Judge postpones ‘birther’ hearing until Monday; Orly Taitz claims to have Obama birth

[DeathMagus]

Being a “citizen” dual or naturalized does not satisfy the qualification of Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5.

The plain text of the Constitution shows that the framers allowed persons to become Senators and Representatives if they were “Citizens”, but as to the office of President they required a “natural born citizen”.

You are aware that one can be a natural born dual citizen, aren't you?

 

[HerbieHeadley]

You are aware that one can be a natural born dual citizen, aren't you?

Irrelevant to the discussion.

 

[tulc]

Except, there is no evidence the Pres_ _ ent is legal to be holding the office. Exclamation point!

Wow, this may be the first time a conservative has treated President Obama like he's G-d.
tulc(seriously, he's just a normal guy, no need to treat him like he's the Tetragrammaton)

 

[tulc]

Irrelevant to the discussion.

Is a cover-up!! We smells cover-up!!
tulc(sometimes pretends to be Orly Taitz) :o

 

[TheNewWorldMan]

You know, every time that fringe of U.S. conservatives rants about Obama's birth, all I hear is, "We have nothing of substance to offer on the real, tangible issues people actually care about, so we're going to bang the table and throw out this big red herring to distract people."

Sorry, folks, I'm not distracted. It isn't working. Your intellectual bankruptcy is all too apparent.

Try focusing on real issues. I'd say the most important issue is if we don't start taking some very serious steps to address the finity of oil and other fossil fuels, we're not going to have an industrial civilization anymore.

Now I realize grappling with THAT issue is a little bit more of a challenge than cut-and-pasting wingnut blogs and Photoshopping Kenyan birth certificates, so if the Birthers aren't up to it I understand. Nevertheless, as I would like my daughter and my future grandchildren to have such niceties as running water and electricity when they get to be my age...well, the Birthers will just have to understand that I don't really give a rat's posterior about the issue of Obama's birth, not least because the issue HAS ALREADY BEEN ADDRESSED BECAUSE OBAMA ALREADY COMPLIED WITH THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS TO PROVE THE PLACE AND CIRCUMSTANCES OF HIS BIRTH.

 

[kiwimac]

You are aware that one can be a natural born dual citizen, aren't you?

Apparently not.

 

[kiwimac]

Irrelevant to the discussion.

I would have thought this was EXACTLY what the conversation was about.

 

[HerbieHeadley]

I would have thought this was EXACTLY what the conversation was about.

You thought wrong. A Natural Born Citizen can, later in life become a citizen of another country and try and maintain dual citizenship, depending on what those countries definitions of citizenship are. But a dual citizen at birth can not become a natural born citizen. That would be an oxymoron.

 

[sinner/SAVED]

US CODE: Title 8 § 1401. Nationals and citizens of United States at birth



The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof;
(b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property;
(c) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person;
(d) a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year prior to the birth of such person, and the other of whom is a national, but not a citizen of the United States;
(e) a person born in an outlying possession of the United States of parents one of whom is a citizen of the United States who has been physically present in the United States or one of its outlying possessions for a continuous period of one year at any time prior to the birth of such person;
(f) a person of unknown parentage found in the United States while under the age of five years, until shown, prior to his attaining the age of twenty-one years, not to have been born in the United States;
(g) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 288 of title 22 by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or
(B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 288 of title 22, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date; and

(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

 

[HerbieHeadley]

US CODE: Title 8 § 1401. Nationals and citizens of United States at birth



SNIP
(h) a person born before noon (Eastern Standard Time) May 24, 1934, outside the limits and jurisdiction of the United States of an alien father and a mother who is a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, had resided in the United States.

Not, I repeat, Not, a natural born citizen.

This has been debunked before, did you forget?

 

[sinner/SAVED]

Not, I repeat, Not, a natural born citizen.

This has been debunked before, did you forget?

Nope, this is where the US code fills in the blanks in the Constitution. Anyone who meets any of these descriptions is eligilble to seek the presidency of the United States.

 

[CaDan]

Leo Donofrio, who brought one of the first legal challenges to Obama's eligibility to be president and unsuccessfully tried to get the U.S. Supreme Court to get involved at the time of the election, is reporting on his website that Hawaiian state law requires "information collected and maintained for the purpose of making information available to the general public" be released.

While Fulino's statements have been picked to pieces and, in fact, leave out a number of key issues, they now are being used as a reason for a demand that "information collected and maintained" be made public.

On his blog, Donofrio explained that one of his contacts, identified as "TerriK," had asked for all of the state information "collected and maintained" for the purposes of preparing Fukino's public statements.

Under state law, he said, "such information must be released."

"TerriK was interested in knowing how Director Fukino came to the conclusion that the president was a natural born citizen. She was familiar with Section 92F-12(15) which demands that all information collected and maintained for the purposes of making such a public statement be made public. She was denied that information despite the clear wording in the statute. Furthermore, the case law from Hawaii clearly demands production of the records TerriK requested," he said.

Donofrio said work is under way to press the demand.

"I will provide legal research and relevant examples of official correspondence in my follow up report and press release at this blog.

TerriK has previously provided details of her investigation and correspondence with the state of Hawaii in comments to this and other blogs. She has also authorized me to speak publicly about her case and to provide the public with all relevant correspondence," he said.

Under the state's law addressing records. exceptions are made for government records that would "constitute a clearly unwarranted invasion of personal privacy." Also exempted are various records regarding prosecutions and certain court [COLOR=blue !important][FONT='Times New Roman', Georgia, Serif][COLOR=blue !important][FONT='Times New Roman', Georgia, Serif]papers[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR].

But it explains that disclosure "shall not constitute a clearly unwarranted invasion of personal private if the public interest in disclosure outweighs the privacy interests of the individual."

In fact, the law states, "A person aggrieved by a denial of access to a government record may bring an action against the agency at any time within two years after the agency denial to compel disclosure. … The circuit court may examine the government record at issue, in camera, to assist in determining whether it, or any part of it, may be withheld."

Donofrio said he would issue a full statement and make available the complete history of correspondence with the Hawaii agency on his blog.
"Any legal assistance provided by me to TerriK will be pro bono. I will seek to be admitted pro hac vice in Hawaii for purposes of filing the case and conducting the trial. If such admission is not forthcoming, other counsel may be retained or TerriK may represent herself pro se. In any case, I will be drafting the pleadings. The only issue will be related to who files them and conducts the trial de novo," he said.

He said correspondence already has confirmed "President Obama's vital records have been amended."

But he said this case already has circumvented the issue that has been the downfall of many of the court cases challenging Obama's eligibility: "standing."

"The [state] manual states: 'Any person' may make a request for government records under part II, the Freedom of Information section of the UIPA. 'Person' is defined broadly to include an individual, government agencies, [COLOR=blue !important][FONT='Times New Roman', Georgia, Serif][COLOR=blue !important][FONT='Times New Roman', Georgia, Serif]partnerships[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR] and any other legal entities," he wrote.

New case to demand evidence of Hawaiian birth

In camera review. You know what that is?

 

[CaDan]

The Obama Loving media’s attack on the truth : Western Journalism.com

Call us crazy. Call us conspiracy theorists. We prefer to think of ourselves as inquisitive and investigative. If someone tells us to ignore the elephant in the room, we generally ignore the messenger. While the media and their favorite “mainstream” conservatives are willing to ignore the mounting questions and evidence, we prefer to dig deeper into yet unanswered questions. If the same people in the media who are disparaging those who ask these questions would have done some investigating in the past, perhaps the issue would be resolved.

President Obama has hidden and suppressed more information than any other president in recent history. While Obama campaigned on the promise of a “more open and transparent government,” he has conveniently exempted his personal records from that promise. Obama has yet to release his long-form birth certificate, numerous university and college records, his medical records and a myriad of other documents. As a candidate for the highest office in the land, with a top-secret security clearance, shouldn’t Obama be required to produce a document that the rest of us show to get a driver’s license at 16? Doesn’t Obama have a constitutional obligation to prove his eligibility?​

Conspiracy theorists? Hmm . . . Let's look at the evidence.

I went prowling around PACER today and found some fun stuff.

Ladies and gentlemen, meet Christopher-Earl : Strunk, birther and conspiracy theorist par excellance!

From his Complaint in Strunk v. Department of Commerce, et al, File No. 1:09-cv-01295 (D.D.C)

I have a copy up on DropBox: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/344377/gov.uscourts.dcd.137509.1.0.pdf

73. Barry Soetoro (a.k.a Barack Hussein Oama), the Usurper, is a naked undocumented tourist, and is usurping the office of the Presidency for an enterprise hidden from public view, is in the Capitol despite the fact Strunk fired him and returned his offer of contract on January 23, 2009; and the Usurper is the subject of a Quo Warranto inquest as all usurper acts are void ab initio.

74. That Defendant Barry Soetoro is at the hub of a conspiriatorial enterprise to naturalize all undocumented tourists by use of the 2010 Census, as a defacto matter is wanton and relentless.

75. That the Jesuit's Council on Foreign Relations and Goldman Sachs created Usurper and his agents act beyond the scope of 13 USC §195, 13 USC §141, U.S. Constitution and in violation of the 10th Amendment the Usurpers uses the oval office to seize control over the 2010 Census in a ultra vires manner as if the Executive were to have more than just ministerial duties.

76. That the Usurper and his agents are at the hub of the enterprise using an early taking of the Census using the Jesuits' ACORN to extort concessions from States of the several States, in the same way done by the Jesuit controlled Woodrow Wilson Administration, that in the 1920 Census wrongly enumerated too early in January 1920 rather than during the planting season of April 1920 to extort Republican passage of the 15 points of the Treaty of Versailles, for which Fr. Edmund Walsh, S.J. of Georgetown University, was instrumental in implementation and supervision from 1918 forward; of wich 14 points were adopted by Senators Borah and Lodge, who delayed the 1920 allotment of CDs until 1930, and prevented the USA from being dragged into the one world League of Nations then under the control of the Jesuit General as the United Nations is today.

77. That the Defendant Usurper submitted the nomination for the ex-governor of Arizona, Janet Napolitano to be the Secretary of DHS, and which then was rubber stamped by Defendant Pelosi with the intent to forward the enterprise to naturalize all undocumented tourists.

78. That Defendant Napolitano has systematically sabotaged and opposed enforcement of border control between Arizona and Mexico, and has breeched her fiduciary duties.

79. Defendant Napolitano and the Usurper actively used the naked power to chill speech, defame Plaintiff along with those similarly situated, and allege spurious threats of extremist and domestic terrorism Joseph Goebbels style big lie in preparation of an imminent false flag operation, and that outrageous defamation against: all those citizens wishing to enforce of INA, all those who are Veterans, all those who question the lack of credentials of the Usurper, all those who are against infanticide and genocide, those who read and praise their bible and right to bear arms, all those who speak against the destruction of the family structure with the Jesuit devised sodomy liberation movement, all those outraged by the destruction of the value of currency as a burden of debt enslavement placed upon our children's children future, and all those who use the right to speech, association, religion, petition; in that the Usurper and DHS have outrageously issued a DHS Intelligence Report outrageous invidious singling out of Plaintiff and those similarly situated, and

80. Despite the fact that DHS, the FBI, Napolitano, the Usurper continue the charade that Timothy McVeigh was somehow a white-supermacist militiaman rather than a government employee live Lee Harvey Oswald agent provocateur, (that when by FOIA the public record will show McVeigh was on loan from the DIA to infiltrate the phantom Patriot movement, in fact was used an active government infiltrator and agent provocateur); and Defendant persist to spread black propaganda under the guise of Operation Vigilant Eagle by which the FBI, DHS, NSA, use warrent-less wiretaps that interfere with Strunk since January 20, 2009; and as such like Senator Goldwater, Strunk contends "I would remind you that estremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue!"

81. That the Usurper and DHS Secretary, under Jesuit control, have initiated an inquisition against Plaintiffs along with those similarly situated as heretics, using the naked power of government under color of the Jesuits' Patriot Act written at of Georgetown University in the 1990's and who now use the Executive and Congressional Branch to assemble an enemies list to single out and invidiously discriminate against Strunk and others similarly situated as heretics."​

I dunno, but I'm voting "conspiracy theorist" based on this.

 

[CaDan]

Being a “citizen” dual or naturalized does not satisfy the qualification of Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5.

The plain text of the Constitution shows that the framers allowed persons to become Senators and Representatives if they were “Citizens”, but as to the office of President they required a “natural born citizen”.

Wong Kim Ark.

 

[CaDan]

I'm especially fond of "The Jesuit devised sodomy liberation movement" myself, but he has some other gems, too.

 

[Steezie]

The plain text of the Constitution shows that the framers allowed persons to become Senators and Representatives if they were “Citizens”, but as to the office of President they required a “natural born citizen”.

Why on earth should we still go with a 1700's understanding of geopolitics in 2009?

 

[CaDan]

You thought wrong. A Natural Born Citizen can, later in life become a citizen of another country and try and maintain dual citizenship, depending on what those countries definitions of citizenship are. But a dual citizen at birth can not become a natural born citizen. That would be an oxymoron.

Just wrong. Plain wrong.

 

[CaDan]

Not, I repeat, Not, a natural born citizen.

This has been debunked before, did you forget?

Here's the case law on it:

United States v. Wong Kim Ark

When you have read it, we can discuss it.

 

[CaDan]

He can't and wont.
So we have to do it for him and the Constitution.

Political question. Congress can begin impeachment proceedings. You cannot; Capt. Rhodes cannot; Alan Keys cannot; Mr. Strunk cannot; Dr. Taitz cannot.

For loving the Constitution so much, birthers are awfully quick to bypass it when it gets in the way of getting rid of the Negro with a funny name.

 

[HerbieHeadley]

Wong Kim Ark.

Nope.