Mars Hill, Driscoll and so on

[Apologetic_Warrior]

Driscoll definitely has many falls, but if people want to shed the light on problems like this, let them start with Joel Osteen, Kenneth Copeland, Fred Price, Creflo Dollar just to start off with.

Exactly, not a fan of Driscoll either, not a continualist, but neither do I agree with how some have handled the failings the shortcomings, let's even go so far as to call them sins, of Driscoll. The difference between Driscoll and many of us is, his celebrity status his every sin is strained under a public microscope. So our sins are better hidden, more easily swept under the rug, and stuffed into the closet. This is not to excuse anything, it's more of a general exhortation to do self-examination before "witch hunting". I honestly wish these kind of topics would just die and fizzle, as they contribute nothing positive towards bringing anyone any closer to the truth to Christ. Oh but we're warning our brothers...I've not met many Calvinists who were followers of men. The Calvinists I know, would be better labeled Biblicists, and ever remembering the Solas of the Reformation. Do we believe it's possible to deceive the elect? It's not, not to the extent of apostatizing. Mark Driscoll is just another man, trying hard to be culturally relevant, trying hard to speak and write in the language of people during this time, and in the process making many mistakes. There probably is more going on behind the scenes, but this is the case for most anyone. This may be more my personal opinion, but I have felt for some time, that there is a number of people who hate Driscoll simply because of differences, and it is hate that feeds the motivation to catch the man sinning catch him contradicting himself, catch his inconsistency, even try and catch him blatantly sinning. To many people he does a fine job of that himself without any need of being caught, but even so, even if he were the enemy, what are we to do, even if he strikes us on the right cheek, what are we called to do? Hate him I guess, that seem to be what passes for the brotherly Christian response these days never mind Scripture.

P.S. - GQCHRIS this post isn't for you, I am not sure who it's for, but someone might need to hear my foolish ranting.

 

[cubanito]

Certainly there are people whose motivation for Driscoll bashing is evil. Yet there are many who continue to support a man who shows every sigh of power corrupting to the detriment of the Church as a whole. This adulation of pastors is harmful as few men can resist it's corrupting influence. It is time to remember one of the major points of the reformation, the dethroning of the clergy. I wish there were a sola for this specifically.

NO ONE is above accountability, save Christ who in fact became accountable for ALL the sins of the elect (so I suppose, He is most accountable of all). I am sick and tired of Protestant clergy setting themselves above the laity. There is another thread here where precisely that is being debated now.

The things Driscoll has done and said should bar him from the ministry. When people begin questioning those who bring legitimate public accusations instead of examining the validity of the accusations we are in deep trouble.

JR, a Janet Mefferd radio show enthusiast

 

[AndOne]

All pastors have error in their theology to some degree. Nobody is perfect. If we threw out a pastor everytime we heard something wrong, we'd have no pastors left.

I've listened to Mark Driscoll for years. But yeah, every once in a while he makes me raise an eyebrow, and most of those instances are highly publicized in articles and message threads like this one. But in between all the "scandals", Mark Driscoll preaches A LOT of truth. He preaches the Gospel of Jesus Christ and calls sinners to repent, which is foreign to 90% of modern day pastors.

Hang onto the good, throw out the bad. If Mark Driscoll offends you, listen to someone else.

It's not his preaching that is of primary concern in this thread. It's his plagiarism and dishonest act of paying the NY Times to have his book on the best seller list that is at issue here.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

It's not his preaching that is of primary concern in this thread. It's his plagiarism and dishonest act of paying the NY Times to have his book on the best seller list that is at issue here.

I remember reading an article or two about the plagiarism charges not too long ago. Supposing he blatantly purposely flagrantly plagiarized, I've heard about many instances of Christian leaders doing far worse. I don't know all the details, and cannot remember the details from the articles I read, but from what I recall it was questionable as to whether he purposely plagiarized. Has more information been released? I thought I read something about the publishers not seeking lawsuits against him, and something about him quickly responding by pulling the said material off his site, etc. making corrections? Plagiarism can be as simple an editing error as leaving off " " " from quotes...sloppy to say the least. Also there are some not so black and white aspects to copyrights. Is the author alive and living? Is the publisher still publishing? Is the person holding copyrights alive? How many years have passed since the author passed away? Did the author secure copyrights to begin with? What year were the copyrights secured and did they renew them? The rights may be especially questionable before 1978. Did the person make a reasonable attempt to obtain permission or information about the copyrights?

I have no clue, but did Driscoll like quote half of a book and try claiming credit and profit from it? It's difficult to perceive a man in his shoes doing such a thing? I mean why would he? It's not like he does not already have fame and fortune, the American dream most can only dream of. Just to get away with it because he's Mark Driscoll? I don't buy that. It's more likely poor scholarship, poor editing, and overly zealous to get a message out, in my opinion. If Mark were thinking level headed beforehand, he wouldn't say or even preach some of the messages he has from what I've been told. His efforts to be a cool hip preacher seem to have caught up to bite him on the...yeah...I won't pull a Driscoll there.

 

[gord44]

I always found him a bit obnoxious but have already moved on and any ill will forgotten. Best to not dwell on other's faults.