Reformed Church Thats Not Calvinist?

A

Awaken4Christ

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Hi all,

How do you find those Staunch Bible Believing Churches or Online Sermons That Teach and Preach The WHOLE Gospel and Praise and Confirm God's Sovereignty. Every time I try to find Some sort of niche on youtube or through google this is what happens

1. I Run into pure calvinist websites or youtube videos where they are holding a conference and its all calvinists.

2. I find videos or websites where the preachers sermon talks about golf, food, worldy stuff like 80 percent or more of the sermon. Not enough preaching from the bible.

I am looking for a Baptist type church that isn't calvinist but preaches and takes God's word and makes Christ so important that never does it seem like just a secular community meeting. I hear to often in sermons a self-help seminar message.

Basically if I can simplify it I am looking for a Non- Calvinist or Arminian version of Paul Washer lol. If someone can direct me to some audio, video, or way to find local churches, I would greatly appreciate it. I am not trolling or trying to start a debate I am truly seeking for what I described.
 
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Skala

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Basically if I can simplify it I am looking for a Non- Calvinist or Arminian version of Paul Washer lol. If someone can direct me to some audio, video, or way to find local churches, I would greatly appreciate it. I am not trolling or trying to start a debate I am truly seeking for what I described.

The reason you can't find very many solid or heavy hitting preachers like Paul Washer (but an Arminian version) is because Arminianism typically doesn't produce sound, biblical truth, nor exalt God's sovereignty, nor really give a reason to love and worship God and be thankful for salvation.

In other words there's a reason all the greatest preachers and teachers in church history as well as contemporary times are Calvinists/monergists...

Because it's what the Bible teaches :D

Example list:

Martin Luther
John Calvin
George Whitefield
John Owen
Jonathan Edwards
Charles Spurgeon
John Piper
John MacArthur
Paul Washer
Steve Lawson
JP Boyce
Lorraine Boettner
JI Packer
John Newton
AW Pink
RC Sproul
August Toplady

(PS, also, I think being reformed automatically makes one a Calvinist. So there's no such thing as a non-Calvinist reformed person)
 
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MrJim

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The reason you can't find very many solid or heavy hitting preachers like Paul Washer (but an Arminian version) is because Arminianism typically doesn't produce sound, biblical truth, nor exalt God's sovereignty, nor really give a reason to love and worship God and be thankful for salvation.

In other words there's a reason all the greatest preachers and teachers in church history as well as contemporary times are Calvinists/monergists...

Because it's what the Bible teaches :D

Example list:

Martin Luther
John Calvin
George Whitefield
John Owen
Jonathan Edwards
Charles Spurgeon
John Piper
John MacArthur
Paul Washer
Steve Lawson
JP Boyce
Lorraine Boettner
JI Packer
John Newton
AW Pink
RC Sproul
August Toplady

(PS, also, I think being reformed automatically makes one a Calvinist. So there's no such thing as a non-Calvinist reformed person)

No "greatest preachers & teachers" prior to the Reformation:doh:
 
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Petruchio

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Yes, the Calvin and Arminius views tend to both be extremes of the Word of God, and the truth is more between these two opposites.

Many people say this, but I've never seen any evidence that such a view actually exists as a comprehensible, logical, scriptural system. I think it's more like that Bigfoot show on the animal planet. They know all these Bigfoot facts, like how he sounds like, where he likes to sleep, etc., but they sure as heck never can actually catch him despite all they say.
 
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Keachian

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Yea, the dark ages were a nuisance.

But, now that you mention it:

Saint Augustine.

Happy now? :)

Athanasius, John Chrysostom, Gregory to a small extent, Anselm.

Patristics is a really interesting and valuable realm of study, it is a shame that many can't trace their faith back to anyone but Augustine pre-reformation.
 
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Skala

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Yes, the Calvin and Arminius views tend to both be extremes of the Word of God, and the truth is more between these two opposites.

Many people say this, but I've never seen any evidence that such a view actually exists as a comprehensible, logical, scriptural system. I think it's more like that Bigfoot show on the animal planet. They know all these Bigfoot facts, like how he sounds like, where he likes to sleep, etc., but they sure as heck never can actually catch him despite all they say.

I agree with you Petruchio. Often, when people claim some sort of "middle ground", and then you press them on what their stance is on the issues, they usually reveal themselves as being just straight up Arminians. That's not a middle ground.
 
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Skala

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Athanasius, John Chrysostom, Gregory to a small extent, Anselm.

Patristics is a really interesting and valuable realm of study, it is a shame that many can't trace their faith back to anyone but Augustine pre-reformation.

it is true that I'm sure much valuable knowledge is overlooked from the early Christians.

Thankfully, we have the writings of Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter, and Paul.

So, I'm not too sad about missing out on those other doodz.
 
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hedrick

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I'm confused by the OP. The text seems to speak of a solid, Biblically based Church that isn't Calvinist. But the topic says Reformed that isn't Calvinist. Are you specifically interested in a Reformed church?

Historically, there were a couple of Reformed movements that weren't pure TULIP. One was Arminianism, the other various 4-point Calvinist variants, e.g. Amyrault.

Of course Arminianism has now been separated from its Reformed background, and is held by quite a variety of groups. But there appear to be a few churches that are Reformed Arminian, some calling themselves Reformed, and I've seen signs of some Baptists.

On the other hand, from what I can tell, a majority of Reformed in the US are actually part of mainline denominations. They meet your criterion, but I'm betting you aren't interested in a mainline Church. The mainline Reformed churches (e.g. PCUSA and RCA) do not hold to an unmodified TULIP, at least not as a mandatory standard.
 
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Skala

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I'm confused by the OP. The text seems to speak of a solid, Biblically based Church that isn't Calvinist. But the topic says Reformed that isn't Calvinist. Are you specifically interested in a Reformed church?

Historically, there were a couple of Reformed movements that weren't pure TULIP. One was Arminianism, the other various 4-point Calvinist variants, e.g. Amyrault.

Of course Arminianism has now been separated from its Reformed background, and is held by quite a variety of groups. But there appear to be a few churches that are Reformed Arminian, some calling themselves Reformed, and I've seen signs of some Baptists.

On the other hand, from what I can tell, a majority of Reformed in the US are actually part of mainline denominations. They meet your criterion, but I'm betting you aren't interested in a mainline Church. The mainline Reformed churches (e.g. PCUSA and RCA) do not hold to an unmodified TULIP, at least not as a mandatory standard.

I disagree that Arminians can call themselves reformed. The hinge that the reformation swung on, according to Luther, was the debate between monergism and synergism. In other words, the root of the reformation was a swing from synergism to monergism.

Arminians, by necessity, are synergists. Thus, how can they be considered to have been "reformed"? They're still stuck in the theology of pre-reformation.
 
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Petruchio

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On the other hand, from what I can tell, a majority of Reformed in the US are actually part of mainline denominations. They meet your criterion, but I'm betting you aren't interested in a mainline Church. The mainline Reformed churches (e.g. PCUSA and RCA) do not hold to an unmodified TULIP, at least not as a mandatory standard.

That's like asking someone if they want to ride on the Titanic WHILE it's sinking. The PCUSA is collapsing under the weight of liberal modernism:

Mainline Presbyterians (PCUSA) Continue Decline
According to their own news service, the PCUSA (not to be confused with the OPC or the PCA or any of the other NAPARC (sideline) Presbyterian denominations) lost more members last year than at any time since 1983. They claim 2.1 million members. Can this really be true? For the sake of discussion, let’s assume that church discipline is lax in the PCUSA. Let’s assume that, just as in some more confessional congregations, sometimes sessions are reluctant to “clear the rolls” of those who no longer attend. If they erased 100,000 members last year (and they did) does that not suggest that there are likely many more folk who could be “cleared from the rolls”? As in the case of the SBC, one suspects that the reported membership in the PCUSA is greatly exaggerated. Taking the SBC as a model, where the reported number of members is 16 million but estimated by insiders to be more like 6 million, might the PCUSA actually be only about 630,000? If so, then the PCA is about 1/2 to 2/3 of the PCUSA.

Mainline Presbyterians (PCUSA) Continue Decline | The Heidelblog
 
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hedrick

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I don't think it will help the OP to raise this issue here. I think it's an irrelevancy in any case. No one thinks you can gauge truth by popularity, nor that denominations should change their theology in accordance with what current culture supports. But if you're interested in discussing it in another context, there's a fair amount of data on the causes of membership decline. [If you want to compare us with the PCA, you might want to get them to put membership data back on their web site. They seem to have removed it when the PCA started showing declines as well.]

The PCUSA apportions contributions to Presbytery and GA by reported membership. That's a pretty strong incentive for Sessions to prune their rolls.
 
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Arminianism was a demonstration AGAINST the established Reformed church and their confessed doctrine. Arminianism is located in history near the Reformation but not of the Reformation.

Arminian preaching operates under the assumption that man will choose to believe from a position of neutrality, wounded by sin, but not dead in sin. This leads to changing key elements of the church doctrine and preaching. The Regulative Principle of Worship is changed to allow for worldly music believing worldly music is less of a hindrance to the free will of man. The Gospel is preached differently, removing the hard hitting biblical facts of sin for example, to make it less objectionable. Arminians are more likely to allow for worldly influence which ultimately affects their presentation of the Gospel.

You may find an Arminian who preaches like a Calvinist but denies Calvinism when question directly. They are, for practical reasons Calvinists in their preaching because they cannot escape it, even if they deny Calvinism.

I use to attend a church like that.
 
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