Who gets taken? (post-trib theory only)

[erickson]

[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


I'm interested in who is being taken in post-trib theory? i.e. are people being "taken" to be with Jesus, or are they being "taken" in judgement?

Is this something that post-trib believers will disagree on?

 

[John S]

I will let God worry about that and then I don't have to.

 

[Interplanner]

The verb "taken" there is bad. See what the analogy applies to: people in Noah's day taken away. The more revealing verb is that they "knew nothing."

All of this applies first of all to the 1st century situation when Roman legions swept Galilee and Judea. It is situated next to the final coming of Christ because that was the expectation (see the thread 'the only real eschatology question'), although that is not what the Father decided ultimately.

 

[erickson]

All of this applies first of all to the 1st century situation when Roman legions swept Galilee and Judea.

I think that's a very unlikely interpretation. That wasn't a case of sudden unexpected destruction.

 

[Interplanner]

You are right in a sense. Mt 24B (after v29) may be totally about the 2nd coming; however, some commentators notice a sort of 'looping' back and drawing comparisons between what happened in the 60s in Judea and what would happen on the final day. The reason they do that is because of v34, obviously after v29. That generation would see it, and the fig tree symbol which was also used of the events of the Jewish revolt in Lk 23:31, in which the setting is that generation and the horrible things that happened in the 60s. For that matter, the OT quote about the mountains falling (Hos 10) applied to that as well, which is important to remember while touring the Rev. The official apostolic use of Hos 10 is about that generation.

 

[Biblewriter]

[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


I'm interested in who is being taken in post-trib theory? i.e. are people being "taken" to be with Jesus, or are they being "taken" in judgement?

Is this something that post-trib believers will disagree on?

This is a major problem for all post tribbers. For if this is the final judgment, all are taken and none left. Some, indeed, are taken for blessing and others are taken for judgment, but post trib requires that all are taken at this time.

 

[SG9]

[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


I'm interested in who is being taken in post-trib theory? i.e. are people being "taken" to be with Jesus, or are they being "taken" in judgement?

Is this something that post-trib believers will disagree on?

Verse 39 might appear contrary to the other prophecy and some people concerning 'not knowing the hour or day of God's return'. It's written that the wicked will be 'taken' by surprise when they least expect it, although they expect it, don't miss that part.

So I wonder then if the people in the days of Noah knew that it would come but did not believe Noah's predictions as when? That's the general idea I have and it's said that our days will be parallel, so if we flip the coin we then can see in the reverse direction and see that their days were like ours. What is our problem these days? Confusion

It depends on how you view the end when Christ returns, and it's confusing because we are between the two and without a map or stars to navigate by. The symbolism is in the three angels messages, and they will be our stars for navigation to glory in Christ.

I'm not sure which view that this fits into but it seems plain to believe that those who are taken away are the wicked population, and the flood is of corruption as the parallel to Revelation's flood of corruption. Those people saw a physical flood of water while the people in the last days will die a spiritual death from drowning in the sea of corruption that the dragon sends in but then it's said that the earth helps the mother of the offspring and so.

I don't know where it would end if we look at other evidence, and many questions I can't answer, myself. This could likely be limiting the interpretation that you're looking for by limiting it to post-views, just a thought that came to mind. Thanks

 

[rdclmn72]

Taken as in judgment.

 

[zeke37]

[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


I'm interested in who is being taken in post-trib theory? i.e. are people being "taken" to be with Jesus, or are they being "taken" in judgement?

hi
taken in the coming flood. (trib)
it's a very bad thing

Is this something that post-trib believers will disagree on?

i'd imagine

This is a major problem for all post tribbers.

no it is not...see above

For if this is the final judgment, all are taken and none left. Some, indeed, are taken for blessing and others are taken for judgment, but post trib requires that all are taken at this time.

1st of all, this scripture is about Mat24:38f
when u continue to read the chapter, u learn that
those left are the ones found working when He comes
and those left working are blessed and inherit all things

2nd, u don't really thinK the good guys are the ones taken here do u?
they knew not and were taken

 

[Bible2]

Interplanner said in post 3:

The verb "taken" there is bad.

That's right.

Luke 17:26-37 and Matthew 24:37-41 refer to what will happen at Jesus' 2nd coming, "when the Son of man is revealed" (Luke 17:30), "the coming of the Son of man" (Matthew 24:37,39), which Jesus had just finished saying won't happen until immediately after the future tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31). Those "taken" at the 2nd coming (Luke 17:34-36, Matthew 24:40-41) will be unsaved people who will be taken to where they will be killed and birds will eat their dead bodies (Luke 17:36-37; Matthew 24:28, cf. Job 39:30b; Revelation 19:21). The Greek word "paralambano" ("taken": Luke 17:34-36, Matthew 24:40-41) can be used to refer to being taken to another place to be killed (John 19:16-18).

Those "left" where they are at the 2nd coming (Luke 17:34-36, Matthew 24:40-41) will include unsaved people who will be forced to come up annually to worship the returned Jesus in Jerusalem during the millennium (Zechariah 14:16-19). These unsaved people will have to be ruled with a rod of iron by Jesus and the bodily resurrected church during the millennium (Revelation 2:26-29, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 20:4-6, Psalms 2, Psalms 66:3, Psalms 72:8-11). And their descendants will be deceived by Satan after the millennium is over into committing the Gog/Magog rebellion (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39).

Before the millennium, at Jesus' 2nd coming, those in the church will neither be "taken" and killed, nor "left" where they are, but will be "gathered together" (raptured) (Matthew 24:31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1) into the sky to hold a meeting in the air with the returned Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17). The purpose of this rapture meeting will be so that those in the church can be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7) in the sky, before Jesus descends from the sky (the first heaven) with the obedient part of church to bring his 2nd-coming wrath on the unsaved world (Revelation 19:14 to 20:3).

So the 2nd coming will be like "the days of Noah" (Matthew 24:37) and "the days of Lot" (Luke 17:28,30) in that just as Noah went into the ark before the Flood, and Lot went out from Sodom before it was destroyed, so the church will be raptured into the sky at the 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, Matthew 24:30-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Revelation 19:7) before Jesus begins the 2nd-coming wrath (Revelation 19:15 to 20:3, Luke 17:26-30, Matthew 24:37-39).

 

[Bible2]

erickson said in post 4:

That wasn't a case of sudden unexpected destruction.

The unsaved people of the world will have no idea that most of them are going to be killed at Jesus' 2nd coming until it happens (Matthew 24:37-39). For they could think that the 2nd coming had already occurred with the coming into power of the Antichrist's miracle-working False Prophet (Revelation 13:13-14, Revelation 19:20), who could claim to be Jesus returned. And just as the people of the world shortly before Noah's flood, even though they could see or hear about Noah building his huge ark, no doubt rejected the idea that YHWH had the power to actually cause a global flood which would kill them, so the people of the world at the end of the future tribulation could reject the idea that YHWH has the power to actually defeat them.

For during the tribulation's 2nd half, the world will see the power of Lucifer (Satan, the dragon) and his fallen angels (Revelation 12:9), and the power Lucifer will give to the Antichrist to take over the entire earth (Revelation 13:4-8), and to utterly revile YHWH year after year without being destroyed (Revelation 13:5-6, Daniel 11:36), and to physically overcome and kill people in the church in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13). And the world will see the amazing miraculous powers that Lucifer will give to the Antichrist's False Prophet, by which he will be able to even call fire down from heaven in the sight of everyone (Revelation 13:13, cf. 2 Thessalonians 2:9).

And near the end of the future tribulation, the world will see the Antichrist's defeat of YHWH's amazingly-powerful two witnesses (Revelation 11:3-9), after which defeat the world will rejoice and make merry and send gifts to each other because the two witnesses had been sending plagues on the world (Revelation 11:10,6). And even though those plagues will be shortly followed by even more plagues from YHWH, poured out directly from heaven (Revelation 16, the tribulation's final stage), the people of the world won't lose their confidence that YHWH can still be defeated. For after almost all of the plagues from heaven are over, the world will see the awesome miraculous powers of some unclean spirits, convincing the world's armies to gather together for a battle against YHWH (Revelation 16:13-14, Revelation 19:19). And so the world could come to that battle at the very end of the tribulation with the same careless attitude as some people at the start of the American Civil War, who held picnics at the expected first battleground of Bull Run/Manassas to watch the battle and what they expected to be a quick and easy victory.

 

[Kingdom_Come]

[38] For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,
[39] And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
[40] Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
[41] Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.


I'm interested in who is being taken in post-trib theory? i.e. are people being "taken" to be with Jesus, or are they being "taken" in judgement?

Is this something that post-trib believers will disagree on?

To me, this really isn't much of a mystery if we reconcile it with other Scripture on the subject. Consider 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17. It is clear who is taken in this passage. If we accept that Paul is referring to the same event that Jesus was speaking about, then it becomes clear who will be taken and who will be left. You will probably find people who disagrees on this. However, I do believe Jesus and Paul are speaking of the same event: the Second Coming.

Verse 39 might appear contrary to the other prophecy and some people concerning 'not knowing the hour or day of God's return'.

This is a very common way that this passage is read or understood. However, people seem to overlook one very important word: 'of' from the Greek word peri which can be translated as concerning or about. It is important because it can have a drastic effect on the meaning of that passage.

" But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only" (Mat 24:36).

" But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son" (Mat 24:36 - ESV).

With regard to verse 40, "Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left," the Greek word translated there as taken is paralambanō, which essentially means to receive near or take (unto, with). Again, this is consistent with the notion of Christ gathering His elect to Himself as He appears - which is what He says earlier in verse 31 - and preparing to bring about the destruction of the man of sin.

Verses 37-39 should not be confused with the gathering that is being spoken about in this passage. Those verses are speaking about what things were like in the world at the time the flood came. Jesus is merely trying to paint the picture that people will have the same cavalier attitude at the time of the end. They will live their lives as if they have nothing to worry about. These are the same people that the Day of The Lord will come as a thief upon; it will come unexpectedly. It is not referring to who will be gathered at the Second Coming as Jesus already identified who will be gathered at His coming.

 

[n2thelight]

Matthew 24:37 "But as the days of Noe were so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."

This "Noe", is the Greek form of the Hebrew word, "Noah". These final days of this earth will be exactly as it was in the days that Noah was on the earth, just prior to his entering into the ark. To find out what happened in that day, we must go to Genesis 6. What was it like in those days?

Genesis 6:1, 2; "And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them," [1] "That the sons of God [the fallen angels] saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose." [2]
These angels left their first estate, as Jude writes in Jude 4, and married flesh women of flesh man. From this marriage came the offspring of this evil relationship. These offspring were called; in Strong's Hebrew dictionary # 5303, and 5307, "Nephilim, or the Giants. These angels are created beings, and thus are called the "sons of God".

Genesis 6:4-5; "There were giants [Nephilim] in the earth in those days; and also f=after that, when the sons of God [fallen angels] came in unto the daughters of men, they bare [children, is added by the translators] to them, the same became might men which were of old, men of renoun."

So we see that the fallen angels left their habitation of the heavenlies, and came to earth and mated with women and a new for of life was formed, and evil form defiant against God. Man and angels are very similar, for the Israelites were sustained on angels food in the wilderness, and angels ate of mans food, as we saw when they sat with both Abraham, and Lot, and ate.

The whole reason for the flood of Noah's time was to destroy the misfits that had invaded the earth, and inbred with women. The reason for God saving Noah is recorded in Genesis 6:8, 9; "But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord." [8] "These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God." [9]

In the Hebrew manuscripts, "perfect" is the word "tamin", or without blemish, with respect to pedigree. What this is telling us is that all of flesh corrupted except for Noah's family. The word in the Hebrew for "walked", means Noah walked habitually [continually] with God.
Are you starting to get the picture, these angels are going to return to earth in the last days, and do the same as they did in Noah's day. Strange events are starting to come to light, and the governments around the world are allowing sightings and events to go out to the public, where before they would kill and discredit those who saw the events. We are very close to the time when they will become as common as man, and be accepted, and this can happen because the Kenites now control the one world system.

Jesus is telling them that it is not going to be any difference now, as it was in Noah's day, for you are going to have the fallen angels down their with you then. When Satan is caste to the earth, all of Satan's many fallen angels will be caste out with him. This is recorded in Revelation 12:7-9; "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, [7] "And prevailed not, neither was their place found any more in heaven." [8] "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him." [9]

What will the people of the earth be doing at this time?

Matthew 24:38 "For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,"

They were eating and drinking, and marrying, and giving in marriage to the fallen angels. If you think that is not possible, that is exactly as it was in Noah's day as he entered into the ark. Friend that is what is starting to happen, where even churches are catering to Sodomy, and all forms of ancient Baalism, and they think it is of God, they are accepting it, because they are ignorant of God's holy word. Pray to God that you are not of that mind set, for it is part of the mark of the beast. No the mark of the beast is not any form of electronic devise, but a mind set that conforms to the doctrines of devils.

Before Christ returns the entire world will accept the doctrines of this locust army of fallen angels, because they will be taught in their church houses to do so. If you are not one of the elect, you will accept these angels as being from God, and you will agree with everything that they say, for if you do not have the seal of God in your forehead, you mind, God will allow the delusion to come over your mind. It is not to late to know the truth now, but that time is getting near when it will not be your choice.

Just before Jesus Christ return to earth these angels will be working miracles, with their leader, Satan, and this is possible because they are supernatural, just like Satan is. They are not of flesh our human substance. What happened in Genesis 6 is going to happen again, so make a point of getting to know the chapter.

matthew24

 

[n2thelight]

That is why Paul would say the following

II Corinthians 11:2 "For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ."

For a young woman to be "espoused" to her husband means that she is completely committed to him, even before the vows have been exchanged. Paul is using this relationship whereby we could understand the emotions of Christ towards His bride. The feeling and commitment goes both ways, and applies to the man as much as it applies to the woman. It is no great secret what causes virginity to be lost, for it is being unfaithful sexually to the one you are espoused to marry.

If a woman has been unfaithful, and is with child, how could she expect that she could be accepted by the man she was espoused to, when she is carrying another man's child? Paul is afraid that if Christians start listening to these fairy-tale preachers, they will be taken by the wrong christ, or Satan the Antichrist [the instead of Christ]. Then when Jesus Christ returns at the seventh trumpet, they will be found unworthy to be part of "the bride of Christ".

Remember what Jesus said in Matthew 24:19;

"And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!" He was not referring to a mother with a child in her womb, but spiritually speaking, Christians that have given themselves over to the wrong husband. In ignorance they will have been deceived into climbing into the spiritual bed of Satan, and their hearts have been given over to the Satan.

If you are one of the harlots of Satan, than you cannot be one of the virgins of Christ waiting with your lamps full of oil [which is the truth from God's Word] that is waiting for the coming of the bridegroom, which is Jesus Christ. Paul now is putting it into a language that most anyone can understand. Paul is saying; "I'm afraid that one of these false teachers is going to seduce you."

satan comes before Christ and if you don't understand this you will be seduced,with deception,making you a spiritual harlot whom Christ will have nothing to do with at His return

Matthew 24:4 "And Jesus answered and said unto them, "Take heed that no man deceive you."

This is the number one warning, "Take heed that no man deceive you." Deception will be the foremost thing to guard against in the latter days, that will consummate the end of this age. This means that these events will not happen all at one time, but will take place over a period of time. These warnings or signs that Jesus is about to give us, are the seven seals that are given us in the Book of Revelation.
These are an exact overlay of the seven events, which are the seven seals that we should be watching for today. At the end of Matthew we will include the thirteenth chapter of Mark, which is an overlay of Matthew twenty four. These events will be spelled out before we are finish, but again, Don't let anyone deceive you.