WHY is "seeing" the kingdom so hard for so many ???

[mrhappy3]

Being born of the Spirit ??? Why is it so hard for so many - meet people all the time who say they would love to have the faith to believe...but just can't "SEE" it.

They appear totally genuine or is the "blockage" more sinister

God's revealing damascus moments appear quite rare...why would this be so.....when some get "visions" or a burning bush type experience and others apparantly grope in the dark.

odd or (revelation anyone)


The "blockage" you refer to is a result of what happened to mankind because of Adam's "fall".

Before Adam fell he lived by knowledge received directly from God.

After the fall he and therefore we, lost that "connection" and were put into a "natural" situation where we were dependent on the five physical senses to receive knowledge by.

After we are born again that connection to God was made again.

However, to break the intense habit of living by how it looks, how it feels, what we hear(what others tell us), is a monumental task.

The reason being that it requires the acknowledgment that what we learned just growing up is not God's way.

Then we have to retrain ourselves to do life as God intended us to in the first place, which is by faith.

More to it but that is a brief summary.

 

[imperfectchristian]

Being born of the Spirit ??? Why is it so hard for so many - meet people all the time who say they would love to have the faith to believe...but just can't "SEE" it.

They appear totally genuine or is the "blockage" more sinister

God's revealing damascus moments appear quite rare...why would this be so.....when some get "visions" or a burning bush type experience and others apparantly grope in the dark.

odd or (revelation anyone)

If a person seeks God with all of their heart they will find Him. He is not hard to be found...He is not far from any of us.

 

[mrhappy3]

If a person seeks God with all of their heart they will find Him. He is not hard to be found...He is not far from any of us.

Good point...

 

[mourningdove~]

Being born of the Spirit ??? Why is it so hard for so many - meet people all the time who say they would love to have the faith to believe...but just can't "SEE" it.

They appear totally genuine or is the "blockage" more sinister

God's revealing damascus moments appear quite rare...why would this be so.....when some get "visions" or a burning bush type experience and others apparantly grope in the dark.

odd or (revelation anyone)

Hi Mr. H!

I'd like to be sure I'm clear on your question ...
are you referring in your question to UNBELIEVERS ...
-or-
to BELIEVERS WHO LACK FAITH?

... thanks

 

[KleinerApfel]

We live on a fallen planet with the hindrances to full health and freedom that accompany that, so just as our physical eyes may sometimes suffer imperfections, so I believe the "eyes of our hearts" may be affected adversely.

Our physical vision can be obscured to some degree or other at times for a variety of reasons: Anxiety and fear causes temporary blurred and tunnel vision, exhaustion can cause tired eyes that won't focus correctly. then there's sickness and injury migraine, strokes, infections, retinal damage etc., and inherited weakness of sight that requires glasses to correct.

Is it so strange that sometimes the "eyes of my heart" fail me and I have to live by faith until the fog clears?

I want to see Him more clearly, I'm sure most of us do!

 

[mrhappy3]

Hi Mr. H!

I'd like to be sure I'm clear on your question ...
are you referring in your question to UNBELIEVERS ...
-or-
to BELIEVERS WHO LACK FAITH?

... thanks

UNBELIEVERS - appreciated

 

[The_Joker]

Well, last time I was up in heaven on one of my many visitations I asked Saint Paul this same question. Evidently, preternatural greatness such as mine is not all that common amongst "normals" as Paul put them. We are of a superior organic and spiritual pedigree, my line can be traced directly from the Apostle John (whom Jesus loved).

Besides, the vast majority of people who have 'visions' don't actually have visions. They only think they hear this or that, and while they praise God mightily, the tragedy is that they're actually hearing nothing. I cannot tell you how many "great" Holy people I have met who couldn't prophecy their way out of a wet paper bag. A very great few of them could prophecy accurately every now and then, but other times they could not prophecy the truth at all. False prophecy, false Holy power, false spirituality, all with the form of Holiness but lacking all of its power. It isn't that there are a few people with "low" faith who can't "see" the kingdom, it's that there are alot of people who think they see the kingdom but don't actually see anything at all. I know for a certain that I have a faith that can move mountains at times, but the fact that I have never heard or seen God doesn't mean that my faith or my spirituality is inferior to anyone elses. The fact of the matter is, such experiences were never meant to be common. God never spoke to a person just to give them cheap and common words and dreams. He comes with a purpose, he comes when there is something important to be said and would rather let us figure it out most of the time. That is why the legendary Paul, with all his greatness, only had that one visitation into heaven, "whether in the body or out of the body" he knew not, in a 14 year period, possibly even in his entire life. On top of that, he certainly didn't brag about it either, but even called it unlawful to speak of the things he saw and would not even acknowledge in his letter that it was he who had been transported. Jesus said, blessed is he who has not seen but still believes. Is this that same faith that you all teach amongst yourselves? Is this the same Christianity that today isn't happy unless it flops around like a fish on the floor or has mystical experiences?

 

[The_Joker]

Hi Mr. H!

I'd like to be sure I'm clear on your question ...
are you referring in your question to UNBELIEVERS ...
-or-
to BELIEVERS WHO LACK FAITH?

... thanks

But, you know, there isn't always much of a difference. Only the believers with the faith are the ones who are similar to the infidels. Your faith or lack thereof isn't what determines a spiritual gift. Paul, in his rebellion, was confronted by God. Samuel as a child was recruited by God directly. Jonah fled from God, he wasn't on his face praying constantly and begging for the gift. Did any of these men deserve such a thing? Did either pray so very much to Jesus Christ or to God to deserve it? Or were they chosen based on something none of them could discern?

And I wonder, how many of you who pray without ceasing truly have much prophecy to show for it? How many of these great prophets ever told us a thing before it came to be? How many of these great Prophets spoke something that wasn't vague and meaningless? How many of you, with all your love of God, ever raised a man from the dead or spoke a prophetic word outside of an already converted Christian church or forum? (Prophetic words are impressive to believers, but not impressive to the unbelievers who should be the target audiance) Not many, I've never met one, I don't think I'll ever meet one. The fact of the matter is works or "spiritual" works like praying without ceasing or great faith do not determine your fate. We are commanded to be Holy as God is Holy, but are we commanded to pray so strongly so we can become Christian Wizards? We cannot expect to each be an Apostle of God. We can only expect to do what it is we can in this world, and if God chooses to bless us with something peculiar to help us with this task, then so be it. But those who have not seen yet continue to live the good fight are better than those who are always going up into heaven. They are not inferior, they are not "weak" in faith. They were destined for different things... And all those Prophets? Most of them will fall to nothing. Most of their followers, convinced by their signs and wonders in the past, will collapse along with them. Their collective prophecies will be revealed to be nothing more than vain noise. Theirs is a foundation built on sand.

That is not to say that we should not seek spiritual gifts. But you know, all these spiritual gifts and those who are gifted by them aren't doing that great of job with them. They're irrelevant, they aren't making changes to society. They're alone in their worship songs and in their constant festivals. They're alone in their mission trips to Eastern Societies who are actually in greater revival than we will ever experience.

 

[mrhappy3]

But, you know, there isn't always much of a difference. Only the believers with the faith are the ones who are similar to the infidels. Your faith or lack thereof isn't what determines a spiritual gift. Paul, in his rebellion, was confronted by God. Samuel as a child was recruited by God directly. Jonah fled from God, he wasn't on his face praying constantly and begging for the gift. Did any of these men deserve such a thing? Did either pray so very much to Jesus Christ or to God to deserve it? Or were they chosen based on something none of them could discern?

And I wonder, how many of you who pray without ceasing truly have much prophecy to show for it? How many of these great prophets ever told us a thing before it came to be? How many of these great Prophets spoke something that wasn't vague and meaningless? How many of you, with all your love of God, ever raised a man from the dead or spoke a prophetic word outside of an already converted Christian church or forum? (Prophetic words are impressive to believers, but not impressive to the unbelievers who should be the target audiance) Not many, I've never met one, I don't think I'll ever meet one. The fact of the matter is works or "spiritual" works like praying without ceasing or great faith do not determine your fate. We are commanded to be Holy as God is Holy, but are we commanded to pray so strongly so we can become Christian Wizards? We cannot expect to each be an Apostle of God. We can only expect to do what it is we can in this world, and if God chooses to bless us with something peculiar to help us with this task, then so be it. But those who have not seen yet continue to live the good fight are better than those who are always going up into heaven. They are not inferior, they are not "weak" in faith. They were destined for different things... And all those Prophets? Most of them will fall to nothing. Most of their followers, convinced by their signs and wonders in the past, will collapse along with them. Their collective prophecies will be revealed to be nothing more than vain noise. Theirs is a foundation built on sand.

That is not to say that we should not seek spiritual gifts. But you know, all these spiritual gifts and those who are gifted by them aren't doing that great of job with them. They're irrelevant, they aren't making changes to society. They're alone in their worship songs and in their constant festivals. They're alone in their mission trips to Eastern Societies who are actually in greater revival than we will ever experience.

Powerful stuff there !


Any thoughts on why people struggle to find the kingdom, when it appears on the surface anyhow, their new age jaunts etc..show they ARE spiritually hungry at least.

 

[KleinerApfel]

Joker, you are (ironically perhaps?) using the gift of prophecy within your posting.
Thanks, a lot of truth, freeing truth, in that one.

 

[mourningdove~]

Any thoughts on why people struggle to find the kingdom, when it appears on the surface anyhow,
their new age jaunts etc..show they ARE spiritually hungry at least.

Here is one reason that is helpful for me to remember when witnessing to others ...

The words of Jesus, John 6:44:

"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him;
and I will raise him up at the last day."
___________

When I pray for the salvation of an unbeliever,
I pray that the Father would 'draw' them ...

 

[mrhappy3]

Here is one reason that is helpful for me to remember when witnessing to others ...

The words of Jesus, John 6:44:

"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him;
and I will raise him up at the last day."
___________

When I pray for the salvation of an unbeliever,
I pray that the Father would 'draw' them ...

That one certainly takes the pressure off and sorts the "men" from the "boys".

 

[Honibee]

Any thoughts on why people struggle to find the kingdom, when it appears on the surface anyhow, their new age jaunts etc..show they ARE spiritually hungry at least.

Sin has a way of blinding people to the truth. Romans 6:16 comes to
mind:

6 have you not known that to whom you present yourselves servants
for obedience, servants you are to him to whom you obey, whether of
sin to death, or of obedience to righteousness?

 

[ydouxist]

Being born of the Spirit ??? Why is it so hard for so many - meet people all the time who say they would love to have the faith to believe...but just can't "SEE" it.

They appear totally genuine or is the "blockage" more sinister

God's revealing damascus moments appear quite rare...why would this be so.....when some get "visions" or a burning bush type experience and others apparantly grope in the dark.

odd or (revelation anyone)


The "blockage" you refer to is a result of what happened to mankind because of Adam's "fall".

Before Adam fell he lived by knowledge received directly from God.

After the fall he and therefore we, lost that "connection" and were put into a "natural" situation where we were dependent on the five physical senses to receive knowledge by.

After we are born again that connection to God was made again.

However, to break the intense habit of living by how it looks, how it feels, what we hear(what others tell us), is a monumental task.

The reason being that it requires the acknowledgment that what we learned just growing up is not God's way.

Then we have to retrain ourselves to do life as God intended us to in the first place, which is by faith.

More to it but that is a brief summary.

I have been witnessing to people for 30 years.
Many have gotten saved years later. The longest time span I'm aware of to date is 9 years. There was nothing wrong with the seed I planted, it was the condition of the soil.
We live in a now society, God doesn't.

 

[Holly's_Dream]

We live in a now society, God doesn't.

Well said.

 

[irenemcg]

Mat 6:33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.

Maybe we haven't got the order right, that would seem to me to be pretty much the reason.

For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen

It's His Kindom, let's not lose sight of that, then we can see the Kingdom invade earth

 

[nephilimiyr]

Being born of the Spirit ??? Why is it so hard for so many - meet people all the time who say they would love to have the faith to believe...but just can't "SEE" it.

They appear totally genuine or is the "blockage" more sinister

Let's not forget that the kingdom of heaven is within us.

God's revealing damascus moments appear quite rare...why would this be so.....when some get "visions" or a burning bush type experience and others apparantly grope in the dark.

odd or (revelation anyone)

Actually, from the news reports that I have seen, there are many road to Damascus type conversions involving the muslims in the Middle east. Scores upon scores of them are revealing that they have seen Jesus and talked to Him face to face. Many of them never even heard of him.

Here's some websites or articles that will bless your heart!

http://answering-islam.org/Testimonies/index.html

http://isaalmasih.net/isa/dreamsofisa.html

http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/69001.aspx