What does Catholicism have to do with Messianic Judaism????

Open Heart

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From my own experience, the things said about the RC in here are pretty tame. If you really want to get offended, introduce a Catholic topic on a Jewish forum.:)
I'm trying to get the Messianics who are hostile to the CC to post their stuff in here, where it is more appropriate.
 
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James Is Back

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Mod Hat On

Thread has undergone a cleanup due to flaming/goading so if your post is gone that is the reason or you quoted someone that did. Folks it got heated in here so let's cool off and address the post not the poster.

Mod Hat Off
 
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ContraMundum

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Well, I have seen this particular council quoted to support church dogma. No matter, and no hard feelings I hope? We simply don't see eye to eye here, not a big deal. :)

No, no biggie. People quote the Councils all the time to support whatever their point is. Hence, you hear them cited in support of dogmas on every side of any given argument. :)
 
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visionary

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The old view is still ok, actually. Not all things in Revelation have come to pass. A newer view says that nothing in Revelation has come to pass.
For what purpose is revelation other than to carry us to His coming.
 
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Open Heart

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sahjimira

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I am a messianic gentile still learning. The nearest sabbath keepers r the SDA and I don't abide
by EG White but they do honor the Holy Days as far as I know. It's hard for me to understand combining 2 religions like RC and MJ. Some obviously have peace about it but I don't see it myself. I feel OK about being a gentile messianic as Christianity has Jewish roots which understanding can further open up the scripture to me. Catholic bashing is not showing love. I am an x Catholic and disagree with lots in the Church. When I post I try to b respectful as I would like in return
 
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Dave-W

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Alithis

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I post all over CF. I post in the theology section, the ethics section, etc. If I want to talk about Catholic stuff, I don't post about it here. I don't see what it has to do with Messianic Judaism. I will post in OBOB, or in one of the other appropriate forums such as Mariology.

Yet when I come in here, there is always a thread or two going about the Catholic church or the pope (and not usually a nice one). Why? Why HERE?

I don't think it's appropriate to the forum. It's not in the rules, and there's nothing I do about it. But I can have my say, and my say is this: I wish you'd take it to the proper forum and leave it out of MJ.
and yet here you are ..posting about it here too .. cunning
 
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Open Heart

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and yet here you are ..posting about it here too .. cunning googletag.cmd.push(function() { googletag.display('div-gpt-ad-1431698694306-1'); });
This is not a thread about Catholic doctrine.
 
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Righttruth

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The problem with that statement is "the Lord's Day" is not Sunday. The term was used in the Prophets ("The Day of the Lord") in dealing with end time events and thus when John, in Revelation, uses the term... he is not denoting "Sunday," he is drawing on a phrase understood by his contemporaries to be dealing with end time events. And so, there he sat, in the Spirit viewing the end time events and recording them. After the first century and once the weight shifted from the faith being more or less a sect of Judaism to distinguishing itself as a new religion, Greek philosophy entered and thus so too did the spiritualization of many things including the day of the resurrection which CULTURALLY was called, "The Lord's Day." So, he raised on Sunday and non-Jewish believers began to call that day the Lord's Day... and on the authority of the church and NOT Scripture... they shifted the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday.

"It is well to remind the Presbyterians, Baptists, Methodists, and all other Christians, that the Bible does not support them anywhere in their observance of Sunday. Sunday is an institution of the Roman Catholic Church, and those who observe the day observe a commandment of the Catholic Church." Priest Brady, in an address reported in the Elizabeth, NJ News on March 18, 1903

"Protestants ... accept Sunday rather than Saturday as the day for public worship after the Catholic Church made the change... But the Protestant mind does not seem to realize that ... in observing Sunday, they are accepting the authority of the spokesman for the Church, the pope." Our Sunday Visitor, February 5, 1950

"The [Roman Catholic] Church changed the observance of the Sabbath to Sunday by right of the divine, infallible authority given to her by her founder, Jesus Christ. The Protestant, claiming the Bible to be the only guide of faith, has no warrant for observing Sunday. In this matter the Seventh-day Adventist is the only consistent Protestant." The Catholic Universe Bulletin, August 14, 1942, p. 4

So here are a few of many claims I can share proving that even the RCC acknowledges the change was their doing and not Scripture. And when did they do this?


The council of Laodicea states in cannon 29:

"Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ."

It took a decree AND the threat of ex-communication, to shift the church away from the Sabbath. We were then born 1600 years later into a culture that saw Sunday as the Christian Sabbath and we simply don't even know the was a question to ask.

* As a side note... if they had to pass a decree, then clearly there were enough Christians still honoring the Sabbath that a decree was even necessary.

God never said Saturday or Sunday is the Sabbath. He commanded to work for six days and then the next day should be observed as Sabbath rest day. I suppose Christians in Arab countries may be observing that on Friday, and there is nothing wrong with that spiritually!
 
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Open Heart

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God never said Saturday or Sunday is the Sabbath. He commanded to work for six days and then the next day should be observed as Sabbath rest day. I suppose Christians in Arab countries may be observing that on Friday, and there is nothing wrong with that spiritually!
The commandment is not one out of every seven days, but the seventh day. They "names" of the days of the week were numbers in ancient Hebrew. You didn't get to pick whatever day you wanted to be the seventh day. Preposterous.
 
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Righttruth

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The commandment is not one out of every seven days, but the seventh day. They "names" of the days of the week were numbers in ancient Hebrew. You didn't get to pick whatever day you wanted to be the seventh day. Preposterous.

That is depending on the letter of the Law, not the spirit of the Law as preached by Jesus.
 
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The Lone Ranger

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The Jews know when the Sabbath is. Jesus worshiped From Friday evening to Saturday evening, as HE was Jewish. HE said remember the Shabbat and keep it Holy. We have to try our best to keep the Shabbat on Saturday at all times, but if we can't get Friday night to Saturday night off, we have to pick another day. Israel closes up during that time, as far as I know. The town I am from used to close up Saturday night to Sunday night, until the late 1980's IIRC, after the baby boomers took over things, because America followed the Sunday Sabbath almost entirely. We could shoot a canon ball down main street, and nothing would get hit back then. The important thing to do is try.
Jesus said we did not have to go to Shabbat on certain days because of War, or if your camel was stuck in a ditch, or your wife was in labor, or...... Practicing Jews would actually die, rather than miss a Shabbat, before Jesus came down. They would lose a war, and have many people killed, because they were not allowed to do anything on Shabbat, even defend themselves, as per the Levitical law.

Now that I have re-read some of the First Testament, I am even considering the Jews left Judaism, and strayed from the Book because it didn't make sense to them to lose out on so much because of being forced to worship on a Saturday....................
 
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Open Heart

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That is depending on the letter of the Law, not the spirit of the Law as preached by Jesus.
You have to keep the letter in order to keep the spirit. The thing is that it is esssential everyone agree on which day of the week to keep as the sabbath in order that the community can keep it together. Otherwise you will have everyone doing something different and nothing but confusion. There would be no sacred day.
 
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Dave-W

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God never said Saturday or Sunday is the Sabbath. He commanded to work for six days and then the next day should be observed as Sabbath rest day. I suppose Christians in Arab countries may be observing that on Friday, and there is nothing wrong with that spiritually!
What day did Jesus keep as the 7th day?
 
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Righttruth

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You have to keep the letter in order to keep the spirit. The thing is that it is esssential everyone agree on which day of the week to keep as the sabbath in order that the community can keep it together. Otherwise you will have everyone doing something different and nothing but confusion. There would be no sacred day.

That is what I am saying. Any day after six days of work for a group of people that gather to worship.
 
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