Why are they are not Saved ??

[KarlX]

Jesus.
Jesus.
Jesus spoke to scribes and pharisees directly.
Jesus told them exactly what the Father told Him to say.
Same today.
They had a choice.
Follow Jesus and live.
Or don't follow Jesus.
Jesus did not give them a choice to keep on doing what they were doing and also follow Him.
They could follow Him, necessarily giving up all they had been doing before that was opposed to Torah,
or they could keep on doing what they had done all their lives religiously,
and remained dead in their sins forever - separate from Jesus Christ, not in Him, no following Him.

"Did God Say.... ? " they had to ? "Did God Really Say ? ...... "

The temptation to doubt and change what God said is there for everyone.

Most religious people stay on the wide road with man's traditions opposed to Jesus.

A few follow Jesus. Same as when Jesus Himself was on earth with them - only a few followed Jesus. Most rejected Him and died in their sin, often surrounded by 'tradition' that took the place of God's Way of Liffe that would have saved them.....

That makes all the difference for eternity.

At least where the LDS are concerned I assure you they do believe they are following Jesus .
Are they , well that might very well be another question but they certainly do believe they are following him .

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

At least where the LDS are concerned I assure you they do believe they are following Jesus .
Are they , well that might very well be another question but they certainly do believe they are following him .

Why do you think so ?
Whenever the True Yeshua HaMashiach is shown to them, in life and in Scripture
they admit that is not who they serve. (many in churches do also, but that's another though similar point - the fake "jesus" is very common, not just in lds)
Whenever a true born again believer immersed in Yeshua
talks to them about Scripture, True Scripture,
they are afraid and run.
They will not discuss Truth, nor Scripture,
unless it is "theirs".

 

[KarlX]

Why do you think so ?
Whenever the True Yeshua HaMashiach is shown to them, in life and in Scripture
they admit that is not who they serve. (many in churches do also, but that's another though similar point - the fake "jesus" is very common, not just in lds)
Whenever a true born again believer immersed in Yeshua
talks to them about Scripture, True Scripture,
they are afraid and run.
They will not discuss Truth, nor Scripture,
unless it is "theirs".

Well yes I agree they do not have the same idea of what and who Jesus is but what I mean is the man commonly referred to as Jesus who died on the cross for the forgiveness of sin , they do believe they follow that person.

What he is all about , who he actually is might be in error but that is still the person they not only believe they follow but believe they are the only ones who follow him correctly

They also believe they are the only one's who worship God correctly ( even though their Idea of God is far astray from the norm , they believe they are the one and ONLY true Church so to speak , see what I mean?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

they believe they are the one true Church so to speak , see what I mean?

Totally.
Thanks for clarifying also (they are not saved).
That's actually more common (not just with them) world wide than most of the world accepts.

 

[KarlX]

Totally.
Thanks for clarifying also (they are not saved).
That's actually more common (not just with them) world wide than most of the world accepts.

No prob .

 

[Job8]

Why is it from a biblical perspective ( where it actually says in the bible ) that certain members of various sects are not saved or not considered christian that are considered by some to be cults and or heretical ?

The Bible says "Believe on THE LORD JESUS CHRIST and thou shalt be saved" (Acts 16:31). If any person preaches ANOTHER GOSPEL or ANOTHER JESUS he cannot be saved, but is rather accursed (Galatians 1:6-9). Those who deny the Deity of Christ or preach a different Jesus cannot be saved. Those who insist that salvation requires both faith and works preach another Gospel.

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

 

[crossnote]

Isaiah 8:20 KJV
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

 

[Winken]

God, Our Hope

We live on hope! A student lives in hope of passing the test and graduating. A worker hopes he will find the right job. The critically ill live in hope of getting well. The wage-earner lives in hope of making money or getting a badly needed car — or even making enough for basic temporal needs. We live in hope that our children will have a decent world to grow up in.

(Obviously, we cannot hope in government. The inability of elected public servants to solve anything has been obvious for many years, and has been emphasized in the last 8 and this coming November election. We deceive and exhaust ourselves placing our hope in government.)

True hope is found only in Jesus. Our hope of salvation is in Him. “For there is none other name under Heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” (Acts 4:12). How to happily embrace that Truth? Romans 10:8-13. Then you walk (constantly, permanently) in His Amazing Grace. Romans 8:1.

@KarlX: What else do you need to know?

 

[Geralt]

that quotation in galatians also forwards one very important principle, that the gospel is supreme authority and vindicates all claims of authority. even Paul or an angel is disqualified if they preach a different gospel. titles and positions are qualified or disqualified based on the gospel they preach or teach.

one sect may claim they have authority at par or above scripture suggesting they were the ones who made them (the canon), but at the same time no longer teaches the gospel as preached by the apostles but rather resorted to ritualism salvation by works, etc.. => they are therefore no longer in authority and are damned regardless of whatever claims of authority they have (even quoting scripture).

the preaching of the biblical gospel is the identity of the true church.​

The Bible says "Believe on THE LORD JESUS CHRIST and thou shalt be saved" (Acts 16:31). If any person preaches ANOTHER GOSPEL or ANOTHER JESUS he cannot be saved, but is rather accursed (Galatians 1:6-9). Those who deny the Deity of Christ or preach a different Jesus cannot be saved. Those who insist that salvation requires both faith and works preach another Gospel.

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

 

[ToBeLoved]

At least where the LDS are concerned I assure you they do believe they are following Jesus .
Are they , well that might very well be another question but they certainly do believe they are following him .

I don't know about that.

What they do is contridictory to the words of Jesus. Even they know that to 'follow' someone is to heed their words. The fact is that just believing Jesus' words would be enough doubt to Mormonism that would make one think. But.... Jesus is not God. He is a human that has received godhood. So, He is their brother who did what they believe they will do, which is become gods.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Well yes I agree they do not have the same idea of what and who Jesus is but what I mean is the man commonly referred to as Jesus who died on the cross for the forgiveness of sin , they do believe they follow that person.

What he is all about , who he actually is might be in error but that is still the person they not only believe they follow but believe they are the only ones who follow him correctly

They also believe they are the only one's who worship God correctly ( even though their Idea of God is far astray from the norm , they believe they are the one and ONLY true Church so to speak , see what I mean?

This is very telling what they believe of their Jesus. The Mormon Jesus did not atone for sin on the cross. The Mormon Jesus bled through His pores in the Garden of Gethsemene and that is the atonement. They do not even acknowledge the cross as being anything.

Now, why would this be? The most important thing that Jesus did for mankind, yet their church does not acknowledge it? That is very telling of the direction that Mormonism leads their people in to.

If you think about it, EVERY meaningful thing that God does for us is twisted. Adam & Eve sinning was good. Everything is backwards, now that is not just a coincidence.

Almost every word in the Christian vocabulary means something else to them. So what God is it?

I DO wish that their religion did not lie to them and say the Bible cannot be trusted. I DO hope that God has mercy on them.

 

[ToBeLoved]

that quotation in galatians also forwards one very important principle, that the gospel is supreme authority and vindicates all claims of authority. even Paul or an angel is disqualified if they preach a different gospel. titles and positions are qualified or disqualified based on the gospel they preach or teach.

one sect may claim they have authority at par or above scripture suggesting they were the ones who made them (the canon), but at the same time no longer teaches the gospel as preached by the apostles but rather resorted to ritualism salvation by works, etc.. => they are therefore no longer in authority and are damned regardless of whatever claims of authority they have (even quoting scripture).

the preaching of the biblical gospel is the identity of the true church.​

Right.

If Jesus is not God and if Jesus did not die on the cross for the forgiveness of sins, then who is atoning for them?

 

[Albion]

At least where the LDS are concerned I assure you they do believe they are following Jesus .
Are they , well that might very well be another question but they certainly do believe they are following him .

I appreciate that fact and agree that it's so, however the naked truth still is that if you think you're worshipping the same God as Christians do but you've installed a completely different being in his place, you are not, in actuality, worshipping the same God or following Jesus, as the case may be.

If I were to say that I follow Jesus and therefore I do sincerely believe that he was born of a unicorn under a cabbage leaf and grew up to teach all the Japanese people to bark at the moon and worship a personal god rather than their ancestors, I would not be following Jesus of Nazareth even if I assigned Jesus' name and some other characteristics taken from the New Testament to that being.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Not to derail the thread but what I think is also a pertinent fact in their beliefs is that JS is even a prophet. Looking at the Bible, it is clear that God chose Godly men as prophets. Looking at JS life, you can clearly see that he is nothing like a prophet that God would even have chose. He has convictions in courts for deceptions and falsifying things. A bank that went under. His testimonies about his not being a polygamist that were obviously not true.

In one instance I feel very bad that they have been misled, but on the other side there is just so much evidence that I have a hard time seeing how they cannot see it.

Archeology, places, history shows the Bible to be accurate. The Mormon history, scripture and even the BOA which is a forgery off of Egyptian hyroglifs shows that JS was a fraud.

Now there is a certain point where facts are facts. And any religion that is founded off the apostasy of another religion has to prove that point to even be believeable enough to exist.

The fails are so many. One must be in denial not to see it.

 

[Geralt]

no disrespect but the question is moot.
no need to discuss or argue what is not or what did not happen.

Right.
If Jesus is not God and if Jesus did not die on the cross for the forgiveness of sins, then who is atoning for them?

 

[ToBeLoved]

no disrespect but the question is moot.
no need to discuss or argue what is not or what did not happen.

I don't see how what they believe about Jesus and atonement could be moot.

But we all have our opinions.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[KarlX]

I appreciate that fact and agree that it's so, however the naked truth still is that if you think you're worshipping the same God as Christians do but you've installed a completely different being in his place, you are not, in actuality, worshipping the same God or following Jesus, as the case may be.

If I were to say that I follow Jesus and therefore I do sincerely believe that he was born of a unicorn under a cabbage leaf and grew up to teach all the Japanese people to bark at the moon and worship a personal god rather than their ancestors, I would not be following Jesus of Nazareth even if I assigned Jesus' name and some other characteristics taken from the New Testament to that being.

You may have a point .

 

[Blade]

"KarlX"

We all know for the most part our truth is the real truth and others are just wrong or.. anyway. Yet our personal belief is not GODS WORD! What can be proved is Jesus came in the flesh died was buried rose the 3rd day and is the ONLY way to the Father. The heart none of us know. Jesus said if HE had not come they would have no sin. Jesus said if you were blind you would have no sin. You say you see your sin remains.

JESUS is real. You can pray and talk to Him and He talks back.. the Father the sweet sweet Holy Spirit. So for me for that is allI can speak for..when ANY group goes out side the lines. As in OTHER ways to get to God or Jesus or go past GOD as in becoming a GOD so for so on. These are not of God. I have to answer to Him not man. So to offend I always say forgive me.

When a thief can just say "remember me"... BILLIONS are blind praise GOD! So many only know what they been taught so to judge them on a truth they never heard.. God will not. Its when you..YOU ask..and you hear and you then will not listen..for that I can not speak. For I believe it is FAR easier to be saved then lost.

Were hear to show the way.. that path to God through Christ that HE IS REAL and ALIVE! I can not show people a path that I am not will not take aka to hell lol.

So only the FATHER/CHRIST/HOLYSPIRIT...

 

[Job8]

I mean who decides who is saved and who is not ?

God decides who is saved and who is not. He has laid down certain criteria in Scripture which determine whether some are saved and some are not. Those who preach "another Jesus" or "another Gospel" cannot be saved (Galatians 1:6-12).

6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

10 For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

 

[gracethroughfaith]

Only God is the judge of souls