Where did the people Cain was afraid would kill him, come from?

WilliamB

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YES. YES. 100000X YES!!!!!!!


The bible is a book about first-born male children, and males with certain birth-rights. Adam and Eve were the first humans; there were no others. Adam was the prime. He was split from androgyny into male and female by God - Adam and Eve (the name given to her by Adam, but she is still Adam.) Genesis 1:1 - 2:3 is a quick overview of the work of God, from creating the Heavens and earth, to humans. Genesis 2:4 - Revelation 22:21 is what happen after humans were created up to the end. Gen 1:1 - 2:3 is like a Star wars movie where the rolling screen of text fills you in on what has happened in the mean time, and the Gen 2:4 to the end of the bible is the movie.

At that time, incest was legal (because the genetic line was pure enough to take inbred genes.) It was outlawed in in Leviticus 18, when there was sufficient genetic variation that could damage progeny. It is often said (and theorized) that, in addition to twin boys, the early humans also had twin girls - sets of two (male/female twins,) or sets of four (male male/female female.) Even if the multiple theory is not the case, or was sometimes the case, the sons married (had sex) with their sisters. We do not hear of this in the bible, because the books chosen are addressing other topics.

A reason why it is a book about first born male children, or males with certain birth-rights, is because it is a foreshadow and allusion to Christ, who is the first perfect man living today.

Another point of Cain's fear was that humans back then lived for nearly 1000 years, so that would be plenty of time for a lot of angry brothers, sisters, neices, nephews, grand nieces, etc. to come after Cain, especially when he gets old. He was thinking about the present, but especially the future, when he pleaded with God to give him protection from the other people. Also, he probably refered to them as "whoever," a relatively impersonal term, because killing Abel qualified him as an exile from the family of Adam and Eve. Not to mention, Adam did not father Cain (can you guess who did,) take a look at Genesis 5 where it lists Adam's sons: it does not list Abel (because he was murdered,) but it does not list Cain either.

Well written assumption, yes. But all assumption none the less. I think I missed the obvious answers last night in the 8th day thread. After reading the Genesis passages, this becomes clear to me.

God created all mankind both male and female before Adam and eve. They were created to be over all manner of fish and animals, etc. but we're not created to work the land. Directly after this on the 8th day, God created Adam to work the land. Case closed...I would think. This is why there's seems no big concern in the text or from scholars because it's already spelled out in scripture.
 
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1234321

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Well written assumption, yes. But all assumption none the less. I think missed the obvious answers last night in the 8th day thread. After reading the Genesis passages, this becomes clear to me.

God created all mankind both male and female before Adam and eve. They were created to be over all manner of fish and animals, etc. but we're not created to work the land. Directly after this on the 8th day, God created Adam to work the land. Case closed...I would think. This is why there's seems no big concern in the text or from scholars because it's already spelled out in scripture.

The 8th day creation is one of the most damaging theories out there. Genesis 2:4 is not an 8th-day creation, otherwise it would have said so (since He explicitly stated which day He created everything else.) Please show me, since it explicitly states the day which God created everything else, where it refers to the creation of Adam and Eve as an 8th day creation. Considering Christ came through Adam's lineage, I would think it to be important enough to record. So, please show me where it explicitly states that the 8th day Adam and Eve were created, when the sixth day (6 is the number of man) He created male and female, and Paul refers to Adam as the first human

And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a life-giving spirit.
1 Corinthians 15:45

Genesis 2:5 states that there was no man (adam) to till the earth. Genesis 2:7 states that God created man (adam) from the dust of the earth and breathed life into his nostrils (1 Corinthians 15:45 references this verse when Paul states Adam was the first human.) Genesis 2:19 is the first time man is referenced as Adam. In Genesis 2:20-23, God makes male and female out of Adam. Genesis 2:4 starts a narrative that begins at the 6th day. It is a deeper insight into the creation of man and woman. It is not another creation story.

Adam was the prime human. He was split into male and female. He was not an 8th day creation. Paul refers to him as the FIRST HUMAN. Saying Adam was the 8th day creation, and other humans were created on the sixth day sets up an extremely high platform for racism. We are all descendents of Eve - the first female. Most all of us are all descendents of Adam - the first male.
 
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WilliamB said:
2. We have no idea how old Cain and Able are but at 30 years old, Eve could have born a max of 40 children in that time.

Actually, we do have some idea, for we read:

Genesis 4:25

"And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew."

Since we know that Adam begat Seth when he was 130 years old (Genesis 5:3), why would you assume that Cain and Abel where only about 30 years old when Cain killed Abel? Are you suggesting that Adam and Eve didn't have children until they were about 100 years old? Are you suggesting that Seth wasn't born until 100 YEARS AFTER Abel died? Neither seems likely and neither seems to be what the texts are actually implying. No, rather, the texts seem to be implying that shortly after God brought Eve unto Adam they had children together. If such is indeed the case, then Adam and Eve could have had a multitude of children/grandchildren/great grandchildren before Seth was born. The text also seems to imply that very shortly after Cain killed Abel, Adam begat Seth and this happened when Adam was 130 years old. IOW, it's quite likely that Cain and Abel were way beyond 30 years old (unless Adam and Eve didn't have any children for the first 100 years) at the time of Abel's death and that many other descendants of Adam and Eve were already alive by this time.
 
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WilliamB

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The 8th day creation is one of the most damaging theories out there. Genesis 2:4 is not an 8th-day creation, otherwise it would have said so (since He explicitly stated which day He created everything else.) Please show me, since it explicitly states the day which God created everything else, where it refers to the creation of Adam and Eve as an 8th day creation. Considering Christ came through Adam's lineage, I would think it to be important enough to record. So, please show me where it explicitly states that the 8th day Adam and Eve were created, when the sixth day (6 is the number of man) He created male and female, and Paul refers to Adam as the first human

1 Corinthians 15:45

It's a good question. Maybe Paul misunderstood as well. He's not perfect. I don't know.

Genesis 2:5 states that there was no man (adam) to till the earth. Genesis 2:7 states that God created man (adam) from the dust of the earth and breathed life into his nostrils (1 Corinthians 15:45 references this verse when Paul states Adam was the first human.) Genesis 2:19 is the first time man is referenced as Adam. In Genesis 2:20-23, God makes male and female out of Adam.

Adam was the prime human. He was split into male and female. He was not an 8th day creation. Paul refers to him as the FIRST HUMAN. Saying Adam was the 8th day creation, and other humans were created on the sixth day sets up an extremely high platform for racism. We are all descendents of Eve - the first female. Most all of us are all descendents of Adam - the first male.

In genesis 1 24-26 God creates all mankind. Male and female. This is the sixth day. The 8th day is an obvious reference as God creates Adam after He rests on the seventh day. I'm just telling you what the scriptures say. I'm not concerned with what platform it sets, people will find a way to be racist if they choose. All people are able to enter God family through Jesus Christ, so that's a non-issue.
 
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1234321

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Actually, we do have some idea, for we read:

Genesis 4:25

"And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew."

Since we know that Adam begat Seth when he was 130 years old (Genesis 5:3), why would you assume that Cain and Abel where only about 30 years old when Cain killed Abel? Are you suggesting that Adam and Eve didn't have children until they were about 100 years old? Are you suggesting that Seth wasn't born until 100 YEARS AFTER Abel died? Neither seems likely and neither seems to be what the texts are actually implying. No, rather, the texts seem to be implying that shortly after God brought Eve unto Adam they had children together. If such is indeed the case, then Adam and Eve could have had a multitude of children/grandchildren/great grandchildren before Seth was born. The text also seems to imply that very shortly after Cain killed Abel, Adam begat Seth and this happened when Adam was 130 years old. IOW, it's quite likely that Cain and Abel were way beyond 30 years old (unless Adam and Eve didn't have any children for the first 100 years) at the time of Abel's death and that many other descendants of Adam and Eve were already alive by this time.

Interesting point. Very interesting point. It is possible that they didn't have children for 100 years, but I can see your point. It is possible that they did (after Abel was born) and Abel was mentioned because he was the first born son (on Adam's side,) but when he died (after children/grandchildren were already born,) they had another son who they "appointed (literally Seth)" to be the one in Abel's place. It is sort of like Joseph, who was born after the rest of his brothers, being an appointed one for Jacob's boys; having the dream that his brothers would kneel to him.

On the other hand, Genesis 5 lists Seth as the first of Adam. If the bible is a book about first-born males, then this may suggest they did wait some time before they had another child. It is understandable, since seeing a child die (when death necessarily didn't exist, and was novel) would take an extreme toll on Adam and Eve.

Of course, they could have had Abel when they were 100 years old. 100 years old to a human that has a lifespan of nearly 1000 years is like a 10 year old in the modern world, barely pubescent. Likewise, 130 years old to a human that has a lifespan of nearly 1000 years old is like a 13 year old pubescent of today. I personally believe Adam and Eve didn't have children until scores of years after they were created. At 130 years old, Adam and Eve were still kids (even though they were created "adult".)
 
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WilliamB

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Interesting point. Very interesting point. It is possible that they didn't have children for 100 years, but I can see your point. It is possible that they did (after Abel was born) and Abel was mentioned because he was the first born son (on Adam's side,) but when he died (after children/grandchildren were already born,) they had another son who they "appointed (literally Seth)" to be the one in Abel's place. It is sort of like Joseph, who was born after the rest of his brothers, being an appointed one for Jacob's boys; having the dream that his brothers would kneel to him.

On the other hand, Genesis 5 lists Seth as the first of Adam. If the bible is a book about first-born males, then this may suggest they did wait some time before they had another child. It is understandable, since seeing a child die (when death necessarily didn't exist, and was novel) would take an extreme toll on Adam and Eve.

Of course, they could have had Abel when they were 100 years old. 100 years old to a human that has a lifespan of nearly 1000 years is like a 10 year old in the modern world, barely pubescent. Likewise, 130 years old to a human that has a lifespan of nearly 1000 years old is like a 13 year old pubescent of today. I personally believe Adam and Eve didn't have children until scores of years after they were created. At 130 years old, Adam and Eve were still kids (even though they were created "adult".)

Still all of this and the text you quoted, ignores Genesis 1 26-28, the sixth day. How do we explain that? Unless starting in Genesis 2 4, it is simply God going back to be more specific in how man was created. But this would still leave the question, where did the people already in the world, that Cain was afraid of and God marked Cain to protect him from, came from.
 
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WilliamB

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Actually, we do have some idea, for we read:

Genesis 4:25

"And Adam knew his wife again; and she bare a son, and called his name Seth: For God, said she, hath appointed me another seed instead of Abel, whom Cain slew."

Since we know that Adam begat Seth when he was 130 years old (Genesis 5:3), why would you assume that Cain and Abel where only about 30 years old when Cain killed Abel? Are you suggesting that Adam and Eve didn't have children until they were about 100 years old? Are you suggesting that Seth wasn't born until 100 YEARS AFTER Abel died? Neither seems likely and neither seems to be what the texts are actually implying. No, rather, the texts seem to be implying that shortly after God brought Eve unto Adam they had children together. If such is indeed the case, then Adam and Eve could have had a multitude of children/grandchildren/great grandchildren before Seth was born. The text also seems to imply that very shortly after Cain killed Abel, Adam begat Seth and this happened when Adam was 130 years old. IOW, it's quite likely that Cain and Abel were way beyond 30 years old (unless Adam and Eve didn't have any children for the first 100 years) at the time of Abel's death and that many other descendants of Adam and Eve were already alive by this time.

I wasn't making a declaration they were 30, I was simply using a number to determine how many children could be produced in 30 years. You can do additional math for whatever age you assume them to be but it's still 40 babies for every 30 years, max. Guess I could have been more specific.
 
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1234321

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Still all of this and the text you quoted, ignores Genesis 1 26-28, the sixth day. How do we explain that? Unless starting in Genesis 2 4, it is simply God going back to be more specific in how man was created. But this would still leave the question, where did the people already in the world, that Cain was afraid of and God marked Cain to protect him from, came from.

Cain was scared of his step brothers and sisters, and their offspring. He was thinking of his future and present. People lived to near 1000 years, so that means many angry and resentful people that would come to find him wherever he went over the years. He knew humans were capable of dying by human hands (since he committed the first murder,) so he was scared of the same thing happening to him. If not from Adam or Eve, from their offspring. It really is that simple.

I am not ignoring the sixth day. The sixth day was when Adam and Eve were created. Like I said, it is an abridged description of God's work (Gen. 1:1 - 2:3.) The detail occurs in Gen 2:4, specifically concerning the creation of Man (Adam.)


Now, please show me where God spent an 8th day to create Adam and Eve, or even when He decided to come out of His rest (from the 7th day, which is arguably the time in which He gave everything to Christ.) And, How do you reconcile 1 Corinthians 15:45 calling Adam the first man?
 
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WilliamB

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Cain was scared of his step brothers and sisters, and their offspring. He was thinking of his future and present. People lived to near 1000 years, so that means many angry and resentful people that would come to find him wherever he went over the years. He knew humans were capable of dying by human hands (since he committed the first murder,) so he was scared of the same thing happening to him. If not from Adam or Eve, from their offspring. It really is that simple.

I am not ignoring the sixth day. The sixth day was when Adam and Eve were created. Like I said, it is an abridged description of God's work (Gen. 1:1 - 2:3.) The detail occurs in Gen 2:4, specifically concerning the creation of Man (Adam.)


Now, please show me where God spent an 8th day to create Adam and Eve, or even when He decided to come out of His rest (from the 7th day, which is arguably the time in which He gave everything to Christ.) And, How do you reconcile 1 Corinthians 15:45 calling Adam the first man?

I already said I don't know why Paul said that. Either he knew it to be true or he made a mistake. Since Paul wasent there, either is possible based on scripture. Cain being scared of his siblings is of course possible, but there is no biblical proof that supports that. Additionally, the conversation between him and God lean toward other people, not siblings.

If God created Adam, and I do mean IF, after the 7th day of rest, that would be the 8th day, right?
 
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1234321

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I already said I don't know why Paul said that. Either he knew it to be true or he made a mistake. Since Paul wasent there, either is possible based on scripture. Cain being scared of his siblings is of course possible, but there is no biblical proof that supports that. Additionally, the conversation between him and God lean toward other people, not siblings.

If God created Adam, and I do mean IF, after the 7th day of rest, that would be the 8th day, right?

If it was the 8th day, then show me where God claims that He did create Adam and Eve on the 8th day. He laid out each day He created everything else...
 
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WilliamB

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If it was the 8th day, then show me where God claims that He did create Adam and Eve on the 8th day. He laid out each day He created everything else...

I've already posted this. Either keep up with the thread or just move along. I'm looking for answers, not arguments.
 
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1234321

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I've already posted this. Either keep up with the thread or just move along. I'm looking for answers, not arguments.

The truth is the truth whether you have to say it 1 time, or 1000 times.

You were the one that called me presumptuous by stating everything I said, and it was you in response to my post that said it was the 8 th day creation that created adam and eve. I am just asking for biblical proof of your claims before I call you presumptuous too. Show mr where it says Adam and Eve were made on the 8th day, that there were humans created on the 6th day, and definitively that Paul was wrong in 1 Corinthians15:45. If you are saying Paul misunderstood that Adam was the first man, then perhaps he misunderstood the whole gospel.

Just one verse that states "and on the eighth day..." will do.
 
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WilliamB

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Here's what I know so far:

1. Cain and Able were Adams only children at the time
2. Thus Cains wife is not a sibling
3. Adam had no new children until Seth.
4. There were other people on the planet whom Cain feared

Where did these other people come from?

Possibilities:

1. Adam had other children not mentioned in the text.
2. God created more people than just Adam and Eve on the sixth day
3. God created all mankind on the sixth day and Adam and Eve on the 8th day
4. God continued creating mankind after Adam and Eve
5. They were not people but demons
 
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1234321

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Here's what I know so far:

1. Cain and Able were Adams only children at the time
2. Thus Cains wife is not a sibling
3. Adam had no new children until Seth.
4. There were other people on the planet whom Cain feared

Where did these other people come from?

Possibilities:

1. Adam had other children not mentioned in the text.
2. God created more people than just Adam and Eve on the sixth day
3. God created all mankind on the sixth day and Adam and Eve on the 8th day
4. God continued creating mankind after Adam and Eve
5. They were not people but demons

1. Cain and Abel were the first children mentioned, not necessarily the only children.

2. It cannot be assumed Cain's wife wasnt his sibbling if one does not assume he amd able were the only ones around.

3. The next child mentioned was Seth, which means appointed, as in appointed to the birth right Abel had before he died.

4. Who were the other people if, Paul says that Adam was the first man, and by your own admission, it is believed that Cain and Abel were the only ones around? Where is the explicit mention of the 8th day creation like there is explicit mention of the other seven days?


The reality is that a lot of seemingly important information is missing from the bible cannon. Enoch was so righteous that he was taken by God before death. His prophecy is mentioned in Jude 1:14 (one that i have actually read in the book of Enoch,) yet the book of.Enoch is not in the Western canonical bible (though it is in the Ethiopia cannon.) It mentions in the book of Enoch, also, that Adam was the first [human.]

Adam was the prime human. He mated with a human made from himself (Eve.) It should not be hard to fathom that their offspring mated with each other, especially to keep a pure bloodline. Ancient and modern royal families do this very often in order to keep their bloodlines "regal."
 
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SolomonVII

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That's actually what troubles me. There's seems no real concern in the text nor in any of the non-canon books. I'm not looking for wild conspiracy theories as I'm secure in the creation of all by God alone. But you have to admit, it is an interesting question that raises all sorts of questions. Were these Adams offspring who had been sent from Gods presence prior to Cains sin? We're they simply continued creation of God but not deemed or included as Gods true people? Are they simply spiritual demons that he's afraid of, now that he's no longer protected by God?

It says that when Adam named all of the creatures, that no acceptable mate was found. Is this to assume they hoped some animal would be good for Adam? Or, is this to suggest that there were other <mates> but that obviously wouldn't work for procreation? Or does it simply mean, there were none other like Adam, period?

What I have been taught is important when coming to an understanding of the Bible is to note what kind of story that is being presented to you at any given point in time.
Is it history? Or is it an allegory, or perhaps maybe even a new understanding of an archaic myth that came from the mists of human origins? Maybe there is no final answer to any of those questions, and nobody really is such an expert on this as to tell you what to conclude.
Always though, for every page, chapter and verse, for every jot and iota, the Bible gives us theology. All the rest is a backdrop to God revealing himself to us, and also revealing us to ourselves, so that we may come to some kind of understanding of who we are and what we are created to be.

And here, I do think you have come upon one of the central themes. Might man find a suitable mate among the animals? Who are we really? Are we actually animals, and therefore might find mates among animals, among the beasts of the fields?

It seems amusing at one level, to think that Adam might find a mate, a sexual partner even, among the animals, but much of modern science says that that is exactly who we are&#8212;just another species of animal!

Indeed, the most magnficent beast of the field, a walking, talking, highly intelligent and insightful snake, comes into the story directly after Adam deems no animal a suitable mate, and Eve was created to fill that void.

This does not seem to be a very scientific sort of event, woman coming from the side of the man, but it does tell us about the basic unity of man and a woman, their relationship as side to side partners.

And yet the beast that most resembles men, in this case the walking, talking snake of taste, does show himself to be a possibility of a mate for Eve, even if Adam had already rejected all the beasts. He is able to talk to Eve, to really relate to her, through an appeal to a desire, to the appeal of physical beauty, of what is pleasing to the palate, what is beautiful to contemplate even.

Such is the voice of God even&#8212;for beasts. To listen to their desires rather than to God speaking to their minds through commands that go against desires is the nature of the beast.
But for humans, this is a recipe for death. Murder, slavery, and will to power result from mankind listening to our desires. We listen to the voice of God, we are higher than the angels. We allow the beast to take the drivers seat, there is no beast capable of the evil that we are capable of.

This is the kind of thing that was of interest to the earliest rabbis and the earliest church fathers. In a world in which our brightest and best tell us we are nothing other than animals, maybe it ought to be of interest to us as well, those of us who still study theology.

Questions from empirical science were of little concern for the earliest students of the Bible, because they had a whole different kind of way of looking at the world than what we do.

Just exactly how it came to be so that there were other people for Cain to deal with is simply outside of the text. The story doesn't really delve into how that could be so, because it is just not that kind of story. I imagine that scientists have a better explanation of how that could be so, much more than the Bible even interests itself in answering.
There is no theological theme that is pertinent to that kind of question, and the Bible is theology to the jot and iota.
 
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WilliamB

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What I have been taught is important when coming to an understanding of the Bible is to note what kind of story that is being presented to you at any given point in time.
Is it history? Or is it an allegory, or perhaps maybe even a new understanding of an archaic myth that came from the mists of human origins? Maybe there is no final answer to any of those questions, and nobody really is such an expert on this as to tell you what to conclude.
Always though, for every page, chapter and verse, for every jot and iota, the Bible gives us theology. All the rest is a backdrop to God revealing himself to us, and also revealing us to ourselves, so that we may come to some kind of understanding of who we are and what we are created to be.

And here, I do think you have come upon one of the central themes. Might man find a suitable mate among the animals? Who are we really? Are we actually animals, and therefore might find mates among animals, among the beasts of the fields?

It seems amusing at one level, to think that Adam might find a mate, a sexual partner even, among the animals, but much of modern science says that that is exactly who we are—just another species of animal!

Indeed, the most magnficent beast of the field, a walking, talking, highly intelligent and insightful snake, comes into the story directly after Adam deems no animal a suitable mate, and Eve was created to fill that void.

This does not seem to be a very scientific sort of event, woman coming from the side of the man, but it does tell us about the basic unity of man and a woman, their relationship as side to side partners.

And yet the beast that most resembles men, in this case the walking, talking snake of taste, does show himself to be a possibility of a mate for Eve, even if Adam had already rejected all the beasts. He is able to talk to Eve, to really relate to her, through an appeal to a desire, to the appeal of physical beauty, of what is pleasing to the palate, what is beautiful to contemplate even.

Such is the voice of God even—for beasts. To listen to their desires rather than to God speaking to their minds through commands that go against desires is the nature of the beast.
But for humans, this is a recipe for death. Murder, slavery, and will to power result from mankind listening to our desires. We listen to the voice of God, we are higher than the angels. We allow the beast to take the drivers seat, there is no beast capable of the evil that we are capable of.

This is the kind of thing that was of interest to the earliest rabbis and the earliest church fathers. In a world in which our brightest and best tell us we are nothing other than animals, maybe it ought to be of interest to us as well, those of us who still study theology.

Questions from empirical science were of little concern for the earliest students of the Bible, because they had a whole different kind of way of looking at the world than what we do.

Just exactly how it came to be so that there were other people for Cain to deal with is simply outside of the text. The story doesn't really delve into how that could be so, because it is just not that kind of story. I imagine that scientists have a better explanation of how that could be so, much more than the Bible even interests itself in answering.
There is no theological theme that is pertinent to that kind of question, and the Bible is theology to the jot and iota.

I read this post last night before bed. It really opens the door to thinking beyond what is the normal "surface" thinking on the bible. Theology it would seem, is much deeper than I thought. For me, it's an exciting revelation and it leaves me wondering where even to begin next. I thank you sir! May God bless you! :thumbsup:
 
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WilliamB

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1. Cain and Abel were the first children mentioned, not necessarily the only children.

2. It cannot be assumed Cain's wife wasnt his sibbling if one does not assume he amd able were the only ones around.

3. The next child mentioned was Seth, which means appointed, as in appointed to the birth right Abel had before he died.

4. Who were the other people if, Paul says that Adam was the first man, and by your own admission, it is believed that Cain and Abel were the only ones around? Where is the explicit mention of the 8th day creation like there is explicit mention of the other seven days?


The reality is that a lot of seemingly important information is missing from the bible cannon. Enoch was so righteous that he was taken by God before death. His prophecy is mentioned in Jude 1:14 (one that i have actually read in the book of Enoch,) yet the book of.Enoch is not in the Western canonical bible (though it is in the Ethiopia cannon.) It mentions in the book of Enoch, also, that Adam was the first [human.]

Adam was the prime human. He mated with a human made from himself (Eve.) It should not be hard to fathom that their offspring mated with each other, especially to keep a pure bloodline. Ancient and modern royal families do this very often in order to keep their bloodlines "regal."

Thanks for trying to help out, my friend. At this point I feel there are bigger things to be concerned with, than topic I originally posted. I think first I'd like to decide for myself, what kind of story is actually being told. Without that understanding, I fear I'm simply shooting arrows in the dark. Again my thanks to you and to all who contributed! :thumbsup:
 
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1234321

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Thanks for trying to help out, my friend. At this point I feel there are bigger things to be concerned with, than topic I originally posted. I think first I'd like to decide for myself, what kind of story is actually being told. Without that understanding, I fear I'm simply shooting arrows in the dark. Again my thanks to you and to all who contributed! :thumbsup:

I have to be honest and say that your reply is not what I expected. I expected some hackneyed retort. But, you have definitely humbled me with your response. I agree with you that there are bigger issues to be concerned with. Nevertheless, I am glad that (even if you do not agree,) we can come to some sort of mutual understanding. I wish you the best, brother. God bless, and take care of yourself.
 
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WilliamB

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I have to be honest and say that your reply is not what I expected. I expected some hackneyed retort. But, you have definitely humbled me with your response. I agree with you that there are bigger issues to be concerned with. Nevertheless, I am glad that (even if you do not agree,) we can come to some sort of mutual understanding. I wish you the best, brother. God bless, and take care of yourself.

Thank you, same to you sir. May He bless you all your days! :prayer:
 
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