When did Islam become a "race?"

[Dave-W]

"The reason Arabs are included in "Caucasian" on the US census....."
Which of the other 4 races would YOU put them in?

Black sub-Saharan African?
Native American?
Oriental?
Native Australian?

 

[nightflight]

Isn't "Caucasian" just a social construct?

 

[nightflight]

dp

 

[grasping the after wind]

This Chinese guy is yellow skinned.

Is he? Doesn't look that way to me.

Is the person on the right Caucasian in your mind?

 

[grasping the after wind]

Isn't "Caucasian" just a social construct?

From wikipedia

The Caucasian race (also Caucasoid[1] or occasionally Europid[2]) is a taxon historically used to describe the physical or biological type of some or all of the populations of Europe, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, Western Asia, Central Asia, and South Asia.[3] The term was used in biological anthropology for many people from these regions, without regard necessarily to skin tone.[4] First introduced in early racial science and anthropometry, the taxon has historically been used to denote one of the three proposed major races (Caucasoid, Mongoloid, Negroid) of humankind.[5] Although its validity and utility are disputed by many anthropologists, Caucasoid as a biological classification remains in use,[6] particularly within the field of forensic anthropology.[5]

 

[dzheremi]

"The reason Arabs are included in "Caucasian" on the US census....."
Which of the other 4 races would YOU put them in?

Black sub-Saharan African?
Native American?
Oriental?
Native Australian?

As I already wrote in post #121, I do not believe that race is a scientifically valid way to look at things. Arabs are Arab because they identify as being so and share certain cultural similarities (primarily linguistic, but not always; there are, after all, millions of native Arabic-speakers who hail from politically Arab-identifying states who do not consider themselves Arab, so it's too simple to say an Arab is someone who speaks Arabic), not because of certain phenotypical characteristics such as we associate with the social and political categorization of people into races. There are Arabs who are whiter than many southern European people (Italians, Portuguese, Maltese, etc.), and there are Arabs who are as dark as subsaharan Africans. Arab -- like Ethiopian, Italian, Indian, etc. -- is an ethnic identifier, not a racial one. You cannot comfortably fit Arabs into any one racial category any more than you could Hispanic people (hence the U.S. census specifies that Hispanics can be of any race; they ought to do that for Arabs, if they're going to reclassify Arabs formerly included under "white" as "MENA", as is apparently proposed according to the linked Al Jazeera story in my last post).

 

[Dave-W]

Is the person on the right Caucasian in your mind?

The person on the right is an albino.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

http://www.wusa9.com/story/news/loc...-closes-spotsylvania-public-meeting/76027308/

There are muslims of almost every race on earth. I do not understand this reporter's use of the term.

Can anyone there help me understand it?

Many racist people think of Muslims as dark tan or even black. Some people just see them as a darker color, that they want to disappear. I doubt these people really know Muslims in their color. If they even seen a white Muslim. She or he would be considered a trader. They would believe she or he would be mixing with Muslim. In some peoples eyes that would be horrible.

 

[Cerberus~Infinite]

Islam became a race when the know-nothings on the left decided that it was easier to demonize those critical of Islam by labeling them racists instead of islamophobes.

Hard for a fear of something trying to kill you to be irrational.

That and cry's of racism are what make the world of the left spin. Most of them who apply the term when defending Islam probably don't even realize the logical disconnect.

 

[grasping the after wind]

The person on the right is an albino.

True, but that doesn't answer my question. Of course it would be difficult if not impossible for you to answer the question of what would constitute being a Caucasian in Superhero Sam's mind but, from the conversation so far, I cannot rule out the possibility that he would consider anyone with light skin, even an albino whose parents were African, a Caucasian .

 

[Cerberus~Infinite]

An albino African American that you're not sure whether to consider white or black.

That's an easy problem.

Spray paint. Buy it at Walmart for a $.

Or maybe you can just ask him. I mean if let murdering men like Bruce Jenner identify as female (even though he has a penis), then surely we can do likewise for that kid.

On a side not, I really hope that kid doesn't live in Africa.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Islam became a race when the know-nothings on the left decided that it was easier to demonize those critical of Islam by labeling them racists instead of islamophobes.

Hard for a fear of something trying to kill you to be irrational.

That and cry's of racism are what make the world of the left spin. Most of them who apply the term when defending Islam probably don't even realize the logical disconnect.

Republicans in my family and Face books seem to have more of a problem with Muslims and seem to look at them as yucky, Then the left.

 

[Dave-W]

Many racist people think of Muslims as dark tan or even black. Some people just see them as a darker color, that they want to disappear. I doubt these people really know Muslims in their color. If they even seen a white Muslim. She or he would be considered a trader. They would believe she or he would be mixing with Muslim. In some peoples eyes that would be horrible.

If you read the article and saw the pics from the confrontation, you would see the attacker and the Muslim man he was yelling at were both white.

 

[Dave-W]

An albino African American that you're not sure whether to consider white or black.

I have no problem considering an African albino as black. I saw one on a regular basis in college. There are many other structural factors than skin color which made it clear this person was African American.

 

[classicalhero]

I find it funny how you are called numerous things when you criticise Islam when you see all the people killed in it's name. Obviously it's bad to call someone who commits terror as Muslim, than it is for the actual terror committed. What an upside down world we live in.

 

[loveofourlord]

yes islam isn't a race, but we know what most people mean when they say muslim, they are thinking arabic looking people. And there is a tendecy to equate the two together, especially in those that get called racists.

 

[Cerberus~Infinite]

I think you're a racist because I think you're thinking of white people when you refer to people who don't like Islam and think Arab and Islam are the same.

See how such irrational lines of thought can quickly be turned on you?

 

[dzheremi]

yes islam isn't a race, but we know what most people mean when they say muslim, they are thinking arabic looking people. And there is a tendecy to equate the two together, especially in those that get called racists.

Arabic is a language, not a race or a skin tone. How does a person look like a language?

These are all Arabic speakers:

(Palestinian)

(Copts)

(Yemeni)

(Sudanese)

(Lebanese)

(Iraqi)

(Saudi)

(Libyans)

How many of these people look "Arabic" to you? And more importantly, why?

 

[loveofourlord]

Arabic is a language, not a race or a skin tone. How does a person look like a language?

These are all Arabic speakers:

(Palestinian)

(Copts)

(Yemeni)

(Sudanese)

(Lebanese)

(Iraqi)

(Saudi)

(Libyans)

How many of these people look "Arabic" to you? And more importantly, why?

your being pedantic here, I know that, you know that, but when people are protesting and yelling, "No muslims here!!!." that they would probably be pointing at the stereotypical arab looking muslim." they don't see shades of grey and thats what were talking about here. when they say no muslims, they arn't looking for asians that are muslim and saying get out, they wouldn't even think of them as muslim.

 

[dzheremi]

I absolutely know that. I have witnessed my Coptic friends experiencing extreme intimidation and harassment from such people, and Copts are neither Arab nor Muslim (also the Lebanese in that picture are Greek Orthodox Christians, not Muslims). My point was that Arabic is a language, and Arab is an ethnicity, not a race. There are millions of Arabic speakers who very consciously do not identify as Arab, and yet may look like what a person from another ethnic background thinks an Arab looks like, so they are treated the same despite not being Arab (or Muslim, in some cases). That's precisely the point of pointing out that "Arabic", "Arab", etc. are what they are -- because the reason why people can paint with such a broad brush is this kind of lack of intellectual curiosity or willingness to make these distinctions between the people, their language (which was in many cases forced on them at some point in history), and the dominant religion of a given area. I'd rather be pedantic than erase the identities of millions of indigenous ethnic and religious minorities by lumping them in with the people who hate, oppress, and kill them just because they successfully forced their language, culture, and religion on the societies they conquered.