Why does a non-Christian have to be alive to repent?

[Hestha]

Why not dead? If a non-Christian is dead, and God really does exist, then that non-Christian can actually see that God exists and would want to turn to God rather than relying on faith.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Because faith is important. You had your chance and you can't just do it after there's proof.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I'm not convinced that repentance isn't possible after death. To fall on one side or the other on the subject would be speculative either way.

The usual prooftext brought up against it is Hebrews 9:27,

"And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment, ..."

However if we're honest it actually isn't saying anything one way or another except that we will all face judgment after death.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[drich0150]

Why not dead? If a non-Christian is dead, and God really does exist, then that non-Christian can actually see that God exists and would want to turn to God rather than relying on faith.

Because God want you to make your desision based on the condition of your heart, and not your desire to perserve yourself from Hell. Because if knoweledge of God is undenyable at that point, so to will be your awareness of Hell.

For simple acknoweledgement of God is not what is demanded from a follower of Christ. But an all encompassing love. We are told even the demons believe, and yet that is not enough to save them from Hell.

 

[talitha]

The whole point of this life is to make a CHOICE about believing and trusting in God. Once we die, there will be no choice; all will believe.

 

[bling]

The objective is not to “acknowledge” the existence of God, but it is to fulfill an objective which only can be fulfilled while here on earth. At some point God can determine an individual will not ever fulfill his earthly objective and thus from that point on takes on a lesser objective.

 

[Publius]

Why not dead? If a non-Christian is dead, and God really does exist, then that non-Christian can actually see that God exists and would want to turn to God rather than relying on faith.

You're assuming that the wicked would repent if they saw God. They would not. That's why they're wicked.

The wicked do not war against God because of a lack of faith, but because they have a sinful nature.

You're also assuming that it is up to them to believe and repent, which is not what the Bible teaches. It is God who chooses who will be saved and who to grant faith and repentence to.

You can ask "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin", but the bottom line is that God has decided that He will save men while they are alive, not after they are dead.

 

[Elioenai26]

You're assuming that the wicked would repent if they saw God. They would not. That's why they're wicked.

The wicked do not war against God because of a lack of faith, but because they have a sinful nature.

You're also assuming that it is up to them to believe and repent, which is not what the Bible teaches. It is God who chooses who will be saved and who to grant faith and repentence to.

You can ask "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin", but the bottom line is that God has decided that He will save men while they are alive, not after they are dead.

 

[food4thought]

God wants us to willingly, freely choose Him over our own sinful desires. Once one is dead, there will be no hope of fulfilling sinful desires; so in essense there is no real choice for a reasonable person.

Also, I believe that God is concerned with how our actions/decisions affect others in this world... if one leaves no evidence of a conversion before death, there is no result in this life on others... for example, say a father was abusive to his children when young, and only regrets it after death; at that point he could not apologize and seek to reconcile with his children, thus perhaps positively affecting their future. In the same way, someone could be non believing their whole lives, but on their deathbed make a decision to accept Jesus. This decision will have an effect (however small) on those who know of this person's conversion.

Here is an excerpt from a very lengthy post I made regarding free will, predestination, and the existence of evil. It does not directly adress your question here, but it expresses a sense of what God's overall plan is for us; and is therefore somewhat relevant to this topic. I clipped some of it out and left only the ideas I thought relevant to this thread, so forgive me if it seems a bit disjointed.

God created us in His own image (Genesis 1:26-27), and that doesn't mean we look like God (lol), it means we have been given a nature that, in some aspects, reflects His nature (pause and rejoice over this!). That image was marred by Adam's sin, but I strongly believe part of that image that we still retain is free will. That is why God will not take away our free will, because it is part of His image in each of us. Above, we see that God is working all things together for the good of those who love God; but what is that "good"? The next verse answers that question: "that we might be conformed to the image of His Son". If God were to continually thwart our free will, He would be thwarting His own purpose in shaping us in the likeness of His Son, who the Bible testifies is "the express image of His Person" (Hebrews 1:3). So we can see the importance of our free will to God, as He purposes to shape us into the perfect image of His Son Jesus Christ. He wants sons, not mindless slaves.

Now we come to the meat of your question, and a further reason why God values our free will... How can, or why would, an all knowing, good God create a creature that is sinful and prone to evil? To begin with, God created man without sin or a sinful nature; only the potential for these by virtue of His ability to choose, which in and of itself is a wondrous thing that echoes the very nature of God. The fact that Adam used that freedom to do evil and disobey God's command does not in any way reduce the goodness of free will. But why, of all the attributes of His nature, did He place that one in His creatures? Answer: capacity for love. At the heart of love is the ability to express that love freely... ask any man to say "I love you" at gunpoint, and you are probably assured of hearing him say "I love you", but you know that statement was not given freely, but under compulsion, and is therefore of no more value than hearing a doll say "I love you" after you pull it's string. ANY expression of a creature without the ability to choose is pretty much the same as that doll... it will simply respond as it was designed to do when the string is pulled. Real love is impossible from such a being.

But God created Adam as an entirely different kind of creature than a lifeless doll, able to both obey and disobey, able to both express love for his Creator or reject it... and also able to do both good and evil, to choose to sin or not to sin in any given situation. Enter Satan, and through his deception man chose to break God's command and follow him and fulfill his selfish desire. Now that image of God, which was supposed to glorify God and express love, is marred by separation from God; and now all manner of evil desires surface within us. I hope you see that without free will there may be a world without sin and evil, but there would be no beings capable of real love for each other or God.

I hope you are familiar with the rest of the story. Paul sums the human condition up very nicely in Romans 6-7, and then he gives us the cure in Romans 8. Without the blood of Jesus Christ shed on the cross for us, we would be forever in Romans 6-7, but by faith in Jesus we can receive the Holy Spirit of promise and dwell in Romans 8, freely expressing the love of God through the indwelling power of His Holy Spirit, which we receive by faith in the gospel of Jesus Christ. In this way God accomplishes His purpose for man despite his fallen condition.

Right now the world is full of people who either have the Holy Spirit but choose not to continuously walk in it, or people who do not have the Holy Spirit and choose to do whatever their selfish desires lead them to do (of course they are restrained by their selfish desire to stay alive, out of jail, and have human companionship, so the full extent of their sinful desires are rarely fully realized thank God). So we have a world full of people that still use their free will, to varying extents, to act contrary to God's purpose; yet all the while, despite this, God in His sovereignty is working out His purpose of bringing those who will receive Him ever closer to the image of His Son, and thus ever closer to Himself and His ultimate goal: a vast host of immortal creatures who will freely love Him and receive His love throughout eternity. Praise God. Amen.

Hope this helps you understand the Christian position, Hestha.

Mike

Note: if someone were to accept Jesus after death, in the very pressense of the God he/she once rejected, the choice would be between an instant judgment of eternity suffering with no more potential for sinful desires to be fulfilled, or an eternity with at least spiritual pleasures with God. Again, no choice for a rational person. In this life, we must choose God over the temporary pleasures of this world. In eternity, that may make a difference over whether someone would be inclined to go their own way against God's will again, thus potentially starting the whole cycle of sin and rebellion all over again. I believe God looked into all eternity for the best possible eternal result, and that is the path He set the temporal world upon at creation. All this may not make perfect sense to us now, but I believe we will know in eternity exactly why God set the course He did. Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[Hestha]

You're also assuming that it is up to them to believe and repent, which is not what the Bible teaches. It is God who chooses who will be saved and who to grant faith and repentence to.

If God is the one who chooses who will be saved and who to grant faith and repentance to, then does that take away the point of evangelism? What's the point of sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ when some people will never saved in the first place, when salvation is already pre-determined by God? I mean, if God is the one who chooses, then salvation is pre-determined, right? If salvation is pre-determined, then what's the point with evangelism in the first place when some people are already going to be doomed to hell?

Does that mean I am going to hell? If I am going to hell, that would give me one more reason to hate God.

 

[Publius]

If God is the one who chooses who will be saved and who to grant faith and repentance to, then does that take away the point of evangelism?

No. God still works through the preaching of the Gospel.

What's the point of sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ when some people will never saved in the first place, when salvation is already pre-determined by God?

Because we don't know who the elect are, we don't know who isn't elect, because God reaches the elect through the preaching of the Gospel, because God commands us to, and because, when someone does something as amazing as God has done for us, it's only natural to want to share it.

I mean, if God is the one who chooses, then salvation is pre-determined, right? If salvation is pre-determined, then what's the point with evangelism in the first place when some people are already going to be doomed to hell?

There are two points:

The first is that we simply don't know who is elect and who is not.

The second is, even if someone is not among the elect, preaching the Gospel to them is still God's plan because it upholds His Word and will be among the criteria of His judgement against them later on.

Does that mean I am going to hell?

As it stands now? Yes. But that doesn't mean that you may not repent and receive Christ at some point. I certainly hope you do.

If I am going to hell, that would give me one more reason to hate God.

How many reasons you concoct to hate God is irrelevent. If you have one, your judgement won't be any less terrible than if you have one thousand.

 

[drjean]

Actually, Biblically, we are ALL dead until the Holy Spirit quickens us to life in Christ.

"Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ..." Ephesians 2

We can do nothing for salvation on our own, for we are dead before God enables us to believe.

If you are talking about waiting until after you have lived a life without God, and are dead in hell, then the example of the rich man and Lazarus is a good example of why we cannot be saved then---why it's too late.

God says His whole creation knows of Him, and of their need for salvation. I wonder what would prevent someone from desiring God's love as soon as they can receive it.

 

[elman]

Why not dead? If a non-Christian is dead, and God really does exist, then that non-Christian can actually see that God exists and would want to turn to God rather than relying on faith.

Are you saying spiritually dead or physically dead? If someone is dead how do they see God exists and how do they repent, which is an action. Dead people are not active.

 

[DCJazz]

Are you saying spiritually dead or physically dead? If someone is dead how do they see God exists and how do they repent, which is an action. Dead people are not active.

Ah but the soul is eternal.

 

[Publius]

God wants us to willingly, freely choose Him over our own sinful desires. Once one is dead, there will be no hope of fulfilling sinful desires; so in essense there is no real choice for a reasonable person.

So, once one is dead, can they choose to be alive again?

 

[Ruby claire]

Hestha, i do agree with you, but granting faith is a personal choice of every individual that doesn't make sense to compare it with "chose god" or else it may look a stereotype worship.

 

[Dragons87]

If someone doesn't believe in God when they're alive, I don't see what anything in death would encourage them to do otherwise.

 

[salida]

Ro 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse.