Why will every knee bow?

[oi_antz]

Wake up without a body? Are you kidding me??? C'mon dude! Remember who you are talking to here (LOL)

Ken

That is the reality we are discussing.

 

[Ken-1122]

You get to do what you want to do, but what do you really want to do?

Enjoy life

Do you want to be like God Himself?

No I'm happy being the best that I can be; warts and all.

Whatever you do is out a gratitude for what has already been done for you and not to “payback” or get something more (you have it since you have the Birthright that includes heaven).

But not everything we do is out of gratitude; some things we do because we enjoy it and some of those things have been defined as "sin" according to your bible.

The perceived pleasures of sin are a very strong incentive to not want Godly type Love (being unselfish). If you do not want to be unselfish than you would not be happy around God and heaven would be totally undesirable since it is one huge Love feast (this Love is only Godly type Love).

They aren't just perceived as pleasures, they are pleasures, and they have nothing to do with being selfish. I can be the most unselfish person on earth and still sin.
But getting back to my point, do you think maybe the restrictions and cost are the reasons people are unwilling to accept this "charity" as you call it?

Ken

 

[bling]

]

Enjoy life

Well here in lies the first problem. This world is not a happy place and is not intended to be a happy place. You can have true “joy” in fulfilling your objective and serving others, but there will always be opportunities (problems) that you can cease. Heaven is a place of rest and not this earth.

No I'm happy being the best that I can be; warts and all.

Here in lies the second problem. God wants to help you, so if you feel no need of help, God will be found helping others, hopefully through true Christians. We just might have to wait until you first feel the need.

But not everything we do is out of gratitude; some things we do because we enjoy it and some of those things have been defined as "sin" according to your bible.

Third problem: As a hell bound non Christian there is really nothing you should be grateful to God about. You have to accept God’s charity first in order to feel grateful.

They aren't just perceived as pleasures, they are pleasures, and they have nothing to do with being selfish. I can be the most unselfish person on earth and still sin.
But getting back to my point, do you think maybe the restrictions and cost are the reasons people are unwilling to accept this "charity" as you call it?

In general “sin” is doing stuff that hurts others. Christ was the most “unselfish person that was ever on this earth” and people that today follow in His footsteps can be similarly unselfish. If you are unselfish than you are always doing the best for the sake of other people and not hurting them (sin).

You are restricted by your own desires (anxiety over things), surrendering to God would free you of those anxieties. You do need to do a cost benefit analysis and really weigh the benefits.

 

[razeontherock]

They aren't just perceived as pleasures, they are pleasures, and they have nothing to do with being selfish.

Living for pleasure isn't selfish?!? You're kidding, right? You named 3 specific "pleasures;" pot, alcohol, and pre-marital sex. Jesus said to count the cost of the tower you're going to build, and you've decided the cost is too great to start.

Now you may have noticed, people like to opine about what the true cost of that choice will be, in the final analysis. Some insist it is eternal torment. Others say annihilation, whereby you'll be reduced to ashes, which may take some time of suffering but is finite. What I consistently point out is that WE DON'T KNOW. All Judgment is given to the Son! He can do any of the above,
as well as any other option He sees fit. How do you think He will react to someone that sees as clearly as you do, and knowingly rejects all He has done? You might start with, if you had gone through all that for someone, could you predict your response?

I can be the most unselfish person on earth and still sin.

How? Serious question. Name you sin you could commit.

 

[Ken-1122]

Well here in lies the first problem. This world is not a happy place and is not intended to be a happy place. You can have true “joy” in fulfilling your objective and serving others, but there will always be opportunities (problems) that you can cease. Heaven is a place of rest and not this earth.

For me this world IS a happy place. Sure it ain’t perfect but there is a heck of a lot more good going on than bad (in my life at least) I don’t know what has happened to you that has caused you to have such a sad outlook on life but I can only hope that you figure out a way to make your life as happy as I have made mine. If you would like some pointers, just let me know.

in general “sin” is doing stuff that hurts others.

Not sure how you define sin, but as I said before, there are many actions people do that many Christians define as sin and they don’t hurt anyone. This is probably the main reason people are unwilling to accept your God’s charity.


Ken

 

[Ken-1122]

Living for pleasure isn't selfish?!?
You're kidding, right? You named 3 specific "pleasures;" pot, alcohol, and pre-marital sex. Jesus said to count the cost of the tower you're going to build, and you've decided the cost is too great to start.

Hold up! Let’s keep things in context. First I never said anything about “living for pleasure”, second what I listed does not necessarily apply to me, I was just giving examples of things people enjoy doing that don’t harm anyone and many Christians deem as “sin”. I suspect many people are reluctant to take Christianity seriously because they don’t want to give up the little pleasures that Christianity deem unacceptable.

How do you think He will react to someone that sees as clearly as you do, and knowingly rejects all He has done? You might start with, if you had gone through all that for someone, could you predict your response?

If I did something for someone without their permission or request, I would have no right to become offended if they don’t appreciate what I did for them; I would assume they did not value what I did, and possibly may have become offended by what I did.
My response would be to no longer do anything for them unless they ask me to. What would your response be?

How? Serious question. Name you sin you could commit.

Making love to my girlfriend is a sin that doesn’t harm anyone.

Ken

 

[someguy14]

Come on Ken. Just believe. Take God for His word.

 

[Ken-1122]

Come on Ken. Just believe. Take God for His word.

Belief happens after reason and logic demands it; NOT before. I am no more able to believe what some guys claimed God did than you are able to believe you can fly like a bird if you tried.
Sometimes reason and logic does not demand belief.

Ken

 

[oi_antz]

Belief happens after reason and logic demands it; NOT before. I am no more able to believe what some guys claimed God did than you are able to believe you can fly like a bird if you tried.
Sometimes reason and logic does not demand belief.

Ken

You can believe if you think about it. You did not think about what you will do when you wake with no body. Why don't you want to think about that?

 

[Ken-1122]

You can believe if you think about it.

No more than you can believe you can fly like a bird if you thought about it!

You did not think about what you will do when you wake with no body. Why don't you want to think about that?

I will do the same thing you will do when you wake up facing Ahura Mazda and he asks why you spent your entire life ignoring him; the true God while worshiping your fake one.
In my opinion, nobody has ever waken up facing Ahura Mazda, and nobody has ever waken up without a body, so for me it isn't worth a second thought.

Ken

 

[brinny]

No more than you can believe you can fly like a bird if you thought about it!

I will do the same thing you will do when you wake up facing Ahura Mazda and he asks why you spent your entire life ignoring him; the true God while worshiping your fake one.
In my opinion, nobody has ever waken up facing Ahura Mazda, and nobody has ever waken up without a body, so for me it isn't worth a second thought.

Ken

how would they report it if they did?

Do you know about the realm of the dead?

 

[jpcedotal]

The saddest thing is that even though every knee will bow, there will still be some who will acknowledge that Jesus the Christ and that God is real....and stand back up and say no.

 

[bling]

For me this world IS a happy place. Sure it ain’t perfect but there is a heck of a lot more good going on than bad (in my life at least) I don’t know what has happened to you that has caused you to have such a sad outlook on life but I can only hope that you figure out a way to make your life as happy as I have made mine. If you would like some pointers, just let me know.

Although I look upon or the tragedies in this world as being opportunities, it is still extremely sad I have to have all these opportunities.

It is a Joy, privilege and honor to allow Christ to work through me, but it is hard to see/feel people hurting.

I realize the world is the best place for willing humans to accept God’s help (which is good in a way), but that also means a lot of hurting people are here.

I realize heaven awaits those that have accepted God’s help, but heaven is still far off.

Do you empathies with the people that are suffering in this world?

Not sure how you define sin, but as I said before, there are many actions people do that many Christians define as sin and they don’t hurt anyone. This is probably the main reason people are unwilling to accept your God’s charity.

If people are defining actions that do not hurt others as being sin, they are not interpreting scripture the way I see it.

 

[Ken-1122]

how would they report it if they did?

Do you know about the realm of the dead?

I'm not the one claiming the possibility of people waking up without a body..... do you know about the realm of the dead?

K

 

[Ken-1122]

Although I look upon or the tragedies in this world as being opportunities, it is still extremely sad I have to have all these opportunities.

It is a Joy, privilege and honor to allow Christ to work through me, but it is hard to see/feel people hurting.

I realize the world is the best place for willing humans to accept God’s help (which is good in a way), but that also means a lot of hurting people are here.

I realize heaven awaits those that have accepted God’s help, but heaven is still far off.

Do you empathies with the people that are suffering in this world?

Yes I do.

If people are defining actions that do not hurt others as being sin, they are not interpreting scripture the way I see it.

Perhaps the reason people are unwilling to accept the charity is because of the way some christians interpert scripture; ya think?

Ken

 

[Ken-1122]

The saddest thing is that even though every knee will bow, there will still be some who will acknowledge that Jesus the Christ and that God is real....and stand back up and say no.

Shouldn't be too surprising; how would you react if you found yourself before Vinishu someday and he wanted you to bow; would you comply? I bet many christians would not.

Ken

 

[razeontherock]

Making love to my girlfriend is a sin that doesn’t harm anyone.

That has nothing to do with the conversation. I asked you to name one sin you could do without being selfish. Others here can explain how this is selfish, even though you may perceive it as giving.

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by Ken-1122
No more than you can believe you can fly like a bird if you thought about it!

I will do the same thing you will do when you wake up facing Ahura Mazda and he asks why you spent your entire life ignoring him; the true God while worshiping your fake one.
In my opinion, nobody has ever waken up facing Ahura Mazda, and nobody has ever waken up without a body, so for me it isn't worth a second thought.

Ken

Originally Posted by brinny
how would they report it if they did?

Do you know about the realm of the dead?

I'm not the one claiming the possibility of people waking up without a body..... do you know about the realm of the dead?

K

Since no one here has been to the realm of the dead, who's to say that people will not wake up without a body?

i get my information about the realm of the dead from what God's Word says about it. it doesn't sound very welcoming.

 

[Ken-1122]

That has nothing to do with the conversation. I asked you to name one sin you could do without being selfish. Others here can explain how this is selfish, even though you may perceive it as giving.

You are right! Allow me to restate. Making love to my girlfriend is a sin and it is not a selfish act.

Ken

 

[razeontherock]

Well at least we have the statement out there, clearly. Who's gonna rebut this one?

Clearly it's still selfish in the sense of being done for pleasure, putting that over and above the revealed will of G-d, rather than surrendering that over to Him. Can we agree on that much?