Young earth Creationism.

[Sammy-San]

Young earth creationists believe the earth is 6000 yrs old. Somebody at my church told me that the term "days" in Genesis in Hebrew/Greek refer to literal days. However, I have a hard time accepting that Young Earth Creationism is the truth, mainly because of pre history.

According to Wikipedia, ancient history is recorded as far back as about 5,000 years ago. Dinosaurs are accepted to have lived tens of millions of years ago. Ice age animals-like saber tooth tigers, woolly mammoths, lived tens of thousands of years ago. How does that fit into young earth creationism? Carbon dating has been proven to be accurate, btw. How would/could scientists be wrong millions/thousands of years?

The only evidence that dinosaurs coexisted with man is cave paintings that one could argue, may have been hoaxes, and I see no even remotely possible historical evidence that man coexisted with Ice age animals-like mastadons.

What are your views on young earth creationism, and my claims about it?

 

[BryanW92]

First, Wikipedia is not a scholarly source.

But it is true that a lot of evidence exists for the old earth theory, but the proof for that evidence has a lot of circular reasoning. I'd invite you to go to The Institute for Creation Research to see the other side of the story. They do make a good case for young earth theory.

I do not have a firm belief in either theory and that's OK since I don't create universes. Therefore, my "method" of doing so would not matter anyway. The rational, worldly side of me believes in the rational science that I've been taught for my whole life. The Godly, Spirit-driven side of me believes that God could create a fully functioning universe in 6 days.

But, the one thing I do know about "science" over the last 30 years is that scientists follow the money. They pursue the grants and the corporate dollars and that has shaped science. Just follow the lies of climate science since 1970. We were going into an ice age in 1970 but in 1998, we were told that we'd burn up by 2010. Its 2014 and we've given up on both, and moved past mere climate "change" and now our great scientific boogeyman is "climate disruption"! Well, duh. Climate changes. It always has and always will, but the scientists keep chasing the money.

The battle against creation science is just as corrupt. So, even if the old earth theorists are right, the well has been poisoned by the greed of the Science-Academic Complex. It has become the Military-Industrial Complex of the 21st century.

 

[dragongunner]

I don't believe the 6 days of creation where six 24 hr. days, I have stated that before and if you do a search you will find info on what "days" mean. I do believe that man has only been on earth for 6000 yrs as we can go by the bible and see the generations back. Carbon dating is flawed big time imho. Some agree with me, some do not. Some say I can't believe the way I do and have faith...LOL. I open my heart when I open the bible. In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter, it just depends on how much you want to study and learn. And no matter what you learn, or how you believe on the subject don't expect the rest to believe you. Search for yourself. I myself love searching for the truth and have enjoyed searching things like this out. Our God is awesome is a understatement.

 

[Sammy-San]

I don't believe the 6 days of creation where six 24 hr. days, I have stated that before and if you do a search you will find info on what "days" mean. I do believe that man has only been on earth for 6000 yrs as we can go by the bible and see the generations back. Carbon dating is flawed big time imho. Some agree with me, some do not. Some say I can't believe the way I do and have faith...LOL. I open my heart when I open the bible. In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter, it just depends on how much you want to study and learn. And no matter what you learn, or how you believe on the subject don't expect the rest to believe you. Search for yourself. I myself love searching for the truth and have enjoyed searching things like this out. Our God is awesome is a understatement.

How can carbon dating be off millions of years? I could understand maybe a few hundred years, but millions of years?

 

[dragongunner]

How can carbon dating be off millions of years? I could understand maybe a few hundred years, but millions of years?

Because its all theory. You can date things that you know are a certain age like a thousand yr. something....but the farther you go back the more off it becomes until it becomes theory.....or guess work. To know something was million yrs. old you would have to know for a fact that it was, then take the carbon date and then compare that with other stuff.....but no one was around to live for a million yrs to say that what you just carbon dated is in fact a million yrs old......if you don't get my point its because I'm not that smart, LOL. Do some searching on the web.


http://www.essortment.com/carbon-dating-accuracy-flaws-carbon-dating-37183.html

 

[BryanW92]

How can carbon dating be off millions of years? I could understand maybe a few hundred years, but millions of years?

Scientists have used those same methods, assumptions, and theories to date the Mt St Helens explosion at 235 Million years ago. You know, the one that erupted in 1980.

 

[ALEA40]

I think you are being called to do more exploration. As a former evolutionary biologist, I think I laughed the first time I met someone who was a creationist. I couldn't understand how anyone could believe in creation. 20 years later and here I am! Everyone's journey with Christ is different. For me, it was important for me to put my faith in the word of God, even if I didn't understand it. My favorite verse at the time was "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; In all ways submit to Him and He will make your paths straight."

I think I've read every article at ICR.org. They have an amazing group of scientists and great online archives. I have many of their books and I subscribe to their magazine, Acts and Facts.

My faith in God multiplied by a thousand when I embraced creationism. I began to see the whole world in a different way. My relationship with God is so close, so intense and so beautiful. You can see the joy God has in creation when you read Job: 38-41. When I read those words for the first time it was like I was right there with Him. I don't understand how He did it because I am not God and I will never be God. But it's enough that I can gaze upon his creation everyday and marvel at His artistry, expression, humor and kindness.

Blessing to you on your journey!

Scientists have used those same methods, assumptions, and theories to date the Mt St Helens explosion at 235 Million years ago. You know, the one that erupted in 1980.

There are so many of these examples out there!!!

 

[Vanguard PCD]

Y.E.C. is a theory. That's it, nothing more. Some people buy it, some people don't. It can't be proven beyond any doubt. It banks on Genesis being 100% literal and translated correctly from ancient Hebrew. That is a BIG gamble.

 

[Sammy-San]

Y.E.C. is a theory. That's it, nothing more. Some people buy it, some people don't. It can't be proven beyond any doubt. It banks on Genesis being 100% literal and translated correctly from ancient Hebrew. That is a BIG gamble.

Do you have any possible evidence/clues that young earth creationism may not be true?

 

[Sammy-San]

First, Wikipedia is not a scholarly source.

But it is true that a lot of evidence exists for the old earth theory, but the proof for that evidence has a lot of circular reasoning. I'd invite you to go to The Institute for Creation Research to see the other side of the story. They do make a good case for young earth theory.

I do not have a firm belief in either theory and that's OK since I don't create universes. Therefore, my "method" of doing so would not matter anyway. The rational, worldly side of me believes in the rational science that I've been taught for my whole life. The Godly, Spirit-driven side of me believes that God could create a fully functioning universe in 6 days.

But, the one thing I do know about "science" over the last 30 years is that scientists follow the money. They pursue the grants and the corporate dollars and that has shaped science. Just follow the lies of climate science since 1970. We were going into an ice age in 1970 but in 1998, we were told that we'd burn up by 2010. Its 2014 and we've given up on both, and moved past mere climate "change" and now our great scientific boogeyman is "climate disruption"! Well, duh. Climate changes. It always has and always will, but the scientists keep chasing the money.

The battle against creation science is just as corrupt. So, even if the old earth theorists are right, the well has been poisoned by the greed of the Science-Academic Complex. It has become the Military-Industrial Complex of the 21st century.

According to the young earth worldview (that the earth is about 6000 yrs old), when exactly did the Plesitocine Era happen in?

 

[KrAZeD]

Y.E.C. is a theory. That's it, nothing more. Some people buy it, some people don't. It can't be proven beyond any doubt. It banks on Genesis being 100% literal and translated correctly from ancient Hebrew. That is a BIG gamble.

No it's not a big gamble. No, it's not a theory, Either you believe Gods word or you don't, that's belief and faith. It's imperative we believe all or believe nothing, either God told us the truth or he lied. Either trust and believe God is true, he's preserved his word for us to hear and see, or believe man who thinks they know it better than the one who created it.

An if one chose to gamble like you put it-
5....And the evening and the morning were the first (Yom)long period of time
8....And the evening and the morning were the second (Yom)long period of time
13..And the evening and the morning were the third (Yom)long period of time
19..And the evening and the morning were the fourth (Yom)long period of time
******************(Yom used as it's other meaning instead of 24h day)

So was the first long period of time 10billion years and the second long period of time 10 years with the 3rd long period of time 72hours long and etc? How does one know exactly what was what here, if theirs no key identifiers then it's all speculation and irrelevant because it's all one SINGULAR LONG PERIOD OF TIME. It also seems illogical and foolish for God to break long periods of time up if their just Long periods with no relevant concepts of true time (Notice I stopped at 3- 4th day is the argument of when it was a literal 24hr day.).

Oh wait their is an identifier for all seven Yoms, the evening and morning make the identifier as the breaks of the Yom.

But if theirs an equal identifier for all 7, where's the identifier to distinguish where night and day switched from long time spans to the actual 24hr days?

The argument that their was no sun to distinguish time is semi insulting since it implies that God who gave the account to get told, was the one creating this "time", did not know that he spent eons making the earth and then 24hrs making man.

If he were to mean a long period of time them he would have left off "And the evening and the morning were the xxxx..."
--------

It is man who desires to have the creation account span billions of years to build their theory that man came from mutating apes that evolved from a mutated single cell amoeba. It's Mans desire to take the Glory away from God who created everything as he clearly says, exactly when and in what time frame. It is man trying to have science prove Gods word wrong. Which is why it's important to trust God, and believe all he has given us in his book. An know it's evil wanting to separate the believers from God through doubt and skepticism.
-----------

Though if your willing to throw out genesis for not being accurate, go ahead and throw all of exodus out as well. Exodus 20:8-11

11 reiterates the time frame of actual days for us to follow, the same pattern God used. 6 to work 1 to rest-
11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

Do you have any possible evidence/clues that young earth creationism may not be true?

Do you have any possible evidence/clues that young earth creationism is true?

I could go into my reasons, but they are theories, just like the Y.E.C. concept.

I could start with every human genetic coding for skin tone, hair color, eye color, hereditary conditions, physiology, etc., along with world wide population (how did Pacific Islanders get way out there in the first place) point to a MUCH older earth than a mere 6,000 years. That and I do not take Genesis literally.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

No it's not a big gamble. No, it's not a theory, Either you believe Gods word...

Are you aware that the Hebrew terms for light and darkness are completely different than the terms for sun and moon? Are you aware that those two different sets of terms were used in Genesis 1, during the creation phases?

No, I have no problem believing God's word. But what is God's word? Every letter in the Bible was penned by man, and subject to interpretation, translation, transliteration and...mistakes. It is human error that I do not put much faith in, especially translational error that uses "best guess" or the most traditional interpretation (which leaves room for, you guessed it, errors).

Don't bother trying to preach to me...you won't convince me of anything.

An know it's evil wanting to separate the believers from God through doubt and skepticism.

...wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

God is the all powerful, great creator...including the creation of evil, the capacity for evil, etc. One has to wonder why God doesn't just uncreate all of this evil. Why go through all the red tape, 1000s of years, war in heaven, etc. There must be a purpose and I dare say traditional Christianity has yet to define it.

BTW, which day exactly is the sabbath?

 

[dragongunner]

No it's not a big gamble. No, it's not a theory, Either you believe Gods word or you don't, that's belief and faith. It's imperative we believe all or believe nothing, either God told us the truth or he lied. Either trust and believe God is true, he's preserved his word for us to hear and see, or believe man who thinks they know it better than the one who created it.

An if one chose to gamble like you put it-
5....And the evening and the morning were the first (Yom)long period of time
8....And the evening and the morning were the second (Yom)long period of time
13..And the evening and the morning were the third (Yom)long period of time
19..And the evening and the morning were the fourth (Yom)long period of time
******************(Yom used as it's other meaning instead of 24h day)

So was the first long period of time 10billion years and the second long period of time 10 years with the 3rd long period of time 72hours long and etc? How does one know exactly what was what here, if theirs no key identifiers then it's all speculation and irrelevant because it's all one SINGULAR LONG PERIOD OF TIME. It also seems illogical and foolish for God to break long periods of time up if their just Long periods with no relevant concepts of true time (Notice I stopped at 3- 4th day is the argument of when it was a literal 24hr day.).

Oh wait their is an identifier for all seven Yoms, the evening and morning make the identifier as the breaks of the Yom.

But if theirs an equal identifier for all 7, where's the identifier to distinguish where night and day switched from long time spans to the actual 24hr days?

The argument that their was no sun to distinguish time is semi insulting since it implies that God who gave the account to get told, was the one creating this "time", did not know that he spent eons making the earth and then 24hrs making man.

If he were to mean a long period of time them he would have left off "And the evening and the morning were the xxxx..."
--------

It is man who desires to have the creation account span billions of years to build their theory that man came from mutating apes that evolved from a mutated single cell amoeba. It's Mans desire to take the Glory away from God who created everything as he clearly says, exactly when and in what time frame. It is man trying to have science prove Gods word wrong. Which is why it's important to trust God, and believe all he has given us in his book. An know it's evil wanting to separate the believers from God through doubt and skepticism.
-----------

Though if your willing to throw out genesis for not being accurate, go ahead and throw all of exodus out as well. Exodus 20:8-11

11 reiterates the time frame of actual days for us to follow, the same pattern God used. 6 to work 1 to rest-
11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

If I get you correctly....? You can't have faith in God and not believe in 24 hr. days?....it comes down to interpretation. You interpret it as 24 hr. days therefore if you don't believe that then you can't have faith. But what if you interperation is wrong? Some think the light was always the sun, how do you not know it was not something else giving that light before the sun was created.

As for your interpretation of the word "yom", I suggest you do more of a study, heres a link.

Does the Bible Say God Created the Universe in Six 24-Hour Days?


CAUTION: If you are young earth, and believe they were 24 hr. days the link above will offend you. God could of done it all in 24 hr. days, and I would have faith in that, but the scriptures just don't bear that out to me.

 

[BryanW92]

God is the all powerful, great creator...including the creation of evil, the capacity for evil, etc. One has to wonder why God doesn't just uncreate all of this evil. Why go through all the red tape, 1000s of years, war in heaven, etc. There must be a purpose and I dare say traditional Christianity has yet to define it.

There is a purpose and it has been discovered, not defined, by traditional Christianity. There is no definitive verse to quote to prove this to you, but it is found in the entirety of the bible. Not all can see this purpose because they are blinded by humanistic desires, most notably the Progressive desire to be gods ourselves. The purpose of the last 6000 years since Adam and Eve left the garden have been to train and refine humanity so that some can return to that paradise to worship and serve, yes SERVE, God forever.

Anyone who can't see that is blinded by their humanism. God is giving us the CHOICE to serve him and not to merely use him as a tool in our own humanist agendas.

 

[thesunisout]

Young earth creationists believe the earth is 6000 yrs old. Somebody at my church told me that the term "days" in Genesis in Hebrew/Greek refer to literal days. However, I have a hard time accepting that Young Earth Creationism is the truth, mainly because of pre history.

According to Wikipedia, ancient history is recorded as far back as about 5,000 years ago. Dinosaurs are accepted to have lived tens of millions of years ago. Ice age animals-like saber tooth tigers, woolly mammoths, lived tens of thousands of years ago. How does that fit into young earth creationism? Carbon dating has been proven to be accurate, btw. How would/could scientists be wrong millions/thousands of years?

The only evidence that dinosaurs coexisted with man is cave paintings that one could argue, may have been hoaxes, and I see no even remotely possible historical evidence that man coexisted with Ice age animals-like mastadons.

What are your views on young earth creationism, and my claims about it?

I grew up secular, with a firm belief in long earth ages and evolution. After I became a Christian, the Holy Spirit challenged me to look at the evidence for evolution. What I found absolutely shocked me; that it was not a hard fact as I had been taught from a young age, but a conclusion drawn from a pile of circumstantial evidence. When I found it out it would take more faith to believe in evolution and long ages than it would in Genesis, I placed my faith in the bible as being literal truth. Along the way, God has shown me that both theologically and scientifically, my faith in that is well placed.

Investigate the evidence for evolution and long ages; tear it apart and see how and why they come to the conclusions they do. Don't just listen to the secular side, see what the creation scientists have to say. God bless.

 

[BryanW92]

I grew up secular, with a firm belief in long earth ages and evolution. After I became a Christian, the Holy Spirit challenged me to look at the evidence for evolution. What I found absolutely shocked me; that it was not a hard fact as I had been taught from a young age, but a conclusion drawn from a pile of circumstantial evidence. When I found it out it would take more faith to believe in evolution and long ages than it would in Genesis, I placed my faith in the bible as being literal truth. Along the way, God has shown me that both theologically and scientifically, my faith in that is well placed.

Investigate the evidence for evolution and long ages; tear it apart and see how and why they come to the conclusions they do. Don't just listen to the secular side, see what the creation scientists have to say. God bless.

Same for me. What I believe with regards to Uniformitarianism vs Catastrophism does not affect the world one bit. But, it does affect me.

The Institute for Creation Research may not change a person's mind, but it will open it enough to let them see that the "settled science" of Uniformitarianism is not really that honest or settled.

 

[Vanguard PCD]

There is a purpose and it has been discovered, not defined, by traditional Christianity. There is no definitive verse to quote to prove this to you, but it is found in the entirety of the bible.

In other words, the Bible does not come out and say it, but humans have "read between the lines" and created a belief/tenet out of what is not actually written. That would be traditional, not biblical. There are several of those types of beliefs/tenets floating around. No verse comes out and says "when you die, you immediately go to heaven as a Christian," yet that is exactly what is taught, even though it has no direct scriptural support.

It always fascinated me that people just toss out what is found in the Book of Revelation. They ignore it as if it does not exist. Go read Revelation 20-21.

Edit: I am stepping out of this thread as it is spiraling down rapidly. Nothing to be gained by continuing.

 

[MWood]

The only way for any of us to know that the earth is only 6000 years old, is to start with the age of Adam when he died, and count forward. That only tells us how long ago it was when God formed Adam from the dust of the ground. It doesn't tell us the time from "The beginning" until Adam was formed. It doesn't tell us how long the days were ( a day of the Lord is as a thousand years?). If you read in to it that a day is just 24 hours then you are twisting scripture to fit your theory. The Bible doesn't say how long those days were. If it does then type some scripture. I haven't found it, have you?

 

[AmericanChristian91]

There are many methods/ways of dating the earth, and all of those methods point to an earth (and also the universe) being older then 6000 years (carbon dating is just 1 method, and I don't think its used to date millions of year old things). Are species alone is older then 6000 years (there are man made items/structures that are older then 6000 years, and that's just the tip of the iceberg, when it comes to evidence supporting a humanity that is older then 6000 years).

Here is an interesting article about radiometric dating.

http://www.asa3.org/ASA/resources/Wiens.html#page. 16