Why would modern day man worship the statue image of the AC? Brought to ashes?

[Douggg]

During the last 42 months of the Antichrist rule as the Antichrist-beast (the fourth stage to the Antichrist's career) the false prophet has the world make an image of the Antichrist, which the world will be required to worship.

The question becomes why would modern day man worship such an image?

Well, it doesn't make sense, unless we consider that during that same 42 month period Satan will have been cast down to earth. Satan's long term agenda has been to be worshiped as God.

When the Antichrist, in the third stage of his career as the revealed man of sin, goes into the temple (to be rebuilt on at least the 15ft x 30ft minimum size) and claims to be God - it will be as God in the flesh. God, in Ezekiel 28, in the first ten verses, has him killed for this outrageous action.

In Isaiah 14, the Antichrist, slain, the mortally wounded 7th head in Revelation 13:1-2, who God in His disdain for him will cast him out of the grave, in Isaiah 14, bringing him back to life = as the strong delusion that God will send to them who believed the Antichrist's claim to start with.

That will cause them upon the earth to believe his claim of being God come in flesh. A take off of Jesus being God come in the flesh. So we read in Revelation 13:3-4.

3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?


Why would the world worship the dragon - Satan? I don't think they will - knowingly.


The image of the Antichrist that the false prophet has the world itself make, a statue - the world will be keenly aware that it has no virtue of its own to be worshiping it. But what if it is Satan, who uses the statue, as the vehicle, to speak to the people, under the deception as being God speaking to the people? Different story. And it is passed off as that is God speaking to the people - which by lying miracle will seem to be verified by the inert statue coming to life. I think modern man would worship the image, thinking that they are worshiping God speaking to them through the image.



15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.


So people of the world will not be worshiping the image of it's own accord, because they are the ones who will have made the statue image themselves. But by having them make the image themselves - that will be part of the grand deception that it is God who is speaking to them through the statue image - they will worship the image thinking they are worshiping God being present in the image, when it comes to life and speaks . The person who will actually be speaking through the image - will be Satan - and that the coming alive of the image will be like the two magicians of Pharaoh's court did in Exodus making the two sticks come alive into serpents.


The day that Jesus returns, the brightness of His coming will dissolve away the facade of the image, and there will be Satan, exposed to the entire world, as he is. In fulfillment of Ezekiel 28:



18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.


The ashes will be that dissolved statue image facade.

 

[Bible2]

Douggg said in post 1:

The question becomes why would modern day man worship such an image?

Because it could be amazing.

The "image of the beast" (Revelation 13:15) could be an android image of the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) which the Antichrist's False Prophet (Revelation 13:11-16, Revelation 19:20) could cause to be made after the Antichrist receives a terrible head wound (Revelation 13:3,14b). For this injury could leave the Antichrist's facial and bodily appearance permanently marred, and could render him unable to speak clearly, like someone after a bad stroke, so that the Antichrist won't want to appear or speak in public again.

Did you ever see that movie "Dave"? It had a President who was in a coma, so his handlers found a regular guy who looked exactly like the President, and had him be a public stand-in for the President. He was able to speak just like the President did. It could be like that with the Antichrist's image. It could be the Antichrist's "Dave", his double, that appears and speaks (Revelation 13:15) before the world instead of his wounded self. But instead of letting people think that the Antichrist's android image is the Antichrist himself, the False Prophet could tell people from the beginning that the image isn't the Antichrist himself, but still fully represents him.

In Revelation 13:15, the original Greek word translated as "life" or "breath" (pneuma, G4151) can mean "spirit" in the sense of consciousness (1 Corinthians 2:11a, Luke 1:47), so that the android could appear to have a spirit, to have consciousness. The way this could be achieved would be through the android having wireless connections to huge banks of supercomputers running advanced artificial intelligence software. The False Prophet could claim that the Antichrist's consciousness dwells within the android by means of neural networks imprinted with the Antichrist's brain patterns. But this could be a lie, in that the android won't actually have the Antichrist's consciousness, or any true consciousness, but will only appear to have consciousness, by its being able to pass even the most stringent Turing Test. This is a test whereby one speaks with a computer and can't tell whether it has consciousness or not, because all of its answers are the same as if it had consciousness.

But the android's "consciousness" could appear far more advanced than any human's, for it could have access to huge databases containing every fact known to man, so that the android will appear to be omniscient. In this way, it could convince the world that it is not just a machine, but a material incarnation, a machine avatar, of the true God, a literal "deus ex machina", a literal "God from a machine". And this machine "God" could boast not only of his mental powers, but also of his physical powers: he could be extremely strong. And he could boast of the "immortality" of his machine body, which could be made of titanium, covered with some practically-everlasting flesh-like silicone. People could just be completely awestruck by his (what they could call) "omniscient wisdom, his strength, his indestructibility". They could consider him more than worthy of worship by (in their words) "mere humanity, which is so mentally and physically limited, made out of mere flesh and blood, which is so weak and so mortal". The world will actually worship the Antichrist's image (Revelation 13:15), just as it will actually worship Lucifer (the dragon, Satan) and the Antichrist (Revelation 13:4,8, Revelation 12:9).

The Antichrist's image could be placed standing in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem, so that the image will become the abomination of desolation (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31). And in order to make it easy for everyone in the world to be able to see the image and worship it (Revelation 13:15), it could appear on every smartphone, television, computer, GPS navigation system, and electronic billboard at set times each day. And to make it possible for everyone to interact with it personally, it could appear as a computer generated image on each individual's smartphone, speaking in and understanding each individual's language, conversing with each individual with personalized messages and responses devised by supercomputers running artificial intelligence and language software.

And it could discuss with them even the most intimate details of their lives, for it could have access to huge databases compiled by the Antichrist's worldwide intelligence, law enforcement, economic, and health agencies, databases containing all the facts about everyone: who their family and friends are, where they live and work, who their neighbors and coworkers are, how much they make, what cars and properties they own and use, where they go, where they shop, what they buy, where they eat out, what shows and videos they watch, what they read, what they say, what they post on the internet, what their health problems are, etc., so that the Antichrist's image could seem to know everything about everyone.

And the worship of the image could be connected with a daily surveillance and subjugation of everyone. For the image's supercomputers could make his image automatically appear on everyone's smartphone at set times every day to be worshipped. And smartphones contain GPS chips which can be secretly pinged in order to determine the exact location of the smartphones. So when the image appears on everyone's smartphone, the image's supercomputers could ping the GPS chip of everyone's smartphone and know exactly where everyone is.

Also, smartphones contain cameras and microphones, which can be remotely opened secretly in order to see and hear what is going on around the smartphones. So when the image appears on everyone's smartphone, the image's supercomputers could open the cameras and microphones of everyone's smartphone to determine what everyone is doing and saying, and the image could then demand that the individuals worship him as God, saying some set prayer of praise and adoration. And if any individual refuses, the image's supercomputers could detect that individual's noncompliance, and notify the nearest police officers of that individual's exact location, and order the officers to arrest that individual for blasphemy and treason. The offending individual could then be given a chance to be "reformed" (i.e. in a brainwashing camp, or through physical torture, if necessary), but if he proves recalcitrant, he will be executed (Revelation 13:15) by being beheaded (Revelation 20:4).

The beheading process itself could be made into a televised and webcasted spectacle, to serve not only as a dire warning to anyone thinking of refusing to worship the image, but also to serve as an amazingly-horrific entertainment for the masses, like how the ancient Romans made it an entertainment for the masses to gather them into the Colosseum in Rome and let them watch Christians being thrown to lions and devoured alive.

Huge beheading structures could be built, by which twenty "traitors" could be beheaded at one time by one fall of one blade. The "traitors" could be bound in a row along an upright "U"-shaped device with a track for a large guillotine blade, which could start out in a resting position at the top of one side. The blade could be so massive and so sharp, that when it is released, it will easily slice down through 10 necks on one side of the "U" and continue on by its own momentum up the other side of the "U", shearing off another 10 heads. This all could happen so quickly that it will appear as if all 20 heads are struck off almost in unison, followed immediately by 20 geysers of blood rushing out in unison for all the Antichrist's "faithful" to gawk at and cheer over in the comfort of their own homes before their televisions and computers.

Also, immediately after the show is over, at the site where it took place, teams of surgeons could rush in to "harvest" all the fresh organs and other body parts from the beheaded bodies to be used for transplants (beheading being the best way for a body to die if you want to harvest its parts). What is left of the bodies could then be stuffed into shipping containers, which, once full, could be stacked like stones into a gigantic "Pyramid of Death", which could eventually reach some 30 stories high and contain tens of millions of bodies. A huge plaque could be erected in front of the Pyramid that will read: "This is a monument to the shame of YHWH, who created everything to die". (Of course, the truth is that he didn't, for he created Adam and Eve immortal; it wasn't until they sinned that they became mortal: Genesis 2:17. And YHWH will restore immortality to saved humans through Jesus Christ: Romans 6:23. Also, any such plaque would be hypocritical, for it will be the Antichrist who will have murdered the people entombed in the Pyramid, not YHWH. And so it will actually be a monument to how those who hate YHWH and his wisdom, love death: Proverbs 8:36b.)

Regarding the worship of the Antichrist's image, to help foster a group dynamic, every neighborhood and village in the world could be helped to create a group worship center in which everyone in that neighborhood or village will have to gather together at a set time each evening to bow down and prostrate himself or herself before a life-size, lifelike image of the Antichrist, which could be a computer-generated, animated, holographic or widescreen 3D HDTV image of him clothed in beautiful golden robes and standing majestically before them (or sitting on a magnificent golden throne), and speaking computer-generated customized messages to them as a group.

This worship could be accompanied by the most beautiful symphonic music (cf. Daniel 3:5), or whatever is the most beautiful music to the local people, to help them (in the words of the Antichrist's propaganda machine) "be uplifted into the true spirit of praise and worship of our Great Lord and Master. Praised be His Majestic Name forever and ever!", etc. And what with the wonderful music, and all their fellow worshippers around them, and customized messages of encouragement spoken in a deep, soothing voice by a life-size, holographic or 3D HDTV image of the Antichrist to certain members of each "worship group", it could be that some people in each group will start to really get into the evening worship sessions, and even begin to (in their words) "truly feel the Living Presence of our loving God among us, loving us so tenderly, so personally! Oh, how I love Him! He is So Great!"

But the world's worship of the Antichrist's image (Revelation 13:15), no matter how blissful it may become for some people, and the world's worship of the Antichrist and Lucifer (Satan) the dragon (Revelation 13:4, Revelation 12:9), will last for less than 4 years (Revelation 13:5, Daniel 12:11-12) before Jesus Christ returns from heaven and completely defeats the Antichrist and Lucifer and the Antichrist's False Prophet (Revelation 19:20 to 20:3), and Jesus then sets up his own, 1,000-year physical kingdom on the earth with the bodily resurrected church (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29).

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[Douggg]

Hi Doug,

Do you understand Aorist tense as to verbs in Revelation?
I'm asking because, why do I sometimes find a word listed twice in a row within
verses? Rev.13 is one of those passages, as it has wondered wondered after the beast. Do you know why wondered is there two times?

My guess is that when John sees the vision, everyone is worshiping the beast and Satan. John sees things actively taking place in the vision, instead of just telling about a prophecy that will happen.

John also would have read the name of the beast on peoples foreheads and right hands, and knew what it was, but back in Revelation 10 was told not to write certain things down - which I am pretty sure one of those things is the actual name of beast.

The one thing John did reveal that the number of the beast's name was the number of a man, so from that it is certain that the one they were worshiping was a man - and not some angel.

 

[random person]

I think this thread is taking creative liberties with scripture.


Please remember Revelation is heavy and loaded with symbolism.

Nero's suicide before the siege of Jerusalem was finished and the destruction of the Second Temple maybe the terrible head wound.

 

[Douggg]

I think this thread is taking creative liberties with scripture.


Please remember Revelation is heavy and loaded with symbolism.

Nero's suicide before the siege of Jerusalem was finished and the destruction of the Second Temple maybe the terrible head wound.

The thread is not about the wounded head on the beast, but "why would modern man worship the statue image of the AC? Brought to ashes."

There is another thread called "head wound".

 

[Echolipse]

While yes, Bible2's account could be true, the other fact could be that the people will just follow blindly. Since we as Americans know how that could happen so easily.

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[Douggg]

At the time of Rev. 13 when the deadly wound is healed, it is not yet time
for the mark of the beast, right? So this means a beast is worshipped before the little horn mouth comes.

The little horn in Daniel 7 is the Antichrist. In Daniel 7 it doesn't address the other three stages (which are in subsequent passages in the bible). So Daniel 7 just talks about the little horn as going all the way through until Jesus returns bringing the kingdom of God here to earth.

Daniel 7 covers the period when the little horn first comes on the scene in the EU, which will be before Gog/Magog, and before the 7 years begin - all the way through till when Jesus returns. So the little horn is the Antichrist for a 7+ years timeframe. Could be 10 years.

When in Daniel 7, the Antichrist little horn (as he is called in that Chapter) start speaking the great things against God - then yes to your question, he will have entered the Antichrist-beast stage.

The beast and the dragon are worshipped but this is not yet a cause to make one lose their salvation forever? I don't get it. What do you think about what the word worship means in Rev. 13? It almost seems as if the ten-horned kingdom is around for a-while before the little horn mouth ever shows up and he is then worshipped by only part of the world. Yet, earlier all the world worships the beast that is healed.

I didn't say anything about not losing the chance for salvation. It maybe though that them who take the mark, the 666, or the name have gone too far, to be saved. But I really wasn't addressing that issue.

The world is not going to worship a kingdom, but the king of that kingdom. It is not a kingdom that will be mortally wounded and healed, but the king of that kingdom. That king will be the little horn, after he has gone through the King of Israel mashiah stage, and then the revealed man of sin stage. It is in the man of stage, when he goes into the temple and claims to be God, sometime in the middle of the seven years, that God has him killed - mortally wounded. That is the mortally wounded head.

Rev. 12 only links the scarlet beast as to not being worshipped by those who have their names not blotted out of the Lamb's book of life.

A mouth would need to be added via a new horn - or head -or another entire beast, wouldn't it? When the mouth that speaks great things comes on the scene, then are we to take that as a new horn shows up?

The six heads are former Caesars; Julius, Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, Nero. They are done, over, finished. So we don't have to be concerned about those six kings anymore. The only guy left is the end times little horn.

He is going to be assertive when he first comes on the scene, but won't be attacking God then. It is not until mid-way through the seven years and claims to be God, is killed, comes back to life, possessed by the unclean spirit of the beast, that he goes on the rampage bragging and cursing God and them in heaven.

Rev. 13:7
"And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things..."

The beast out of the sea already had a mouth.

"...the mouth of a lion..."

Exactly, one mouth. So the other six heads don't have mouths, because they are d-e-a-d, long time ago, the six Caesars... and don't have much to say in the end times.

The one mortally wounded head is the Antichrist revealed man of sin killed, so that shuts him up as well, until he comes back alive as the beast, which is him possessed by the unclean spirit coming out of the bottomless pit - then he starts going full mouth against God and them in heaven.

The one mouth doing the talking is the Antichrist, that part of the overall beast kingdom.

The world though doesn't worship a kingdom, but the king which will be the Antichrist after he has entered the Antichrist-beast stage of his career in Revelation 13 with 42 months left.

 

[Douggg]

Hi Douggg,

Sorry to have to add another post so quickly, but I forgot
to ask you something.

Do you think that the dragon is cast out of heaven for ever by the time
he gives the beast out of the sea his seat?

Yes.

If, so, did the dragon begin a war at this point, and this is how the beast gets deadly wounded? Is that why the people will remark as to -who can make war with him-?

The Antichrist will enter the Antichrist beast stage in the middle part of the 7 years, but before the end of the two witnesses 1260 day testimony, because it is as the beast that he has them killed. On day 1260.

They lay in the street for 3 1/2 days, so the world is celebrating saying who can make war against the beast - in Revelation 13. So 1260 + that 3 1/2 days, that leaves 1256.5 days in the seven years, that is why it says 42 months in Revelation 13. It is almost 42 months, but not to the very day. During those 42 months the Antichrist-beast will be out of control, without the two witnesses to keep him off-balance.

When the two witnesses come back alive, they ascend, having not loved their lives, dying, for the sake of the testimony of Jesus. Their deaths will be last straw, that God puts up with Satan's accusations, and the 7th trumpet blows. The first action in the process of making the kingdoms of the world the kingdoms of God and His Christ, will be to kick Satan out of heaven, which technically is the second heaven, down to earth. Babylon is fallen is fallen will be the saying, Satan's principality has been cast down, which will be by the war in heaven. Satan doesn't initiate the war, God does. He has Michael and his angels overpower Satan and his angels and cast them down to earth.

The beast, the head which is mortally wounded and healed, has nothing to do with Satan and the war in heaven. The head is the Antichrist, who after he goes into the temple and claims to be God, for that act God has him killed and brought down into hell.

Then in His disdain for the Antichrist, God brings him back to life, to carry out the remainder to the end times events to end the age, and to finish off Satan - to be cast into the bottomless pit. Until the end of the thousand years, briefly, unitl he is cast into the lake of fire.

The dragon comes down knowing that he has but a short time.
Does this time begin before the beast out of the sea has his deadly wound healed? Is this the time of woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea - for the devil is come down unto you-?

No, it is after the head is mortally wounded. After head comes back to life.
After the unclean spirit of the beast ascends out of the bottomless pit. And after the two witnesses ascend.

The third woe in Revelation 11, comes after the two witnesses ascend. The
third woe is Satan being cast down to earth with the time, times, half times left. Which will be a little be less than 42 months, but we don't know how much less.

1260 days - testimony of the two witnesses
......42 months - the time of the beast after the two witnesses ascend.
............time, times, half time - the time Satan has left after he is cast down

How does this fit with the new world order type of government and the bankers/elite?

We don't have enough information on how to factor all those issues in. The radio talk show people know generalities regarding bible prophecy, and use prophecy in sound bite fashion.

 

[ebedmelech]

Modern man is worshiping many antichrists! Which is why in this day and age an image most likely would not be worshiped. It would more likely be individuals/entities that are worshiped.

This is another reason this weighs heavily toward 68-70 AD where images were worshiped and failure to do so could very well result in death.

Then there's also the question...where is it said the beast is antichrist? The fact is, it doesn't. It takes one back to 1 John and 2 John...the only places the term is used. Of course taking the way John defines antichrist, it can be individuals/entities...and we have many of those that are antichrist...Israel included.

 

[Douggg]

Modern man is worshiping many antichrists! Which is why in this day and age an image most likely would not be worshiped. It would more likely be individuals/entities that are worshiped.

This is another reason this weighs heavily toward 68-70 AD where images were worshiped and failure to do so could very well result in death.

eb, please give the specifics of 68-70 AD of said images coming to life, speaking, and demanding worship.

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

 

[Just The Facts]

Hi Dougg

First no where does it say it is a statue it says image....To say that it is statue is a rather large assumption. An image can be a painting a photo a tv screen or even an idea or memory. For example, we have all heard the expression "I have an image in my mind of what I want to do", Or I have an Image in my mind of what it will look like.

Every one in this forum has an image in their mind of what Jesus return will be like. For that matter not one single person has ever met Jesus we all believe by faith by our mental and spiritual image of Jesus. Jesus and his life and sacrifice is an image in our minds that touches our soul and there for we believe.

This being true..... to say that he forces everyone to make an image and worship it could very well mean he forces everyone to see it in their mind in a particular way........ in their mind believing what is not true. That is to say he deceives them. This would also fit with what Paul says here.

[9] The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders, [10] and with all wicked deception for those who are to perish, 11: And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

The other thing that really needs to be considered is that it is a Beast.............. and Daniel is very clear a Beast is a Kingdom. Having said that Revelation clearly refers to the Final King of the Kingdom in Rev 17 as a Beast in the pit.

So the questions we are left with are this

1. Is the deadly head wound to the King or the Kingdom.
2. Is the image that is worshipped the image of the King or the Kingdom.
3. Is the image a mental image or Idea.......... or is it a literal image.

 

[Douggg]

Hi Dougg

First no where does it say it is a statue it says image....To say that it is statue is a rather large assumption. An image can be a painting a photo a tv screen or even an idea or memory. For example, we have all heard the expression "I have an image in my mind of what I want to do", Or I have an Image in my mind of what it will look like.

It will be a statue for two reasons.

(1) Antiochus's historical act in Daniel 11 of placing a statue of Zeus in the temple defines what will the Abomination of Desolation in Daniel 11:31, "placing" the abomination of desolation.

(2) Jesus references Daniel 11-12, via spoken of by the prophet Daniel. Jesus said "stand" in the holy place. So that infers a statue. Daniel 12 also says "set up" also an indication it will be a statue.

The other thing that really needs to be considered is that it is a Beast.............. and Daniel is very clear a Beast is a Kingdom. Having said that Revelation clearly refers to the Final King of the Kingdom in Rev 17 as a Beast in the pit.

In Revelation 17, the beast is in the pit, and doesn't come out until king 7 short time is over.

So the questions we are left with are this

1. Is the deadly head wound to the King or the Kingdom.

It is not a question because it says the heads are the place where the woman sits and there are seven kings associated with that place.

2. Is the image that is worshipped the image of the King or the Kingdom.

Again this is not a question because the beast that is worshiped will be cast alive into the lake of fire, and the number of the beast's name is the number of a man. And the ten kings give their kingdom to that beast, as it says in Revelation 17.

3. Is the image a mental image or Idea.......... or is it a literal image.

A statue image. Which is appear to come to life. Which when Jesus returns can be turned to "ashes", to fulfill Ezekiel 28.

 

[Interplanner]

Doug wrote:
(1) Antiochus's historical act in Daniel 11 of placing a statue of Zeus in the temple defines what will the Abomination of Desolation in Daniel 11:31, "placing" the abomination of desolation.

Try to dis-assume Doug. Keep all the options on the table. Your next line also says Jesus is quoting Dan 11-12 about the AofD. Really? Who says? Why not 9? Why not 8? Can we read 9 without 8? Who says? Can we read 11-12 without 9? Who says?

The climate of the times Jesus was speaking of was 'wars and revolutions' (which the 1st cent was) and the first time the AofD-type of expression is used, it is the 'rebellion/revolution that desolates' (ie the leader of that).

As an ex. of how fixed we can be in our assumptions, BW complained after several months to me that I was just making up this thing about the 'rebellion that desolates.' I have no idea why other than presumption. It's 8:13 and it seems to be what the 4th kingdom encounters when it rules over Israel.

As with "the end" in the intro of Mt 24 & //s, keep all options option for as long as you possibly can. There are good reasons for them.

 

[Douggg]

Doug wrote:
(1) Antiochus's historical act in Daniel 11 of placing a statue of Zeus in the temple defines what will the Abomination of Desolation in Daniel 11:31, "placing" the abomination of desolation.

Try to dis-assume Doug. Keep all the options on the table. Your next line also says Jesus is quoting Dan 11-12 about the AofD. Really? Who says? Why not 9? Why not 8? Can we read 9 without 8? Who says? Can we read 11-12 without 9? Who says?

Jesus wasn't quoting but referring to Daniel the prophet and the abomination of desolation, which we find abomination of desolation in the text only in Daniel 11 and 12.

The climate of the times Jesus was speaking of was 'wars and revolutions' (which the 1st cent was) and the first time the AofD-type of expression is used, it is the 'rebellion/revolution that desolates' (ie the leader of that).

Well, you only have to read what it says in Daniel 11 and 12 about the abomination of desolation, to know that the abomination of desolation is not a rebellion/revolution.

As an ex. of how fixed we can be in our assumptions, BW complained after several months to me that I was just making up this thing about the 'rebellion that desolates.' I have no idea why other than presumption. It's 8:13 and it seems to be what the 4th kingdom encounters when it rules over Israel.

If you are talking about at the end of Matthew 23, and Jesus looking upon Jerusalem and saying your house is made desolate - that's the 70 AD event.

The Matthew 24 abomination of desolation is end times.

As with "the end" in the intro of Mt 24 & //s, keep all options option for as long as you possibly can. There are good reasons for them.

The Antichrist that shall come will have to be King of Israel mashaich (instead of Jesus), the unioned one country like in the days of Solomon in order for the Antichrist to fill that role. That brings us to 1948/1967.