Why The Trinity is a False Teaching - Summarized Doctrinal Reasons

[cgaviria]

1 Cor 2:14 is all I can say........

Well, you can go ahead and continue sinning, and blame the weakness of your flesh. I, on the other hand, actually want to get saved and not live a lie, and I also don't want to be found at fault in anything I do, so I will continue abstaining from sin. We'll see who has the better outcome, the one who stopped sinning according to the teaching of Jesus and the apostles, or the one who continued sinning and blamed it on being "weak", etc.

 

[cgaviria]

Yes, I'm well aware of that. But a person can sincerely repent of a sin, determine not to do it again, and slip up. Or move away from Jesus and allow the devil to get in - or just because they are weak.

I mean, you're still committing the sin of judgementalism - although you probably think you're not, so won't have repented.



And I have never said that it does. I specifically said that if someone claims to have repented and to love God and they continually and deliberately carry on sinning, there would be every reason to question their sincerity.



I don't believe anything of the sort, so that is a totally foolish and idiotic post.

These slip ups are exactly the problem. I'm trying to show you guys through scripture that the holy spirit prevents these slip ups because he removes all manner of evil desire that wouldve caused a slip up.

 

[cgaviria]

You are already a false teacher, you just dont know it yet......

You are actually and it is you that doesnt know it.

 

[civilwarbuff]

I, on the other hand, actually want to get saved and not live a lie,

So, what is stopping you?....your fear of not living up to your own standard that you have established?

so I will continue abstaining from sin.

Ah, so you do have the HS even though you have claimed you dont. Because you can't abstain from sin unless you have the HS but you say you don't have the HS so how can you abstain from sin?

 

[Strong in Him]

If someone truly loves God and knows his love, mercy and forgiveness, they will have no desire to sin and to hurt him - and almost certainly won't do it deliberately and continuously. They are not, and do not become, perfect; as you, yourself, said, no one is.
That is very different from thinking, "I can do whatever I please, even break the law, just say "oh sorry," and God has to forgive." The Church at Corinth believed that and Paul had some pretty harsh words for them.

 

[cgaviria]

So, what is stopping you?....your fear of not living up to your own standard that you have established?

Ah, so you do have the HS even though you have claimed you dont. Because you can't abstain from sin unless you have the HS but you say you don't have the HS so how can you abstain from sin?

It is the standard of scripture, not my own. My own standards wont save me, the standards of God through the belief in Jesus Christ will. I have very little to say to you, except repent.

 

[cgaviria]

If someone truly loves God and knows his love, mercy and forgiveness, they will have no desire to sin and to hurt him - and almost certainly won't do it deliberately and continuously. They are not, and do not become, perfect; as you, yourself, said, no one is.
That is very different from thinking, "I can do whatever I please, even break the law, just say "oh sorry," and God has to forgive." The Church at Corinth believed that and Paul had some pretty harsh words for them.

Yet somehow Jesus said be perfect, didn't he? And sin no more, didn't he? Sounds like you have a very lukewarm gospel.

 

[civilwarbuff]

except repent.

Been there, done that....you ought to try it some time.....works wonders.

 

[Strong in Him]

These slip ups are exactly the problem. I'm trying to show you guys through scripture that the holy spirit prevents these slip ups because he removes all manner of evil desire that wouldve caused a slip up.

Yet you yourself have said that no one is perfect, except Jesus.

A desire to go out and deliberately sin, is not a "slip up", it is a pre thought out plan to sin - do a deliberate wrong. A slip up is when you give in to the devil's tempting, or maybe put yourself in temptations way, either due to weakness, illness, depression or whatever.

 

[cgaviria]

Yet you yourself have said that no one is perfect, except Jesus.

A desire to go out and deliberately sin, is not a "slip up", it is a pre thought out plan to sin - do a deliberate wrong. A slip up is when you give in to the devil's tempting, or maybe put yourself in temptations way, either due to weakness, illness, depression or whatever.

I never said that, I said no one is sinless, except Jesus Christ, as all else have sinned. Yet when one is born of God, one is perfected to never sin again.

 

[Strong in Him]

Yet somehow Jesus said be perfect, didn't he? And sin no more, didn't he? Sounds like you have a very lukewarm gospel.

Not at all. "My" Gospel is THE Gospel, that Jesus died for sinners and that if we confess our sins, God will forgive us.
That is Scriptural.

 

[redleghunter]

Obviously if you are still committing the same sin that isn't repentance. Repentance means to stop what you are doing, stop committing that sin. Being sorry that you did it means nothing. God cares about obedience, not all this nonsense you and your churches teach about all this sorriness while you people still go out and commit the same sins every day, as if you could go ahead and live a lascivious life, and saying, "oh God is merciful, he will forgive you each time". That is not how this works, if you do not stop sinning, you will find yourself dying in your sins, and being cast out into a fiery lake, being called a "worker of iniquity". If I were to believe what you believed, I would be out in the world partying, drinking, getting laid, and then going to church every Sunday, and asking God for forgiveness each time, and why not, he forgives each time, right? What idiotic and foolish teachings.

You have moderated your view in the last 30 or so posts.

First you said we must be sinless. That means no sin.

Now you are saying we should not be practicing or committing the same sins.

I agree with the latter which is the right message to young or new disciples in Christ.

Your sinless claims will cause many to err in many ways.

We are saved by Grace for justification.

We are saved by Grace for sanctification.

We are saved by Grace for our ultimate resurrection and glorification. Praise be to our Lord Jesus Christ, without Him we are worms.

 

[cgaviria]

Not at all. "My" Gospel is THE Gospel, that Jesus died for sinners and that if we confess our sins, God will forgive us.
That is Scriptural.

He'll forgive us so that we can then live obedient lives, not continue living sinful lives. When he forgave the adulterous woman, he didn't say, "I know you are weak, keep asking God for forgiveness each time you commit adultery", he said, "sin no more."

 

[cgaviria]

You have moderated your view in the last 30 or so posts.

First you said we must be sinless. That means no sin.

Now you are saying we should not be practicing or committing the same sins.

I agree with the latter which is the right message to young or new disciples in Christ.

Your sinless claims will cause many to err in many ways.

We are saved by Grace for justification.

We are saved by Grace for sanctification.

We are saved by Grace for our ultimate resurrection and glorification. Praise be to our Lord Jesus Christ, without Him we are worms.

I have not changed my view. You must stop sinning 100%. And then, when you receive holy spirit you will be perfected to never sin again, as that is the sanctifying work of the holy spirit.

 

[redleghunter]

Obviously if you are still committing the same sin that isn't repentance. Repentance means to stop what you are doing, stop committing that sin. Being sorry that you did it means nothing. God cares about obedience, not all this nonsense you and your churches teach about all this sorriness while you people still go out and commit the same sins every day, as if you could go ahead and live a lascivious life, and saying, "oh God is merciful, he will forgive you each time". That is not how this works, if you do not stop sinning, you will find yourself dying in your sins, and being cast out into a fiery lake, being called a "worker of iniquity". If I were to believe what you believed, I would be out in the world partying, drinking, getting laid, and then going to church every Sunday, and asking God for forgiveness each time, and why not, he forgives each time, right? What idiotic and foolish teachings.

Sir you misrepresented another poster. @Strong in Him never advocated the practice or wilful recurrence of sin.

As with many here we challenge your sinless claim.

 

[redleghunter]

I have not changed my view. You must stop sinning 100%. And then, when you receive holy spirit you will be perfected to never sin again, as that is the sanctifying work of the holy spirit.

One must work to receive the Holy Spirit? Meaning you must on your own effort stop sinning 100% before receiving the Holy Spirit?

Show me where this is in Holy Scriptures.

It sounds like a works based salvation which one can boast "I'm at 100% now!"

How does one know they are at that 100% mark of sinless? Is it a self assessment or peer assessment?

 

[Wgw]

It is the standard of scripture, not my own. My own standards wont save me, the standards of God through the belief in Jesus Christ will. I have very little to say to you, except repent.

This argument from you would be rather easier to accept were it not for your well-known and well-documented rejection of various scriptures that have the effect of refuting your doctrinal positions, for example, Matthew 28:19 and John 1:3.

So in fact, it is your own standard, because you have altered scripture to conform with your personal standards about what it ought to say, rather than what it does say.

Thus this attempt on your part to appeal to sola scriptura comes across as, frankly, disingenuous.

 

[MerriestHouse]

In the OT Satan appears to be a specific individual

Job 1:6-7
(6) Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan [השׂטן/hashatan] came also among them.
(7) And the LORD said unto [השׂטן/hashatan] Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan [השׂטן/hashatan] answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
​

השׂטן/hashatan means "the Satan" not "a satan." And in the NT Jesus was tempted by a specific individual.

The word satan was mistakenly translated as a capitalized name that suggests a being but there are no capitalizations in the Hebrew language. The word ha-satan or an adversary, is never used to represent a being in Hebrew. In Hebrew, the word accuser represents an opposing force like accuse, oppose, slander or be adversarial. It is never used in Hebrew Scripture to represent an actual being. It is more of an opposing attitude against God, which in Scripture is attitudes of selfishness, self-centeredness etc. Anyone with this attitude becomes an adversary of God. This attitude would be an adversary to Jesus who lived and taught the principles of self-denial and self-sacrifice.

"For where you have envy and selfish ambition, there you find disorder and every evil practice." James 3:16

In Job, the word Satan should be translated as an adversary.

Mat 4:1-3

(1) Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil. [τοῦ διαβόλου/the diabolou]
(2) And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungered.
(3) And when the tempter [ὁ πειράζων/the peirazon] came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.​

"The devil" not "a devil" "The tempter" not "a tempter"

​

In Judaism, there is no concept of the Devil. In the LXX, the word in place of satan is diabolos. Strong's 1228. This word is commonly translated devil. It means slanderer or false accuser. This loanword has been made as a title for this arch evil being.

In Christianity, one of the main roles of the Devil is to tempt people to sin, but this would suggest that the Devil has God-like powers which only God has. Temptation does not originate from God. "When tempted, no one should say, 'God is tempting me.' For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone." James 1:13

This word, diabolos occurs in several passages, but not translated as 'The Devil."

Diabolos, translated as "malicious gossips," in 1 Timothy 3:11

Switch the words "malicious gossips" to Devils in 1 Timothy 3:11 and this is the way you would read it "Women must likewise be dignified, not "Devils," but temperate, faithful in all things."

Jesus was tempted as a man. He was made perfect through suffering. This is why the author of Hebrews could say about Jesus: Hebrews 4:15 "For we have not a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."​

"one who in every respect has been tempted as we are." How are we tempted? By our own lusts. Jesus was tempted in that same way, as a man. Our own lusts are our adversary, our enemy.

 

[Wgw]

The word satan was mistakenly translated as a capitalized name that suggests a being but there are no capitalizations in the Hebrew language. The word ha-satan or an adversary, is never used to represent a being in Hebrew. In Hebrew, the word accuser represents an opposing force like accuse, oppose, slander or be adversarial. It is never used in Hebrew Scripture to represent an actual being. It is more of an opposing attitude against God, which in Scripture is attitudes of selfishness, self-centeredness etc. Anyone with this attitude becomes an adversary of God. This attitude would be an adversary to Jesus who lived and taught the principles of self-denial and self-sacrifice.

"For where you have envy and selfish ambition, there you find disorder and every evil practice." James 3:16

In Job, the word Satan should be translated as an adversary.

In Judaism, there is no concept of the Devil. In the LXX, the word in place of satan is diabolos. Strong's 1228. This word is commonly translated devil. It means slanderer or false accuser. This loanword has been made as a title for this arch evil being.

In Christianity, one of the main roles of the Devil is to tempt people to sin, but this would suggest that the Devil has God-like powers which only God has. Temptation does not originate from God. "When tempted, no one should say, 'God is tempting me.' For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone." James 1:13

This word, diabolos occurs in several passages, but not translated as 'The Devil."

Diabolos, translated as "malicious gossips," in 1 Timothy 3:11

Switch the words "malicious gossips" to Devils in 1 Timothy 3:11 and this is the way you would read it "Women must likewise be dignified, not "Devils," but temperate, faithful in all things."

Jesus was tempted as a man. He was made perfect through suffering. This is why the author of Hebrews could say about Jesus: Hebrews 4:15 "For we have not a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."​

"one who in every respect has been tempted as we are." How are we tempted? By our own lusts. Jesus was tempted in that same way, as a man. Our own lusts are our adversary, our enemy.

It is impossible to read the Book of Job and not believe the devil is a specific person, frankly. Also this view ignores various Judaic scriptures the Masoretes later rejected, like 1 Enoch, which clearly identify a malign diabolical figure.

 

[nomadictheist]

The word satan was mistakenly translated as a capitalized name that suggests a being but there are no capitalizations in the Hebrew language. The word ha-satan or an adversary, is never used to represent a being in Hebrew. In Hebrew, the word accuser represents an opposing force like accuse, oppose, slander or be adversarial. It is never used in Hebrew Scripture to represent an actual being. It is more of an opposing attitude against God, which in Scripture is attitudes of selfishness, self-centeredness etc. Anyone with this attitude becomes an adversary of God. This attitude would be an adversary to Jesus who lived and taught the principles of self-denial and self-sacrifice.

"For where you have envy and selfish ambition, there you find disorder and every evil practice." James 3:16

In Job, the word Satan should be translated as an adversary.

In Judaism, there is no concept of the Devil. In the LXX, the word in place of satan is diabolos. Strong's 1228. This word is commonly translated devil. It means slanderer or false accuser. This loanword has been made as a title for this arch evil being.

In Christianity, one of the main roles of the Devil is to tempt people to sin, but this would suggest that the Devil has God-like powers which only God has. Temptation does not originate from God. "When tempted, no one should say, 'God is tempting me.' For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone." James 1:13

This word, diabolos occurs in several passages, but not translated as 'The Devil."

Diabolos, translated as "malicious gossips," in 1 Timothy 3:11

Switch the words "malicious gossips" to Devils in 1 Timothy 3:11 and this is the way you would read it "Women must likewise be dignified, not "Devils," but temperate, faithful in all things."

Jesus was tempted as a man. He was made perfect through suffering. This is why the author of Hebrews could say about Jesus: Hebrews 4:15 "For we have not a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin. 16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."​

"one who in every respect has been tempted as we are." How are we tempted? By our own lusts. Jesus was tempted in that same way, as a man. Our own lusts are our adversary, our enemy.

Jesus appears to believe the devil is a real being:

You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father's desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

And if Satan also is divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand? For you say that I cast out demons by Beelzebul.

He answered, "He who sows the good seed is the Son of man; the field is the world, and the good seed means the sons of the kingdom; the weeds are the sons of the evil one, and the enemy who sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the close of the age, and the reapers are angels.

John also believes the devil is a real being:

Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.

And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world—he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him. And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, “Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God. And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death. Therefore, rejoice, O heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to you, O earth and sea, for the devil has come down to you in great wrath, because he knows that his time is short!”

And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years,

I would respectfully suggest that it is unwise to believe that just because a name has a specific meaning means that it does not represent a real being. The scriptures I have presented here from the New Testament are not an exhaustive testimony of the devil, but they represent enough to see that he is spoken of as a real entity who is also the embodiment of all that is evil.