We really need to pay close attention to James!
- Thread starter ZacharyB
- Start date
Sorry but scripture says believers have the indwelling Holy Spirit.
Matthew Henry calls such you are trying to describe as 'empty professors'
And he also says they are not saved, they were never repenting and believing in Christ,
they went through the rituals, but their deeds showed they did not have a true conversion, they were not born again.
Preplanned sin is presumptuous sin. You know unbelievers add sin to sin, they continue in sin without stopping.
Obviously they do not have the Holy Spirit or they would be restrained by God. The Holy Spirit leads His people into truth and leads in the way they are to walk. In fact, the discipline of the Lord is mentioned, if you belong to the Lord, then you will be disciplined by Him, otherwise your not belonging to Him.
I get the sense you have this big disconnect in your life, placing all the disciplining on what the Christian is to do, and leaving God completely out of the loop.
However it tells us 'SONS' is how God deals with us and not as illegitimate children of the world who have no FATHER in heaven that disciplines them. People of the world are NOT SONS and are not disciplined by God, they are not God's children.
But those who are God's children, God corrects and rebukes so they they are conformed to the image of His Son. And believe me, God' s able to subdue and make all things conform to the purpose of His will. And His will is none of those He gives to Christ as believers will be lost and perish. And His will is done, as it states in Eph 1.
Heb 12
5 And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons:
“My son, do not despise the chastening of the Lord,
Nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him;
6 For whom the Lord loves He chastens,
And scourges every son whom He receives.”
7 If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten? 8 But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons. 9 Furthermore, we have had human fathers who corrected us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much more readily be in subjection to the Father of spirits and live? 10 For they indeed for a few days chastened usas seemed best to them, but He for our profit, that we may be partakers of His holiness.11 Now no chastening seems to be joyful for the present, but painful; nevertheless, afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.
Upvote
0
Let me also explain this as well. In the Old Testament the Jews would have to make a blood sacrifice for their sins. They not only had to do this for the sins they knew they committed but also for the sins they did not realize they had committed. (Leviticus 4:27).
Christ ultimately paid the price for all of our sins, known and unknown. The idea that there are people in heaven with unconfessed sins is on a technical level possible. For we may have committed sins that we did not even know about. But fortunately the Blood of Christ covered those and when we face the judgement and those unknown sins are revealed to us....Jesus will step in and be our advocate and judgement will pass over us.
Christ ultimately paid the price for all of our sins, known and unknown. The idea that there are people in heaven with unconfessed sins is on a technical level possible. For we may have committed sins that we did not even know about. But fortunately the Blood of Christ covered those and when we face the judgement and those unknown sins are revealed to us....Jesus will step in and be our advocate and judgement will pass over us.
Upvote
0
Simply that the believer is forgiven as the Apostle John teaches
1 John 2:12
[ Their Spiritual State ] I write to you, little children, Because your sins are forgiven you for His name’s sake.
And also a Christian will forgive other's who sin against them, recall Stephen the Martyr in acts.
This is an acknowledgement that their judgement is in God's hands. when you pray for your enemy, you heap up burning coals of fire on their heads, since they seek to destroy God's temple which is for the believer, you. Whoever destroy's God's temple, God will destroy.
59 And they stoned Stephen as he was calling on God and saying, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he knelt down and cried out with a loud voice, “Lord, do not charge them with this sin.” And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
You do have an enormous problem.
Elsewhere you made a ridiculous statement, and I refrained from posting.
Now this ludicrous statement of yours above.
I have repeatedly said that co-operation with the precious Holy Spirit
is mandatory for coming out of the salvation process ... with eternal life!
Do you understand what co-operation means?
It means going along with (following) what someone has said, instructed, etc.
It is common practice here for people to completely mis-represent
what other believers have clearly stated.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Zach...how can you come out of the salvation process without eternal life? If you go through salvation and do not get life, then you did not go through the salvation process....I mean if you go through the process what have you been delivered from?
Salvation by definition is deliverance from harm or sin....er go being saved. So if you are saved, then you have gone through the salvation process.
Salvation by definition is deliverance from harm or sin....er go being saved. So if you are saved, then you have gone through the salvation process.
Upvote
0
Jerald, you are in kindergarden with hopes of successfully graduating.
But, one can go through the educational system and end up failing to graduate!
All throughout the NT (even in the gospels), we see warnings about
falling away, leaving the faith, falling from grace, etc.
(for all kinds of reasons, not just for insisting on being a slave to sin).
Especially (in this discussion) the 10 verses that warn about ...
enduring in the faith until the end of one's life to receive eternal life!
Any person may (due to free-will), and can (due to ability),
leave (abandon, reject) any process whatsoever!
There's that word again ...
the person must co-operate with the process, not leave it!
Last edited:
Upvote
0
John decided to lend James a hand ...
“And everyone who has this hope in Him
(to be "children of God", verses 1 and 2)
purifies himself, just as He is pure.” (1 John 3:3)
This is part of co-operating with the salvation process ...
which some people can choose to do,
if they really wish to be "children of God".
“And everyone who has this hope in Him
(to be "children of God", verses 1 and 2)
purifies himself, just as He is pure.” (1 John 3:3)
This is part of co-operating with the salvation process ...
which some people can choose to do,
if they really wish to be "children of God".
Last edited:
Upvote
0
But Zach...until you graduate....you are not a graduate. While you are in school...you are simply going to school. The Bible quite clearly indicates being saved is current and or past tense situations "You are saved" sort of verses. So while you are in kindergarden you are not graduated.
I state all this in the form of a question to see if I have what you believe right....It seems you are separating the idea of being saved and eternal life. As if they are two independent "rewards" to get. You have to get saved, and then you have to work to earn eternal life. Is that sort of what I think you are working on saying?
So technically speaking a person could be saved but still not receive eternal life as one has to come before the other as well, correct?
I state all this in the form of a question to see if I have what you believe right....It seems you are separating the idea of being saved and eternal life. As if they are two independent "rewards" to get. You have to get saved, and then you have to work to earn eternal life. Is that sort of what I think you are working on saying?
So technically speaking a person could be saved but still not receive eternal life as one has to come before the other as well, correct?
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Truly, I am boring myself (which is quite rare for humans, don't you think?).
It seems I have to keep repeatin' the same things over and over again!
Many people have the revelation that salvation is a life-long process.
So, one begins with salvation (eternal life), but is quite able to lose it ...
... whilst working out his/her salvation, and whilst hoping he/she will end up with it.
People read all of these truths in the NT, but are so deceived that they ignore them!
Upvote
0
nobdysfool
The original! Accept no substitutes!
- Feb 23, 2003
- 15,018
- 1,006
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Private
- Politics
- US-Constitution
And, of course, only YOU have discovered the truth, right? You may deny you're saying that, but it sure comes off that way. Let me clue you in a little: As long as you insult and denigrate anyone who doesn't agree with you, your message will not be heard or accepted. On more than one occasion, you have implied that anyone who doesn't agree with you may not even be saved at all. You surely know that such an attitude is not going to increase your fan base.
Are you here just to insult and put off others? if so, your attitude is not right, and you're not operating from the right spirit. You cannot elevate yourself and your views by putting others down.
Try treating others with respect and kindness even if you think they're wrong. Use wisdom when responding to others. Stop trying to "win". This isn't a competition, there are no prizes, nor will anyone be named a "winner" with bragging rights, etc.
Upvote
0
Why do you think Jesus has always been appointing certain believers to
the 5-fold ministry: apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, teachers (Eph 4:11)?
These are Jesus' church leaders.
Trouble is: thou needs to figure out who's Christ-appointed and who's men-appointed.
Caution: be careful!
Upvote
0
nobdysfool
The original! Accept no substitutes!
- Feb 23, 2003
- 15,018
- 1,006
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Private
- Politics
- US-Constitution
Are you claiming to be one of them? Paul would rebuke you to your face.
Jas 3:1 Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
There is one TV preacher with a large following that claims God lives on a planet.
And other weird things like Christ was tortured in Hell by Satan. Those kinds always seem to get worse and worse into oddball strange and diverse teachings. I also saw his tongue flicking like a serpent once during him delivering 'the message from God.'
Upvote
0
Similar threads
