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Why Abortion should never be Outlawed!! (an honest, personal eperience) TRUTH!!!!

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality' started by MyrokRolles, Aug 19, 2011.

  1. mdancin4theLord

    mdancin4theLord New Member

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    Where did you get these statistics and information?


    What is so ridiculous about it? Most all abortions are done because of excuses like this. Go to Guttmaucher Institute and look at their research on this. The fact is most women who get abortions in America are Christian. The abortions they are not because of any threat to their health. Less than 1% of ALL ABORTIONS are done to save the mothers life. This is hardly an issue. No hospital in the country would allow a mother to die...they would save her first...even it abortion was illegal.
    Women should be taking this more seriously...getting pregnant. If you cant afford and dont want another baby....get fixed, so abortion would never be an option. Sex before marriage is sin. Most abortions are done on Christian single women. What does that say? It says there are a lot of sinning women out there having sex. And then when they get pregnant...using abortion as birth control. Guttmaucher also says most women don't just get one, they get multiple abortions today.


    I find this very hard to beleive, very hard. What I see is true are people who think that if you are pro-life and against abortion....the responsiblity for everyones children fall on your shoulders...that no one should have to take responsiblity for their own actions...that pro-lifers should even shoulder the burdons of those who do opt for abortion or adopt. Why?

    If I am poor myself...and do pro-life work...and I responsibly have had two children who I am raising...why should someone who wants to give their children up become MY RESPONSIBLITY, just because I am against killing the ones they created? What about them standing up and doing the right thing? What you are saying is that....pro-choice people can sleep around conceive children...and because some people are pro-life...and dont want abortion to be on the table...should then be responsible for the children they conceived and had.

    Pro-lifers just dont want unborn children dismembered alive. Why cant you see that? What is so difficult to get? We want abortion illegal because if it were it would save millions and millions and millions of human lives every year. We see that life is precious and that no one should have the right to kill just for the hell of it. Do you think abortion is humane? We don't even do this to our animals on the scale of human abortions every year. The back alley coathanger thing is a myth. Even PP said that before 1973 most abortions were done by doctors in offices. The US Bureau of Statistics...reports of this are so low...it was never an issue.
    But by your mindset.....do we just legalize everything because people are going to do it anyway? I mean is that where you want to go with this? Shoudl we legalize all drugs......? Legalize and lower the drinking age because most kids do it anyway?
    What your saying is that abortion is good.....because it eliminates some babies from things that MIGHT happen. They MIGHT be in a less than perfect family. Is your family perfect? LOL Mine isnt and most arent.They MIGHT be in a poor home, a home with an alcoholic parent...etc. MIGHT MIGHT MIGHT.
    What RIGHT do you have to determine for another human being what MIGHT HAPPEN IN THEIR LIFE?



    If every Christian would live their life by the scriptures......acknowledging that premarital sex is wrong, is sin......we would not have this problem. Well we might because you are pro-abortion...so you think its acceptable for any reason probably going into the third trimester...to abort. This is not a Christian viewpoint.

    How many adopted kids do you support?

    What you say is it scriptural?
     
  2. mdancin4theLord

    mdancin4theLord New Member

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    If you are pro-choice....you want abortion to be legal. Saying it is legal...means that women can kill.
    You vote to allow women the option to kill.
    You are not pro-life....you are pro-abortion.

    Why don't you like the label? Something wrong with abortion? LOL
     
  3. lumlite

    lumlite Regular Member

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    This is a very good question, where are you getting your information?
    The Guttmacher Institute study here: http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/journals/3711005.pdf ?

    Actually, according to the study, 12% cited a health issue with the mother as a factor in deciding to get an abortion. 13% cited a possible health issue with the fetus as a factor. 7% cited one or the other as the most important factor in deciding for an abortion.

    The factor affecting the largest group of women getting an abortion deals with the cost of raising a child, which 73% cited as a reason.

    Just wanted to make sure we were all working with the same facts.
     
  4. Skaloop

    Skaloop Senior Contributor

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    I don't like it because it is not accurate. I am not pro-abortion. I am pro-choice, but it would certainly be my preference if nobody ever got an abortion. If anything, I am anti-abortion. But the freedom of women to choose to have an abortion outweighs my objections to women having abortions.
     
  5. FaithLikeARock

    FaithLikeARock Let the human mind loose.

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    From the statistics that he quoted. Read back.

    You call it excuses - and how many of those starving mothers have you offered thousands of dollars to pay for her pregnancy and birth costs after which you adopted her child?

    Doesn't surprise me.

    Yeah, I said that.

    [/quote]Less than 1% of ALL ABORTIONS are done to save the mothers life.[/quote]

    It's not less than 1% though it is low.

    Some pro-lifers would disagree, but that isn't what I was talking about and I never said the statistic was higher. Sounds to me like you're preaching to make yourself feel better and ignoring my major point.

    Fun fact: most Christians are pro-life, meaning at least some of those Christian women getting an abortion are pro-life. You're preaching to the choir - I already knew that Christians were enormous hypocrites who bend the rules to get their way. It wasn't what I was talking about at all.

    Also, the reason women get multiple abortions is unwanted pregnancy is directly linked to a lack of education about birth control, and a lack of education is typically linked to a higher likelihood to have sex more often with multiple people.

    I really LOVE that excuse. "No they should take responsibility for their actions!" Yes, at the expense of the child. The child YOU insist you want to protect, and yet have no problem with it going to an underfunded, abusive or non-existent home. It's hypocrisy at best and it proves that pro-lifers don't care about the child or the situation. They care about their misguided sense of morality, and forcing others to do what they say.

    You want to make children suffer their entire lives, and more than likely doom them to a life on the streets without a family and then you try to brush it off by going "Well it's not MY responsibility". Every abortion you PREVENT with you self-righteous nonsense makes it your responsibility. Every woman you force to have a baby she can't afford makes that baby the responsibility of the pro-life movement.

    I take responsibility for the women who have no excuse to have an abortion (except for shallow, meaningless "because I don't want too" excuses) and I will tell any woman who gives me that reason that she is despicable. But the pro-life movement doesn't want to take responsibility for their half.

    Because you're the one pushing for laws that force that child to be born without a home.

    Bringing a child into a home where they're unloved and uncared for is the right thing? In what scenario?

    No, I'm saying that forcing mothers who can't afford a child, or who are in an abusive situation, or who don't have the emotional or mental readiness to raise a child, is morally irresponsible and that makes it YOUR responsibility. You're complaining that you're poor and raising two kids. Two kids you CHOSE to have instead of adopting.

    Pro-lifers aren't concerned with actual life or they would adopt. And I mean adopt more than just the newborn perfect babies. I mean the kids who really need it. You are just as pro-choice as the women you condemn because you CHOSE to have kids instead of adopt, you CHOSE to ignore the thousands of kids in foster care who don't have a family, because you wanted to have your own little carbon copy.

    Neither do pro-choicers because that's not the procedure.

    Because it's untrue.

    No, you want to save hundreds of fetuses - once they pop out you've proven that you don't care in the least because it's "not your responsibility".

    Obviously not, or you wouldn't be letting kids waste away in the adoption system.

    If done legally yes.

    What are you talking about? Animal euthenization is still alive and well.

    It's a myth? You're trying to say it never happened? Just because doctors still did most procedures doesn't mean it never happened and doesn't mean those doctors DOING it were still unsafe and unlicensed.

    How on earth do you get statistics on something like that? It's like trying to measure the amount of illegal drugs in the country - you can give it a rough stab but you'll never get very close because you can't keep an official record of something being done illegally.

    Yes, but that's another argument.

    No, I'm saying it's necessary until human being stop being selfish and reaching out a hand to these families that need it. You know for someone who whines about how I'm not getting it, you sure will take my words out of context in a heart beat.

    There's no MIGHT about it. If a mother is willing to abort her baby, then clearly that home isn't right for them. And since people like YOU aren't willing to adopt, and foster care isn't exactly known for being nurturing, then there is no might. It's practically a guarantee.

    Oh yes, Leverticus 16:146 - "Thou shalt not abort because I say so". I know this is hard for you to believe, but no everyone is Christian.

    I'm 20 - state won't even let me adopt especially with my income and when I do have the income to adopt they'll probably still turn my away because of my sexuality. The fact that I already have many years of experience with children, including children with developmental disabilities, is completely ignored because I have a girlfriend. But let me guess - you agree with that too?

    I'm not Christian, so why would I care?
     
    selfinflikted likes this.
  6. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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  7. AtheistStu

    AtheistStu Newbie

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    Abortion is the deliberate killing of a human being by a human being: it is a form of homicide. The only difference between abortion and premeditated murder is the age of the victim. Unless there is a desperate and wholly exceptional case, abortion is morally repugnant and brings shame on a supposedly civilised and humane society.

    Atheist Stu
     
  8. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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    While that may be your opinion, which you are wholly entitled to, the law simply doesn't side with you on this.

    I think "stage of development" would be a better qualifier than "age."

    Again, this is solely your opinion. Some people find nothing inherently morally wrong with abortion.
     
  9. razeontherock

    razeontherock New Member

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    Not responsive in the least. All you can do is dodge?
     
  10. razeontherock

    razeontherock New Member

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    The only problem I have with this view is NO CONSIDERATION IS GIVEN TO THE CHILD
     
  11. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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    You mean fetus.
     
  12. razeontherock

    razeontherock New Member

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    Wonderful to see an atheist with such a sense of fairness and decency! YOU can make a case for morality without God. (A topic which never seems to go away in these parts)

    A few posts back someone mentioned adoption, and this is a really valid point that cannot be separated from the abortion issue. Here in the US we have couples avoiding the adoption system entirely, shelling out big bucks for a child to adopt. We have other couples adopting from foreign countries at huge expense, winding up with children they have no idea how to care for due to the traumas they have been exposed to.

    If the US adoption system were fixed, (the need for which is evidenced by the above examples) and there was no supply of couples wanting to adopt, the "pro choice" side of the aisle would have a MUCH stronger position!

    Look at the basics folks; we have a (at least) 2 party system to facilitate progress. Pro choice should be focused on fixing the problems with adoption, while pro life might myopically focus on only limiting abortions. Great strides would be made like this!
     
  13. razeontherock

    razeontherock New Member

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    No, I mean child. Morning after pill? (RU486, heh) First tri-mester? This is clearly the realm of E & M. Arguably before 20 weeks, much moreso by 20 weeks, and absolutely by viable age (even with medical assistance)we are talking about a CHILD.
     
  14. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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    Did you read FaithLikeARock's post at the top of page 14? I think she nailed it. What you meant was "fetus."
     
  15. good brother

    good brother Guest

    Well said. Amen.

    In Christ, GB
     
  16. TomCS

    TomCS justified by his blood

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    Every pro-choice argument boils down to expediency; doing what is convenient rather than what is right because it is easier.
     
  17. razeontherock

    razeontherock New Member

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    This is no way related to any part of her post. Which you know, does not lend weight to your assertion. I should take a cue from many of Skavau's posts:

    look, I am me, and you are not. You understand? If one of us were to state what I am trying to say, that would be me, and not you. Your attempts at stating what I mean fail, because you are not me, while I am. Understand? etc etc ^_^
     
  18. AtheistStu

    AtheistStu Newbie

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    selfinflikted

    The law varies from country to country. The UK looks like it's going to tighten its abortion law quite soon and some other European countries are reviewing theirs. Laws can be changed.

    We are all at a "stage of development". We are in a continuing state of change from conception to death. That is the nature of life,

    Some people find nothing inherently wrong with slavery, or cruelty to animals, or forced marriage.

    razeontherock

    Atheism is only legitimate as a complete belief system if it encompasses a belief in some kind of innate morality. If we think killing people is wrong, then killing unborn infants must be wrong, too. :thumbsup:

    Stu
     
  19. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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    Yea, I get it. But you guys should really try to say what you mean instead. That way, I wouldn't have to translate for you.

    The proof is in the pudding, so to speak. I stand by FaithLikeARock's original assertion, until you show me differently. You guys only care for imposing your morality onto others and trying to make everyone else think and act like you. It really doesn't concern the "children" does it? Once that child is born, you never give it another thought. The concern lies in making the expecting mother do what you think she should do. It may just be the bad mood I'm in today, but I really think the pro-life argument has little to do with saving children, only fetuses.

    (the above "you" is the "general you" and not you, specifically, Raze.)
     
  20. selfinflikted

    selfinflikted Under Deck

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    So can opinions, and moralities.

    Indeed. Age normally reflects this, but not always. Most two year olds have functioning brains, as well as most 50 year olds. Most two week old fetuses do not. You get the point.

    Indeed. Point being, not all people have the same values and morals.
     
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