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Why did lot offer his daughters to be raped to protect the angels?

Discussion in 'Non-denominational' started by Nurbz, Jul 23, 2010.

  1. Nurbz

    Nurbz Regular Member

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    In Genesis 19, the angels came to warn lot about Sodom's destruction because he was suppost to be a worthy man. But what does it say about him to offer his virgin daughters to a crowd to be raped in order to protect the angels? There was nothing about admonishment from the angels for him doing this, and it doesn't seem like the right solution, no matter what the cause for it.

    On top of this, God killed Lot's wife by turning her into a pillar of salt for merely looking back, but no punishment for Lot himself for nearly forcing his daughters to be raped, especially when virginity is so important?

    This doesn't seem right to me at all, and Lot doesn't seem like someone worth saving after something like that.
     
  2. shinbits

    shinbits New Member

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    It's because Lot was a messed up person.

    Apart from that, it wouldn't have been considered rape. Women were conditioned to think that they had no rights, and thus, would've willingly had sex with those men.
     
  3. Svt4Him

    Svt4Him Legend Supporter

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    Interestingly enough pillar of salt and looking back are Jewish idioms. As for admonishment from angels, angels are not there to judge sin, they are messengers, and they were sent with a message. Do you want the angels to talk to Job and tell him how bad he was or strike the crowd with blindness then tell Job to leave quickly or he will be destroyed as well? I'd choose door no 2.
     
  4. StartedAtEly

    StartedAtEly Newbie

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    I agree. I think its best to understand Lot in terms of being a man of his times, and in those times, women had virtually no rights. He was simply reflecting the rather cold attitude to women then.
     
  5. NatalieJan777

    NatalieJan777 Humbled before GOD

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    These angels were sent by GOD, matter of fact GOD was traveling with them in visiting Abraham lots uncle before destruction of these cities. Abraham questioned GOD about righteous men in the city, and he did it to save Lot.

    Why do we say that Abraham had faith when he offered Issac on the alter, yet can't understand that Lot too had faith in GOD that no harm would come to his daughters?

    We are told to honor GOD above men and Jesus himself has said that anyone who loves his family members/friends etc... or anything more than HIM is not worthy of HIM. The same is true of HIS messangers even angels.

    Lot's wife was told not to look back, but she rebelled and did. Her punishment was in her own hands, she died because she lacked faith and belief in GOD's WORD.

    Lot's daughters were vowed to marriage already and when Lot asked them to come, they refused. Their punishment as well was in their own hands.

    What has always confused me is the continued seed of Lot. It was through his daughters, who got Lot drunk to take advantage of him so that they could continue his seed. It seems to me the honest thing to do would have been to ask their father to get away from the mountain to find them spouses. Perhaps they did and Lot refused. Had his daughters not done what they did, Lot's seed would have died there. Perhaps someday if this is important for me to know it will be revealed to me.
     
  6. Nurbz

    Nurbz Regular Member

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    But regardless of the period, virginity has always been important, so to offer his virgin daughters to a mob when the supernatural creatures could defend themselves doesn't make him seem any better than the people who were killed.


    the difference is that God told Abraham to do it, what Lot did wasn't directed. If he did offer them up expecting them to be protected, that would have been testing God, and of course something you're not suppost to do.

    But again, back to the importance of virginity in the old testament, to be raped as punishment seems extreme, even for the period.

    I guess its one of those things we'll never know
     
  7. NatalieJan777

    NatalieJan777 Humbled before GOD

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    True he was not told that we know of. Perhaps he knew that they were homosexual and wouldn't be interested? I don't know. But I do know that they were GOD's messengers and Lot might not have done wrong in the offer. I cannot judge this, nor do I think anyone can, not knowing what Lot was thinking and that GOD knows what that was.

    I have found that the Law was written after GOD examined the actions of man for some time. This is just what I've noticed after reading old testament scripture.

    It is written in the law that the Jews were not to offer their woman to prostitution.

    Somewhere there in the law in reference to rape I know that GOD does put some of the responsibility on the woman. It says something to the effect that if she goes out at night in the town and is raped she is not guilty because there are people around that she can yell out to for help. However, if she goes out at night in the country it is her own fault because there are not others to yell out for help to.

    I know that has nothing to do with Lot's case, however it is in reference to the same subject.

    Resigning from this topic for I believe GOD will be the one to judge such matters.

    GOD Bless!
     
  8. singpeace

    singpeace Senior Member

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    Lot was clearly afraid and acted stupidly. He had surrounded himself and his family with a city filled with every manner of sexual sin... he feared the men would break down his door to get to the angels. He believed stupidly that those men could actually overcome and rape the angels. He feared God's wrath and judgment over that more than over the sin of offering his daughters in place of the angels.
     
  9. Daxen

    Daxen Newbie

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    yes, he feared for HIMSELF .... the heart of men lays depravity
     
  10. bliz

    bliz Contributor

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    Really? Really?

    And I suppose slaves have always been happy, carefree workers...
     
  11. Daxen

    Daxen Newbie

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    to say how a woman was treated in the OT by men, is one thing ~ we no for a fact women were treated as property and slaves but to say they would have willing done something so vulgar is wrong ~ they may not have any rights to say NO, but that is a far cry from saying they would have WILLINGLY gone along with it ....... any more then you can say a child WILLINGLY goes along with being raped by dear father or uncle
     
    bliz likes this.
  12. NatalieJan777

    NatalieJan777 Humbled before GOD

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    I know many who say this, but seriously I've studied the law of the Chaldeans at the time of Abraham leaving Ur. The Isrealite women were treated with respect and honor by their own. Scripturally I just do not see anywhere where women had no rights.
     
  13. Lively Stone

    Lively Stone New Member

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    I believe the answer regarding Lot's choice is based on this truth:

    Luke 14:26
    If you want to be my disciple, you must hate everyone else by comparison—your father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even your own life. Otherwise, you cannot be my disciple.


    Lot knew he had the holy with him. Even his beloved daughters were no comparison to their holiness. I sure wouldn't want holy angels sent from the presence of God to help me to be accosted or touched by tainted sinners while they were visiting me!
     
  14. Nurbz

    Nurbz Regular Member

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    But see that would go against the bible's instruction: Virginity is one of the most important things about a person, yet being forced to compromise one's daughters in such a way contradicts it's importance. So we have a contradiction, or Lot was making a really stupid decision
     
  15. Cassidy

    Cassidy Guest

    YUK YUK YUK YUK!!!!

    It was most certainly rape!!! If they had no choice but to 'willingly' (as you put it) have sex with them BECAUSE of their cultural status...THAT IS RAPE!!!

    This sickens me!!!

    Thank you!!! :doh:
     
  16. Lively Stone

    Lively Stone New Member

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    I see it as Lot knew the holiness of the angels deserved more honour than even his own daughter's virginity. In the light of God's holiness, our righteousness is as filthy rags.

    Same principle. Lot was doing only what he should have done. It is also very similar to Abraham, offering up his son Isaac, willing to plunge that knife into his neck for the sake of Jehovah.
     
  17. NatalieJan777

    NatalieJan777 Humbled before GOD

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    I know I stated this before but let me point this out again. The law that stated not to prostitute their women, came after all the instances we are speaking about here in Lot's case. As we study we need to keep this truth in the back of our minds.

    I can point to several instances where women freely offered themselves to those who they were not betrothed to, as well as their husbands to other women.

    Sarah told Abraham to take Hagar to wife, and Abraham agreed. (Genesis 16)

    Lot's daughters (Genesis 19) had intercourse with thier father to continue his seed.

    Issac that I know of was the only one to have had only one wife.

    Jacob when seeking a wife ended up working for his father in law Laban for the hand of Rachel but ended up with Leah as his first wife, then Rachel. Both of whom gave thier servants as wives to Jacob and thus we have where all 12 tribes of Isreal stem from. (Genesis 29-30)

    Let us look at Dinah. The bible doesn't state that she resisted, but what it does say is that her brothers exhonerating her virginity by killing all the men was wrong. (Genesis 34)

    Judah promises Tamar children through his offspring but doesn't uphold his promise. Tamar takes matters into her own hand. (Genesis 38) And what is it that Judah confesses after he discovers it all? But that he was in the wrong in what he did and Tamar was more righteous than him.

    Reuben has intercourse with his fathers concubine, but his father does not disown him as his flesh and blood, the only thing he did was in his blessing to his sons he brought a curse there (Genesis 49).

    My point is that the Law of Moses was handed down after everything we are speaking of had happened. If you read Leviticus 18 you will find where now after establishing the Isrealites GOD set to law, who the men were not to have sexual relationships with.

    Today we call this marraige and it requires a man incited certificate for it to happen. Now I am not saying this is wrong, I am just saying that back then there were no marraige certificates. We find the truth about marraige as Paul writes in this epistle:

    1 Corinthians 6:16 Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh."

    It is this act of Sexual relations that makes a man one flesh with a woman and vice a versa. This is why we now uphold no premarital sex. No where in the law does it say that a man shall have only one wife, except for the Priests (Leviticus 21) and again in reference to an Overseer of the flock in Paul's epistle (1 Timothy 3:2).

    The act of infidelity is not as an extreem act as rejecting GOD and HIS messangers. One act is forgivable, where as the other might not be. In other words if we do not put GOD before our own selves and others, there will be punishments incurred. Where as if we have an act of indescretion we can go to HIM for forgiveness. However, if we refuse to hear what HIS Spirit is telling us and continue in sin, we might very well suffer consequence:

    Hebrews 12:25 See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven?

    Matthew 12:23 Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

    GOD BLESS!
     
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