Was Jesus omniscient?

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RDKirk

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It is a triky explanation on how a prophet recieves knowledge. Sorry but you are making it up. It never was like that.

Never? Have you not read the book of Daniel?

Jesus told the samaritanian woman about her husband - you know the details - and her answer was "you are a prophet"
So what does she know? All there had ever been before were prophets--never the Son of God. "Prophet" was just her guess, and a good guess, but she was wrong. Jesus is not a prophet.

If we take your thits we can say that Paul, Herod or whoever, was also omniscient. Pilates was omniscient, but he didnt know because he choose not to know and he controls his omniscience. The dunky in wich jesus entered jerusalem was omniscient; only that him/it controled his omniscience and choose not to know.

What are you talking about? None of those people were the Son of God. Or are you also arguing that Jesus was not the Son of God?
 
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Maite Els

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I provided you with biblical references to demonstrate God's (the Trinitarian God) omniscience, which is the doctrine of biblical orthodoxy. Why do you ignore the biblical support I provided?

Norman Geisler is an orthodox, evangelical, biblical exegete, theologian and apologist. In the second volume of his Systematic Theology: God, Creation (vol 2, 2003. Minneapolis, Minnesota: BethanyHouse) he has an entire chapter providing an exposition of the orthodox doctrine of God's omniscience (ch 8, pp. 180-212).

Has it occurred to you that you might be the one promoting something other than orthodox Christianity with your failure to support the Trinitarian God's omniscience?

Bye,
Oz


I really dont care a bit on what Norman geiser has to say.
The Biblical orthodoxy dont teach of God atributes including the omniscience.
The Biblical Orthodoxy declare that the atributes of God is what God is. The atributes is that wich are part of God being God, and without them God would be not God.
The Biblical orthodoxy declare that God is God. God presented himdelf as "I am". God is what God is. And most importantly, God is what the Bible say God is.
The Biblical Orthodoxy declare that God is light; God is saint; God is spirit; God is love... etc. But never declares that God is omniscience.
 
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Maite Els

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The biblical text you quoted show that God knows averything, not that God IS omniscient. You have demostrate that God has omniscience, not that he IS omniscience.

God can give away having omniscience because omniscience is not what God is.
At least that is what the Biblical Orthodoxy declares.
 
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RDKirk

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The biblical text you quoted show that God knows averything, not that God IS omniscient. You have demostrate that God has omniscience, not that he IS omniscience.

God can give away having omniscience because omniscience is not what God is.
At least that is what the Biblical Orthodoxy declares.

Okay, so you're just playing with the words.

"Nothing to see here, folks. Move along."
 
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OzSpen

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I really dont care a bit on what Norman geiser has to say.
The Biblical orthodoxy dont teach of God atributes including the omniscience.
The Biblical Orthodoxy declare that the atributes of God is what God is. The atributes is that wich are part of God being God, and without them God would be not God.
The Biblical orthodoxy declare that God is God. God presented himdelf as "I am". God is what God is. And most importantly, God is what the Bible say God is.
The Biblical Orthodoxy declare that God is light; God is saint; God is spirit; God is love... etc. But never declares that God is omniscience.
You don't seem to understand the meaning of omniscience.

dictionary.com gives this meaning:
omniscience

  Use Omniscience in a sentence
om·nis·cience

[om-nish-uh
thinsp.png
thinsp.png
ns] Show IPA
noun 1. the quality or state of being omniscient.

2. infinite knowledge.

3. ( initial capital letter ) God.

Origin:
1605–15; < Medieval Latin omniscientia, equivalent to Latin omni- omni- + scientia knowledge; see science

Dictionary.com Unabridged
Based on the Random House Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2013.
Cite This Source |
Link To omniscience

Collins
World English Dictionary
omniscient (&#594;m&#712;n&#618;s&#618;&#601;nt) — adj 1. having infinite knowledge or understanding 2. having very great or seemingly unlimited knowledge [C17: from Medieval Latin omnisciens, from Latin omni- + sc&#299;re to know] om'niscience — n om'nisciently — adv

Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition
2009 © William Collins Sons & Co. Ltd. 1979, 1986 © HarperCollins
Publishers 1998, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2009
Cite This Source
Are you disagreeing with these explanations of omniscience as they apply to God?

Sincerely, Oz
 
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OzSpen

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okay, so you are recognicing not having more arghuments.
have nothing to say and you move along
When I provided the arguments, based on Scripture, to support God's omniscience, you ignored this evidence.

Why are you censoring my arguments and still appealing for arguments?

Oz
 
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Maite Els

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Now you know the dictionary meaning.
Next step will be understanding what an atribute is.
Definitions

verb

(&#601;&#712;tr&#618;bju&#720;t
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)
  1. tr usually foll byto to regard as belonging (to), produced (by), or resulting (from); ascribe (to) &#8658; to attribute a painting to Picasso
noun

(&#712;ætr&#618;&#716;bju&#720;t
redspeaker.gif
)
  1. a property, quality, or feature belonging to or representative of a person or thing
  2. an object accepted as belonging to a particular office or position
  3. (grammar)
    1. an adjective or adjectival phrase
    2. an attributive adjective
  4. (logic) the property, quality, or feature that is affirmed or denied concerning the subject of a proposition
 
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Maite Els

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attribute

&#8194;http://app.dictionary.com/signup/co...p://dictionary.reference.com/browse/attributeUse Attribute in a sentence
.slDL{font-family: "Verdana";font-size: 12px;color: #404040;line-height:16px;}.slDL{font-family: "Verdana";font-size: 12px;color: #404040;line-height:16px;}Ads
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at·trib·ute

/v. &#601;&#712;tr&#618;b
thinsp.png
yut; n. &#712;æ
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tr&#601;&#716;byut/ http://dictionary.reference.com/help/luna/IPA_pron_key.htmlShow Spelled [v. uh-trib-yoot; n. a-truh-byoot] http://dictionary.reference.com/help/luna/Spell_pron_key.htmlShow IPA verb, at·trib·ut·ed, at·trib·ut·ing, noun
verb (used with object) 1. to regard as resulting from a specified cause; consider as caused by something indicated (usually followed by to ): She attributed his bad temper to ill health.

2. to consider as a quality or characteristic of the person, thing, group, etc., indicated: He attributed intelligence to his colleagues.

3. to consider as made by the one indicated, especially with strong evidence but in the absence of conclusive proof: to attribute a painting to an artist.

4. to regard as produced by or originating in the time, period, place, etc., indicated; credit; assign: to attribute a work to a particular period; to attribute a discovery to a particular country.


noun 5. something attributed as belonging to a person, thing, group, etc.; a quality, character, characteristic, or property: Sensitivity is one of his attributes.

6. something used as a symbol of a particular person, office, or status: A scepter is one of the attributes of a king.

7. Grammar . a word or phrase that is syntactically subordinate to another and serves to limit, identify, particularize, describe, or supplement the meaning of the form with which it is in construction. In the red house, red is an attribute of house.

8. Fine Arts. an object associated with or symbolic of a character, office, or quality, as the keys of St. Peter or the lion skin of Hercules.

9. Philosophy . (in the philosophy of Spinoza) any of the essential qualifications of God, thought and extension being the only ones known.
 
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Maite Els

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When I provided the arguments, based on Scripture, to support God's omniscience, you ignored this evidence.

Why are you censoring my arguments and still appealing for arguments?

Oz

OK. One more time. Provide a single evidence (or as many you want) declaring that knowing all is an esential of what God is. Not a text merely saying that God knows all; but a verse saying that knowing all is what god is and that god will not be God if he dosnt know all.

tray again, because you have failed before.
 
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Maite Els

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Gen 6:5;
The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time.

Job 2:11;
When Job’s three friends, Eliphaz the Temanite, Bildad the Shuhite and Zophar the Naamathite, heard about all the troubles that had come upon him, they set out from their homes and met together by agreement to go and sympathize with him and comfort him.

36:4;
Be assured that my words are not false;
one who has perfect knowledge is with you.

For a mpoment I thot I was wasting my time. But this is a very interesting verse. God HAS omniscience, not that God IS omniscient. This is all I am trying to explain. Thanks.

37:16; Ps. 139:2-4, 17-18; Ps. 147:4-5; Isa. 40:28; 42:9; 46:10; Matt. 6:8; 10:29-30; Acts 15:17-18; Rom. 8:29; 11:33; Eph 1:11 and Heb. 4:13.
 
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OzSpen

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OK. One more time. Provide a single evidence (or as many you want) declaring that knowing all is an esential of what God is. Not a text merely saying that God knows all; but a verse saying that knowing all is what god is and that god will not be God if he dosnt know all.

tray again, because you have failed before.
I'm not interested in playing your sort of games!

Bye, Oz
 
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Maite Els

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37:16;
Do you know how the clouds hang poised,
those wonders of him who has perfect knowledge?

God HAS omniscience, not that God IS omnicient.

Ps. 139:2-4,
You know when I sit and when I rise;
you perceive my thoughts from afar.
You discern my going out and my lying down;
you are familiar with all my ways.
Before a word is on my tongue
you, Lord, know it completely.

This is a good description of the omniscience that God has

17-18;
How precious to me are your thoughts, God!
How vast is the sum of them!
Were I to count them,
they would outnumber the grains of sand—
when I awake, I am still with you.

Many thots, infinite thots, thots that god has.

Ps. 147:4-5;
He determines the number of the stars
and calls them each by name.
Great is our Lord and mighty in power;
his understanding has no limit.

"His understnading" is the understanding He has.

Isa. 40:28; 42:9; 46:10; Matt. 6:8; 10:29-30; Acts 15:17-18; Rom. 8:29; 11:33; Eph 1:11 and Heb. 4:13.
 
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Maite Els

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I'm not interested in playing your sort of games!

Bye, Oz

It is demostrated that God has omniscience not that God is omniscient.
Omnicience is not something inherent to God, and is something of what Jesus emptied out on incarnation.

I am glad you did undertand it finally.
God is blessing you with understnading.
 
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Ronald

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You confuse me. Are you saying that Jesus was omniscient or that he was not?
He is the God/Man. His spiritual nature was and is always God. He never had a different spirit. He was fully God and fully man, but did not use the fullness of His abilities, only what was necessary. If Beethoven was sent to kindergarden to teach kids how to play "Mary Had A Little Lamb", would he need to give them all he had in a shock and awe performance, or humble himself to their level and start with a few notes? They wouldn't grasp the complexity, it would be overwhelming.

There a mysterious element to the mind of God and we can only grasp part of it.
 
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RDKirk

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When I provided the arguments, based on Scripture, to support God's omniscience, you ignored this evidence.

Why are you censoring my arguments and still appealing for arguments?

Oz

He's just playing with the words and grammar.

He's making point that "omniscience" is not the "being" of God, it's an attribute of God, so it's not grammatically correct to say "God is omniscience," but one should say "God has the characteristic of omniscience."

Of course, I've never heard anyone ever say "God is omniscience" anyway; people say "God is omniscient," which in English grammar is the same thing as saying "God has the characteristic of omniscience." Maite Els may not realize this element of English grammar.

But here is something a bit different. Scripture does say, specifically:

"God is love."
 
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Ronald

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< Staff Edit >

Your assessment is incorrect. Both Catholic and Protestants theology teaches that Jesus was/is fully God. (John 1:1-14) Being the creator (Col.1:16,17) He is clearly God and God is spirit. "God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."John 4:24 The Father refers to Him as God in Hebrews 1. "And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power ..."Heb. 1:3
"But of the Son He says,
&#8220;Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,
And the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom." Heb. 1:8


Physically, He was fully man as well.

I do study scripture and can go toe to toe with you or anyone else. I wrote a book on basic Christianity based on 570 of the most life changing and powerful scriptures in the Bible using 7 different translations. I have 22 years of study, while learning from the top Prostestant scholars in the English speaking world. I was merely offering some help ... you don't receive it, so go your way ... you're the one confused.
But don't worry about it, put your faith in Jesus and you'll get in --He'll have to explain it all later ... and you'll say: "Ah you are fully God and fully man, I see now!"
 
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Maite Els

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He's just playing with the words and grammar.

He's making point that "omniscience" is not the "being" of God, it's an attribute of God, so it's not grammatically correct to say "God is omniscience," but one should say "God has the characteristic of omniscience."

Of course, I've never heard anyone ever say "God is omniscience" anyway; people say "God is omniscient," which in English grammar is the same thing as saying "God has the characteristic of omniscience." Maite Els may not realize this element of English grammar.

But here is something a bit different. Scripture does say, specifically:

"God is love."

I am not playing with grammar. The simple fact is that to be or to have omniscience is not what God is. There is not a problem for Christ emptying of omniscience because being not omniscient is not being less a God.
 
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Maite Els

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.

Your assessment is incorrect. Both Catholic and Protestants theology teaches that Jesus was/is fully God. (John 1:1-14) Being the creator (Col.1:16,17) He is clearly God and God is spirit. "God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth."John 4:24 The Father refers to Him as God in Hebrews 1. "And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power ..."Heb. 1:3
"But of the Son He says,
“Your throne, O God, is forever and ever,
And the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom." Heb. 1:8


Physically, He was fully man as well.

I do study scripture and can go toe to toe with you or anyone else. I wrote a book on basic Christianity based on 570 of the most life changing and powerful scriptures in the Bible using 7 different translations. I have 22 years of study, while learning from the top Prostestant scholars in the English speaking world. I was merely offering some help ... you don't receive it, so go your way ... you're the one confused.
But don't worry about it, put your faith in Jesus and you'll get in --He'll have to explain it all later ... and you'll say: "Ah you are fully God and fully man, I see now!"

I can see that you are extremelly qualified. if I you fail to demostrate that being God necesarelly means to be omniscient, then we can be sure that nobody else can prove it.

can you please provide any evidence - out of all your extend and deep studies - that not being omniscient is not being God, or viceversa?
I hope you can enlight all of us on that.
 
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He's just playing with the words and grammar.

He's making point that "omniscience" is not the "being" of God, it's an attribute of God, so it's not grammatically correct to say "God is omniscience," but one should say "God has the characteristic of omniscience."

Of course, I've never heard anyone ever say "God is omniscience" anyway; people say "God is omniscient," which in English grammar is the same thing as saying "God has the characteristic of omniscience." Maite Els may not realize this element of English grammar.

But here is something a bit different. Scripture does say, specifically:

"God is love."
By the way, Maite Els has identified herself as a female.

I know she is playing with words when she wants to affirm the difference between "God is omniscient" and "God has the attribute of omniscience".

My simple point is that which is affirmed in 1 John 3:20:
for whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything.
Oz
 
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