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Water Baptism / Baptism in the Holy Spirit

Discussion in 'For New Christians' started by teaspill, Jan 19, 2010.

  1. teaspill

    teaspill Junior Member

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    When I was at my old Bible Study, one of the women was telling me about the significance of baptism. She then stated that water baptism isn't necessary to receive the Holy Spirit, and asked if I'd like to receive the Holy Spirit right then and there. Unfortuntely, we got side-tracked by om nom nommy cake...

    On this forum, I see suggestions that perhaps baptism in the Holy Spirit and water baptism are in fact different things, but things that aren't mutually exclusive. So I'm wondering if water baptism and baptism in the Holy Spirit are different. If so, how does one become baptised in the Holy Spirit without a water baptism?
     
  2. heggarty

    heggarty Newbie

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    Hey, Im an Aussie and im 17 years old as well. Its cool that your curious and trying to get sweet with god, if you ever need anyone to talk to add me on msn or PM me.

    Baptism is an outward expression of an inward reality. Baptism in water declares ones faith in jesus christ publicly. Baptism in the holy spirit is most definately a different experience whereby gods holy spirit fully enters you. You usually pray a prayer initial signs that you have been baptised in the holy spirit include praying in tongues. I know that my mate hasnt been baptised in water yet still very much speaks in tongues. And im pretty sure many of the believers at the day of pentecost (acts 2) wernt baptised in the holy spirit, I might be wrong there though. Usually it is step 1: Salvation. Step 2: Baptism in water and Step 3: Baptism in the spirit. However steps 2 and 3 sometimes swap.

    Sorry I dont have time to look up the scriptures. Hope that helps. Blessings joey.
     
    heron likes this.
  3. teaspill

    teaspill Junior Member

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    Hi Heggarty. :3 I've tossed a PM your way. It's nice to meet another young Australian on here!

    Thank you very much for explaining that to me. Is there a particular reason that water baptism tends to come before baptism in the Holy Spirit?
     
  4. Bouke285

    Bouke285 It's not a sin to be wrong, but be wrong humbly!

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    Baptism in the Holy Spirit is more or less a fuller opening of ourselves to God not more of God entering us. Water Baptism is a great great thing "I will do whatever you want me to do God and to show you, Watch this!" is what you are telling God when you go under and emerge from the water. Everybody around you can see but that's not the most important thing it's telling God "Use me, i'm ready."

    I may have sounded like I was trying to disagree with you in these replies, but I'm just giving my understanding never let anyone force you to think in certain ways including me. God has given you a great teacher and he knows much more then us all :). God Bless
     
  5. seashale76

    seashale76 Orthodox Christian

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    When she was speaking of receiving the Holy Spirit, did she mean speaking in tongues? If so, that isn't a correct teaching (that one doesn't have the Holy Spirit unless they speak in tongues).

    Baptism and Chrismation (the seal of the gift of the Holy Spirit) bring one into the Church (i.e. one who is baptized into Christ has put on Christ). One receives one immediately after the other.

    About the sacraments:
    OCA - The Orthodox Faith
    OCA - The Orthodox Faith
    Holy Baptism: An Orthodox Christian Understanding
     
  6. teaspill

    teaspill Junior Member

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    I was away from the computer for three days and so I couldn't get back to this thread, but thank you both for responding. :3 I went ahead and got baptised in the Holy Spirit after asking my Pastor about it and it was the most powerful feeling I've ever felt...
     
  7. heron

    heron Legend

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    That's great to hear! Now you know.

    Water Baptism is a great great thing "I will do whatever you want me to do God and to show you, Watch this!"


    Lol. (-;

    Denominations tend to have very firm and disparate views of what the Spirit baptism is, so it's good to just listen to all the approaches and then decide what is scriptural and of God.

    Some fellowships will get crazy over insisting people must speak in tongues to prove that God dwells in them. It is not scriptural to treat a gift and a phenomenon as a standard or measure.

    The water baptism, as shown above, is a public and formal statement of your intents. You tell God and man that you're serious.

    Notice that when Jesus chose to get water baptised, the Spirit descended like a dove.

    The Holy Spirit is not a commodity to be weighed and traded and assessed. The Spirit is part of the triune God. We treat the Father with awe, but tend to demean or compartmentalize this part of God that is so fluid and intangible.

    Jesus promised that when he left earth, He would send the Comforter, who would lead us to understanding.

    John 14

    In Greek, comforter/par-ak'-lay-tos was used to describe a legal advocate.

    http://studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3875

    Ac 2:38 - In Context
    [​IMG] Greek Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Mr 1:8 "I baptized you with water; but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."

    Ac 1:5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."

    Ac 11:16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, `John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'

    1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.


    It is the same God that dwells in you, the same Spirit. But people found a distinct difference between committing themselves to God for salvation, and allowing Him to work through them for the building up of other people.

    God did some crazy things that most people would not normally feel comfortable with. These results strengthened faith, brought more people to connect with God, and gave insight. God continues to work in this way, if we let Him.

    One difference between the two baptisms -- when we get water baptised, we usually tell God we are committed... when we get Spirit baptised, we ask God to be more involved. Both involve yielding, but in a different way. Water baptism seems to be more of a begging to be accepted into His kingdom; Spirit baptism is sort of a "now that I'm here, I want to be involved."
    Ask, seek, knock.

    But I don't think the two are necessarily separate for each person. It's the same God dwelling in us.
     
  8. Mister_Al

    Mister_Al Regular Member

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    Water Baptism is your marriage ceremony to Jesus and you don't get the Holy Spirit until then.

    Acts 2:38 (New International Version)

    38) Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


    You can't go by what you feel, you must go by what the Bible says.


    Acts 19:1-7 (New International Version)

    1) While Apollos was at Corinth, Paul took the road through the interior and arrived at Ephesus. There he found some disciples 2) and asked them, "Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?"
    They answered, "No, we have not even heard that there is a Holy Spirit."

    3) So Paul asked, "Then what baptism did you receive?"
    "John's baptism," they replied.

    4) Paul said, "John's baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus." 5) On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. 6) When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied. 7) There were about twelve men in all.

    Blessings,

    Alan
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2010
  9. heron

    heron Legend

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    Yes, the first one requires your action, the second requires God's action.

    A long time ago some friends wanted to get water baptized, but their church did not teach of the born-again life, and they didn't know of others that would baptize them with the same meaning they intended. They waited about half a year before they could find an opportunity that reflected what they believed baptism was about.

    In the meantime, God didn't stop working in their lives. From what I remember, they were baptized in the Holy Spirit before their water baptism. This is not the scriptural order of things, but their desire for water baptism was there, and they were public about asking for referrals... in asking, they gave a public declaration of intent, informally.

    I always thought it was a little confusing that water baptism would be required, when so much of the rest of faith happened in the heart. But I think that's the point -- we need to hold ourselves to some formal public expressions of faith, so we're not just hermits who think ourselves wise.
     
  10. LilLamb219

    LilLamb219 The Lamb is gone. Supporter

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    When we look at the scriptures that concern baptism, we see that God is the one at work through the waters with His Word attached to it in the form of promises.

    In baptism, we are clothed in Christ's righteousness...covered so that we are righteous. Galatians 3:27. For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.

    In baptism, our sins are washed away. Acts 22:16. And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name. Titus 3:5. He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit. Eph. 5:26. Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word. 1 Corinthians 6:11. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

    In the early church, when baptism was mentioned...one only had in mind ONE baptism, not two as some churches today declare it to be. There is but one baptism for the remission of our sins.
    Ephesians 4:5 (New International Version) one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
    Acts 2:37-39. Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, "Brothers, what shall we do?" And Peter said to them, "Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself."
     
  11. salida

    salida Veteran

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    The baptism of the Holy Spirit can occur without speaking in tongues. Some people speak in tongues and some don't. Everytime in Acts they didn't always speak in tongues. What is most important is that you have the fruit of the Holy Spirit. Jesus said to inspect the fruit. Plus, just being able to have the power to live a christian life by the Holy Spirit is evidence alone that you have it. Your human effort alone can't do this.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2010
  12. send.the.rain

    send.the.rain Junior Member

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    I have a question:
    So I was baptized at birth, but my parents didn't really raise me as a Christian. As a result, I was an athiest for as long as I can remember. Now as a new Christian, it is possible for me to get re-baptized?
     
  13. LilLamb219

    LilLamb219 The Lamb is gone. Supporter

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    Why would you want to? God did it right the first time :thumbsup:

    Baptism is God's work within you, it doesn't expire.
     
  14. chilehed

    chilehed Veteran

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    Christ's sacrifice on the cross is the fulfillment of the OT sacrifice of the Passover lamb, and His sacrifice actually accomplishes what it signifies.

    In the same manner, Christ's Baptism is the fulfillment of the OT mikveh, and as such actually accomplishes what it signifies: the cleansing of our sins. See how when Christ was baptised the Holy Spirit descended on Him; when we are baptised in His name we participate in His baptism and the Holy Spirit descends also upon us.

    See also that immediately after Christ said that we must be baptised with water and the Spirit, he went and baptised people. That's the only place we find Christ baptising anyone.

    See also that the Peter writes that Baptism saves and cleanses us, but not as water cleanses the skin.

    Not all are given the same gifts of the Spirit, and not all of the gifts we are to receive are given at Baptism. The Holy Spirit moves in our lives at different times, and in different manners.