What kind of message is The Message?

[Jesus Is Real]

http://www.crossroad.to/Bible_studies/Message.html
"The Message DELETES the reference to God's holy name, ADDS requests not voiced by Jesus, and changes the meaning of other verses.

What does Eugene Peterson himself say? In his introduction to The Message, he tells us that "This version of the New Testament in a contemporary idiom keeps the language of the Message and fresh and understandable in the same language in which we do our shopping, talk with our friends, worry about world affairs, and teach our children their table manners...."

This sounds like a good idea, but what if essential Biblical concepts are not part of our everyday conversation? Should we then rewrite God's holy Scriptures to fit today's more shallow and worldly communications?

Remember, we are dealing with God's holy unchangeable Word - not an ordinary book. God owns His message, we don't. Only His own, well-guarded words can be presented as absolute truth. Yet, readers who trust NavPress and the endorsement of Christian leaders such Warren Wiersbe and J. I. Packer view this book as an authentic translation of the Bible rather than as Peterson's personal, politically correct interpretation."

What Peterson is talking about is the Dialectic Language: Diaprax - the Humanism Language. It's a brainwashing Language, which most of the world and the church has become brainwashed in, because they had no love of The Tuth. No wonder Peterson came on the scene to do ~his bible~ to push on toward the TRANSFORMATION CHANGE to A GLOBAL SOCIEY. For behold, it's here! The world and the world in the church, wanted Satan - well now they have Him.

 

[1usul1]

I think it depends what you use the message for.
If you treat it as the Word of God then its not a good idea. If it is your sole sorce of nourishment then that again is a bad idea.
However i think it would be excellent for people of lower IQ or younger people.
I think it can be a wonderful asset if used side by side of a good translation eg NIV, NASB, NLT or ESV.

 

[imperfectchristian]

People put too much emphasis on translations. It is infinitely more important to understand what Scripture is communicating, than getting hung up on how it is communicated.

 

[Elijah2]

I think it depends what you use the message for.
If you treat it as the Word of God then its not a good idea. If it is your sole sorce of nourishment then that again is a bad idea.
However i think it would be excellent for people of lower IQ or younger people.
I think it can be a wonderful asset if used side by side of a good translation eg NIV, NASB, NLT or ESV.

Mate, remember that HIS INSPIRED WORD is not to be tampered with. Learning the TRUTH OF HIS WORD, isn't written for people with a lower IQ, it's up to the TEACHERS to tend to and feed HIS flock and not rewrite HIS WORD.

It cannot be a wonderful asset, because it distorts and misrepresents HIS INSPIRED WORD.

Have you ever compared verse by verse of The Message with His Inspired Word, then if you have then you will notice that any similarity between the two is purely coincidental.

Have a look at my comments on the other thread on The Message and compare those few Scriptures that I posted.

Oh by the way this is another example of distoration of His Word:

The Lords Prayer

KJV:

“In this manner, therefore, pray:
Our Father in heaven, Hallowed be Your name.
Your kingdom come.
Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
And do not lead us into temptation, but deliver us from the evil one.
For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.

“For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.” (Matt. 6:9-15)

The Message:

“Like this:

Our Father in heaven,
Reveal who you are.
Set the world right;
Do what's best— as above, so below.
Keep us alive with three square meals.
Keep us forgiven with you and forgiving others.
Keep us safe from ourselves and the Devil.
You're in charge!
You can do anything you want!
You're ablaze in beauty!
Yes. Yes. Yes.”

“In prayer there is a connection between what God does and what you do. You can't get forgiveness from God, for instance, without also forgiving others. If you refuse to do your part, you cut yourself off from God's part.”

Do you really believe that this is BIBLICAL?

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

 

[Elijah2]

People put too much emphasis on translations. It is infinitely more important to understand what Scripture is communicating, than getting hung up on how it is communicated.

Mate, we test the spirits, and test of doctrine of demons. So if your church was full of The Message readers, and this garbage was being fed to HIS SHEEP from the pulpit, would you then become concerned about how much emphasis you would put on the doctrine of demons being taught and preached.

Before you make such statements, you need to do a critique on verse by verse of The Message and HIS INSPIRED WORD.

Read some of my comments on the other thread and the Lord's Prayer above.

And I would gladly critique The Message with you making emphasis on the lies that are in that new age gosepl bible.

Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

 

[KleinerApfel]

The acceptance and erroneous use of "The Message" in place of the Bible really bothers me.

It's a book written by a man who has his own interpretations of the Bible, but presented, labelled and sold as a Bible. It is not a Bible.
It's a well written piece of literature, but that is all it is.

Unfortunately many have been led to believe that they are holding a good translation of the word of God in their hands.
If only the author had been honest about his writing, then maybe we could gain something from it in the same way we gain from other secular arts.

As other have been pointing out, the discrepancy in content and meaning is significant, and in some cases the implications could be huge. I bought one years ago and never look at it because I very soon discovered that some passages are completely unrecognisable, and that bothered me very much.

 

[jeolmstead]

I don’t view The Message any differently then I do any other paraphrase of the scripture. Sometimes it misses a little. Sometimes it misses a lot. Sometimes I see things I’ve never seen before and God speaks to me through it.

I have several good translations and other paraphrases that I compare against each other. Some are better then others. The Message is just one of several. It does not offend me

But then, I do not worship the bible. I worship the God it has lead me to and talks about.

I do not consider the bible to be inspired unless God is inspiring it. Otherwise it is the same book that several well known popular cults use.

It is not a book of “magic words” to be enchanted over life’s problems either.

Some have elevated it above the God who inspired it. To them it has become an idol, and, as such it certainly speaks to them and is “spiritually anointed” (but that’s not the Holy Spirit)

To them it’s like the brass serpent Moses lifted up in the wilderness. It had a purpose too, a Godly and good purpose, but when people started worshiping it instead of God it had to be broken up.

Hey, like I said in another thread I would not like it to be my only bible, but I like to look at it from time to time. If something strikes me as radical I check it out against the rest of them.

John O.

 

[Alpine]

It's a paraphrase. It's not intended to replace the bible.

By the way, last time I checked, we all speak the human language. (Unless you're mute)

 

[mont974x4]

I have a copy of the NT in "the message". If it wasn't so useful in showing people what mess it is, an object lesson in twisting Scripture, it would do nicely in my box of newspaper etc I use for starting campfires.

 

[Elijah2]

I don’t view The Message any differently then I do any other paraphrase of the scripture. Sometimes it misses a little. Sometimes it misses a lot. Sometimes I see things I’ve never seen before and God speaks to me through it.

I have several good translations and other paraphrases that I compare against each other. Some are better then others. The Message is just one of several. It does not offend me

But then, I do not worship the bible. I worship the God it has lead me to and talks about.

I do not consider the bible to be inspired unless God is inspiring it. Otherwise it is the same book that several well known popular cults use.

It is not a book of “magic words” to be enchanted over life’s problems either.

Some have elevated it above the God who inspired it. To them it has become an idol, and, as such it certainly speaks to them and is “spiritually anointed” (but that’s not the Holy Spirit)

To them it’s like the brass serpent Moses lifted up in the wilderness. It had a purpose too, a Godly and good purpose, but when people started worshiping it instead of God it had to be broken up.

Hey, like I said in another thread I would not like it to be my only bible, but I like to look at it from time to time. If something strikes me as radical I check it out against the rest of them.

John O.

Hey John O, I've alread commented on this posting of yours on another thread, but for you to say this has caused me great concern for you:

I do not consider the bible to be inspired unless God is inspiring it. Otherwise it is the same book that several well known popular cults use.


In HIS INSIPIRED WORD it commands burning such things, so you better throw The Message into the fire with them.


Christianity isn't a cult, so I think your foundation in His Word has gone adrift, and I guess that can happen when you appear to be reading paraphrased and watered-down versions, such The Message.


Be very careful of what you say, and believe when it comes to HIS WORD, the TRUTH of our LIVING GOD, our Lord Jesus Christ, be very careful.


Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Hey John O, I've alread commented on this posting of yours on another thread, but for you to say this has caused me great concern for you:

I do not consider the bible to be inspired unless God is inspiring it. Otherwise it is the same book that several well known popular cults use.


In HIS INSIPIRED WORD it commands burning such things, so you better throw The Message into the fire with them.


Christianity isn't a cult, so I think your foundation in His Word has gone adrift, and I guess that can happen when you appear to be reading paraphrased and watered-down versions, such The Message.


Be very careful of what you say, and believe when it comes to HIS WORD, the TRUTH of our LIVING GOD, our Lord Jesus Christ, be very careful.


Be blessed in Jesus' Name.

John, can you hear The Heavenly Father's heart crying, in Elijah2, for you? And warning you, beloved?
I cry too.

 

[Jesus Is Real]

I have a copy of the NT in "the message". If it wasn't so useful in showing people what mess it is, an object lesson in twisting Scripture, it would do nicely in my box of newspaper etc I use for starting campfires.

Sad but true. But I too have burned books before. But I will not purchase that Heresy Book. I also love a good campfire, just ask Elijah2, I like fire!

 

[mont974x4]

Sad but true. But I too have burned books before. But I will not purchase that Heresy Book. I also love a good campfire, just ask Elijah2, I like fire!

Thankfully I did not waste my money on it. My mother bought it for .50 at a thrift store and gave it to me. She said, "It is absolutley horrible, but as a pastor you need to know what you are dealing with."

Honestly, it shouldn't take that deep of a look to raise a red flag with us.

 

[Svt4Him]

Love it. I read something in the Message that doesn't look right, I go to the original and it's a valid interpretation of the word...very similar to any other interpretation.

 

[mont974x4]

It varies greatly from the KJV, NKJV, NASB, and otehr reliable Bibles in many areas.

the message is anything but reliable

 

[Jesus Is Real]

It varies greatly from the KJV, NKJV, NASB, and otehr reliable Bibles in many areas.

the message is anything but reliable

Amen, and no Christian should ever try to reason with such a deception. You don't reason with deception you warn other Christians about it and then leave it be.

You are a wise man. Your picture: Nice snow on truck, what do you have in your hands - a Red B. pizza box?

______________
Nice sign line!!!

Rom 13:1-8
13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers (Authority - the office). For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.

6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.

7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
KJV

Titus 3:1-11
3:1 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,

2 To speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.

3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.

9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.

10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject;

11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
KJV

1 Peter 2:13-25

13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;

14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.

15 For so is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men:

16 As free, and not using your liberty for a cloke of maliciousness, but as the servants of God.

17 Honour all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honour the king.

18 Servants, be subject to your masters with all fear; not only to the good and gentle, but also to the froward.

19 For this is thankworthy, if a man for conscience toward God endure grief, suffering wrongfully.

20 For what glory is it, if, when ye be buffeted for your faults, ye shall take it patiently? but if, when ye do well, and suffer for it, ye take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.

21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:

22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:

23 Who, when he was reviled, reviled not again; when he suffered, he threatened not; but committed himself to him that judgeth righteously:

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
KJV

I Godly Fear, that the Gov't. that Obama will work to change-and-transform for America will deflate America because he will make it more one with the United Nations which is not an Authority of Gov't. which God has established - it's of man and not of God. It will be a man-made-institution to not obey. Like the Colony's and Great Britian where that King no longer walked in the God given office (Authority under God) that was acknowledged by God. See: James Borchert --- Diaprax: Romans 13:1 and Governmental Authority. parts 1, 2, 3 First link is here: http://www.authorityresearch.com/Fi...d Goverment-Religious Authority excerpt 1.mp3 And for the rest of the parts there's here: http://www.authorityresearch.com/File Index page Speakers/IAR Audio.htm#James Borchert

 

[Svt4Him]

It varies greatly from the KJV, NKJV, NASB, and otehr reliable Bibles in many areas.

the message is anything but reliable

Where exactly does it vary and why? I think it's important to know that in places it does vary, the KJV is not the benchmark you measure by but the original language.

 

[Elijah2]

Where exactly does it vary and why? I think it's important to know that in places it does vary, the KJV is not the benchmark you measure by but the original language.

Sorry mate, but who told you that the KJV isn't the "benchmark"? That is another false teacher teaching! Have a look at the Geneva Bible and it confirms all what is translated in the KJV.

Here are some examples of discrepancies, seduction, and deception of Eugene Peterson:

Colossians 2:8-10 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
8Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

Colossians 2:8-10 (New King James Version)
New King James Version (NKJV)
8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. 9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; 10 and you are complete in Him, who is the head of all principality and power.

Colossians 2:8 (The Message)
The Message (MSG)
8-10Watch out for people who try to dazzle you with big words and intellectual double-talk. They want to drag you off into endless arguments that never amount to anything. They spread their ideas through the empty traditions of human beings and the empty superstitions of spirit beings. But that's not the way of Christ. Everything of God gets expressed in him, so you can see and hear him clearly. You don't need a telescope, a microscope, or a horoscope to realize the fullness of Christ, and the emptiness of the universe without him. When you come to him, that fullness comes together for you, too. His power extends over everything.

The Message turns prophecy of the Church’s Apostasy into mysticism.

“But evil men and impostors will grow worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.” (2 Tim 3:13)

The Message: “Unscrupulous con men will continue to exploit the faith. They're as deceived as the people they lead astray. As long as they are out there, THINGS CAN ONLY GET WORSE.”

The Message rejects sound doctrine and on fables and myths and turns HIS WORD into a “tickling of itchy ears” and comfort zones and turning their back on the TRUTH OF HIS WORD.

“For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.” (2 Tim. 4:3-4)

The Message: “You're going to find out that THERE WILL BE TIMES when people will have no stomach for solid teaching, but will fill up on spiritual junk food - CATCHY OPINIONS that tickle their fancy. They'll turn their backs on truth and chase MIRAGES.”

The Message distorts the “Principles/Doctrines of Bibliology” and the “Inspiration of the Bible”.

“For prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.” (2 Pet. 1:21)

The Message: “Prophecy resulted when the Holy Spirit prompted men AND WOMEN to speak God's word”

God inspired “holy men”, NOT women to write HIS INSPIRED WORD.

“All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness” (2 Tim. 3:16)

The Message: “EVERY PART OF SCRIPTURE is God-breathed ...”

His Word is a record of what God thinks and speaks, not of what man thinks and speaks!

 

[KleinerApfel]

ALL translations are better than The Message, so this isn't something for the KJV only or the anti-KJV only to get wound up over.
The Message simply is NOT a translation AT ALL, it is NOT a Bible. That is the real issue.

The Message is NOT a Bible at all, but it CLAIMS to be, and that dishonesty, deception, is what makes me concerned.
It has way to much removed and way too much added, it is not God's word, it's one mans thoughts about the word of God, and if only he'd said so I'd be happy.

 

[Lotuspetal_uk]

It's a paraphrase. It's not intended to replace the bible.

By the way, last time I checked, we all speak the human language. (Unless you're mute)

At my member church the minister had stated in one of his sermons that this was as good as, and is treating it with the same authority as the more accurate Bibles.

This troubles me.

I recall doing a Bible reading for Palm Sunday for him and he specifically asked me to use this Bible. When it came to Matt. 21:9 the Message version had "Hosanna" down as "Hooray!" when in actual fact the word means "Save" as an exclamation of praise for our Saviour. I hadn't heard of this Bible prior to this and felt sick to my stomach after I read it. Needless to say I closed the Bible and placed it next to the new minister with a note to self that next time I walk up with my own Bible.