1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a friendly forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Why did God allow Polygamy?

Discussion in 'Christian Apologetics' started by Daniels, Jul 5, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    All that passage proves it sex is for marriage!

    It does not mention or tackle polygamy in any way.

    You have yet to show a single scripture that is in the context of polygamy stating it is wrong.

    I have clearly laid out an example in scripture of God even being the instigator of it. As we all know God cannot instigate sin.

    I am yet to see a single verse talking about polygamy against!
    Or an explaination for the verse i have given!
     
  2. lilymarie

    lilymarie The love of heaven makes one heavenly -Shakespeare

    Messages:
    2,389
    Likes Received:
    18
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    I don't think I can help you any further Andy because YES it does say sex is for marriage and what does it say marriage is? One husband and one wife.

    Because if the Lord has spoken I listen to what he says a marriage is, one husband (a man as the scripture I posted) and one wife (a woman) as stated in the scripture I posted.

    Sorry, I can't offer any more insight into what the scriptures say... so all I can do is tell ya to take it up with Jesus -- okay.

    Take care.
     
  3. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    I see what your saying.
    but there is not one verse in scripture that says one husband one wife.

    No one has been able to explained to me how God who gave David more than one wife can call it a sin? Surely then God would have sinned, because He would of gone against His Word which clearly states God can not tempt us to sin thats from James epistle. I can see why one would not like polygamy. I personally dont like it or want it. But I cannot Biblicaly say it is wrong, simply because my Bible doesnt say it is wrong.

    Still there has not been one verse laid out which states it is wrong!
     
  4. hithesh

    hithesh New Member

    Messages:
    913
    Likes Received:
    2
    Faith:
    Christian
    I am hoping to close this topic, with a message from Paul:

    "A certain man, asked Paul about eating Pork, and if this was a sin.
    and Paul told the certain man, "If your conscious tells you that you will be sinning if you eat pork, and if you then eat it, then you will be sinning."
    (and if your conscious doesn't way heavy on you for doing so, then it's okay, so to say.)

    The real question we should ask is, "If a man has more than one wife, is he destined for hell?"

    and the answer is, "We don't know."

    each of us are built with a soul or spirit--whatever you may like to call it--and when we search within ourselves we can easily decipher what is right and wrong in our own lives, as long as we haven't hardened ourselves to self examination

    What we don't necessarily posses is the ability to "pull the mote out of our brother's eye".

    We have grown as society, since the days of the Old Testament, to see that values which were valid then, no longer apply now.
    In fact, it is against the law.
    Society has decided that polygamy is wrong, not because it is wrong in itself, but because of the effects a multiple parent home have on children, and woman.

    So if someone is debating the issue, of whether to have multiple wives or not, he should really examine the value of polygamy today, and the degradation of woman and children as a result, and then way their conscious, and see if he can honestly say that it is "a good thing."

    If a person is still foolish enough to enter into polygamy, we as Christians shouldn't condemn him for the act itself, but for the withered fruit it brings,

    and leave judgement to God alone.

    (one thing I would like to point out about this "topic thread", is that these arguments only serve for the purpose of having 'fun', or a lively debate. No one here (at least I believe no one is), honestly contemplating a polygamist relationship, because I'm sure most of us don't have a hard time weighing the issue within in ourselves, to see why it is wrong. So once again, the goodness of the 'spirt' within us prevails.)
     
  5. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    I for one think it is absolutly ok.
    I do not want more than one wife.
    I am finding one girlfriend really tough at times.
    I find myself bending over backwards watching and doing things i dont like to see her smile.
    It always means i watch alot less football (soccer) than i so deeply crave and desire.

    Polygamy does not always degrade women and children.
    I have friend who have told a man he must put away his wives and have just one. One friend says he must have the first wife. Another has let the man choose. In either case yes there are unhappy homes. But there are just one man and wife. But people fail to see some cases kids have been devestated. They enjoyed the closeness of them and their sibilings they no longer have. Its not all doom and gloom.


    My big problem that I have with all this is Christians going to countries where it is acceptable and telling them
    God says its a sin, or God says this is wrong. Where no where in His Word it says this.

    How can we say what God thinks is wrong, when God has never said its wrong. Break up families in the name of a God who has never ever told us to? How is that right?

    These are my problems with it all...
     
  6. hithesh

    hithesh New Member

    Messages:
    913
    Likes Received:
    2
    Faith:
    Christian
    I agree with you Andy, and my use of polygamy's affects on children and woman, are quite relative, but I use them as the only basis we can currently have for the Christian and Social dilemma against polygamy.

    Christians don't have the right, or the ability to argue against one's own cultural reasoning, that allows certain things, that are against our own way of thinking.

    I know that most Christians like to use this term "hate the sin, love the sinner", but i want to take it a step further by saying "hate the results and implications of the sin", not the sin itself, and love the "sinner".

    We can sit there and say to someone that we worry about the affects polygamy has on family, but if one's own reasoning tells that these affects are null in their polygamist relationship, then they have found a moral backing to continue their way of lifestyle. If the wives are taken care of, and happy, and the lives' of the children are not adversely affected, than where can I see the wrong in this?

    I still do concede that I can't see any benefit in this day and age for polygamy particularly in our western first world culture, but I can't necessarily pass these ideals on differing societies.

    And once again, we as Christians cannot condemn them for this action, for Judgement is for God alone.
     
  7. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    I can agree with you there,

    You have said some thing new in terms of not hating the sin but the outcome of sin. Surely that can't be right.
    Completely abandoning the polygamy debate for a moment.
    What line of thought has brought you to such conclusions?
    Has certain scripture brought u there?
    It is a very interesting line of thought. It sounds Alien to me in terms of my understanding of scripture. What is it that brought you in line with that point of view?

    Andy
     
  8. hithesh

    hithesh New Member

    Messages:
    913
    Likes Received:
    2
    Faith:
    Christian
    I derive my thinking by examining the life and teachings of Christ. There are so many complexities to Christ's teaching, that Christians overlook.

    If you look at Christ's message you will notice that he doesn't preach how we should live life in details, but his logic is formed in a way that works with our soul/conscious/sprit--whatever you may wish to call it, to decide our own sense of morality.

    Notice, the redemption of Mary Magdalene, Christ renounced those who threw stones at her. He doesn't preach to her about her sins, but he shows her compassion, and she was able to look within herself and decide that the life she lived was sinful.

    I remember when I was younger, the Church I went to dictated to us every detail of life, they forbid us from wearing jewelry, dating, participating in plays, picnics, etc.., by using and twisting Scripture to form their arguments. But as the young grew older, they reasoned within themselves, and abandoned these 'absolutes' from the Church of yester-year. They dated responsibly, wore jewelry and makeup, and at the same time became more passionate about their faith than children of the past.

    The reason why the old church rules didn't stand, is because you cannot say something is wrong in itself; you need to base your arguments on reasons that lead people to believe something is wrong.


    Example:
    In the past, and even in the biblical past people married when they were still in their early teens, and during those periods this seemed morally justifiable. But now as a modern, and learned society, we understand that the child brain is not fully ripened until about eighteen, so we now have laws, and reasons that tell us that marriage under the legal age is wrong.

    What I'm trying to get at, is that we just can't say something is wrong, and assume that we as intelligent beings are going to accept it as so. You have to prove to us, or atleast reason with us on the terms of why it's wrong, and then every individual has to weigh his conscious (the only source of truth in this world), to decide his virtues and vices.

    Nearly every Christian does this with their own life, by deciding on their own morality within themselves We don't believe things are wrong in our life just because the Bible says it is, we allow our reasoning and conscious to decide our own personal morality, and when the Christian message falters is when it attempts to decide moral issues on the basis of a verse alone for others.

    This day and age everything is relative, and Christians are failing to understand this. Their old ways of thinking have only distanced people from finding God, because we base our faith on mystical ideas, when reason is what people really need.

    We have to tune our moral arguments to the conscious of individuals, and from their allow the God that lives within them to do his work.
     
  9. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    So you make your beliefs?
    On that basis that would mean what is wrong for me may be ok for u?
    Instead of... this is wrong period. Why is it you shy away from Biblical verses dictating what is right or wrong.
    Yes we must reason and use our brain.
    But on the system you are working with there would mean sin is onlywhat i say is sin?
    so if i dont think some things a sin its not?
    Well I can think an ant is an elephant, but it does not make the ant an elephant. I can say this is not a sin, but it does not make it so.
    I am completely puzzled by your way of thinking.

    I also think Christ was very detailed in how we should live our lives I think the Bible is very clear there.
    I am admit there may be some shades of grey. But by the way you are talking, I find it very hard to understand sin. Sin can not be down to the individual but to God.
    I cant understand it does not compute.

    please explain further i think i may of missed ur point completely
     
  10. hithesh

    hithesh New Member

    Messages:
    913
    Likes Received:
    2
    Faith:
    Christian
    "thou shall not kill"

    Do you refuse to kill somebody, because this is written in the commandments, or because you, yourself feel murder is wrong?

    If there was no God, then sin would be relative--what's wrong for you, will not necessarily be wrong for me.

    But since we as Christians believe there is a God, and that this God dwells within us, and speaks to us, then sin is relative to the God that dwells within our heart.

    a story about "thou shall not steal":

    I remember a period when I was relatively broke; I barely had money to eat. I was in a school library, and I saw that someone had left their textbook, and I thought about taking this book, and selling it to the bookstore--that way I would have been fed, and I'd have a few desperately needed dollars remaining as well.

    As a Christian, I still juggled this temptation, but the 10 commandments didn't weigh on my heart.

    What weighed on me is compassion, and I thought about the person who lost this book, and how he would have to buy a new one, and the burden my deed would have placed on him.

    This compassion, which only a god, could place in me, had led me to hand the book over to the librarian.

    (No commandment, or law, or fear, weighed my heart, it was only the love of my neighbor, granted by a God above.)

    The greatest of all Christian values is compassion, because from compassion all morality is formed, and the grand themes of right and wrong are no longer relative.

    Just think of this.
     
  11. andybmi

    andybmi New Member

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Non-Denominational
    I agree with ur point on compassion.
    But it no way deducts from that fact if u had taken it you would of transgressed the law?
    The law is good the law is there because of the very reason you stated. Would it would of done to the victim.
    I see no difference.
     
  12. hithesh

    hithesh New Member

    Messages:
    913
    Likes Received:
    2
    Faith:
    Christian
    I'm not too clear on what you're trying to say, but I assume you're talking about punishments by breaking societies laws, and god's laws.

    Yes, some people do behave morally because they fear prison, so to say. Like you might not sell or use drugs, even though you think it's okay to do so, because you fear jail time.

    But does this type of thinking work for God's law?
    Do people behave morally because they fear God's wrath. I don't. Do you?

    I don't think anyone really does, because God's punishment is abstract and has become even more abstract as time has gone on, and Man's punishment is something we are well aware of, and felt. So we have something we can perceive of to fear.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.