Both laughed Gen 17:17 and 18:12. Why was Sarah's laughter a problem compared to Abraham's?
i don't think GOD had a problem with sarah laughing... she did the same thing abraham did... laugh and wonder how it could happen... the only difference is that when GOD told abraham the first time in gen. 17.... abraham asked GOD a question.... and GOD answered him in a way that helped abraham believe what GOD said....Both laughed Gen 17:17 and 18:12. Why was Sarah's laughter a problem compared to Abraham's?
I like how several commentaries put it: Abraham laughed to rejoice, in joy; Sarah laughed in doubt.Both laughed Gen 17:17 and 18:12. Why was Sarah's laughter a problem compared to Abraham's?
are you sure about sarah doing something wrong?.... i read all of chapter 15 to the end of 18....I like how several commentaries put it: Abraham laughed to rejoice, in joy; Sarah laughed in doubt.
Abraham laughed, then openly conversed with God how this should come about. His laughter could have initially been provoked by surprised shock. But a tickling joy followed, though maybe not understanding, for at that point he asks if Ishmael can play a role. But God assures him that although He will bless Ishmael, it is through Isaac that the Covenant shall be established. As HSWOF says, God then took him by the hand and led him to greater faith.
Sarah, on the other hand, hid and in her laughter came close to mocking: "After I'm old this happens??" So even in her faith that God could do this, she doubts. If her laughter were also joy, then she would not have been afraid when the Lord called her on it (v15), which she further exacerbated with a lie: "I did not laugh." And as HSWOF says, God was still able to lead her out of this doubt, into a greater faith, for we see her testimony later in scipture (Heb 11:11).
So #4, lying directly to God is not bad??are you sure about sarah doing something wrong?.... i read all of chapter 15 to the end of 18....
and i saw abraham...
1. laugh and then...
2. spoke his doubts to himself and then....
3. asked GOD a question about ishmael who abraham KNEW didn't come from sarah....
4. and then GOD spoke and then....
5. abraham choose to believe....
and i saw sarah.....
1. laugh and then....
2 speak her doubts to herself and then....
3. GOD ask her a question and....
4. she was afraid (she didn't realize HE heard) and lied about laughing...
5. and then GOD spoke...
6. and she gave birth to isaac by that time a year later.... so she would have conceived very quickly....
i know the commentaries put a bad spin on sarah.... but they don't understand how GOD draws faith out of HIS people so that THEY can BELLIEVE and RECEIVE the full NOW manifestation...
Well, I don't think I said she was rebuked. She was corrected. And she did act in doubt. Personally I don't think I want to tell God that I didn't do something and Him offer reproof and tell me point blank "Yes, you did." That's an argument that I'm likely not going to win.i truly didn't see a rebuke of any kind come from GOD to sarah.... i only saw HIM say things that would help her believe.... even when HE called her on the lying..... it was simple and kind.... no rebuke.... HE wasn't there to rebuke this 89 year old sarah and 99 year old abraham....
So #4, lying directly to God is not bad??
You took a long road to get here. But yes, I agree here..... guess we don't really need to learn about lying....
If the Bible had to add an extra line or paragraph to explain the obvious then it's length would be multiplied by 10. Both laughed. Abraham got back on track immediately and tried to figure out how God would do this: faith. Sarah on the other hand, laughed and did not get back on track. And when God said, "Sarah? You comin'" She stutter stepped and said "I didn't lie." God had to pat her on the back, tell her "You telling me that I don't know what a lie is? You lied. Now, let's get back on the faith track, because you are mother to all who will be free in the New Covenant. And THEN she got back on the faith track.but what i meant was that when sarah laughed she didn't do anything any worse than abraham.... and there is no scripture to say that her laughter was bad and abraham's laughter was NOT bad.... that was what i was meaning......
Commentaries have their leanings, and for the most part they are more orthodox. After all, the bible is inspired of God, the commentaries are written by men.my fault for not articulating clearly..... the commentaries maybe want to say sarah's laughter was bad and abraham's was NOT bad.... but from reading gen 15-18 i don't see GOD saying that.... that was what i meant to say....
wof hugs....
You took a long road to get here. But yes, I agree here.
Both laughed. Abraham got back on track immediately and tried to figure out how God would do this: faith. Sarah on the other hand, laughed and did not get back on track. And when God said, "Sarah? .....
you are mother to all who will be free in the New Covenant. And THEN she got back on the faith track.
The laughter itself is not the issue; what happens after is. And it points to the root for the laughter. Abraham's was a surprised shock. Sarah's was a mocking.
But even in Jesus' blood we need to be careful about casually dismissing our imperfections as "ok with God." They are not.
We need to recognize our "allowances" and not say: well that's good enough, isn't it?
Well, we've reached the point fairly quickly where it's "yes it is" "no it isn't" "yes it is" "no it isn't!" Ha ha.3. ***sarah was MORE eager than abraham to have a child because she NEVER had one... abraham already had ishmael by hagar.... this would also make it NOT TRUE that she would mock what the LORD said.... a woman who longs for a child as long as sarah would GRASP AT STRAWS to have a child.... not mock.... she would be wondering how this could be.... and deeply wish/want/hope it to be true.... even the LORD'S words indicate this.... Why did Sarah laugh, saying, ‘Shall I surely bear a child, since I am old?..... she was looking for surety.... not mocking...
I like how several commentaries put it: Abraham laughed to rejoice, in joy; Sarah laughed in doubt.
Abraham laughed, then openly conversed with God how this should come about. His laughter could have initially been provoked by surprised shock. But a tickling joy followed, though maybe not understanding, for at that point he asks if Ishmael can play a role. But God assures him that although He will bless Ishmael, it is through Isaac that the Covenant shall be established. As HSWOF says, God then took him by the hand and led him to greater faith.
Sarah, on the other hand, hid and in her laughter came close to mocking: "After I'm old this happens??" So even in her faith that God could do this, she doubts. If her laughter were also joy, then she would not have been afraid when the Lord called her on it (v15), which she further exacerbated with a lie: "I did not laugh." And as HSWOF says, God was still able to lead her out of this doubt, into a greater faith, for we see her testimony later in scipture (Heb 11:11).
Also consider: when we look at man, we see sinful. When we look at God's view of man (through Jesus blood covering) we see righteousness being spoken into us. We have been put back on track. It happened. Yes it did.When we look at Sarah's words, we see the doubt. When we look at God's view of the words, we see the surity of what she denied; but she was willing to be lifted "back on track." Because it's going to happen. Yes it will.
I'm wondering why you think God had a problem...The child's name was Isaac...a memorial for all time to laughter.Both laughed Gen 17:17 and 18:12. Why was Sarah's laughter a problem compared to Abraham's?
amen.... welcome to cf wof.... glad to have you in the house.....I'm wondering why you think God had a problem...The child's name was Isaac...a memorial for all time to laughter.
let's all get together and pray that he stays....you will be blessed.amen.... welcome to cf wof.... glad to have you in the house.....
praying in agreement with you Bob.... also thanking GOD for CF WOF.... for the excellent wof fellowship we have here.... the excellent WORD teachers we have here.... and the hunger and love for the WORD that we have at CF WOF....let's all get together and pray that he stays....you will be blessed.
well, almost unfettered. But then again the OT does say to take a disobedient and unrepentant child into the street and stone him......... unfettered....
we do love you greatly.... you have very quickly become one of our favorite cf wof personalities.... your humor.... childlike faith..... anointed posts.... love and protection for our house.... intense hunger for GOD and HIS WORD.... humility.... sense of fun and playfulness.... your excellent consistent contributions to the threads.... your good opinions and comments.... etc.... have made you an extremely valuable part of the wof family.... you are one of a kind.... and we are glad you found us.... that's why we razz you sooo much.... love... prayers.... blessings..... and wof hugs....I have made this forum "my permanent home" away from home. I am fairly new here and will always be on probation since I am "forever learning."
Faith releases God's ability and it's his ability that does the miracles....Bill Winston
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a friend,
Harry
almost unfettered... true.... took a lot of diligent action on the part of many of us to create the wonderful atmosphere we now have here at cf wof.... for learning and growing in wof principles.... thanks to you and all those who have faithfully made the cf wof house what it now is....well, almost unfettered. But then again the OT does say to take a disobedient and unrepentant child into the street and stone him....
too cruel....