What must I do to be saved?

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NJA

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Are you sure it's an "experience?" A lot of is would say that we're born from water and the Spirit when we become followers of Jesus, typically via baptism (the water part).
Philip & the apostles knew that the Samarians had not received the Spirit even though they had been water baptised - Acts 8:12-16
- how did they know?
 
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hedrick

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Philip & the apostles knew that the Samarians had not received the Spirit even though they had been water baptised - Acts 8:12-16
- how did they know?
Note that Peter laid hands on them and prayed for them to receive the Holy Spirit. As I understand it, in the early church baptism included both water and laying on of hands and praying for the reception of the Holy Spirit. It sounds to me like in this case only the water part had been done. The person baptizing them hadn't prayed for the gift of the Holy Spirit.

See Act 8:17 and also the account starting in 8:18. It's clear that the critical thing was the laying on of hands. Nothing is said about them not reporting some experience.
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

Take up your cross daily, and follow Me. Luke 9:23
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@ Countryangel, please read this.

But here's a Lutheran response (Scripture passages are provided in case you want them):

1) You don't do anything to be saved. Salvation isn't something you can achieve by trying hard enough, doing the right things, thinking the right things, or believing the right things. Salvation is God graciously saving you, by sending His Son, the Lord Jesus, who suffered death on the cross for all our sins, and who rose from the dead as victor over sin, death, hell, and the devil. It is only Christ who is our salvation. Salvation is therefore by grace alone, that is, by the abundant kindness and generosity of God which He has for us. God acts upon us to grant us faith, faith to trust in Christ, and we receive this faith as a gift from God, not of ourselves, through the preaching of the Word and the Sacraments.

"But God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the ages to come he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God— not the result of works, so that no one may boast." - Ephesians 2:4-9

The other person who refuted this post is correct, this post is utterly false and unbiblical. (Note: I didn't use the words heresy or fallacy). Belief and faith is just the start of your Christian walk with Christ. Where you end up, either in heaven or hell is 100% based on your works, in obedience with what Christ has given us to follow in the bible.

First let's cover the scripture he used: Ephesians 2:4-9. He left out the most important verse from that scripture, which is verse 10. By accepting Christ, we are required to do good works as an act of our faith. It's a reflection of our willingness to turn away from sin by doing good unto others instead of doing bad.

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Belief and faith is just the start of your Christian walk with Christ. Where you end up, either in heaven or hell is 100% based on your good works toward others.

If you look at all judgements ahead by Christ and God, nowhere in the bible does it reveal a person judged by their faith, it's 100% on your works: your good deeds helping others. Jesus taught us in the Matthew 25:31-46. Here it reveals we are required to show love for others to meet His requirement for eternal life. Those with no works, Matthew 25:41-46 are sent to eternal punishment: hell.

Every judgement mentioned in the bible all reveal two similarities: everyone will be judged by their works and no one will be judge by their faith. "Absolutely no one!" It's because our works is the reflection of our faith. The rule is simple, if you have faith, prove it by your works: Matthew 3:8, Romans 2:13, James 1:22, James 2:20, James 2:24.

Absolutely nowhere in the bible, old or new testament, will people be judge on their belief, it's 100% works: the works you have done for God and Christ. Belief and faith is just the start of your Christian walk, where you end up is by your works. Good deeds toward others: labour of love.

Matthew 25:34-36
34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me, 36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’

Matthew 25:41-46
41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me. 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Revelation 20:11-15
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

People also need to be highly careful who they choose to listen to concerning salvation. There will be differences in opinions due to their denomination because some have based their salvation on a faith alone system, disregarding others teachings and writings in the bible about good works.

MUST READ AND ACCEPT EVERYTHING written in the bible, especially the things Jesus said. Jesus will be the One that decides who goes to heaven and who goes to hell. Just remember this simple rule: You start with faith, you end with works.
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

Take up your cross daily, and follow Me. Luke 9:23
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@ Countryangel,

Here's a scripture Christ revealed about salvation. Here He tells a man asking about how many will be saved and He replied to him, many will try and not be save. These people Christ will reject are Christians, believers trying to follow the narrow path. The narrow path is Jesus, the broad path leading to destruction is sin, Matthew 7:13-14.

If it was really that easy to get save by merely believing, all believers would be able to enter into the narrow gate. What's kept them locked out is no good fruits which is their good works toward others, Matthew 7:15-21.

Luke 13:22-27
22 And he went through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem.
23 Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them,
24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.
25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.
27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
 
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Job8

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1. What must I do to be saved and spend an eternity in Heaven with Jesus Christ?
Acts 16:27-31 (KJV)
27 And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep, and seeing the prison doors open, he drew out his sword, and would have killed himself, supposing that the prisoners had been fled. 28 But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying, Do thyself no harm: for we are all here. 29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas, 30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? 31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
2. What is saving faith?
Acts 8:12,35-37 (KJV)
8 But when they believed Philip preaching the things concerning the kingdom of God, and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.... 35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. 36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
3. How do you get or have saving faith?
Romans 10:8-17
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee,even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach; 9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. 12For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. 14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? 15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? 17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
 
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NJA

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Note that Peter laid hands on them and prayed for them to receive the Holy Spirit. As I understand it, in the early church baptism included both water and laying on of hands and praying for the reception of the Holy Spirit. It sounds to me like in this case only the water part had been done. The person baptizing them hadn't prayed for the gift of the Holy Spirit.

In Acts 2 (120 disciples) and 10 (Gentiles) all received without the laying on of hands.

In Acts 15:8-9 they conclude:
"God, which knows the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith"


God says the heart of man is deceitful above all things (Jer. 17:9).
Only God knows the heart so how could they judge that they had received the "new heart" as teh prophets put it?
We see that they looked for God's independent witness of the new tongues:

"While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter,
because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God."
(Acts 10:44-46, compare Acts 2:4, 33; Romans 8:15-16, John 3:8)



Laying on of hands was never taught as a requirement for receiving the Spirit, by Jesus or his apostles, the only requirement is faith,
along with primary desire "thirst and you shall be filled".

If laying on of hands were a requirement Jesus could have appeared in vision to Peter to lay hands on the apostles, but he didn't.

The only conclusion that fits scripture is that laying on of hands helps faith, but it is not a requirement or the sign that someone has received the Holy Spirit.


See Act 8:17 and also the account starting in 8:18. It's clear that the critical thing was the laying on of hands. Nothing is said about them not reporting some experience.

So what did Simon the Sorceror "see" that he recognised as the receiving of the Spirit?

If it was required for apostles to lay hands on people where does God say that it is no longer a requirement?

If not, are you saying that anyone (such as me) who claims to have received the Holy Spirit without it is deluded?
 
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hedrick

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Of course the Spirit is not limited to the laying on of hands, any more than faith can only be present when someone has been baptized. Nevertheless, if someone came to faith and hadn’t been baptized, we would baptize them. I believe the meaning of Acts 8 is that they had not formally received the Holy Spirit. The emphasis in this passage is not upon a specific experience that they were missing but upon the authority of the Apostles to bestow the Holy Spirit. That's the whole point of the account of Simon. Simon wasn't concerned that he had missed a conversion experience. He wanted the power to lay hands on people and convey the Holy Spirit, like the Apostles had.

Indeed given the overall views of Luke, if there was anything intended beyond the formal laying on of hands, it was not that the men had missed a conversion experience, but that they didn’t have the visible, supernatural gifts of the Spirit. They had already been born from above in their baptism.

As to what happened with the laying on of hands after the Apostles’ time: Laying on of hands was considered part of baptism in the early Church. It still is, in the Orthodox churches. In the West, because of the tradition that it had to be done by a bishop (as they were viewed as the modern equivalent of the Apostles), and bishops weren’t always available at baptism, laying on of hands slowly separated from baptism, and become the separate sacrament of confirmation.

Protestants vary in how they handle these matters. I just checked the official baptismal ritual for my church (the PCUSA). It's only a guide for what actually happens in churches, but it includes laying on of hands, and a prayer that the Holy Spirit be present with the person. Since Protestants normally don't have an separate sacrament of confirmation, you'd hope that their baptisms would include the laying on of hands.

That's not to say that if you were baptized without the laying on of hands you are necessarily lacking the Holy Spirit, but still, your baptism would not have conformed to Acts 8.
 
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NJA

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Of course the Spirit is not limited to the laying on of hands, any more than faith can only be present when someone has been baptized. Nevertheless, if someone came to faith and hadn’t been baptized, we would baptize them. I believe the meaning of Acts 8 is that they had not formally received the Holy Spirit. The emphasis in this passage is not upon a specific experience that they were missing but upon the authority of the Apostles to bestow the Holy Spirit.
Jesus is the baptiser in the Holy Spirit, he neither needs, nor appoints any intermediaries.
This is demonstrated by Acts 2, Acts 10, the other verses about receiving the Holy Spirit and millions of people since then.

Philip was alone in the city and the apostles simply came to help with praying for people individually.

That's the whole point of the account of Simon. Simon wasn't concerned that he had missed a conversion experience. He wanted the power to lay hands on people and convey the Holy Spirit, like the Apostles had.
That was Simon the Sorceror's understanding of how it worked. He was wrong.

Indeed given the overall views of Luke, if there was anything intended beyond the formal laying on of hands, it was not that the men had missed a conversion experience, but that they didn’t have the visible, supernatural gifts of the Spirit. They had already been born from above in their baptism.

Luke has already detailed the receiving of the Holy Spirit and how it is recognised in Acts 2.
The same understanding is taken by Philip to Samaria.

Acts 10 confirms that Peter & John believe the same thing, they judge precisely when the gentiles receive the Holy Spirity by the sign of speaking in tongues, without any laying on of hands or water baptism.
 
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hedrick

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It was not just Simon’s understanding that the Holy Spirit came from the Apostles’ laying on of hands.

“17 Then Peter and John laid their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. 18 Now when Simon saw that the Spirit was given through the laying on of the apostles’ hands, he offered them money,”

It wasn’t a misunderstanding. He saw what had happened.

Again, the Holy Spirit is surely not restricted. As you pointed out, in Acts 10, people had the gift of the Holy Spirit, and clearly had repented and had faith, before they were baptized. But Acts 10 was in some ways unusual. Peter seems to have still needed convincing that Gentiles can really be full Christians. God was making a point to him.

See also 2 Tim 1:6. We don't know that the laying on of hands was part of his baptism, but the author seems to think that the spirit of power came from the laying on of hands. Also Heb 6:2, though the significance of laying on of hands isn't clear in that passage.
 
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ToBeLoved

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. Belief and faith is just the start of your Christian walk with Christ. Where you end up, either in heaven or hell is 100% based on your works, in obedience with what Christ has given us to follow in the bible.

Belief and faith is just the start of your Christian walk with Christ. Where you end up, either in heaven or hell is 100% based on your good works toward others.
This is the reason why Jesus will reply to some that He never knew them. Those who are so busy trying to work their way to heaven will find out that grace is a gift and there is no working your way to heaven.
 
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ToBeLoved

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Of course the Spirit is not limited to the laying on of hands, any more than faith can only be present when someone has been baptized. Nevertheless, if someone came to faith and hadn’t been baptized, we would baptize them. I believe the meaning of Acts 8 is that they had not formally received the Holy Spirit. The emphasis in this passage is not upon a specific experience that they were missing but upon the authority of the Apostles to bestow the Holy Spirit. That's the whole point of the account of Simon. Simon wasn't concerned that he had missed a conversion experience. He wanted the power to lay hands on people and convey the Holy Spirit, like the Apostles had.

Indeed given the overall views of Luke, if there was anything intended beyond the formal laying on of hands, it was not that the men had missed a conversion experience, but that they didn’t have the visible, supernatural gifts of the Spirit. They had already been born from above in their baptism.

As to what happened with the laying on of hands after the Apostles’ time: Laying on of hands was considered part of baptism in the early Church. It still is, in the Orthodox churches. In the West, because of the tradition that it had to be done by a bishop (as they were viewed as the modern equivalent of the Apostles), and bishops weren’t always available at baptism, laying on of hands slowly separated from baptism, and become the separate sacrament of confirmation.

Protestants vary in how they handle these matters. I just checked the official baptismal ritual for my church (the PCUSA). It's only a guide for what actually happens in churches, but it includes laying on of hands, and a prayer that the Holy Spirit be present with the person. Since Protestants normally don't have an separate sacrament of confirmation, you'd hope that their baptisms would include the laying on of hands.

That's not to say that if you were baptized without the laying on of hands you are necessarily lacking the Holy Spirit, but still, your baptism would not have conformed to Acts 8.
Where in the Bible does it say that the Spirit is received by the laying on of hands? As a matter of fact, the disciples received the Holy Spirit without any laying on of hands.

Jesus sends the Holy Spirit to a believer. The apostles did not.
 
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NJA

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It was not just Simon’s understanding that the Holy Spirit came from the Apostles’ laying on of hands.

“17 Then Peter and John laid their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit. 18 Now when Simon saw that the Spirit was given through the laying on of the apostles’ hands, he offered them money,”
Peter & John understood that praying with people, laying on hands helps their faith but going through that process does nopt mean that the other person has therefore received God's Spirit. They waited for God's independent witness of speaking in tongues.


Again, the Holy Spirit is surely not restricted. As you pointed out, in Acts 10, people had the gift of the Holy Spirit, and clearly had repented and had faith, before they were baptized. But Acts 10 was in some ways unusual. Peter seems to have still needed convincing that Gentiles can really be full Christians. God was making a point to him.
While the surrounding circumstances of every conversion is different, the sign when one receives the Spirit is the same.

See also 2 Tim 1:6. We don't know that the laying on of hands was part of his baptism, but the author seems to think that the spirit of power came from the laying on of hands. Also Heb 6:2, though the significance of laying on of hands isn't clear in that passage.
Putting all the veses together, what is clear is that the laying on of hands is used to help people's faith if they have not already received the Spirit, but is not a requirement, neither is it the sign that someone has received the Spirit.
Hebrews 3v1 says Jesus is the Apostle and High Priest so if someone tries to teach that a human apostle needs to be present (some do!), I would also point them to that verse.
 
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AvgJoe

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Ok. I am so confused by all the different websites I read online. So I am asking here.
1. What must I do to be saved and spend an eternity in Heaven with Jesus Christ?
2. What is saving faith?
3. How do you get or have saving faith?


1. What must I do to be saved and spend an eternity in Heaven with Jesus Christ?

God’s Plan of Salvation

The Futility of Human Effort

The Bible teaches that no amount of human goodness, human works, human morality or religious activity can get anyone into Heaven. Being a good person, belonging to a religious family, being baptized, going to church, none of these can save anyone. Everyone still falls short of God’s perfect standard. (Isaiah 64:6, Romans 4:1-5, Ephesians 2:8-9, Titus 3:5-7)

The Only Way

Jesus said to him, “I am the Way and the Truth and the Life; no one comes to the Father except by (through) me.” (John 14:6)


What must I do to be saved?

1) Realize that you’re are a sinner. (Romans 3:23, 5:12; 1 John 1:10)

2) Change your mind about God and His ways (repent).

Jesus said: “…unless you repent (have a change of heart and turn away from sin), you will all perish and be lost eternally. (Luke 13:5)
…now God charges all people everywhere to repent. (Acts 17:30)

3) Believe that Jesus Christ died for you, was buried and rose from the dead.

We are made right in God’s sight when we trust in Jesus Christ to take away our sins. And we all can be saved in the same way, no matter who we are or what we have done. For God sent Jesus to take the punishment for our sins and to satisfy God’s anger (wrath) against us. We are made right with God when we believe that Jesus shed His blood, sacrificing His Life for us. (Romans 3:23, 25)

For if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. (Romans 10:9)

4) Go to God in prayer, confessing Jesus as Lord and your need for forgiveness of your sins. Give your life to Jesus, making Him the Lord of your life.

For it is believing in your heart that you are made right with God, and it is by confessing with your mouth that you are saved. (Romans 10:10)
For anyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.(Romans 10:13)


2. What is saving faith?
Belief + trust = saving faith. Believe the gospel, the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4), and then, trust Jesus to save you, just like He said He would.

3. How do you get or have saving faith?

Faith comes from God in the form of a gift (Ephesians 2:8). God gives a measure of faith to to each one of us (Romans 12:3).

The Bible specifies the way, or the means, that God gives faith to people. “Faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ” (Romans 10:17). It is the Word of God that produces faith. Someone could receive faith while hearing a sermon teaching the gospel, someone else by reading about Jesus in the Bible—any time the true gospel of Jesus is communicated, there is potential for faith.


 
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SeventyTimes7

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Ok. I am so confused by all the different websites I read online. So I am asking here.
1. What must I do to be saved and spend an eternity in Heaven with Jesus Christ?
2. What is saving faith?
3. How do you get or have saving faith?
By stopping to sin and by starting to love and the only way to do that is to read and follow the 10 commandments and whoo follows the 10 commandments loves God and his neighbour (1 John 5:1-3) because who loves God doesn't follow other gods and who loves his neighbour doesn't kill.

James 2:-8;11
8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

James 2:14-17
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

And good or bad works are again ruled by the 10 commandments.
 
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ViaCrucis

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Where in the Bible does it say that the Spirit is received by the laying on of hands? As a matter of fact, the disciples received the Holy Spirit without any laying on of hands.

Jesus sends the Holy Spirit to a believer. The apostles did not.

Yet the Holy Spirit was given by the laying on of hands, that's what happened. The conferring of the Holy Spirit through the laying on of hands is not the same thing that happened on Pentecost or in Cornelius' house, those were unique events in fulfillment of what John the Baptist had said, "I baptize you with water but He who comes after me will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire", that baptism with the Holy Spirit took place on Pentecost--a very special, very unique moment in the history of the world--and a similar event happens in Cornelius' house as demonstration that Gentiles were to be regarded as fully included in God's plan and purposes.

What we see, regularly, is that the Holy Spirit is, in some sense, conferred by the laying on of hands by the apostles; not because the Apostles had magic powers but because this seems to have been means God used to accomplish this purpose. It's also why in Christianity the laying on of hands as continued to be an essential element in what can be called the Rite of Christian Initiation, which historically includes two major things: Baptism and Chrismation. Chrismation is the laying on of hands, a practice that has continued straight down from the time of the apostles until the present day, for the purpose of sealing the baptized with the Holy Spirit, laying on of hands and anointing with oil (chrism) are intricate parts of this. This is more obvious in the Eastern Churches which never separated Baptism and Chrismation, in the West things got messy because in the Middle Ages it became more normal to withhold Chrismation until children were older, which is the origin of the Western Christian practice of Confirmation.

In my own Lutheran church we do not regard Confirmation to be a Sacrament as Rome does, but it is retained as a Churchly Rite; we do however apply chrism and lay hands upon the newly baptized (that includes infants and small children) which is mostly regarded as simply part of the Rite of Baptism.

Does God need the laying on of hands to confer the Holy Spirit? Of course He doesn't. The promise of the Holy Spirit is for all the baptized, for all who believe. God can do whatever He wants to do. But as the Christian Church we do things certain ways for several reasons:

1) Because of God's instructions as we find in Scripture.
2) Out of respect for the historic practices of the Christian faith going back well into antiquity and to the apostolic period.
3) For good order.

Most important is that we do not violate the first, that we do not violate what God has instructed, commanded, and given in Scripture. If such a thing is not in violation of God's command is beneficial for the good of the whole Church both because of its antiquity and it providing good order within the Church there remains no reason to abandon it.

It is a peculiarity of modern radical Protestantism to see the need to change the way Christianity has always done things for no other reason than for innovation and to distance itself from history and tradition out of a misguided sense that tradition is a bad word.

Without tradition there would be no Bible, no preaching of the Gospel, no Church. It is only on account of the fact that those who came before us have passed on the faith to us that we are standing here, after all the Apostle writes, "How can they believe if they have never heard?"

-CryptoLutheran
 
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ViaCrucis

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By stopping to sin and by starting to love and the only way to do that is to read and follow the 10 commandments and whoo follows the 10 commandments loves God and his neighbour (1 John 5:1-3) because who loves God doesn't follow other gods and who loves his neighbour doesn't kill.

James 2:-8;11
8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well.
11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.

James 2:14-17
14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

And good or bad works are again ruled by the 10 commandments.

I'm always sometimes amused by those who seem to have an obsession with the Decalogue, as though there were only ten commandments given by God to the children of Israel.

Firstly: God gave hundreds of instructions to the children of Israel, what we call the Torah. Historically the Jewish rabbis have enumerated that there were 613 distinct mitzvot given in Torah.

Secondly: Anyone who bothers to read the New Testament should immediately realize that Christians are not expected to observe the Torah, as the Torah was part of the distinct and unique covenant God made with the children of Israel in the past.

Thirdly: Neither the mitzvot of Torah nor our efforts toward righteous works can save us or have any merit in justifying us, as the Scriptures say, the Law is powerless to justify.

So no works, neither works of the Law/Torah nor works of the flesh benefit us in anyway in attaining righteousness before God. Righteousness before God is found exclusively in Jesus Christ, and it is ours solely by the grace of God through faith.

Those who teach that salvation is through human efforts in attempting to be righteous should probably spend a good bit of time contemplating St. Paul's epistle to the Galatians. Further, it runs very near the heresy of Pelagius who denied human inability, insisted on the human capacity to be righteous through his or her own efforts, and thereby denied the central place of grace--and ultimately--the Gospel itself.

No Christian church teaches that we can be saved by our own merits, because such teaching is quite explicitly heretical.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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SeventyTimes7

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I'm always sometimes amused by those who seem to have an obsession with the Decalogue, as though there were only ten commandments given by God to the children of Israel.

Firstly: God gave hundreds of instructions to the children of Israel, what we call the Torah. Historically the Jewish rabbis have enumerated that there were 613 distinct mitzvot given in Torah.

Secondly: Anyone who bothers to read the New Testament should immediately realize that Christians are not expected to observe the Torah, as the Torah was part of the distinct and unique covenant God made with the children of Israel in the past.

Thirdly: Neither the mitzvot of Torah nor our efforts toward righteous works can save us or have any merit in justifying us, as the Scriptures say, the Law is powerless to justify.

So no works, neither works of the Law/Torah nor works of the flesh benefit us in anyway in attaining righteousness before God. Righteousness before God is found exclusively in Jesus Christ, and it is ours solely by the grace of God through faith.

Those who teach that salvation is through human efforts in attempting to be righteous should probably spend a good bit of time contemplating St. Paul's epistle to the Galatians. Further, it runs very near the heresy of Pelagius who denied human inability, insisted on the human capacity to be righteous through his or her own efforts, and thereby denied the central place of grace--and ultimately--the Gospel itself.

No Christian church teaches that we can be saved by our own merits, because such teaching is quite explicitly heretical.

-CryptoLutheran
You are telling all the opposite of James chapter 2, how's that?
 
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SeventyTimes7

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I'm always sometimes amused by those who seem to have an obsession with the Decalogue, as though there were only ten commandments given by God to the children of Israel.

Firstly: God gave hundreds of instructions to the children of Israel, what we call the Torah. Historically the Jewish rabbis have enumerated that there were 613 distinct mitzvot given in Torah.

Secondly: Anyone who bothers to read the New Testament should immediately realize that Christians are not expected to observe the Torah, as the Torah was part of the distinct and unique covenant God made with the children of Israel in the past.

Thirdly: Neither the mitzvot of Torah nor our efforts toward righteous works can save us or have any merit in justifying us, as the Scriptures say, the Law is powerless to justify.

So no works, neither works of the Law/Torah nor works of the flesh benefit us in anyway in attaining righteousness before God. Righteousness before God is found exclusively in Jesus Christ, and it is ours solely by the grace of God through faith.

Those who teach that salvation is through human efforts in attempting to be righteous should probably spend a good bit of time contemplating St. Paul's epistle to the Galatians. Further, it runs very near the heresy of Pelagius who denied human inability, insisted on the human capacity to be righteous through his or her own efforts, and thereby denied the central place of grace--and ultimately--the Gospel itself.

No Christian church teaches that we can be saved by our own merits, because such teaching is quite explicitly heretical.

-CryptoLutheran
That's not my fault if you don't know the difference between the Decalogue and the Moral law, Social law, etc. I am so amused you don't know the difference and which you set up pompous words as "Heretical" without even knowing about what Scriptures you are talking about, and without knowing my thought about salvation; the first thing is to obey to the Decalogue cause the fulfilment of it is love, because if you ignore the Decalogue and you commit sin then you have no love for thy neighbour nor love for God; obviously this is not the only thing we must do for to be saved, because we should believe in Jesus and be baptised, we should have mercy cause that will be the measure set on us, and many other things we need to do to be saved. The Moral,Social law, the one you are talking about (but you don't know it) was an hard way to put in practice the Decalogue (eye for eye) and if I am not wrong you are mixing also the ceremonial law without even knowing it, and in plus you shacked the Decalogue inside them and made a huge cocktail.
This is a proof of what I say:

Mark 10
17 And as he was going forth into the way, there ran one to him, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Teacher, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good save one, even God.
19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor thy father and mother.
20 And he said unto him, Teacher, all these things have I observed from my youth.
21 And Jesus looking upon him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.
22 But his countenance fell at the saying, and he went away sorrowful: for he was one that had great possessions.

Jesus told to observe the commandments in many other passages in the Bible, like Matthew 5, but evidently you never opened a Bible
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

Take up your cross daily, and follow Me. Luke 9:23
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This is the reason why Jesus will reply to some that He never knew them. Those who are so busy trying to work their way to heaven will find out that grace is a gift and there is no working your way to heaven.


Believing in Jesus means doing the works He did (John 14:12) by showing love for others, Matthew 25:34-36. Jesus' commanded us to bear good fruit by loving others, Matthew 25:34-36. You will know them by their fruits, by what they do for others, Matthew 25:34-36. Those who show love for others are those bearing good fruits, John 15:5. And those who refuse to help others will be cast off and burn in hell, John 15:6, Matthew 7:19, Matthew 25: 41-46 when He comes during judgement day.

Christ will consider you as His friend if you do His commandment, John 15:14. This is how you build up a relationship with God and Christ, by loving others, John 14:21. As the relationship continues to grow, Christ will reveal Himself, John 14:21 (You'll start seeing miracles and experience special blessings). Continue in obedience, God/Jesus will then give you the holy spirit when they come live in you, John 14:23. The holy spirit is given to those by their merit have shown to obey Jesus' commandment to love others. Now He comes to live with you as a shepherd who will guide you as His own sheep from inside you.

His sheeps have shown to be obedient and have listen to His commandment from the bible. They will now continue to listen to Him from inside as the holy spirit. My sheep listen to my voice, they follow Me and I know them, John 10:27-28. There's now an established relationship, based on obedience by following Him.

On that day when He comes to judge the world, those He depart from and declares He does not know them is because they never obeyed His commandment to bear any fruit showing love for others.

It's all based on our works. Each of us decide if we want to follow Him in His labour of love. Your journey with God starts with faith when you believed He sent His Son to save us, it ends with works by bearing much good fruit. John 15:8

Those who do not produce good fruit, has no relationship with Him and will be thrown into the fire to be burn when He returns. John 15:2-6, Matthew 7:19, Matthew 25:41-46.


*****************
John 14:12
“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I am going to the Father.

John 15:12-15
12 “This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this, that someone lay down his life for his friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command you. 15 No longer do I call you servants, for the servant does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all that I have heard from my Father I have made known to you.

John 15:1-6
1 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in me that does not bear fruit he takes away, and every branch that does bear fruit he prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 Already you are clean because of the word that I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit by itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in me. 5 I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not abide in me he is thrown away like a branch and withers; and the branches are gathered, thrown into the fire, and burned.

Matthew 7:16-20
16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

John 14:21-23
21 Those who accept my commandments and obey them are the ones who love me. And because they love me, my Father will love them. And I will love them and reveal myself to each of them.” 22 Judas (not Judas Iscariot, but the other disciple with that name) said to him, “Lord, why are you going to reveal yourself only to us and not to the world at large?” 23 Jesus replied, “All who love me will do what I say. My Father will love them, and we will come and make our home with each of them.

John 15:8
My Father's glory is shown by your bearing much fruit; and in this way you become my disciples.

John 10:27-28
27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one can snatch them away from me,

Matthew 25:41-46
41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink;43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

44 “Then they also will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

*********************
As I've said before, due to the denomination differences, there will be differences in opinion concerning salvation. On one side, many Christians believe in faith with works. On the other side, many other Christians believe in faith only. Best to read and follow everything in the bible, especially Jesus' words as He'll decide who goes to heaven and hell, not the reformed theologians that created those denominations in the 16th century with their own teachings on salvation. Do we really want to gamble with our own soul?


James 2:24
You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

James 1:22 But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.

Romans 2:13 For it is not the hearers of the law who will be judged as having righteousness before God, but only the doers:
 
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