Islam Pagan

[Jonathan95]

I bet you can't provide a single documented case.

I know a woman whose grandchild or something, would wake up early in the morning to watch Cartoons. He was like 6 years I think. He watched a lot of Cartoons. He'd become really aggressive, and scratch his sister in the face, and other cruel stuff. He'd become rebellious. He had toy-guns too. When they removed those stuff, and he stopped with cartoons, along with that, he stopped having nightmares. He also became really nice to his sister, and they became best friends.

First, the Neopagan traditions are highly subjective and experiential. What flies for one will not fly for another. Many of us are solitary practitioners; we don't know who is practicing what or when, nor do we care. Those who do practice in groups are exclusive because working in such close spaces requires a high level of trust and cohesion. Groups typically do not want members unless members are sincerely working from the same page. There is no recruiting, there is no proselytizing. In other words: we don't want you.

Ok, well, I don't understand how you people can be into Paganism anyways. My mum's friend speaks about ghosting in her house. Her (my mum's friend's) husband is a Norse-Pagan practitioner.

Scripture says that they "sold their souls" to the devil by their
occult practices! (2 Kings 17:17)

God says witchcraft is an abomination in His sight.
Deuteronomy 18:9-14

Ah, the Ouija board; another fine product from the Milton Bradley company. Ever play Monopoly on a Ouija board? It's great! You roll the dice and the pieces move by themselves.

No I haven't done it, and I'll never use such Occult objects. I've heard those are being sold in normal stores as toys or something. It's demonic.

I've read Tarot for people for years. Never had a problem.

Well, doesn't mean it doesn't affect you spiritually. Those cards are Occult.

Well, maybe you shouldn't be using the Internet either.

Why? I don't play games.

 

[Jonathan95]

No, I do not believe in demons. I do not believe that angels can rebel against HaShem. Keep in mind I also do not believe Jesus was tempted by Satan or anything like that as I am not a Christian.

Ok, why not? Don't you believe the angels had free will?

These all sounds like symptoms of mental illness or other problems. I had similar experiences when the dosage of my medication was way off.

Well, those I had lately, the dreams and seeing demons in dreams and so, it was since I got born-again. Satan wants to destroy me. After receiving intercession and after Fasting, I didn't get any more dreams and heavy attacks.
So it's not mental illness. I haven't been on medication for some years.

I've had heavy attacks outside dreams too, oppression and getting attacks feeling like waves of fire through my body.

Sexual dreams are not demonic. Sex is how we, as a species, procreates. Having a dream about sex is merely a way for us to express the sexual desire we feel. It is natural as it is a natural drive to desire procreation.

Yes it can be seducing spirits, since I got tempted and oppressed afterwards.

 

[LoAmmi]

Ok, why not? Don't you believe the angels had free will?

I have not found any evidence in scripture to suggest that they have free will.

Well, those I had lately, the dreams and seeing demons in dreams and so, it was since I got born-again. Satan wants to destroy me. After receiving intercession and after Fasting, I didn't get any more dreams and heavy attacks.
So it's not mental illness. I haven't been on medication for some years.

I've had heavy attacks outside dreams too, oppression and getting attacks feeling like waves of fire through my body.

You honestly have not ruled out mental illness, you are merely saying that it got better when you thought it should get better in some respect.

Yes it can be seducing spirits, since I got tempted and oppressed afterwards.

Your profile shows you are 16. 16 year old men have sexual desires generally. By thinking them evil or worse, you are making it so that your natural desire to find a mate is wrong.

 

[awitch]

I know a woman whose grandchild or something, would wake up early in the morning to watch Cartoons. He was like 6 years I think. He watched a lot of Cartoons. He'd become really aggressive, and scratch his sister in the face, and other cruel stuff.

I can see scratching at his own eyes if he was watching the Smurfs, but that's still not a documented case. I know this is a surprise for a lot of people, but I still watch a lot of cartoons (ask me...I dare you), but no demons here.

Ok, well, I don't understand how you people can be into Paganism anyways. My mum's friend speaks about ghosting in her house. Her (my mum's friend's) husband is a Norse-Pagan practitioner.

That's OK. I never understood that whole Christian thing either. I tend not to believe in ghosts so I don't know what she's talking about.

Scripture says that they "sold their souls" to the devil by their
occult practices! (2 Kings 17:17)

God says witchcraft is an abomination in His sight.
Deuteronomy 18:9-14

That's nice.

Those cards are Occult.

My cards are mass produced on computerized printing presses, sold in big chain bookstores and purchased with a little plastic gift card. There's nothing spooky, demonic, or secretive about them.

 

[Jonathan95]

I can see scratching at his own eyes if he was watching the Smurfs, but that's still not a documented case. I know this is a surprise for a lot of people, but I still watch a lot of cartoons (ask me...I dare you), but no demons here.

I don't see why she would lie, that would be a sin. But this kid was a Christian, he'd see demons in his room, he could see with his spiritual eyes. So Satan probably wanted to ruin his calling.

That's OK. I never understood that whole Christian thing either. I tend not to believe in ghosts so I don't know what she's talking about.

Strange stuff happening in her house, because of her husband's Norse-Paganism.

My cards are mass produced on computerized printing presses, sold in big chain bookstores and purchased with a little plastic gift card. There's nothing spooky, demonic, or secretive about them.

Yes, otherwise they wouldn't be used in the Occult.

 

[LoAmmi]

I don't see why she would lie, that would be a sin. But this kid was a Christian, he'd see demons in his room, he could see with his spiritual eyes. So Satan probably wanted to ruin his calling.

A six year old child has a very vivid imagination usually. They may not be lying, but may be mistaken about what they think they have seen.

 

[Booko]

Sorry no, as far as I can remember, he didn't even mention that. It's far more in-depth than that, and I was surprised to see how smart the symbolism is and how everything is connected and so. He brings up the 5 pillars, the Kabah etc. Wow, Satan is smart.

I hate to break it to you, Jonathan, but to someone swift of mind it's not difficult to concoct all sorts of scenarios that appear smart but are ultimately based on drawing connections where there is not sufficient reason to do so.

LOL this reminds me of someone my brother-in-law knew when young, who tried to make a big deal about "Santa" being an anagram of "Satan." Well, anyone can make such a connection, and to this guy it seemed smart too.

And it might until you learn something more about etymology. (The study of where words come from, to put it simply.)

Satan comes from a source that has nothing at all to do with the Dutch name "Sinterklaas" from where Santa is derived.

It's very easy to dupe those with no deep knowledge into thinking there is a connection where there is none. I encourage you to look much deeper into what the guy in your video is claiming as far as symbols go. Even asking about specifics here may help. There are some people with various forms of knowledge that might help guide you to look even further.

 

[Booko]

Ephesians 5:11
Take no part in and have no fellowship with the fruitless deeds and enterprises of darkness, but instead [let your lives be so in contrast as to] expose and reprove and convict them.

OK, but on your way to exposing and reproving and convicting, make sure you actually know your subject so you're not wasting your time "exposing" something that doesn't exist in reality.

Also please note Ephesians talks about you leading your life in a way that exposes, reproves and convicts.

That does not require any words.

I have had the honour of meeting people before that I would unhesitatingly describe as being "a true Christian." One of them was one of the top cancer specialists in the country. He never had to mention his faith...his life made it clear. Awesome guy.

(And a CV so long you could wallpaper your kitchen with it.)

 

[Booko]

I never really realized how many poop jokes there are in the bible...

Well, there's a fun thread in itself.

Our personal favorite at Chez Booko is the story in 1 Kings 5 where the Philistines touch the Ark of the Covenant and God gives them hemorrhoids.

(search a KJV for "emerods" there are a few instances of this sort of thing.)

Now if someone here develops a certain health condition we say "I touched the Ark of the Covenant!" Yes, well we're all a bit strange.)

 

[awitch]

I don't see why she would lie, that would be a sin. But this kid was a Christian, he'd see demons in his room, he could see with his spiritual eyes. So Satan probably wanted to ruin his calling.

I agree with LoAmmi: a vivid imagination.

Strange stuff happening in her house, because of her husband's Norse-Paganism.

With 0 details I'm going to have to chalk it up to any number of completely natural phenomena like drafts, temperature changes, settling foundation, optical illusion, apophenia, and I won't even mention altered states from drugs or alcohol.

 

[Booko]

Unfortunately for Jonathan and I say this in all sincerety to him.. Hoggard is quite off the wall on a number of points..

Thanks for the list, Arthra. I'm not really able to see this video and I was curious about the contents.

He says he would have to learn Aramaic to read the Qur'an... The Qur'an is in Arabic.

Hm, kind of a huge tip off the vid's author is not knowledgeable about his subject.

Believes entering churches having what he thinks is a womb like symbol is also unclean..

Beyond the imagery surrounding the Theotokos I cannot imagine what he would be talking about.

Believes Harry Potter is unclean... The brooms are phallic symbols.

*sigh* And here I thought brooms were 3rd class levers. Silly me?

Mentioned the Kaaba and called it "Kaba" noting it was a cube having six sides ...noted it also when laid out formed a cross and then...oddly enough said that was a symbol of chromosome and a symbol of the anti-christ!?

Wow srsly? A Google image search reveals how off base that is.

He then said the Washington monument was a phallic symbol..

Well, I would argue he was right about that at least.

 

[Jonathan95]

I have not found any evidence in scripture to suggest that they have free will.

Revelation 12:7-9
7And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

You honestly have not ruled out mental illness, you are merely saying that it got better when you thought it should get better in some respect.

WHat do you mean? I'm not mentally ill. I'm fine now after intercession and fasting.

Matthew 17:18-21
18And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour.

19Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?

20And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

21Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.

Your profile shows you are 16. 16 year old men have sexual desires generally. By thinking them evil or worse, you are making it so that your natural desire to find a mate is wrong.

No we don't have sexual desires, if we live in the spirit, and walk by the spirit, and not in the flesh, and fulfill the desires of the flesh. The Holy Spirit sanctifies me, purifies me and helps me. By the Holy Spirit I kill the flesh's desires.

Sexual desire is Sin. I found out inappropriate contentography was sin, that was one of the main reasons I came back to Jesus, to find deliverance, because The Holy Spirit convicted me of it.

I don't really have a desire to find a mate. There aren't any Christian girls on fire for Yeshua here. Haven't seen any atleast. Premarital sex is sin. I will definetly not be together with an unbeliever, we have nothing in common > nothing to talk about.

(2 Timothy 2:22) Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Timothy was a young man, some say he was around 17-18 if I recall right.

 

[Jonathan95]

Beyond the imagery surrounding the Theotokos I cannot imagine what he would be talking about.

I posted an answer to it in this thread.

Wow srsly? A Google image search reveals how off base that is.

No, it's a cube.

 

[LoAmmi]

Revelation 12:7-9
7And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

8And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

9And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.



WHat do you mean? I'm not mentally ill. I'm fine now after intercession and fasting.

Matthew 17:18-21
18And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour.

19Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out?

20And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

21Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.



No we don't have sexual desires, if we live in the spirit, and walk by the spirit, and not in the flesh, and fulfill the desires of the flesh. The Holy Spirit sanctifies me, purifies me and helps me. By the Holy Spirit I kill the flesh's desires.

Sexual desire is Sin. I found out inappropriate contentography was sin, that was one of the main reasons I came back to Jesus, to find deliverance, because The Holy Spirit convicted me of it.

I don't really have a desire to find a mate. There aren't any Christian girls on fire for Yeshua here. Haven't seen any atleast. Premarital sex is sin. I will definetly not be together with an unbeliever, we have nothing in common > nothing to talk about.

(2 Timothy 2:22) Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Timothy was a young man, some say he was around 17-18 if I recall right.

I do not recognize the New Testament as scripture, so it does no good to quote it to me.

I can only say that I do not believe you are reading the correct message that all sexual desire is supposed to go away. Paul says that those that have such desires should be married.

 

[Jonathan95]

I do not recognize the New Testament as scripture, so it does no good to quote it to me.

I can only say that I do not believe you are reading the correct message that all sexual desire is supposed to go away. Paul says that those that have such desires should be married.

That's not what I'm saying. But we can get tempted, but to Lust, if that's what you mean by sexual desire, is a choice, and is Sin. The lusts of the flesh are youthful lusts, which young people must carefully watch against.

I've heard people in the Old Testament and New Testament days and so, got married at really young ages, is it so? Maybe that's why? Maybe it's supposed to be so?

I can't get married in this age anyways.

 

[LoAmmi]

That's not what I'm saying. But we can get tempted, but to Lust, if that's what you mean by sexual desire, is a choice, and is Sin.

Sexual desire is the desire to have sex. It is a natural desire. I think you are using lust to mean something else.

I've heard people in the Old Testament and New Testament days and so, got married at really young ages, is it so? Maybe that's why? Maybe it's supposed to be so?

Some did, some did not. I do not think it really matters one way or the other.

I can't get married in this age anyways.

No, but to beat yourself up over having sexual desires is hindering one of the first things we were told to do. "Be fruitful and multiply." We were not being told to eat fruit and do math, you know?

 

[Jonathan95]

Sexual desire is the desire to have sex. It is a natural desire. I think you are using lust to mean something else.

Some did, some did not. I do not think it really matters one way or the other.

No, but to beat yourself up over having sexual desires is hindering one of the first things we were told to do. "Be fruitful and multiply." We were not being told to eat fruit and do math, you know?

Yes I see.

And No, I didn't think desire to have sex was sin. I thought you meant Sexual desire as Lust.

 

[LoAmmi]

Yes I see.

And No, I didn't think desire to have sex was sin. I thought you meant Sexual desire as Lust.

There is a difference between noting a girl is attractive and drooling on her.

 

[Booko]

Maybe he said wrong.
...
Ok, maybe you heard wrong, or he said wrong.

And if he's that uncareful about a video, why should I think he's right about other things? Why should I not assume he's just as uncareful in his study if he's this careless about something he puts out in public?

Before Muhammad the Arabs had 365 gods - one for each day of the year. Muhammad picked Allah (the Arab moon god).

This is falsehood that makes the rounds on the Internet like the worst form of gossip. If you do not like people saying things about your own religion that are not true, then I urge you to follow the Golden Rule and not spread this falsehood about someone else's religion any further.

It's a demonic stone. A demonic stone can't absorb people's sins, YHWH wouldn't let that happen.

Neither do I believe that stones are either demonic or not. Nor do I believe a rock can have more power than God. So I do not get all excited about rocks.

It represents a mandorla yes, it's pagan.

Mandorlas can be found in mathematics and various fields of science. Does that make math and science demonic and things to be avoided?

 

[Booko]

What about aliens? THey don't exist, but demons do, and they can come as "aliens".

Quite frankly, I consider it far more likely that aliens exist than demons.

The notion that the Universe, vast as it is, is only populated by one sentient species, humanity, makes the Creator out to be very unCreative indeed.

As to the question of whether aliens have visited the Earth, I have yet to see any evidence to make me lean in the direction of thinking that has happened.