Wisconsin manufacturer takes away Muslim prayer breaks

[TerranceL]

Yes, let's make our jobs inaccessible to people of certain religions. That shows how free our society is!

Hey guys look, it's someone whose not read the thread nor actually looked into the issue yet felt the need to post a comment.

 

[SepiaAndDust]

Let's say that you're making hotdogs.

The dogs go through the extruder and the ovens, and they come out into your section of the process in a long, continuous casing. You gotta get them out of that casing, so you have two or three guys who run them through the stripper. Using superhuman dexterity, you pop the string of dogs onto a blade that cuts the skin-tight casing without cutting the dogs, themselves. The strings don't stop coming. If you get behind, you get a pile of encased hotdogs that you have to deal with in addition to the regular strings that keep coming and coming.

From there, they go on a conveyer belt to the hopper--just a big bin about 4 feet tall--where you have one guy who picks out the bad dogs and whatever pieces of casing made it through the stripper.

From there, the dogs go into the feeder, which puts the dogs in little hotdog-shaped molds. You have one, maybe two, guys there who make sure that the dogs are actually in the molds straight and that there aren't any empty slots. The dogs whiz by so fast that it can make you dizzy.

At the other end of the feeder is the wrapper, which puts the dogs in their little plastic packages. Gotta make sure that you have the right number of dogs in each package, and you've gotta make sure the there aren't any leakers (packages that aren't air-tight), AND you've gotta keep the trimmed plastic on the spool and not let it go down the line. Just the one guy working the wrapper.

Next is the bander, where two packages of dogs are banded together with glue and a little paper wrapper. The packages come of the wrapper so fast that you need two lines, each going to its own bander, so you need two people there, with maybe a third as backup. Assume that these banders are constantly being clogged up with glue, and the wheels need to be cleaned frequently.

The banded packages get picked up by the sorter, who makes sure that no leakers were made by the bander (hot glue and the bander wheels can do that). You have two lines, so you have two sorters.

Off to the side, there's a guy running the folder--it turns flat cardboard into folded cardboard boxes.

Last is the boxer. Just one guy who runs the boxing machine that puts the banded dogs into cardboard boxes, glues the boxes shut, and affixes a label. The boxer guy makes sure that the machine doesn't run out of labels, glue, or folded cardboard boxes.

Also, you have a couple of people working support. They keep the knives sanitized, replace plastic gloves and hand sanitizer, and help out with scraps. Their main job, though, is to relieve the people on the stripper when it's break time. When the stripper people come back from break, they relieve someone else--one might go to the hopper and the other to the boxer. When the hopper guy and the boxer guy come back, they might relieve the feeder guys. And so on.

The line doesn't stop. For twelve hours, the dogs keep coming.

Which of those people can just pop off to go pray without breaking the whole process?

 

[BrianJK]

Hey guys look, it's someone whose not read the thread nor actually looked into the issue yet felt the need to post a comment.

I read the thread... not sure what you hoped to accomplished by saying I didn't...

 

[TerranceL]

I read the thread... not sure what you hoped to accomplished by saying I didn't...

Your comment had nothing to do with the story. It sure looks like you didn't read it.

 

[BrianJK]

It was quite relevant, in my opinion. Though if you think creating a job whose rules accommodate some religions but not others is not stifling freedom, then I can see where our disagreement might come in, though disagreement might be better than just flat out accusing someone with whom you disagree of failure to be minimally informed.

 

[Queller]

Let's say that you're making hotdogs.

The dogs go through the extruder and the ovens, and they come out into your section of the process in a long, continuous casing. You gotta get them out of that casing, so you have two or three guys who run them through the stripper. Using superhuman dexterity, you pop the string of dogs onto a blade that cuts the skin-tight casing without cutting the dogs, themselves. The strings don't stop coming. If you get behind, you get a pile of encased hotdogs that you have to deal with in addition to the regular strings that keep coming and coming.

From there, they go on a conveyer belt to the hopper--just a big bin about 4 feet tall--where you have one guy who picks out the bad dogs and whatever pieces of casing made it through the stripper.

From there, the dogs go into the feeder, which puts the dogs in little hotdog-shaped molds. You have one, maybe two guys there who make sure that the dogs are actually in the molds straight and that there aren't any empty slots. The dogs whiz by so fast that it can make you dizzy.

At the other end of the feeder is the wrapper., which puts the dogs in their little plastic packages. Gotta make sure that you have the right number of dogs in each package, and you've gotta make sure the there aren't any leakers (packages that aren't air-tight), AND you've gotta keep the trimmed plastic on the spool and not let it go down the line. Just the one guy working the wrapper.

Next is the bander, where two packages of dogs are banded together with glue and a little paper wrapper. The packages come of the wrapper so fast that you need two lines, each going to its own bander, so you need two people there, with maybe a third as backup. Assume that these banders are constantly being clogged up with glue, and the wheels need to be cleaned frequently.

The banded packages get picked up by the sorter, who makes sure that no leakers were made by the bander (hot glue and the bander wheels can do that). You have two lines, so you have two sorters.

Off to the side, there's a guy running the folder--it turns flat cardboard into folded cardboard boxes.

Last is the boxer. Just one guy who runs the boxing machine that puts the banded dogs into cardboard boxes, glues the boxes shut, and affixes a label. The boxer guy makes sure that the machine doesn't run out of labels, glue, or folded cardboard boxes.

Also, you have a couple of people working support. They keep the knives sanitized, replace plastic gloves and hand sanitizer, and help out with scraps. Their main job, though, is to relieve the people on the stripper when it's break time. When the stripper people come back from break, they relieve someone else--one might go to the hopper and the other to the boxer. When the hopper guy and the boxer guy come back, they might relieve the feeder guys. And so on.

The line doesn't stop. For twelve hours, the dogs keep coming.

Which of those people can just pop off to go pray without breaking the whole process?

The same people who pop off to use the bathroom, or pop off to go smoke.

 

[TerranceL]

The same people who pop off to use the bathroom, or pop off to go smoke.

Never worked in a factory huh? None of those people can just pop off without having the work pile up.

 

[SepiaAndDust]

Never worked in a factory huh? None of those people can just pop off without having the work pile up.

People who pop off tend not to pop back in again.

 

[TerranceL]

People who pop off tend not to pop back in again.

Pretty much, factories love temp agencies for just that reason.

 

[ViaCrucis]

While I might agree that this doesn't constitute a violation of the first amendment, it is a discriminatory policy. It's akin to refusing practicing Jews from taking the Sabbath off. This is a matter of business ethics.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[SepiaAndDust]

While I might agree that this doesn't constitute a violation of the first amendment, it is a discriminatory policy. It's akin to refusing practicing Jews from taking the Sabbath off. This is a matter of business ethics.

What's the solution, then? Hire superfluous people to cover the prayer breaks? Shut down the production line while they go pray?

 

[ViaCrucis]

What's the solution, then? Hire superfluous people to cover the prayer breaks? Shut down the production line while they go pray?

My chief concern isn't that breaks aren't available, but rather that--from what it seems (I may be wrong)--the Muslim workers when hired on were allowed these breaks and thus wasn't an obstacle to hiring. The change in policy puts the workers here in the position of having to choose between the obligations of their religion and their job. I would consider placing one's employees in that position as unjust. How to resolve this is, of course, outside my experience or knowledge.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[bhsmte]

My chief concern isn't that breaks aren't available, but rather that--from what it seems (I may be wrong)--the Muslim workers when hired on were allowed these breaks and thus wasn't an obstacle to hiring. The change in policy puts the workers here in the position of having to choose between the obligations of their religion and their job. I would consider placing one's employees in that position as unjust. How to resolve this is, of course, outside my experience or knowledge.

-CryptoLutheran

Typically in these situations, it comes down to whether continuing a certain practice, puts an undue burden on the company and or other employees.

Companies don't have to accommodate everything an employee and or group demands, they only have to accommodate what is deemed; reasonable.

 

[SepiaAndDust]

My chief concern isn't that breaks aren't available, but rather that--from what it seems (I may be wrong)--the Muslim workers when hired on were allowed these breaks and thus wasn't an obstacle to hiring. The change in policy puts the workers here in the position of having to choose between the obligations of their religion and their job. I would consider placing one's employees in that position as unjust. How to resolve this is, of course, outside my experience or knowledge.

-CryptoLutheran

They were told during initial orientation that the third break may not always be available. Two breaks is pretty standard for an eight-hour shift, though I don't know how long their shifts are. I assume that they also got a lunch break in there somewhere.

 

[Queller]

Never worked in a factory huh? None of those people can just pop off without having the work pile up.

Are you seriously trying to claim that no one uses the bathroom during their factory shift? Because that has not been my experience with factory work.

 

[Landon Caeli]

But still, these "Muslims" are asking for a private room, to lay their rugs, with no outside interruptions from any other staff so that they can spend 25 to 30 minutes twice a day, on top of their regular 15 minute breaks and their designated lunch time... It's too much to ask.