"Hebraic Thinking"

[ChavaK]

We should NOT bring our modern, Western/American connotations and assumptions to the words and phrases we read in the Bible.

Yep, I agree....

 

[ContraMundum]

I get tired of reading your put downs.. are you aways this negative?

Hang on...only a few months ago you were saying the same thing! Not to mention that the post I was responding to expressed the same sentiments! So it's ok for you to be a critic...

I think you and I agree on this- perhaps you just don't like hearing it from me?

Besides...others, including myself, also get tired of your own put downs and negativity. But I don't complain about it, because I'm happy to consider what you say.

 

[Heber]

However, given that not one of us can be entirely objective in looking at anything, the call to not look through 21st century glasses when reading Scripture can but remain an ideal to which we aspire... but are unlikely to reach in all honesty.

Sorry, this is negative but it is also reality (uness you can show me how to be entirely objective).

 

[visionary]

Hang on...only a few months ago you were saying the same thing! Not to mention that the post I was responding to expressed the same sentiments! So it's ok for you to be a critic...

I think you and I agree on this- perhaps you just don't like hearing it from me?

Besides...others, including myself, also get tired of your own put downs and negativity. But I don't complain about it, because I'm happy to consider what you say.

You have never ever seen or read any negative from my posts regarding the faith of MJ... which you have been more than happy to dis.

 

[visionary]

However, given that not one of us can be entirely objective in looking at anything, the call to not look through 21st century glasses when reading Scripture can but remain an ideal to which we aspire... but are unlikely to reach in all honesty.

Sorry, this is negative but it is also reality (uness you can show me how to be entirely objective).

I do not see this as negative, but the reality which I hope we all aspire to. That inspired truth that Yeshua lite not only the 1st century with, but should be shining forth in us.

 

[Israeli]

Hebraic idioms have to be interpreted as Hebraic idioms and not as Greek or English idioms or else a person gets false interpretation.

For many centuries, "Bible Scholars" have been interpreting the NT as Greek or Western literature despite the fact that the authors of the NT were all Jews who used Hebrew idioms and Midrash. The natural result is false interpretation because they refused to recognise the NT as a Jewish book. Many of them with Dr before their name.

I was once again channel surfing on the radio when I heard a Messianic
man talking about "Hebraic Thinking".

I haven't heard this term so was wondering what you thought and what
exactly it means. To be honest, he had me totally confused by such things
as:

-there is a difference between Eastern ("Hebraic") and Western ("Greek")
thought processes.

-"Hebraic thought" involves thinking in pictures instead of language.

-"Hebraic thought" involves circular thought and reasoning while
"non-Hebraic" thought was linear.

I also noticed that he continually used the terminology "Hebraic"
instead of "Jewish".

So, have you heard of this before, and if so, do you agree with it?
(if you can make sense of what he is talking about, LOL, because
I sure can't)

 

[Heber]

Hebraic idioms have to be interpreted as Hebraic idioms and not as Greek or English idioms or else a person gets false interpretation.

For many centuries, "Bible Scholars" have been interpreting the NT as Greek or Western literature despite the fact that the authors of the NT were all Jews who used Hebrew idioms and Midrash. The natural result is false interpretation because they refused to recognise the NT as a Jewish book. Many of them with Dr before their name.

And some of us spend our time trying to put right the 2000 years of erroneous teaching but it will never be corrected overnight! It needs Messianics to get their hands dirty, to attend a church for a period of time and gently teach the friends they make, how the Bible really hangs together. Trouble is those Messianics (Jews or Gentiles) who go into the church to do this are often like a bull in a china shop and that whole congregation is then lost to change, probably forever. If ministers and pastors are alienated they share the experience with other leaders and friends and guess what - you've blown it! Messianics meeting huddled together is good - we draw strength and encouragement, but nothing will change unless we permeate the church and teach them. I do it by training would be preachers and ministers via College - others can find other ways but...get your hands dirty, and be as gentle as a dove! Oh, and for goodnes sake, do not go on about how bad Christianity has been to the Jews these last two millennia - most Christians know that only too well and hate having it thrown in their face as if they were personally responsible -I know many are old, but not that old! They'll believe we are bad until we come alongside and show them that we have words of life and joy in Jesus that they long for - then they will burn with jealousy at what they have missed all their lives. I know it works, I've done it, and it was done to me, many years ago.

 

[ContraMundum]

You have never ever seen or read any negative from my posts regarding the faith of MJ... which you have been more than happy to dis.

You are, of course, joking I hope.

You're more than happy to "dis" the faith of Hebrew Christians and Jewish people.

You critique, vis. You don't like a lot of MJism that doesn't submit to your way of thinking. Remember when you paid out on J4J? You sometimes even appear on the outside to despise and pick on the wider church, of which you are supposed to be a member. Surely that would be classed as negativity.

 

[ContraMundum]

And some of us spend our time trying to put right the 2000 years of erroneous teaching but it will never be corrected overnight! It needs Messianics to get their hands dirty, to attend a church for a period of time and gently teach the friends they make, how the Bible really hangs together. Trouble is those Messianics (Jews or Gentiles) who go into the church to do this are often like a bull in a china shop and that whole congregation is then lost to change, probably forever.

A few points.

1) All Believers in Yeshua are required to be part of the Body of Christ. If a "Messianic" Christian wants to correct everybody else then he must be the one to exercise patience and do it from within. The true contribution of Jewish converts to Christianity will not come from outside, but from within, the Jews bringing their treasure to the church and enriching her, not tearing her down from outside. The Church is Yeshua's Body. Don't attack it.

2) Messianics need to listen to the church too. They tend to take a very arrogant position and talk down to other Christians, talking at them not with them. Preaching to them rather than being with them. Messianics, despite their beliefs about themselves, are not always going to be right. In fact, as research continues, it is the Messianics who have a lot to sort out and are constantly changing positions.

3) Messianics need to stop thinking that they are "different" or not part of the church. All are equal in Yeshua. The idea that everyone else is always wrong or not as good as oneself is from Satan.

If ministers and pastors are alienated they share the experience with other leaders and friends and guess what - you've blown it!

Exactly.

Listening to the church would be a good start.

This will take time, and more and more Messianic Jews are coming to the conclusion that MJism is not enough, and that there is place for everyone in the Body of Christ.

 

[visionary]

You are, of course, joking I hope.

You're more than happy to "dis" the faith of Hebrew Christians and Jewish people.

You critique, vis. You don't like a lot of MJism that doesn't submit to your way of thinking. Remember when you paid out on J4J? You sometimes even appear on the outside to despise and pick on the wider church, of which you are supposed to be a member. Surely that would be classed as negativity.

You, on the other hand, are to uphold a higher standard as an example to the flock. You are on MJ turf when you dis MJ. It is the "dis"ing of MJ in the MJ forum that I am pointing out that needs to stop. Pointing at my flaws says that you are unwilling to hear. Therefore, there will be no more posts on the subject from me.