old, men of renown" (lit. men of the name, i.e. who got a name and were renowned for their ungodliness).

So that "after that", i.e. after the Flood, there was a second irruption of these fallen angels, evidently smaller in number and more limited in area, for they were for the most part confined to Canaan, and were in fact known as "the nations of Canaan". It was for the destruction of these, that the sword of Israel was necessary, as the Flood had been before.
As to the date of this second irruption, it was evidently soon after it became known that the seed was to come through Abraham; for, when he came out from Haran (Gen. 12:6) and entered Canaan, the significant fact is stated : "The Canaanite was then (i.e. already) in the land." And in Gen. 14:5 they were already known as "Raphain" and Emim", and had established themselves at Asteroth Karnaim and Shaven Kiriathaim.
In ch. 15:18-21 they are enumerated and named among Canaanite Peoples : "Kenites, and the Kenizzites, and the Kadmonites, and the Hittites, and the Perizzites, and the Rephaims, and the Amorites, and the Girgashites, and the Jebusites" (Gen. 15:19-21; cp. Ex. 3:8, 17; 23:23. Deut. 7; 20:17. Josh. 12:8).

These were to be cut off, and driven out, and utterly destroyed (Deut. 20:17. Josh. 3:10). But Israel failed in this (Josh. 13:13; 15:63; 16:10; 17:18. Judg. 1:19, 20, 28, 29, 30-36; 2:1-5; 3:1-7); and we known not how many got away to other countries to escape the general destruction. If this were recognized it would go far to solve many problems connected with Anthropology.

As to their other names, they were called Anakim, from on Anak which came of the Nephilim (Num. 13:23), and Rephaim, from Rapha, another notable one among them. From Deut. 2:10, they were known by some as Emim, and Horim, and Zamzummim (v. 20, 21) and Avim, &c.
As Rephaim they were well known, and are often mentioned : but, unfortunately, instead of this, their proper name, being preserved, it is variously translated as "dead", "deceased", or "giants". These Rephaim are to have no resurrection. This fact is stated in Isa. 26:14 (where the proper name is rendered "deceased," and v. 19, where it is rendered "the dead"). It is rendered "dead" seven times (Job 26:5. Ps. 88:10. Prov. 2:18; 9:18; 21:16. Isa. 14:8; 26:19). It is rendered "deceased" in Isa. 26:14.

It is retained as a proper name "Rephaim" ten times (two being in the margin). Gen. 14:5; 15:20. Josh. 12:15 (marg.). 2Sam. 5:18, 22; 23:13.& b31 nbsp; 1Chron. 11:15; 14:9; 20:4 (marg.). Isa. 17:5. In all other places it is rendered "giants", Gen. 6:4; Num. 23:33, where it is Nephilim; and Job 16:14, where it is gibbor (Ap. 14. iv). By reading all these passages the Bible student may know all that can be known about these beings.

It is certain that the second irruption took place before Gen. 14, for there the Rephaim were mixed up with the five nations or peoples, which included Sodom and Gomorrha, and were defeated by the four kings under Chedorlaomer. Their principal locality was evidently "Ashtaroth Karnaim"; while the Emim were in the plain of Kiriathaim (Gen. 14:5).

Anak was a noted descendant of the Nephilim; and Rapha was another, giving their names respectively to different clans. Anak's father was Arba, the original builder of Hebron (Gen. 35:27. Josh. 15:13; 21:11); and this Palestine branch of the Anakim was not called Arbahim after him, but Anakim after Anak. They were great, mighty, and tall (Deut. 2:10, 11, 21, 22, 23; 9:2), evidently inspiring the ten spies with great fear (Num. 13:33). Og king of Bashan is described in Deut. 3:11.

Their strength is seen in "the giant cities of Bashan" to-day; and we know not how far they may have been utilized by Egypt in the construction of buildings, which is still an unsolved problem. Arba was rebuilt by the Khabiri or confederates seven years before Zoan was built by the Egyptian Pharoahs of the nineteenth dynasty. See note on Num. 13:22.
If these Nephilim, and their branch of Rephaim, were associated with Egypt, we have an explanation of the problem which has for ages perplexed all engineers, as to how those huge stones and monuments were brought together. Why not in Egypt as well as in "the giant cities of Bashan" which exist, as such, to this day?

Moreover, we have in these mighty men, the "men of renown," the explanation of the origin of the Greek mythology. That mythology was no mere invention of the human brain, but it grew out of the traditions, and memories, and legends of the doings of that mighty race of beings; and was gradually evolved out of the "heroes" of Gen. 6:4. The fact that they were supernatural in their origin formed an easy step to their being regarded as the demi-gods of the Greeks.
Thus the Babylonian "Creation Tablets", the Egyptian "Book of the dead", the Greek mythology, and heathen Cosmogonies, which by some are set on an equality with Scripture, or by others adduced in support of it, are all the corruption and perversion of primitive truths, distorted in proportion as their origin was forgotten, and their memories faded away.

 

[Riberra]

I agree with Ebed on this, I don't believe theirs enough scripture to clarify exactly what and/or created those "giants" wether Angels interbreeding or a term for a "group" of people. It's one of the passages that can lead to many ideas, good and far fetched.

The Bible talk about angels who sinned.
2 Peter 2:4
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment;

Jude 1:6 (KJV)
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

 

[brian57]

It seems that these giants or nephilim were also capable of growing fruit larger than normal , and we see this in Numbers 13:23

Then they came to the Valley of Eshcol, and there cut down a branch with one cluster of grapes; they carried it between two of them on a pole. They also brought some of the pomegranates and figs.
The place was called the Valley of Eshcol, because of the cluster which the men of Israel cut down there.


Please take note of how God narrows the focus here to get our attention on this subject , he not only tells us that they named the place the valley of Eshcol (valley of grapes) not because there are plenty of grapes growing here but because of the cluster that they cut down , and as we focus on that cluster of grapes we find it takes two men with a pole to carry them. Now if you went shopping tomorrow and bought yourself a cluster of grapes , that cluster would fit in your hand.
Some have suggested that the nephilim might have been involved in genetic engineering or something similar to be able to grow food this big. When they report back to moses they tell him that the land swallows its inhabitants , meaning that every thing here is big.

I personally find this type of thing very interesting especially when it has something to do with the nephilim.

 

[Postvieww]

I agree with Ebed on this, I don't believe theirs enough scripture to clarify exactly what and/or created those "giants" wether Angels interbreeding or a term for a "group" of people. It's one of the passages that can lead to many ideas, good and far fetched. Desire and curiosity make me want to understand it properly, though the lack of clarity it seems better to not read into it and trust moses and david killed the last of them Josh 13:12; 2 Sam 21:22.

I believe there is far too much scripture on this subject to ignore.

Though the only issue thats kept me from going with the ideal that they are fallen angels was why did they take wives, their already "against" God, why honor the commandment of not committing adultery (in other words why get married, just fornicate). Lest not forget also it is God who opens and closes wombs- sarah, Rachel,Leah, Elizabeth, Mary: so if it was "fallen angel" genetic inheritance then God himself allowed it and coded it. As well as its God who creates life and allows one to live- deuteronomy 8:3 matt 4:4.

I just want to address a couple of points in your post n2thelight and CryOfALion covered most of it thoroughly. “then God himself allowed it and coded it” I believe that God allowed it only in the fact that he did not prevent it from happening. Did God allow the holocaust? He did not sanction or cause it to happen but he does not intervene in or prevent many acts of evil. We are still in a fallen world and until He comes and restores this creation many unholy and evil events will continue to take place.

So why would God allow the angels He's thrown out to marry and procreate knowing their going to G just as evil and insubordinate. One would think then lucifer himself had billions of offspring just to enlarge his "army" and help his rebellion against our God and Lord. To me it seems more fitting of a term used for a sect of people purposely and vigorously serving evil- I.e the myans. Then again I am comfortable knowing that this portion of scripture will remain an enigma to me until I'm face to face with our Lord and He reveals all to us.

“ One would think then lucifer himself had billions of offspring just to enlarge his "army" and help his rebellion against our God and Lord.” I do not believe satan was simply tring to increase his numbers with this plan. I’m convinced its purpose was a failed attempt to corrupt the “seed of woman” to prevent the Savior of the world from being born.


As for pharaohs occultists- power can just G given, it does not need to come from genetics. Moses was given the same ability to create a serpent, part the Red Sea, have and remove leprosy. Rev 13:2 the dragon gives the beast his power, throne and great authority- no mentioning of needing a genetic inheritance. I think the "transfer" is similar to what satan tempted our Lord with as well (wether or not he was being honest) matt 4:8, no need for genetics just a sworn oath or acceptance to serve the wrong master.

Thanks for your opinions on this thread. God Bless

 

[Postvieww]

Gen.6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,

2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.

3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.

4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.

In other references in the Old Testament “ the sons of God” refer to angels, why should we believe “the sons of God in Genesis 6 would be different?

Job 1: 6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

Job 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the Lord.

Job38: 7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

In Gen 19:1-5 two angels came to Lot’s house, and the men of Sodom desired to have sex with the angels. While this did not happen Lot did not think it was out of the realm of possibility. He offered is daughters to the men as a substitute. I am not suggesting that angels of God would engage in such a thing, but I am suggesting that fallen angels did in Genesis 6.

Genesis 19:1 And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground;

2 And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.

3 And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.

4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.

 

[Postvieww]

Jude 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

Could the reference to “ fornication, and going after strange flesh” refer to the” daughters of men” in Gen 6:2?

2 Peter 2:4
4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Could the reference to “the angels that sinned” be the same angels of Jude 6?


1 Corin. 11: 9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.

The context of this passage is clearly a reference to a covering on the woman’s head, see verses 5 & 6 of 1 Corin.11. How does that relate to the angels? Could it just be that it might have to do with how some of the fallen angels might relate to those women? The uncovered woman dishonors her head ( the man who has authority over her)1 Corin. 11:5. Gen. 6: 2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. Does anyone have another explination for this passage?


Matt.22: 30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

Often used scripture to say angels are not capable of sex with women. Nowhere in this text is that stated. What it does say is that “angels of God in heaven” “neither marry, nor are given in marriage”.
This passage says nothing about fallen angels or their ability engage in sex with women.


Isaiah 26: 14 They are dead, they shall not live; they are deceased, they shall not rise: therefore hast thou visited and destroyed them, and made all their memory to perish.

Many think this passage refers to the giants created by the union of fallen angels with the daughters of men. While this is not clearly stated in the text, what is certain is that this passage does not refer to the human race. Compare to scriptures below.

Dan. 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
John 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Whoever Isaiah refers to here “shall not rise”. If not the giants created by the unholy union, then who?

Micah 3:1 And I said, Hear, I pray you, O heads of Jacob, and ye princes of the house of Israel; Is it not for you to know judgment?

2 Who hate the good, and love the evil; who pluck off their skin from off them, and their flesh from off their bones;

3 Who also eat the flesh of my people, and flay their skin from off them; and they break their bones, and chop them in pieces, as for the pot, and as flesh within the caldron.

Is it just possible this passage refers to the giants? Who else in all of scripture has done such a deed?

 

[KrAZeD]

I just want to address a couple of points in your post n2thelight and CryOfALion covered most of it thoroughly. “then God himself allowed it and coded it” I believe that God allowed it only in the fact that he did not prevent it from happening. Did God allow the holocaust? He did not sanction or cause it to happen but he does not intervene in or prevent many acts of evil. We are still in a fallen world and until He comes and restores this creation many unholy and evil events will continue to take place.

We agree that evil/trials are allowed by God at select times, but only because He will use it for the greater good later. The point I was driving at was mainly God has already cast Angels out into darkness because they sinned in heaven. Looking at the story of Job or the time Peter was warned that satan wanted him we can see that the fallen were restricted with what they could do and how. For the allowance of angels to procreate and God to allow the conception it raises the conundrum of why, God has already deemed them unworthy of heavenly things and has reserved/created Hell for them- matt 25:41. Why allow them the privileges and benefits of marriage? Why are these supposed "angels" whom already rebelled once following the commandment of marriage, and being blessed with offspring.

I do not believe satan was simply tring to increase his numbers with this plan. I’m convinced its purpose was a failed attempt to corrupt the “seed of woman” to prevent the Savior of the world from being born.

can't disagree against him attempting to corrupt the entire world and the failed attempt of allowing a savior/redeemer into it.

In other references in the Old Testament “ the sons of God” refer to angels, why should we believe “the sons of God in Genesis 6 would be different?

If one were to only look in the Old Testament and rely on the Old Testament usage/understanding you would have a great point. While it is accurate to take notice of how a word or phrase is used here and then their in scripture to G able to best understand passages, their are times when it's not always applicable and equally interchangeable.

While our Lord is THE SON of GOD, because of the preconceived notion from that era of Jews (and prior) that presumed comment was thought blasphemy because only Angels or God could get understood through that title. However as Jesus clarified - 34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Jesus iterated that it was in the law and scripture that God himself had declared men gods and them children of the Most High- sons(children) of God(Most High)
the John 10 quote coming from psalms 82:6.

In that same psalm we see that God himself is to judge among the gods, is that only fallen angels or men? We see that a fallen prince is also mentioned but not called a son of god- yet we should agree this prince in question is lucifer who was an angel at one time, and at one time a son of God.

We are also told that adam himself was a son of God luke 3:38. If adam were considered a son of God and men were told in the Old Testament psalm they were sons of God- how is it ONLY angels are perceived to G the only ones able to hold that title?

John 12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

romans 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God

Those verses tend to show that our spirit is what helps distinguish us being sons of God or sons of man. If it's the spirit that makes that defining marker then one could ponder that back in abrahams days of meeting Melchizedek, their were men whom were with the spirit of God making them sons of God. An if their were others who worked in that type of "priesthood" like Melchizedek (obviously falling short) then they could have loosly carried that title and been the reference to the gen 6 after those days reference, if I recall methuselah was thought to also G part of a "special priesthood" though I can't remember exactly where I remember reading that.

Like I first said, I really do not see enough clarity to dismiss the aspect of gen 6 referring to men nor angels as the "sons of God". Theirs way to many good points for both sides of the debate, and gratefully non impacting on our salvation.

 

[sojourner4Christ]

Like I first said, I really do not see enough clarity to dismiss the aspect of gen 6 referring to men nor angels as the "sons of God". Theirs way to many good points for both sides of the debate, and gratefully non impacting on our salvation.

Recall that "they are not all Israel which are of Israel" (Romans 9:6). Those that have followed God into the truth of salvation in his only begotten son Jesus Christ are no longer Jews or Gentiles -- they are now the sons of God. Those sons are not in a separate construct called the "church" or the "bride" or some other term lifted out of the context of scripture. They are the Remnant of Israel -- a spiritual body of believers that "doeth truth [and] cometh to the light, that his deeds may be manifest, that they are wrought in God." (John 3:21).

Ephesians tells us "all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light; for whatsoever doth make manifest is light." (Ephesians 5:13) This profound truth is plainly telling the reader that it is the increasing of the light, manifested in a vessel of honour, that is the catalyst for the spiritual clash that is steadily increasing in severity.

The incredible truth here is that "the sons of God" are seen "in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world..." (Philippians 2:15) As that light shines into the darkness, the darkness comprehends it not; and as the world continues to deteriorate into evil, the "sons of God" continue the process of the externalization of the powerful Spirit of God that is growing in us.

Writing early in the first century, the Apostle Paul brings the study full circle in the book of Romans. In a futurist context, we learn that "the whole creation groaneth and travaileth together in pain until now" (Romans 8:22). This verse poignantly speaks of how all aspects of creation are under the same curse of sin.

Paul also articulates the great hope that at some point this physical bondage will be destroyed. He tells us that before that release occurs, "the earnest expectation of the creature [creation] waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God" (Romans 8:19). This statement is pointing to a time when the "sons of God" will lead the entire creation to a state of release from the spiritual decay that presently plagues the world. This "manifestation" will only occur in its fullness when Jesus Christ returns.

The Preterist pretenders would say this has already occurred, yet it is clear the creation is still in an abominable condition. The Rapturists would say this "manifestation" occurs at the so-called "rapture" -- but their twisted version still has a world that "groaneth and travaileth" in the tribulation after they've managed their unscriptural evacuation.

The truth is very straightforward, and in the end times it will occur very much like it did in the time of Christ. As Jesus Christ confronted the corrupted priesthood, they became defensive of their position and standing, and progressively increased their opposition to him. The same thing occurred in the lives of the Apostles as the power of God increased exponentially in the face of the opposition they encountered. Remember, "that which maketh manifest is light." The first century Christians ended up ministering outside of the "church" and, as they began to move supernaturally, and they loved not their lives unto the death.

The Tribulation Saints will do the same. As the Spirit of God grows in us, the darkness reacts to it. It is the light which causes the darkness to manifest itself -- even when the vessel that hosts it is posing as a minister of righteousness. The wickedness in Christianity Incorporated will be exposed for all to see.

Look around you. Believing themselves to be in favor with God, the "Christian" leadership is already manifesting which spirit actually empowers them. That spirit will ultimately drive the corporate church to work within the prevailing political order to facilitate the destruction of those that tell the truth.

As the world deteriorates to unheard of levels of spiritual desolation, the power that works in Jesus Christ as the head of the church will be manifested in the lives of the Remnant, and the world will hate us for it. But Jesus Christ sustains us when he says "In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world." (John 16:33).

 

[n2thelight]

The Bible talk about angels who sinned.
2 Peter 2:4
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment;

Jude 1:6 (KJV)
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

That sums it up right there,or should anyway.....They left what and came where ...........

 

[sojourner4Christ]

From the beginning, the very idea of fallen angels actually breeding with "the daughters of men," and producing offspring is so incredibly controversial that this subject is almost always ignored by teachers and pastors -- and yet The Holy Spirit does not give us verses in the Bible that are unimportant. In typical liberal fashion, over the centuries, various teachers and scholars have sought to turn the Nephilim into the descendants of Cain. Conversely, the sons of God are usually exegeted as the descendants of Seth -- the surviving good son of Adam. However, this perspective did not show up until much later in the Christian era. In the New Testament era, it was widely known that the angels had once bred with the "daughters of men."

It's interesting that some believers don't stumble at the prospect of believing that people once lived to be 900 years old, or of a giant flood that drowned the entire world except for one family in a big boat; yet those same believers sometimes have difficulty in grasping the implications of the verses concerning the Nephilim.

To understand the incredible predicament we are currently caught in, it will be useful to go back to the beginning of the story. The Bible tells us that from the ancient times of man's history, he was not alone on the planet. In the nine generations before the great flood of Noah, "when men began to multiply on the face of the earth... the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose." (Gen 6:1, 2)

These "sons of God" (the Hebrew b'nai elohim) were the fallen angels associated with Satan. In the book of Job, we see "there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also along them." (Job 1:6) Once again, in every instance in the Old Testament in which we find the phrase the "sons of God," it always refers to the angelic beings that were in the company of Satan. ((Job 1:6; 2:1; 38:7)

It is evident that there is a special class of fallen angels that committed a crime that was so thoroughly evil, so repugnant to God, that he bound them in "chains" in the "darkness," even before the general judgment of "everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels." (Mat 25:41) Jude writes concerning these "angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation" and how God "hath reserved [them] in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day." (Jude 1:6)

That sums it up right there,or should anyway.....They left what and came where ...........

This binding in "chains" is a past tense judgment that indicates an unspecified portion of the fallen angels committed such a heinous sin that God felt compelled to imprison them "before the time." (Mat 8:29) This could only refer to the ungodly mixing of the two branches of creation -- angels and the daughters of men..

The Apostle Peter also references this ancient occurrence detailing how "God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment..." (2 Peter 2:4)

The scriptures clearly show that not all the angels that fell from heaven were bound, for we find many of them present on the earth during the current age. As a case in point, when Jesus encounters the Gadarene madman, we learn much about the fallen spirits that sometimes possess men. In this rather chilling example of demonic possession, Jesus "... asked him what is thy name? And he answered, saying, my name is Legion: for we are many." (Mark 5:9)

According to Webster's Third New International Dictionary, a legion was "the principle unit of the Roman army comprising at first 3000 but later 5000 to 6000 foot soldiers with a complement of cavalry." (Webster's Third New International Dictionary, 1976, G & C Merriam Co., Vol. II, Legion) This means there were most likely several thousand devils inhabiting this one individual! It would seem that these devils were not among those that bred with human women, for the spiritual entities in this episode were free upon the earth and had taken control of this one unfortunate man.

In another account of this same case of demonic possession, the Devils "... besought him that he would not command them to go out into the deep." (Luke 8:31) The scriptural tale goes on to tell that...

"... And there was there an herd of many swine feeding on the mountain: and they besought him that he would suffer them to enter into them. And he suffered them. Then went the devils out of the man, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the lake, and were choked." (Luke 8:32, 33)

In still another account of possession, when the devils were confronted by Jesus, they asked him "art thou come hither to torment us before the time?" (Mat 8:29)

In these informative exchanges, we learn that there is a specified time these evil entities expect to be "tormented" with their angelic associates that have already been judged. We also see that they do not want to be cast "into the deep." (Luke 8:31)

It's also clear that these devils prefer to have some form of corporeal body as they begged to be allowed to possess the bodies of the swine rather than be cast out into the deep. The deep is precisely where the Nephilim themselves are currently bound.

Which brings us to the giants, the offspring, of the Nephilim...

 

[nephilimiyr]

That sums it up right there,or should anyway.....They left what and came where ...........

It was these Jude passages, and the Peter 2 passages, that summed it up for me. People always ask for further biblical references, but when you give them further more clearer biblical reference they will still disagree. They just don't want to let go of their biblical paradigm belief, which is understandable to me. I've been debating this subect for a long time and at peace with people not agreeing with me.

The days of the nephilim are at an end and I think they will never come again. I didn't always believe that but I do now. Jesus' reference of the days of Noah wasn't saying the nephilim will be back but the evil that they had and did will be back. We've seen throughout history that normal man is more than capable of the same evil that the nephilim had. If you have doubts on that, visit the old death camps in Eastern Europe. Watch the Muslim extremists behead people and nail christains to the cross. We just saw a small group of them slaughter hundreds of inocent children in a school. That is the evil of the nephilim, not done by them, but being done by others.