Why do people have a problem with prosperity teachings?

[Yitzchak]

I don't want to stereotype. but I do believe that my own struggles are common to a lot of people.



I'm using the modern english version because I think it brings it out very clearly...

Mal 3:13 You have said horrible things about me, and yet you ask, "What have we said?"
Mal 3:14 Here is what you have said: "It's foolish to serve the LORD God All-Powerful. What do we get for obeying him and from going around looking sad?
Mal 3:15 See how happy those arrogant people are. Everyone who does wrong is successful, and when they put God to the test, they always get away with it."

Also this verse...

(CEV) You have worn out the LORD with your words. And yet, you ask, "How did we do that?" You did it by saying, "The LORD is pleased with evil and doesn't care about justice."

In other words , the accusation is that G-d is harsh and we are coping the best that we can because G-d has let us down.
I find that as I get more healing in my relationship with G-d that I can see His love and expect good things from Him.

The basic offense is not really believing that G-d is good.

 

[Jedi.Kep]

Carter shared the story of how she founded Sustainable South Bronx during a Cleveland appearance yesterday. It illuminated why she’s a national icon, like Van Jones, for giving voice and providing leadership to minorities and those disproportionately affected by the damage wrought by our ‘fossil fuel economy.’


Okay. Why are we lifting up someone who is like Van Jones? The dude, for lack of a better term, is a communist. I'd be ashamed to be compared to that guy.

That said, I have no problem bringing farming skills to anyone for growing their own food. In a few years we are all going to have to do that when the economy crashes.

 

[KM Richards]

The basic offense is not really believing that G-d is good.

Exactly...this is why me and mainstream religion don't get along!

When I was a very young Christian they told me God was gonna "git me" if I did anything wrong as though God is some mean guy in the sky looking to give a brotha a black eye.

I found out later God is GOOD...all the time!

 

[Yitzchak]

Exactly...this is why me and mainstream religion don't get along!

When I was a very young Christian they told me God was gonna "git me" if I did anything wrong as though God is some mean guy in the sky looking to give a brotha a black eye.

I found out later God is GOOD...all the time!

I grew up without a Father. The more healing that G-d give me in this area the more that I expect good things from G-d. I have been listening to Keith Moore these last few months and sometimes I get really emotional because I suddenly see a glimpse of how much G-d loves me. I think sometimes people project their own issues and think that we should be like robots who don't need a loving Father to love on us. I can't speak for everyone but the extreme negative and angry responses might be the older brother syndrome from the prodigal son story.

It's just too much for the older brother that the Father would throw a lavish party and give a place of honor to the prodigal. There should be the appropriate time of groveling and paying penance. Then slowly he might merit a few small blessings along the way is the older brother's attitude.

I made use of something I learned from Keith Moore last week when I was at the conference. They had a prayer time at the altar and the speaker said G-d is giving out stuff , raise your voices and tell Him what you want. So I asked big instead of asking what I thought would be the polite level of asking. I think I kind of freaked a few people out because we were praying out loud and I was saying " I want this and this and this and this "... Some really serious looking religious guy opened his eyes and glared at me for a minute like he was thinking settle down , who do you think you are to make such a ruckus asking for all of that ?


You should see the response to my wife's gold teeth. Oh does it ever make some people angry. Espeacially some of the church people. So far there have been about a hundred positive responses from unsaved people. 100% of the negative responses have come from church people. But a lot of positive responses from church people too. It is fun. It is like we are living one of the bible stories. G-d is showing up and is not at all like people expected. Some of the religious people are in a fit about it.

There are so many blessed by it. The unsaved workers at my wife's work are asking her to lay hands upon them and pray for things. You know why these unsaved workers said that they want prayer ? They said because when my wife talks about G-d , they like that G-d. They like this G-d who gives gold teeth and freely blesses whosoever will come and ask. What are they learning ? That G-d loves them ...

 

[KM Richards]

I grew up without a Father. The more healing that G-d give me in this area the more that I expect good things from G-d.

Yeah, I never knew my dad...and I had an abusive step dad so I can definitely relate...I spent alot of years getting over all the junk

I'm blessed just hearing your testimony about how the Lord has opened your eyes and made it a reality to you that The Father is not an absentee Father and He's there for you all the time.

It's only going to get better from here...

This is the kinda thing the world needs to hear about because it's what they are all running around looking for...in all the wrong places.

 

[donnamabob]

Are you saying that you think all prosperity teachers are uncaring and neglecting the spiritual welfare of those under their ministry ? That they are preaching for the sole purpose of receiving lots of money from the people ?

I have to say that I honestly do not believe that I've encountered too many "prosperity preachers/teachers" that were very different from this. And while I absolutely do believe in biblical prosperity, the last thing I want to have anything to do with is a "prosperity preacher/teacher". It's because I've learned the hard way that they are most likely going to harm me (or attempt to). I will say this though, I suspect that some of these false teachers are operating out of ignorance, and don't even realize that they aren't helping anyone except for themselves...they're simply repeating what they were taught and beliving it to be true.

I think that this is the case for a lot of people that want nothing to do with the false "prosperity gospel". Its not that they are against biblical prosperity, or financial gain - they just don't trust peoples teachings on it, and have learned to steer clear of them.

The damage that was done to me by a teacher of the false prosperity gospel, when I was a young and impressionable Christian, took a very long time to heal from. As a college student, they robbed me of many of my much needed resources, and in turn refused to support my missions endeavors or even perform my marriage ceremony. It took much prayer and restoration to understand what had happened, and to heal from it. Theres no telling what could have happened to me if my faith was just a little bit weaker.

So, whenever I hear the term "prosperity" all these alarms go off in my mind and I all I can think to do is protect myself.

 

[Yitzchak]

I have to say that I honestly do not believe that I've encountered too many "prosperity preachers/teachers" that were very different from this. And while I absolutely do believe in biblical prosperity, the last thing I want to have anything to do with is a "prosperity preacher/teacher". It's because I've learned the hard way that they are most likely going to harm me (or attempt to). I will say this though, I suspect that some of these false teachers are operating out of ignorance, and don't even realize that they aren't helping anyone except for themselves...they're simply repeating what they were taught and beliving it to be true.

I think that this is the case for a lot of people that want nothing to do with the false "prosperity gospel". Its not that they are against biblical prosperity, or financial gain - they just don't trust peoples teachings on it, and have learned to steer clear of them.

The damage that was done to me by a teacher of the false prosperity gospel, when I was a young and impressionable Christian, took a very long time to heal from. As a college student, they robbed me of many of my much needed resources, and in turn refused to support my missions endeavors or even perform my marriage ceremony. It took much prayer and restoration to understand what had happened, and to heal from it. Theres no telling what could have happened to me if my faith was just a little bit weaker.

So, whenever I hear the term "prosperity" all these alarms go off in my mind and I all I can think to do is protect myself.

I am sorry that you went through that. I have had similar experiences. Except mine were not in prosperity churches. My biggest example of that was a unfaithful spouse in my first marriage. Talking about investing everything and then getting burned by a selfish person who does not love you back.
Betrayal hurts , espeacially when it leaves you struggling to survive while the other person goes off to pursue their dreams unhindered. But that is speaking in the natural. G-d sent people into my life to help me rebuild what was lost.
Betrayal is not limited to prosperity teachers. The old saying , power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely , comes to mind.

The real betrayal is them not loving you and freely and generously giving to you like you gave to them. That is a heart thing and not a money thing.

I guess it depends on what a person hears. When I hear prosperity teachers , I hear someone teaching us to love with free hearts that hold nothing back and to expect in return to be loved that way back by G-d. It is extreme irony that a prosperity teacher would not believe his own message. It is not the surface level side teachings that are important. It is the root message. Love G-d with our things and G-d wants to love us back with things. One of several love languages written about in the well known books about human relationships.

My example of my first marriage is to me an example of loving freely and holding nothing back. When we get "burned " in our relationships with people , we are experiencing just a little of the rejection that G-d experiences when he gives everything and then is turned away or worse accepted by someone who takes all His benefits but keeps their walls up and will not love Him back.

When I hear prosperity teaching. I hear loving without limits or walls. I haer the love language of giving gifts and also receiving gifts too. I am hearing the message that G-d wants to love me that way and that he wants me to live just like Him in loving Him back and also in loving other people that way.

When I bring my wife flowers or other gifts , it is an act of love. When someone cheapens that to me buying her love , it twists it into something else. We give to G-d to express our love to Him and we receive from G-d for the same reason, to allow Him to express His love to us.

The scripture says guard your heart. So I know there is a time and place for that. But my battle has been trying to get my wounded heart to open up. Putting up protective walls comes very easially.

 

[Yitzchak]

PTSD CHRISTIANS


So for me , the bottomline is that it is not about money or things. It is about love.

Our church relationships should not be like a bad marriage. One person loves and the other stays unconnected and aloof. True love gives it all.

My wife and I don't want to be a part of a church where we are not connected and there is very little room for love. We don't want a business relationship with my church where we have clearly defined roles and limits so that we can work together. We want a church that loves us and that we can love back.

How sad would it be to see a divorced person remarry and then live seperate lives with seperate money and seperate lives really. Just a roomate to partner together with for some things. I have known people like that with their prenuptial agreements. It is ugly. I figure if a person is that afraid to trust , then stay single.

I don't want relationships in my life where I have to constantly watch my back and do their part for them. Thank The Lord we have a church that loves us where we can have mutual loving relationships.

My personal opinion is that this is what is behind a lot of the heresy hunting we see here on the message boards. People with their walls up trying to justify living with walls by proving everyone is untrustworthy. It is a trust issue that extends beyond just money.

Some have proven themselves untrustworthy. That is true. But to become suspious of everyone is a dysfunctional coping mechanism. The rallying cry is , we could be deceived , watch out. Someone is going to trick you and teach you something false. They call this PTSD or post tramatic stress disorder. I was in the army and we saw it first hand. A person goes into protective mode and then has a difficult time shutting that off and returning to a relaxed state. Small things can trigger an episode.

PTSD Christians are very difficult to minister to. Because they feel that the perceived danger is real and to let their guard down for even one minute seems foolish to them. But they have exchanged love for safety.

How do I know so much about it . I have walked the road of a PTSD Christian. It doesn't take much to revert back to the walls up and an on guard position. After a few bad church situations and a divorce and a few other hurts , it is not hard to have walls up.

Some have passive walls and others have agressive walls. The heresy hunters are the agressive type. they are going to make sure they don't get taken by surprise even if they have to turn their machine gun on everything that moves and spray it with bullets. It reminds me of when I was little and we found this little garden snake. We smashed it with rocks and everytime it twitched for an hour after , we would shower it with more rocks.


The passive limit their experience with G-d to only a very limited narrow way which feels safe.


There is a healing for this. Then we can have a measured response to things and not the 24/7 on guard attitude.



By the way , when I was in the army , we were trained to look for the symptoms of PTSD. If it was determined that someone had this condition setting in , they were relieved of duty and their weapon taken from them.
The last thing a platoon wants is someone freaking out and randomly discharging their weapon.

 

[psalms 91]

PTSD CHRISTIANS


So for me , the bottomline is that it is not about money or things. It is about love.

Our church relationships should not be like a bad marriage. One person loves and the other stays unconnected and aloof. True love gives it all.

My wife and I don't want to be a part of a church where we are not connected and there is very little room for love. We don't want a business relationship with my church where we have clearly defined roles and limits so that we can work together. We want a church that loves us and that we can love back.

How sad would it be to see a divorced person remarry and then live seperate lives with seperate money and seperate lives really. Just a roomate to partner together with for some things. I have known people like that with their prenuptial agreements. It is ugly. I figure if a person is that afraid to trust , then stay single.

I don't want relationships in my life where I have to constantly watch my back and do their part for them.

My personal opinion is that this is what is behind a lot of the heresy hunting we see here on the message boards. Peopel with their walls up trying to justify living with walls by proving everyone is untrustworthy. It is a trust issue that extends beyond just money.

Some have proven themselves untrustworthy. That is true. But to become suspious of everyone is a dysfunctional coping mechanism. The rallying cry is , we could be deceived , watch out. Someone is going to trick you and teach you something false. They call this PTSD or post tramatic stress disorder. I was in the army and we saw it first hand. A person goes into protective mode and then has a difficult time shutting that off and returning to a relaxed state. Small things can trigger an episode.

PTSD Christians are very difficult to minister to. Because they feel that the perceived danger is real and to let their guard down for even one minute seems foolish to them. But they have exchanged love for safety.

How do I know so much about it . I have walked the road of a PTSD Christian. It doesn't take much to revert back to the walls up and an on guard position. After a few bad church situations and a divorce and a few other hurts , it is not hard to have walls up.

Some have passive walls and others have agressive walls. The heresy hunters are the agressive type. they are going to make sure they don't get taken by surprise even if they have to turn their machine gun on everything that moves and spray it with bullets. It reminds me of when I was little and we found this little garden snake. We smashed it with rocks and everytime it twitched for an hour after , we would shower it with more rocks.


The passive limit their experience with G-d to only a very limited narrow way which feels safe.


There is a healing for this. Then we can have a measured response to things and not the 24/7 on guard attitude.



By the way , when I was in the army , we were trained to look for the symptoms of PTSD. If it was determined that someone had this condition setting in , they were relieved of duty and their weapon taken from them.
The last thing a platoon wants is someone freaking out and randomly discharging their weapon.

Will you be blessed? By my experience yes. Is that why I tithe and give? No. It is out of love and obedience. I feel sorry for those who do not understand prosperity teachiong.

 

[psalms 91]

Wow! I never heard anybody accuse Jesus
of being involved in "greed and manipulation"

You do know that it was Jesus who said that (Acts 20:35) because the entire Kingdom of God (everything He ever created) works on the seedtime harvest system.

It's always more blessed to plant because that sets you up for harvest in which you will be able to abundantly meet your own needs of yourself and your family (God's will for you to live nicely), and have even MORE to give after you increase.

It sounds like you know how to give, but you've been taught to receive back is wrong, and it's not. That's like calling a farmer evil just because he plants a bunch of seed, harvests the crop, and sell it to support his family each year. That's not evil...

What's evil is the devil's false teaching that it's OK to give, but un-Godly to receive harvest back from your giving which is growth....in God's eyes, this is an evil, satanic teaching that goes against the foundation of God's creation.

God planted Jesus (His only Son) as a seed for the sole purpose of reaping back a multitude of sons (all of us) for no other purpose other than because it's what He wanted. He created mankind in His own image so He's have someone in His likeness to share Himself with...reckon that is evil???

Reckon God is evil for reaping the seeds He has sown???
If He's not, then why would any of us be evil for doing the same?

We're just acting like God (as commanded in Ephesians 5:1)...there's only two beings that we can act like...if a person is not comfortable acting like God, then are they comfortable acting like the devil?

Remember, the devil is the one who pushes "games of chance", "fate", "luck", and other un-Godly concepts that deny the existance of seedtime harvest.

Galatians 6:7
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

This also applies to doing good. Some people think this only applies when you do bad things...if that were true then is this scripture a lie???...

Ephesians 6:8
Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether he be bond or free.

Wow! This even includes people that aren't serving God...

Yes!

 

[lismore]

'Prosperity' is fine. I think most believers wouldn't have a problem with it. Many good scriptures and teachings out there, balances the false 'poverty is godly' mindset.

But, some people do have past bad experiences withinin the prosperity gospel movement etc. We have to admit that there are some false and unscrupulous leaders out there. Perhaps not a huge amount, but a significant number.

 

[KM Richards]

But, some people do have past bad experiences withinin the prosperity gospel movement etc. We have to admit that there are some false and unscrupulous leaders out there. Perhaps not a huge amount, but a significant number.

Yes, it's a shame that the Head of the Body of Christ (Jesus) has no control over the ministry of the Gospel and cannot do anything to oust false teachers.

Maybe we should vote Jesus out and get a new leader???

The truth of this is...there have been ministers that have been exposed to the point it ruined their ministry and they are now non-issues...Jesus does in fact cause the truth to come out on false teachers by allowing them time to repent...and then simply allowing them to publically reap what they sow if they refuse to turn.

All you have to remember at offering time is...is the guy trying to force people to give and spending alot of time raising money versus feeding the sheep??? Saying, "if you don't give, we'll go down the tubes"?

In this situation...I would not give a dime because I'm not willing to sow into bad ground (a ministry trying to raise money first, as opposed to feeding the sheep first)

It's very simple...if they are pressuring people to give, keep your money in your pocket and be polite. Don't go giving them "a piece of your mind" cause nobody wants to hear that trash.

If you believe them to be out of line...you now have a job to do...PRAY, and INTERCEDE in their behalf...that's treating others the way you would like to be treated, right?

No need to get all bent out of shape cause many of these guys are good hearted...they juets haven't leaned much about God's way of handling money, they're probably in debt (no ministry should borrow from the world to do God's work!) and they're scared...so they set out to scare or pressure, people into giving.

Find a church / ministry that spends the majority of their time feeding the sheep with meaningful scripture based teaching and exhortation.

 

[psalms 91]

I understand trusting God, I have also seen many an artist leave christian music because they were starving on love offerings. It is a shame that we will support secular music, lectures, golf, bowling, whatever you can name and yet neglect the house of God and the people in it. I am not painting you with this brush but sadly many within the body are klike this, worldly, carnal, christians, and their pleasures come before the body of Christ or His church building and the ministers.

 

[probinson]

PTSD Christians are very difficult to minister to. Because they feel that the perceived danger is real and to let their guard down for even one minute seems foolish to them. But they have exchanged love for safety.

Best quote I've read on CF in ages.

Just a few weeks ago, it was said from our pulpit, "If you Love deeply, you will get hurt badly."

Of course, people don't want to get hurt, so they "protect" themselves by refusing to make themselves vulnerable. In doing so, they do just what you said, exchanging Love for safety. But I can guaran-dang-darn-tee you that if you Love someone deeply, at some point, you will get hurt badly.

That is why 1 Corinthians 13:5 has been such a life-changing verse for me. "Love pays no attention to a suffered wrong."

Think about Judas' betrayal of Jesus. Just imagine it. Jesus selects this guy to be one of His disciples, Judas flat out betrays Him, and Jesus didn't even hardly blink an eye. If that happened to us, we'd be all like, "But you don't know what Judas did to me!"

I appreciate your posts. I've been hearing many of the same things about the Love of God for about 5 years now, and I believe what you are saying is spot on.

 

[donnamabob]

I am sorry that you went through that. I have had similar experiences. Except mine were not in prosperity churches. My biggest example of that was a unfaithful spouse in my first marriage. Talking about investing everything and then getting burned by a selfish person who does not love you back.
Betrayal hurts , espeacially when it leaves you struggling to survive while the other person goes off to pursue their dreams unhindered. But that is speaking in the natural. G-d sent people into my life to help me rebuild what was lost.
Betrayal is not limited to prosperity teachers. The old saying , power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely , comes to mind.

The real betrayal is them not loving you and freely and generously giving to you like you gave to them. That is a heart thing and not a money thing.

I guess it depends on what a person hears. When I hear prosperity teachers , I hear someone teaching us to love with free hearts that hold nothing back and to expect in return to be loved that way back by G-d. It is extreme irony that a prosperity teacher would not believe his own message. It is not the surface level side teachings that are important. It is the root message. Love G-d with our things and G-d wants to love us back with things. One of several love languages written about in the well known books about human relationships.

My example of my first marriage is to me an example of loving freely and holding nothing back. When we get "burned " in our relationships with people , we are experiencing just a little of the rejection that G-d experiences when he gives everything and then is turned away or worse accepted by someone who takes all His benefits but keeps their walls up and will not love Him back.

When I hear prosperity teaching. I hear loving without limits or walls. I haer the love language of giving gifts and also receiving gifts too. I am hearing the message that G-d wants to love me that way and that he wants me to live just like Him in loving Him back and also in loving other people that way.

When I bring my wife flowers or other gifts , it is an act of love. When someone cheapens that to me buying her love , it twists it into something else. We give to G-d to express our love to Him and we receive from G-d for the same reason, to allow Him to express His love to us.

The scripture says guard your heart. So I know there is a time and place for that. But my battle has been trying to get my wounded heart to open up. Putting up protective walls comes very easially.

I agree completely, it really is a heart issue. Your experience does sound very similar, only I'm sure it was much more difficult. I'm sure similar betrayals happen under many different circumstances, but in the end it always comes back to what is in peoples hearts.

The prosperity teaching that you speak of is the concept of prosperity that I learned when I sat down on my own, with my bible and the Holy Spirit. It wasn't until then that I was able to understand the truth of the matter, and where I was lead astray by false teachers. I learned that most of their teaching was actually biblical, which is why it was so difficult to rightly divide the truth from the lies. Unfortunately, I suspect that many Christians rely too heavily on teachers to walk their walk for them, and will not take the time to learn the truth when they realize that the "prosperity gospel" isn't doing what their preacher promises it will.

I was taught to sew into my flesh, my bank account and my wants. The general message was that you reap what you sew, so if you sew money then by biblical law you have to reap money. Furthermore, I was taught that possessions are just floating around in the heavenly realm waiting for someone to claim them by faith - and since faith requires action to work, you had to sew a financial seed as your act of faith. So for example, if I wanted a boat - I would sew a "boat seed" to the church, and if I used the required amount of faith while sewing this seed, I could "pull the boat out of the heavens" and it would manifest in the physical realm. Of course this never, ever worked - but the church justified it by saying that we weren't using enough faith.

Their other tactic was to use guilt by explaining right before collecting offerings that we were robbing God by witholding our tithes and offerings. While there are elements of biblical truth to these messages, it was never about being a blessing or giving from your heart, it was only about gaining wealth and possessions - or giving because God will be mad at you if you do not.

In retrospect, I now see that when I was buying into their teaching I had absolutely no contentment in my life because I believed that God owed me everything, and when he did bless me (which was seldom) I surely wasn't thankful. It took me a long time to realize that most of the congregation wasn't prospering, but that they were actually very poor both financially and spiritually, myself especially. I knew that you needed to judge everything by its fruit, and it was obvious that this wasn't bearing any fruit at all, so I left the church and witheld all of my giving - and then God finally blessed me! It wasn't because not giving is Godly or something, not at all, but it was because not giving was better then giving for the wrong reasons. That shed a lot of light on the situation for me, and set me on the path to recovery.

Now, I give from my heart, and give where the Lord directs me to give - because I want to. I give way less then I ever used to, because I'm giving what I can reasonably afford - and my life has never been more blessed. I'm beyond grateful because I now understand that I don't deserve any of it, and that everything I have is a gift from God. I don't care if I reap a blessing in return for my giving or not, because I've been delivered from that mentality! In fact, the giving blesses me in itself. And, the Lord has also restored to me everything that the enemy has stolen, beyond my wildest dreams. I now understand that while God wants to prosper us, he is first and foremost concerned about our spiritual condition - and that he will never prosper us at the expense of our relationship with him.

That being said, perhaps you can direct me towards some true prosperity teachers. I would likely feel better about "prosperity preachers" if I could find some that had a real and balanced message. Thanks

 

[psalms 91]

You are aware that Jesus said this to His own disciples when they wanted to call down fire on people, aren't you? Here it is;

Luke 9:53-55 (AMP)
But [the people] would not welcome or receive or accept Him, because His face was [set as if He was] going to Jerusalem. And when His disciples James and John observed this, they said, Lord, do You wish us to command fire to come down from heaven and consume them, even as Elijah did ? [II Kings 1:9-16.] But He turned and rebuked and severely censured them. He said, You do not know of what sort of spirit you are, For the Son of Man did not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them [from the penalty of eternal death]. And they journeyed on to another village.
​

This is not manipulation, or me trying to place you in heaven or hell, but rather pointing out that you don't quite seem to realize who you're speaking for. When I see someone saying "Amen" at the prospect of someone "burn[ing] in hell", I can rightly conclude from what Jesus said here that they don't know what sort of a spirit they are speaking from.

FTR, I have neither condemned nor condoned, much less esteemed or excused, the actions of those you've colorfully labeled "pulpit pimps". All I'm saying is when I see anyone calling themselves a child of God and rejoicing at the thought of someone burning in hell, something is very, VERY wrong with that.


Ok but I'm not rejoicing in these people going to hell. I said "amen" to what I was saying because it was the truth. Hell is a HORRIBLE place, and I wouldn't wist for anyone to go there. However, because people refuse to repent from their pulpit pimpery and make proper amends, then thats where they are on their wat to. Plain and Simple.

Why don't you do this, and this goes for everyonr who is reading this post. For ever prosperity pimp that you know, think about how many people may have turned away from God out of anger, betrayal, bitterness, financial, emotional, and spiritual depletion etc. behind these greedy false prophets. Now do you see the picture? So stop sympathizing with the victimizer and start caring about the victims.

I can truly tell you all some horror STORIES (plural) concerning this issue. One involves a single mom of three who was so afraid of a curse being on her if she didn't give. That she gave her rent money and was begging for the church to help her because she was about to be EVICTED. Needless to say it fell on non-chalant ears. So that was the stick that broke the camels back for me.

That is sad but the church I go to and many others I know of do everything they can to help people, not hurt them. There is a difference between a wolf and a preacher saying that he needs finances for the ministry. Yes, there are abuses but most are not like that. The problem is also that most people dont believe because they have experienced it or learned it, it is not believing what Jesus says or Paul, it is believing what a preacher says and not reading for themselves. Testimonies are great for building faith but you cannot stand on what you have never experienced. You need to know that you know that you know.

 

[Lyndie]

Two things I've always said-
If you are following God to get rich, you already have issues. Sadly many who have been "burned" by WOF were doing it to get rich. Its all about motive.

If someone hears the word prosperity and the first thing they think of is money, they have more issues than the preacher.



.

 

[psalms 91]

Two things I've always said-

If you are following God to get rich, you already have issues. Sadly many who have been "burned" by WOF were doing it to get rich. Its all about motive.

If someone hears the word prosperity and the first thing they think of is money, they have more issues than the preacher.


Gee thats funny, I thought that the preacher is supposed to be the leader of the flock. Yet you blame the people who got burned for following the teachings and the examples of their pastor? Very convienient. Wow it seems as if you WOF people all have the same "blame the victim" spirit. Well, after all, the servant IS no greater than their prosperity pimp master.

I dont know why you choose to keep this up. The church I go to does noit take an offering every time its opoen, we do not beg for money, we trust God to supoply and p[rovide not only for us but for the church also as there really is not enough of us to support it. Funny thing, the doors have been open twelve years and God has supplied and provided for us always. We are still there by the grace of God and obedient people that choose to give as God directs. Sowing and reaping is biblical whether you choose to believe it or not, I do agree that we should not be begging for money for we are to be an example of Gods provision and His goodness to the world. I think ywhile some of what you say is true and there are issues with some preachers I also believe that you have a real issue as well. You need to pray and listen to what God has to say abiout this.

 

[Orange_County_Chopper]

Because these guys are the new Moneychangers of the Temple.

 

[Teclils]

this thread is giving me a headache!
Ive been watching a teaching by Rabbi Lapin on TCT channel he has the Jewish approach to money and it is very interesting...