What Was the Religion of Adam and Eve?

[ApplePie7]

Interesting video, however, this is not evidence that homo sapiens sapiens came from another species.

In fact, the naturalist who holds to darwinian evolution has seen Darwins centerpiece "neandertal man" get completely destroyed with modern nuclear DNA testing.

There is no evidence that humans evolved from another species.

We share a common designer, and that is all...

 

[Isambard]

Interesting video, however, this is not evidence that homo sapiens sapiens came from another species.

In fact, the naturalist who holds to darwinian evolution has seen Darwins centerpiece "neandertal man" get completely destroyed with modern nuclear DNA testing.

There is no evidence that humans evolved from another species.

We share a common designer, and that is all...

So youve chosen to ignore the evidence presented in the video eh? Perhaps one of the other in the series will resonate with you. FYI "neandertal man" was never a center piece.

 

[ApplePie7]

So youve chosen to ignore the evidence presented in the video eh? Perhaps one of the other in the series will resonate with you. FYI "neandertal man" was never a center piece.

A three year old, 6 minute video showing similarities with primates is hardly evidence for human macro evolution.

 

[Isambard]

A three year old, 6 minute video showing similarities with primates is hardly evidence for human macro evolution.

No one ever said it was. The contents of the video are evidence however. Specifically, the fusion resulting in 46 chromosomes. Though I understand that subtle difference could be confusing for you.

http://www.thetech.org/genetics/ask.php?id=229

Now want to address the actual point this time, or shall we set up another straw man?

 

[ApplePie7]

No one ever said it was. The contents of the video are evidence however. Specifically, the fusion resulting in 46 chromosomes. Though I understand that subtle difference could be confusing for you.

http://www.thetech.org/genetics/ask.php?id=229

Now want to address the actual point this time, or shall we set up another straw man?

The question posed to you was for you to bring forth "your best evidence for human evolution".

You brought forth this video as an example of your best evidence....and now you claim that "no one ever said it was" evidence for human evolution...

So, which is it...?

 

[Isambard]

The question posed to you was for you to bring forth "your best evidence for human evolution".

You brought forth this video as an example of your best evidence....and now you claim that "no one ever said it was" evidence for human evolution...

So, which is it...?

Yes, the evidence contained within the video. You focused not on the content, but the age and length. As if that had any relevance of the content itself

 

[ApplePie7]

Yes, the evidence contained within the video. You focused not on the content, but the age and length. As if that had any relevance of the content itself

Thus...your very 'best' evidence for human evolution, is, in fact, only evidence that we share a common designer....not that humans came from another species.

 

[Isambard]

Thus...your very 'best' evidence for human evolution, is, in fact, only evidence that we share a common designer....not that humans came from another species.

Nothing quite like cherry-picking is there? Perhaps if you'd removed your faith goggles, you might've noticed the part where the chromosomes are fused exactly as predicted which is incredibly strong evidence for "macro" evolution.

 

[ApplePie7]

Nothing quite like cherry-picking is there? Perhaps if you'd removed your faith goggles, you might've noticed the part where the chromosomes are fused exactly as predicted which is incredibly strong evidence for "macro" evolution.

Fused chromosomes is hardly evidence that we evolved from chimps.

Sharing similar DNA with most of the creatures on earth tells us that we all share a common designer. Not that we all evolved from each other.

There are 3 possible choices in this matter:

1) No designer
2) Many designers
3) One designer


The first one appeals to the naturalist. The second to the polytheist, and, since these would be products of random chance, and numerous creators, there should be little to no similarity between species, as they all would have taken a distict path to where they are now.

The third choice in the only one that explains what we see today.

One designer....using the same building blocks for His creation.



Here are some exerpts from your weblink...

"We don’t yet know what specific differences at the DNA level are responsible for making us different than apes."

Not a very high confidence level here.

"Scientists have discovered several possible candidate genes for making us human. While the vast majority of our DNA is the exact same as chimpanzees, there have to differences too. If they were exactly the same, then we wouldn’t be 2 different species. Finding differences between human and chimp DNA is actually a very big area of research for scientists. They hope that by studying these differences, we can figure out what makes us human."

Hence, we are two distinct species altogether.

Genetic Similarities do not provide exidence that we were once the same species....but strongly suggests that we come from the same creator God as described within the pages of the HolyBible.

 

[Crazy Liz]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uu9wEP3AETs

Enjoy!

It stopped in the middle!

How can we find the one about the panda?

 

[Zstar]

How does the geological traces of space impacts, super volcanoes and ice ages effect the religion of Adam and Eve?


How would they have taught thier children concerning Divine intervention from cycles of such things?

 

[peaceful soul]

originally posted by Kutte

GeorgeTwo wrote:
If Adam and Eve had not disobeyed God, then we would all have been born in the Garden. We are not, so we suffer the consequences of Adam and Eve's sin.

Yes, just like in the the world we live in presently, we suffer from other's mistakes. You are no exception. We live in a world of cause and effect.

Response:
Instead of condemning Adam and Eve for their alleged "sin" they deserve our gratitude, or would you prefer living in a garden without any understanding of right and wrong, good and bad? Not having any awareness of God's love and goodness?

You assume that we would not have that and more if the opposite circumstances were true. If we knew what is right, we should practice that. What is wrong would be irrelevant to our lives since we would not practice it and suffer the consequences of practicing it. What I am trying to say is that if you know what is right, then you have no need to know what is wrong since what is right is the proper thing to practice; consequently what is wrong is not an issue for someone who is compliant to God's will. At least in theory, there is no need to know wrong if you can perfectly practice what is right. There would be no negative consequences for practicing what is right since you would be 100% obedient to God's will, which was the case before man fell from God's grace.

Besides living in a garden with no challenges to conquer for millions of years would be kind of boring, but no, actually it would represent a state of spiritual death.

Kutte

You measure things by the natural intellect in a world of imperfect understanding. Your conclusion is understandable; however, this is not true according to Christianity. You base everything solely on your current spiritual state and projection of that state. Spiritual death is a consequence of one's separation from God. That is why you see every person, without exception, deteriorate and eventually die physically, but spiritually as well without the salvation of Christ from his or her sins.

 

[peaceful soul]

Show us your best evidence for human evolution...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uu9wEP3AETs

Enjoy!

I found this interesting. Assuming that this video actually represented what occurred with man, then explain how man became moral, emotional, conscious, intelligent, rational, creative, etc. from a merging of 4 chromosomes into 2?

 

[Isambard]

I found this interesting. Assuming that this video actually represented what occurred with man, then explain how man became moral, emotional, conscious, intelligent, rational, creative, etc. from a merging of 4 chromosomes into 2?

Moral and creative are both relative and subjective. Thus, can be said to not exist in any meaningful way in humans.

Emotions, rationality, and intelligence can be seen in out higher prime ape cousins so it wouldn't involve the the chromosome fusion.

Consciousness (defined as a learned process based on metaphorical language), developed as a result of the breakdown of the bicameral mind imo.
http://www.julianjaynes.org/overview.php
http://www.julianjaynes.org/evidence_summary.php

 

[Isambard]

Fused chromosomes is hardly evidence that we evolved from chimps.

Straw man #2. No one ever said we evolved from chimps. ToE says we both share a common ancestor which the fused chromosome is evidence of.

Sharing similar DNA with most of the creatures on earth tells us that we all share a common designer. Not that we all evolved from each other.

Thats nice, but in humans that DNA that a 'perfect designer' gave us is mutated meaning...

There are 3 possible choices in this matter:

1) No designer
2) Many designers
3) One designer

Actually, its really
1) No designer
2) Many competing designers
3) One incredibly incompetent designer

The first one appeals to the naturalist. The second to the polytheist, and, since these would be products of random chance, and numerous creators, there should be little to no similarity between species, as they all would have taken a distict path to where they are now.

Erm, you do see distinct paths in the fossil record as well as all the varied ways different organisms achieve similar things. Such as the very different ways bats, insects, and birds achieve flight.

The third choice in the only one that explains what we see today.

One designer....using the same building blocks for His creation.

Only if that designer is incredibly incompetent. See Cancer, and genetic diseases for details.

Here are some exerpts from your weblink...

Not a very high confidence level here.

Confidence of what? They dont know the specific genes, not that we share a common ancestor.

Hence, we are two distinct species altogether.

Genetic Similarities do not provide exidence that we were once the same species....but strongly suggests that we come from the same creator God as described within the pages of the HolyBible.

Straw man #3. No duh. I never said we were the same species. The fused chromosome is evidence of common ancestry.

Care to try again w/o resorting to fallacies?

 

[peaceful soul]

Moral and creative are both relative and subjective. Thus, can be said to not exist in any meaningful way in humans.

Emotions, rationality, and intelligence can be seen in out higher prime ape cousins so it wouldn't involve the the chromosome fusion.

Consciousness (defined as a learned process based on metaphorical language), developed as a result of the breakdown of the bicameral mind imo.
http://www.julianjaynes.org/overview.php
http://www.julianjaynes.org/evidence_summary.php

If we accept this, then what made man moral, intelligent, conscious, etc. in ways that no other animal that you claim we evolved from have?

I still need to know why we have these capacities and no other animal form has them. We should expect other animals, that we have presumably evolved from to exhibit this too, or at least they should be showing progression towards these characteristics if evolution is really true.

 

[Isambard]

If we accept this, then what made man moral, intelligent, conscious, etc. in ways that no other animal that you claim we evolved from have?

I still need to know why we have these capacities and no other animal form has them. We should expect other animals, that we have presumably evolved from to exhibit this too, or at least they should be showing progression towards these characteristics if evolution is really true.

Read my post again.

 

[Crazy Liz]

If we accept this, then what made man moral, intelligent, conscious, etc. in ways that no other animal that you claim we evolved from have?

I still need to know why we have these capacities and no other animal form has them. We should expect other animals, that we have presumably evolved from to exhibit this too, or at least they should be showing progression towards these characteristics if evolution is really true.

How can we be sure no other animal has any of these capacities? The only capacity we can be sure the great apes and cetaceans do not have to the same degree as humans is language. We can't talk with great apes and cetaceans about morality, intelligence and consciousness because we don't share a common medium of communication - language.

However, the more we research, the more linguistic capacities we find in other animals. Recent research indicates that apes who have been taught various forms of language have capacities to talk about moral and aesthetic concepts. Every line that has been drawn by science as a bright-line criterion to separate humans from all other animals has been falsified by discovering animals with the ability previously thought to be possessed only by humans.

 

[ApplePie7]

Straw man #2. No one ever said we evolved from chimps.

No one ever will...

ToE says we both share a common ancestor which the fused chromosome is evidence of.

We share a common designer...

Thats nice, but in humans that DNA that a 'perfect designer' gave us is mutated meaning...

Mutating from what to what...?

Erm, you do see distinct paths in the fossil record as well as all the varied ways different organisms achieve similar things. Such as the very different ways bats, insects, and birds achieve flight.

The fossil record shows life burst onto the scene fully formed.

Further, the late heavy bombardment has life being exterminated and repeatedly beginning quickly numerous times, each time being fully formed...the exact opposite of what evolution would predict.

Only if that designer is incredibly incompetent. See Cancer, and genetic diseases for details.

We would predict that a single designer would use the same materials in His design.

This is what we find in the fossil record.

The fact that mutations occur and some micro evolution, does not change the cold hard fact that species are still separate from each other, after their own kind, just as stated in the Holy Bible.

Confidence of what? They dont know the specific genes, not that we share a common ancestor.

Common ancestor...or common designer...?

The fused chromosome is evidence of common ancestry.

Common designer...

 

[peaceful soul]

I found this interesting. Assuming that this video actually represented what occurred with man, then explain how man became moral, emotional, conscious, intelligent, rational, creative, etc. from a merging of 4 chromosomes into 2?

Moral and creative are both relative and subjective. Thus, can be said to not exist in any meaningful way in humans.

Emotions, rationality, and intelligence can be seen in out higher prime ape cousins so it wouldn't involve the the chromosome fusion.

Consciousness (defined as a learned process based on metaphorical language), developed as a result of the breakdown of the bicameral mind imo.
http://www.julianjaynes.org/overview.php
http://www.julianjaynes.org/evidence_summary.php

Are we to assume that man was first developed without consciousnesses, morality, etc. that he had to learn these things? I am looking at the capacity to have these--not how they may have developed. What was the starting material for these? Why don't the animals that man evolved from show this progression too?